Author Topic: Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - N1 29-Apr-2022 Every Day Is Caturday  (Read 2467488 times)

Offline AhsokaTaHo

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7365 on: November 28, 2019, 01:53:12 am »
Excuse me for my English. I accepted the fact that my ship is hit in the window, and my soldiers can 't shoot from the inside. I accepted that enemies with guns with little distance from the other end of the map get into me. BUT for what? Do grenades hit me from the same other end of the map when the enemy doesn 't even see me?

Offline BBHood217

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7366 on: November 28, 2019, 03:00:47 am »
Some enemies employ the spotter-sniper tactic where one of them spots your gals and another enemy who can't personally see them shoots at them (or throws grenades at them).  You do it all the time, so why can't they?

Offline Eddie

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7367 on: November 28, 2019, 03:46:19 am »
The enemy actually can do more than you.
If an enemy with the spotter tag sees you, he will have map hack on your unit for 2-3 turns. He will still know where you are next round, even if he can't see you.
If you score a ranged hit on a spotter and he survives, this counts as him seeing you. Even if the enemy had no vision of the shooter.

Offline Rince Wind

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7368 on: November 28, 2019, 10:41:46 am »
Yeah, but you can formulate a tactic and plan ahead, the AI can't do that. If you see an enemy hide behind a corner you can throw a grenade as well, without some sort of hack the AI can't even do that. You can properly coordinate your units, the AI looks at each one individually and doesn't use teamwork to achive a goal. Speaking of which: the AI has no goal apart from being an obstacle to you (and kill civilians in certain missions), it will never mount a proper attack to drive you off and it won't ever defend chokepoints properly. It is also mostly bad at melee, one of the strongest forms of attack.

Offline AhsokaTaHo

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7369 on: November 28, 2019, 01:33:49 pm »
I hope who invented the muton-like mercenaries will be a bitterness. There 's nothing to be killed. Vanshotat. I barely learned a laser weapon. And here they are already on the base.

Offline Kato

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7370 on: November 28, 2019, 01:37:31 pm »
This is a cruel world, you know.

Offline legionof1

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7371 on: November 28, 2019, 02:15:07 pm »
The trick to the muton expies is very simple, anything but bullets. Resistance profiles matter a ton here unlike vanilla or a number of other mods. Here the right damage type for the foe is a very significant mechanic.   

Offline Ethereal_Medic

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7372 on: November 28, 2019, 06:17:44 pm »
Mercenaries are one of the hardest opponents to crack.
Solid ammunition is pointless. Laser and Plasma does work. Throw explosives, plant mines, purge them with fire.

Offline Gremlion

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7373 on: November 28, 2019, 06:55:15 pm »
I hope who invented the muton-like mercenaries will be a bitterness. There 's nothing to be killed. Vanshotat. I barely learned a laser weapon. And here they are already on the base.
They don't have cutting resistance, concussive damage is fine too.

Quote
If your opponent is a far better speaker than yourself, ax him a question.
- Mun Tzu

mace is quite early tech and works fine.

Offline Rubber Cannonball

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7374 on: December 02, 2019, 12:05:15 am »
If an enemy with the spotter tag sees you, he will have map hack on your unit for 2-3 turns. He will still know where you are next round, even if he can't see you.  If you score a ranged hit on a spotter and he survives, this counts as him seeing you. Even if the enemy had no vision of the shooter.

I'm pretty sure the spotter doesn't have to survive.  On one night time merc mission I had a gal in ghost armor beam a commando in the back on turn one.  The commando spins around and dies.  On enemy turn, gal is shot at by long range plasma which all missed and grenaded.  No other enemy unit was close enough to spot her during my turn or the enemy's turn.  Save scummed and killed commando with ghost dagger from behind.  Gal was not targeted during the enemy turn.  Still curious about this so save scummed again and killed commando with ghost dagger from in front thus being spotted.  Ghost armor gal was again shot at and grenaded on the enemy turn.

I'm positive no other enemy unit got close enough to spot the ghost gal.

I know camping is frowned upon, and this mod has introduced several changes to try to minimize camping.  But this particular mechanic really promotes camping.  Although if one's troops can't advance from solid cover without being massacred, they aren't camping; they are pinned down!

Offline Dioxine

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7375 on: December 02, 2019, 02:28:36 am »
I know camping is frowned upon, and this mod has introduced several changes to try to minimize camping.  But this particular mechanic really promotes camping.  Although if one's troops can't advance from solid cover without being massacred, they aren't camping; they are pinned down!

Exactly. Also who said it is "frowned upon".

Offline Rubber Cannonball

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7376 on: December 02, 2019, 05:37:46 am »
No one in those exact words.  Just the general impression I got from reading all the posts in the x-piratez subforum.

Offline Devon_v

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7377 on: December 02, 2019, 04:44:25 pm »
It's more a matter of working with the AI's limitations. Vanilla the best tactic is a bunch of sharpshooters hanging back and one speedy spotter finding targets for them. Frankly it's still the best tactic, but the key differences are that there are a lot more maps and scenarios where it's less optimal, and the enemy can do it too, to a degree. It's unfortunate that the AI has to cheat to accomplish it, but it was never designed to do otherwise, and strong "fair" AI is far more challenging to write and demanding to run.

Offline Ethereal_Medic

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7378 on: December 02, 2019, 04:50:33 pm »
If anyone is cheating, it's the player.
Force-firing a thin wall with autoshot to hit an enemy standing behind it (which we spotted with an aye-phone) is some next level stuff the A.I. could never do.

The current state of the A.I. is absolutely fine.

Offline Devon_v

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Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - K2 - 2 Nov - Ice Ice Cool
« Reply #7379 on: December 02, 2019, 08:11:34 pm »
If anyone is cheating, it's the player.
Force-firing a thin wall with autoshot to hit an enemy standing behind it (which we spotted with an aye-phone) is some next level stuff the A.I. could never do.

The current state of the A.I. is absolutely fine.

It could if it were programmed to. AI is usually handicapped because playing against an opponent that does what you can do, while also having the numerical and statistical advantage, is rarely fun.

I was referring specifically to the map hax anyway. I can do sniper/spotter, but I don't get permanent vision on the target for X turns. It's a cheat which is a workaround for how much harder is to teach an AI to pay attention and remember things in a human like way. AI almost always operate with perfect information. They know everything, but they are programmed not to act on that information.

I'm saying the AI cheats, and that's fine, because it's not smart enough to win fair.