[OLD] Old OXCE+ discussion thread

[Dioxine]

+ Revert "Bow miss fix" (because it was causing unwanted side effects), more info: https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,4058.msg71057.html#msg71057

Not sure it was a good idea... the weird behaviour reported was much, much rarer and not even 10% as annoying due to being obvious, not hidden like the bow bug is.

Should I wait till it's fixed? Or release the game with re-crappified bows?

EDIT: also what does STR_FULL_NIGHT_VISION option do?

[Meridian]

Not sure it was a good idea... the weird behaviour reported was much, much rarer and not even 10% as annoying due to being obvious, not hidden like the bow bug is.
Should I wait till it's fixed? Or release the game with re-crappified bows?

The problem is, it might have side effects we don't know about.
I tried debugging it, but it will take some time until I understand all different scenarios... and even more to test them.
Unless karadoc fixes it soon, I'd recommend releasing the version with re-crappified bows.

EDIT: also what does STR_FULL_NIGHT_VISION option do?

With option ON... it is the original behavior by Stoddard (global night vision across the map),
with option OFF... the night vision is only applied around your units... if something is not in their night vision range, it will remain dark.

I left the option for people to play with initially... but I will most likely remove the option and leave the OFF option only... to me it seems a lot better and more intuitive.

[Dioxine]

Thx. Makes sense.

[Stoddard]

With option ON... it is the original behavior by Stoddard (global night vision across the map),
with option OFF... the night vision is only applied around your units... if something is not in their night vision range, it will remain dark.

I left the option for people to play with initially... but I will most likely remove the option and leave the OFF option only... to me it seems a lot better and more intuitive.

Nice.

I went and replaced the squared-distance comparison with

Code: [Select]

(*i)->hasVisibleTile(tile)
Result is that you have some idea what your unit's field of vision is IF there are no light sources in the way.

Side effect of both variants is that other lighted areas stay lighted, with FOVs it looks plain ugly.

image upload

But this all runs contary to solving the original problem - that you don't see the terrain that you discovered and thus lack information to plan, while you have that information at day.

I think the global night vision should stay as it is, and there be some separate means to see the fields of view, or not.

Edit: I must say that local night vision is great.

[niculinux]

This thread must go sticky please Any wiil?

[Dioxine]

But this all runs contary to solving the original problem - that you don't see the terrain that you discovered and thus lack information to plan, while you have that information at day.

That's really not a problem. With how it works now (especially on localized vision setting - total vision looks way worse), it's like driving a ferrari. Night missions are suddenly fun to play.

[Stoddard]

That's really not a problem. With how it works now (especially on localized vision setting - total vision looks way worse), it's like driving a ferrari. Night missions are suddenly fun to play.

Yes, I came to exactly the  same opinion after all.

[Eddie]

I have a small request concerning getting experience when using shotguns. I just played a mission where my two shotgun gals got no experience at all, despite killing lots of stuff. One had three kills and the other had two. There was probably some bad luck involved, but 5 kills with no experience is just not right.

Could there be a mechanism that counts kills as battle participation so the gals can at least get secondary stat increases? This would also reward indirect kills by shooting exploding barrels, which I think don't give experience right now. Stangely, the diary counted one of the shotgun kills as indirect, but there was no exploding stuff involved.

[Meridian]

I have a small request concerning getting experience when using shotguns. I just played a mission where my two shotgun gals got no experience at all, despite killing lots of stuff. One had three kills and the other had two. There was probably some bad luck involved, but 5 kills with no experience is just not right.

Could there be a mechanism that counts kills as battle participation so the gals can at least get secondary stat increases? This would also reward indirect kills by shooting exploding barrels, which I think don't give experience right now. Stangely, the diary counted one of the shotgun kills as indirect, but there was no exploding stuff involved.

It already works like that.

If you have between 1 and 2 experience points/kills, you can get either +0 or +1 to stats.
If you have between 3 and 5 experience points/kills, you can get either +1 +2 or +3 to stats.

Considering both of your gals had 2 kills (as diary says), it is pretty possible to roll 2 times +0 stats (chance of that is exactly 25%).

[Arthanor]

Is the roll to all stats at once (either you improve or you don't) or for each specific stat (maybe you improve TUs but not STR, etc.)? Because that affects the odds of "no improvement whatsoever" significantly.

I also remember something where only the first pellet of a shotgun multiple pellet shot awarded experience points, to avoid getting 7 experience points at once when hitting with all 7 pellets. If the 1st one misses, it is quite possible for the others to hit and kill their victim but award no xp. A better implementation might be to treat all pellets equally xp wise, but cap the awarded xp at 1/shot (ie track h = number of pellet hits, if h > 0, award 1 xp).

[Starving Poet]

I'm not sure if this is an OXCE+ or OXCE bug - but it seems to take an inordinate amount of TU to close certain types of doors.

See attached image.
Door 1 opens and closes as expected.  Door 2 can only be closed by walking through it.  Right Clicking results in a not enough TU warning.

[Meridian]

Is the roll to all stats at once (either you improve or you don't) or for each specific stat (maybe you improve TUs but not STR, etc.)? Because that affects the odds of "no improvement whatsoever" significantly.

I also remember something where only the first pellet of a shotgun multiple pellet shot awarded experience points, to avoid getting 7 experience points at once when hitting with all 7 pellets. If the 1st one misses, it is quite possible for the others to hit and kill their victim but award no xp. A better implementation might be to treat all pellets equally xp wise, but cap the awarded xp at 1/shot (ie track h = number of pellet hits, if h > 0, award 1 xp).

Each stat rolls separately.

As for pellets, maybe test it and let me know? I don't use shotguns... save would be nice as well.

I'm not sure if this is an OXCE+ or OXCE bug - but it seems to take an inordinate amount of TU to close certain types of doors.

See attached image.
Door 1 opens and closes as expected.  Door 2 can only be closed by walking through it.  Right Clicking results in a not enough TU warning.

A save please.
But yeah, I noticed that several times too... not sure if OXC or OXCE or OXCE+ or feature

[Arthanor]

Each stat rolls separately.

As for pellets, maybe test it and let me know? I don't use shotguns... save would be nice as well.

If each stat rolls separately, the odds of not getting anything on 2 soldiers (even assuming 50% odds per stat) is pretty low. TU/Stam/Strength/Acc for 2 soldiers is 8 rolls, .5^8 = 0.4%

I am not sure how to test this. Shoot at an enemy repeatedly with a shotgun and see how likely you are to get nothing even after multiple hits?

I'll cook a save for Piratez, something like a personal armor dude with no weapon to shotgun repeatedly safely.

[Starving Poet]

Sure thing - I tested this in OXC, it doesn't replicate the bug and this is just the default port attack tileset.

[Starving Poet]

I am not sure how to test this. Shoot at an enemy repeatedly with a shotgun and see how likely you are to get nothing even after multiple hits?

If the logic hasn't changed - you need to get 11 successful actions / PSI attempts to guarantee a stat increase.