Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - N10 24-Nov-2024 Aurora's Dawn

[Yankes]

I am surprised (and disappointed) by this turn of events on the vision thing. I agree that putting the maximum vision range as a moddable value is not the right place (because then everyone would have to go in the Piratez ruleset every time they update and rechange it from whatever Dioxine decides to put in)

one way to proper override is simply create mod that is loaded after xpiratez that change value to more proper one. It could be added as part of official release.

[Hazard]

Uhh... I just noticed that I don't seem to be able to actually spot anyone further than 20 tiles out, even though I can see terrain as far as 30 tiles. Is this intended?

[Dioxine]

Well, against putting the max view distance in a config - a mod has to be balanced with a set vision in mind. If this is an option, yeah, the modder can say 'use this and that option setting' but isn't it much simpler if such things are configured via ruleset? It is much easier to write a small mod that overrides that (or any) value for vanilla or any mod, than compiling a custom executable.

I'd actually vote for putting every advanced option as a ruleset option. It would work like this: When you change values in the menu, the game saves them not in some shady config, but as a ruleset file (in the proper master mod or vanilla 'user' folder). And again, it would search for such a ruleset file when loading up a mod/options screen. That way, both can the user easily modify such values, and a modder can customize a .rul file with all the proper presets which were intended for the mod. It would really save a lot of fuss for the user with setting all the proper options, while allowing modders to stay away from becoming coders (because being a coder is sort of a 4life thing, and not everyone wants to make such a commitment)

[Arthanor]

@Hazard: I play with a vision range of 25 and haven't had that problem. Are you sure it's not just some hard to spot enemy that wasn't in LoS until later? I guess you could spot an enemy in the open and move back until you don't see them anymore?

@Dioxine: Yeah, I generally agree that it would be good to have a "config mod" that sets the gameplay relevant options properly. Having configs as a file that can be exported could work. You already export yours often enough with the executable Although in that case it's the whole config, including resolution (which would cause my game to crash as my laptop can't handle resizing the game in full screen) and debug mode (= no quick save anymore ). Having a proper setup where you can list only the options that should be changed would be much nicer.

However, for things like vision range that affect performance, it can't be in a mod unless it's also easy to change from the default/mod value for the user in the GUI. Asking users to go in the mod to change values defeats the purpose as it's no easier to change it in a mod than in the config file.

[Hazard]

@ Arthanor

I've been playing test battles on various flat environments and my units simply don't spot anyone beyond 20 tiles on a straight line. As I said, terrain is revealed around a 30 tile radius, but not enemies, they pop up way after the fog of war has disappeared. Enemy markers stop blinking when I move a unit back and turn around so that they are more than 20 tiles from an enemy, and no reaction fire occurs beyond that range either from my units or the enemy. Changing the max view distance to 25 only limited the "terrain" vision range, enemies were still invisible beyond 20 tiles.

So yeah, I'm pretty confused about this.

[Solarius Scorch]

@ Arthanor

I've been playing test battles on various flat environments and my units simply don't spot anyone beyond 20 tiles on a straight line. As I said, terrain is revealed around a 30 tile radius, but not enemies, they pop up way after the fog of war has disappeared. Enemy markers stop blinking when I move a unit back and turn around so that they are more than 20 tiles from an enemy, and no reaction fire occurs beyond that range either from my units or the enemy. Changing the max view distance to 25 only limited the "terrain" vision range, enemies were still invisible beyond 20 tiles.

So yeah, I'm pretty confused about this.

Yeah, I remember this has already popped up. Can't remember the explanation, but the next version will take us back to 20 tile vision, so whatever.

[Meridian]

@Hazard: I play with a vision range of 25 and haven't had that problem. Are you sure it's not just some hard to spot enemy that wasn't in LoS until later? I guess you could spot an enemy in the open and move back until you don't see them anymore?

In the official version shipped with 0.98b (2016-03-27) it is exactly like Hazard describes... only the viewRange was increased to 30. The actual visibility was still 20... moddable per armor, but 20 by default.
I changed it later so the default is not 20, but maxViewRange (i.e. 30 in this case)... since version 2016-04-02... so that dioxine doesn't have to change all the armors manually.

[Hazard]

Okay thanks, that explains it. I take it I would need to add a specific line to all entries in the Piratez_Armors.rul, right? What would that be?

[Meridian]

Okay thanks, that explains it. I take it I would need to add a specific line to all entries in the Piratez_Armors.rul, right? What would that be?

To all armors you would need to add:

Code: [Select]

visibilityAtDay: 30

[Hazard]

Thank you. Though instead of going at it by hand I could just stop being a goddamn idiot and download the latest .exe from your thread.

[Meridian]

Thank you. Though instead of going at it by hand I could just stop being a goddamn idiot and download the latest .exe from your thread.

Latest is not the best, you won't recover any more corpses in that version, because of some incompatibilities.

I'd recommend version from 2014-04-07, here: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B8itkFQbhj-YMEdaV0xlYVg3b3M

[Hazard]

Alright, thanks again.

[Arthanor]

In the official version shipped with 0.98b (2016-03-27) it is exactly like Hazard describes... only the viewRange was increased to 30. The actual visibility was still 20... moddable per armor, but 20 by default.
I changed it later so the default is not 20, but maxViewRange (i.e. 30 in this case)... since version 2016-04-02... so that dioxine doesn't have to change all the armors manually.

Oh! wow, I hadn't realize it had changed so much between the "shipped version" and the one I compiled!

Just to make sure, I un-commented the one line you commented out in the "hardcode default 20" commit, and that's really all I need to do to retain the full functionality (of revealing terrain, spotting and reacting to enemies), right?

[Meridian]

Yes.

[Rince Wind]

In program just kill them anyway the net score should still be in your favor

Oft course I kill them. It is still disappointing to have a negative score after killing all enemies and even saving some civs. But this is nothing major. I love this mod (and just started a screenshot LP [in German]).

Also, is there a way to change the screenshot folder?