Re: The X-Com Files - 3.5: Whispers In The Dark

[mumble]

I think the mini swat tank needs to be revamped, currently its an HWP, which means you need AT LEAST a dragon fly to use it, and by that late, 6 shotgun shells and barely any armor simply does not cut the mustard. I figure a slight bump in armor (or at least health, 15 is really nothing) as well as double the ammo reserve would make it more useful by the time its availible, and would certainly help with training troops at least.

Otherwise, even a troop with an MP5 and crappy aim generally does better : I suppose its an OK spotter, but I find a dog is superior in most ways, with equal agility more or less, no ammo concerns, ability to carry, and free motion scanners.

Also, cattle mutilations / abductions really need to stop later in the game, I think : once you research the farmers and hit promotion 2, they start being really out of place. Maybe just make it a requirement to get promotion 2, and make local authorities handle it, like cult safehouses.

[Solarius Scorch]

Anyway, more ontopic, can the blackops SMG get an aimed shot like the minebae smg? I know the minebae is technically a classified gun from the old kiryukai, but I figure blackops could incorporate such techniques anyway, being as powerful as they are. Even if its just a marginal 10% increase in aim, it would be interesting.

Maybe. I'm kinda confused with my own SMG classification now.
But probably not, since they're hardly build for sniping. The Minebea at least has a two-handed grip.

You know, some of the magma guns seem heavy for the sake of being heavy, namely the thrasher shotgun : its basically a giant double barrel shotgun, yet its over 30 weight!

Imagine the recoil...

why is the light cannon so innacurate?

Because it's so specialized. Basically "smallest cannon you can build". First to all, it's too light for the (again) recoil. And extreme in many aspects.

I figure it would be more accurate than a heavy cannon, at very least for snap shot since its lighter weight is easier to manipulate,

Dude... Aiming a weapon does not include dragging it around to point it to the enemy. But on the other hand, recoil (yes) is a bitch.

But certainly, lower the weight of the thrasher to like, 20 : the weight of the ammo alone makes it very hard to carry, trust me, considering its a double barrel : this means if you want 10 shots, you have to set aside 20 weight for it to begin with, where as right not its almost unmanageable even with my biggest dudes.

How do I put it gently... NO!

is it me, or are zombies STUPIDLY explsovie resistant?

No, they are not resistant to explosives at all.

I can understand them being bullet, resistant, even melee resistant, as they have no real vital points, but I figure a satchel of TNT would be more than enough to destroy any zombie by the megazombies : I really think their explosive resistance should be lowered, would certainly make the magma zombie mission a lot easier

I really think you should stop whining. They are not resistant to explosives. At all.

remember, these things aren't much different from humans despite strength, and don't exactly have armor or anything, they hardly have clothes : a tnt charge or landmine under their feet should put them out of commission.

It usually does.

I think the mini swat tank needs to be revamped, currently its an HWP, which means you need AT LEAST a dragon fly to use it, and by that late, 6 shotgun shells and barely any armor simply does not cut the mustard. I figure a slight bump in armor (or at least health, 15 is really nothing) as well as double the ammo reserve would make it more useful by the time its availible, and would certainly help with training troops at least.

Yeah, I agree. I may revamp tanks completely. This just isn't a priority now.

Also, cattle mutilations / abductions really need to stop later in the game, I think : once you research the farmers and hit promotion 2, they start being really out of place. Maybe just make it a requirement to get promotion 2, and make local authorities handle it, like cult safehouses.

Also agreed, but it's WIP.

[mumble]

You know, I find it odd the AK47 and colt 45 ammo function identically : shouldn't a colt 45 be less effective against armor?  Its not a pointed round, or even a magnum round. (sure, the 44 magnums aren't pointed, neither are slugs, but they are HUGE,. so them being mildly effective to armor makes sense due the the size / velocity)

I understand bigger rifles have armor penetration, but the comparison between the 2 rounds shouldn't be identical : I figure the colt45 (and tommy guns for that matter) should have a slight disadvantage to armor : certainly for the tommygun, I feel otherwise its very slightly overpowered, even with the accuracy a 50 round magazine can easily provide many advantages even into black ops era, and I figure maybe a 15%+ armor might be a reasonable change.

[Dr.Crowley]

Also, cattle mutilations / abductions really need to stop later in the game, I think : once you research the farmers and hit promotion 2, they start being really out of place. Maybe just make it a requirement to get promotion 2, and make local authorities handle it, like cult safehouses.

Well, these mission still can be used as some sort of training for the rookies.

[mumble]

I suppose : I guess my biggest issue is that the game is so lenient to slaying innocent farmers even when you start getting explosives and stuff : I would figure the council would have higher expectations at that point.

I suppose it would be fine if killing them actually gave NEGATIVE points, while the bodies gave POSITIVE points, for a net gain IF you collect the body, this way at least plastering a farm with explosives isn't such a good idea, considering people will see the chaos, bullet holes, dismembered bodies, and it will cause MORE of a panic, rather than less, and perhaps even a higher point amount for captures, to put them into witness protection or something : I imagine the council would like, first and foremost, discretion when dealing with innocent civilians, and the more I think about it, the more I think about killing farmers with assault rifles makes no sense, especially if the bodies aren't even retrieved to make it LOOK like a disappearance.

Also, as an idea for MIB, maybe this could be paired into it, where you can find / re-purpose the mind wipe tools from MIB, and use them to brainwash farmers and send them back, or possibly other elements. After all, I'm sure discretion would be important to the council more than anything, to keep the nations happy / as oblivious as possible to the shit hitting the fan around them, so maybe this could be a good idea.

[Solarius Scorch]

You know, I find it odd the AK47 and colt 45 ammo function identically : shouldn't a colt 45 be less effective against armor?  Its not a pointed round, or even a magnum round. (sure, the 44 magnums aren't pointed, neither are slugs, but they are HUGE,. so them being mildly effective to armor makes sense due the the size / velocity)

I'd have to trow the entire balance (including vanilla) out of the window.

Nobody cared about it in vanilla, so why is it so important now?

I will keep thinking about it.

I suppose : I guess my biggest issue is that the game is so lenient to slaying innocent farmers even when you start getting explosives and stuff : I would figure the council would have higher expectations at that point.

I'm all for improvements, but I can't really juggle the properties around like this; I'm working with the code I have.

[DreamThorn]

Is this the right place for bug reports?

In 0.6.6 some of the grassy snowy tiles in the tundra and forests have zero movement cost.  The changelog for versions since then don't mention it being fixed, but I'll upgrade today and see.

[Solarius Scorch]

Is this the right place for bug reports?

Not really, there is another thread in the same place, deceptively called "Bugs, crashes, typos & bad taste". But it's OK.

In 0.6.6 some of the grassy snowy tiles in the tundra and forests have zero movement cost.  The changelog for versions since then don't mention it being fixed, but I'll upgrade today and see.

OK, I'll go and check.

I'm planning a release soon, so thanks for the report.

EDIT: I can't find these tiles. It could be a case of an object tile used as a floor tile... Would you perhaps have a screenshot, or save?

EDIT: 0.6.9 has been released.
- Updated to newest OXCE+ version.
- Overhauled and expanded music.
- Added racial deployments for Floaters.
- Added missions: Trouble in Ski Resort, Alien Downtown Attack, Alien Purge, Dimension X Transfer Point.
- New unit: Crisis Trooper.
- New craft equipment: Shield Generator.
- New weapons: Sporting Rifle, Incinerator, Acid Pistol, Acid Bolt, Boomeroid, Disruptor Rifle, Heavy Disruptor.
- New Ammo: AP-BS for CAWS.
- Introduced new damage types: PSI, WARP.
Added Dossier: Rennielle Diolata (by Yataka Shimaoka).
- Increased MiB armours.
- Moved Smoke Grenade back to Promotion 2.
- New Dragonfly Ufopaedia pic.
- Toxi Suit is now green.
- Zombies and other melee psychos now disregard danger.
- Neutral units fight better.
- Rebalanced Railguns, SMGs and The Kludge.
- Fixed a crash with The Special Client mission.
- Fixed goddamn Keep again.
- Softer cave rocks.
- Minor fixes.

[mumble]

I'm a little worried this has absolutely BROKEN zombies : I don't have much time to test right now, but trying a run on magma lab with blackops guns, miniguns, and rpgs, I couldn't go more than 4 turns without wiping because zombies immediately B line for me even if I shoot them.

Granted, I've NEVER had success with the magma lab (combination of all those shotguns, and all those bullet sponges is an endurance test from hell, and I'm not sure how its INTENDED to be beaten. I do play on super human, but i save scum) but at least before I could last longer. If zombies aren't going to be pushed to flea from being shot anymore, you REALLY need to tweak TU's or other stuff, because man, that seems like it would be too much, especially since zombies are essential to progression IIRC

Also, an infector ends up surviving an AP rpg round just fine, and ends up taking several more bullets before dying : all this combined makes me think you should rethink how zombies are balanced slightly.

A few ideas, are making zombies exponentially slower when injured more, so injuries on them are more effective, making them squishier in general, and again lowering explosive / fire resistance. (zombies are sturdy because less organs are vital than humans right?...but fire and explosives shreds everything evenly.)

I might be wrong, and maybe zombies are doable, but considering 50 v 4  fights between zombies an my agents on super human, I cannot see these as possible now, if I cannot push them back with gunfire. Maybe even THIS is intended, but then capturing fat and infector zombies will be much nastier, and I really would like to at least see your results on trying magma lab with a dragonfly ship...

[Meridian]

I'm a little worried this has absolutely BROKEN zombies : I don't have much time to test right now, but trying a run on magma lab with blackops guns, miniguns, and rpgs, I couldn't go more than 4 turns without wiping because zombies immediately B line for me even if I shoot them.

That's what's called a placebo effect

Due to a bug in code, the zombies are even less harmless than before. In closed quarters they behave more or less the same as before, in open spaces they even stop completely and don't attack (unless you move closer to them).

This will be fixed in OXCE+ 2017-08-30 and higher... but for now enjoy even more impotent zombies

[Solarius Scorch]

I'm a little worried this has absolutely BROKEN zombies : I don't have much time to test right now, but trying a run on magma lab with blackops guns, miniguns, and rpgs, I couldn't go more than 4 turns without wiping because zombies immediately B line for me even if I shoot them.

I completely agree, I have tried the M.A.G.M.A. Lab yesterday and I was completely owned... It was the same team I destroyed Red Dawn HQ with no problems.
...But I was using the fixed version Meridian mentioned. With the one released, it shouldn't be too hard, though I haven't tested it.
Anyway, I have already decreased the threat level for this mission. I also made the zombie attack a bit less useful against heavily armoured foes.

Granted, I've NEVER had success with the magma lab (combination of all those shotguns, and all those bullet sponges is an endurance test from hell, and I'm not sure how its INTENDED to be beaten. I do play on super human, but i save scum) but at least before I could last longer. If zombies aren't going to be pushed to flea from being shot anymore, you REALLY need to tweak TU's or other stuff, because man, that seems like it would be too much, especially since zombies are essential to progression IIRC

Agreed.

Also, an infector ends up surviving an AP rpg round just fine, and ends up taking several more bullets before dying : all this combined makes me think you should rethink how zombies are balanced slightly.

I'm not going to change zombie units, but are playing with their numbers.

A few ideas, are making zombies exponentially slower when injured more, so injuries on them are more effective, making them squishier in general, and again lowering explosive / fire resistance. (zombies are sturdy because less organs are vital than humans right?...but fire and explosives shreds everything evenly.)

They have appropriate resistances.

[krautbernd]

On a totally unrelated note, do you plan on adding any additional craft weapons, especially missles? IIRC Area 51 had something akin to the Stormlance, but with alien alloys instead of Elerium. Seeing how we already have alloy ammunition for pretty much everything else, an alien alloy fragmentation warhead on an air-to-air missile doesn't seem too far off, especially as a stop-gap measure for light missile hardpoints.

[Solarius Scorch]

On a totally unrelated note, do you plan on adding any additional craft weapons, especially missles? IIRC Area 51 had something akin to the Stormlance, but with alien alloys instead of Elerium. Seeing how we already have alloy ammunition for pretty much everything else, an alien alloy fragmentation warhead on an air-to-air missile doesn't seem too far off, especially as a stop-gap measure for light missile hardpoints.

Yeah, I plan to work on it a bit more. But I should identify what is needed first. I'll probably start with something to arm the MiG with...
I'm not saying no to an alloy missile, but how would it work? Why exactly would it be better than something made with Earth materials?

[Lohland]

On a totally unrelated note, do you plan on adding any additional craft weapons, especially missles?

Here's a rocket, buddy. True, this is the final missile. Connect as a normal mod.

[Solarius Scorch]

Here's a rocket, buddy. True, this is the final missile. Connect as a normal mod.

The Bomb to End All Bombs, eh?