Re: The X-Com Files - 3.5: Whispers In The Dark

[Fiskun1]

Thanks for the update!
It is very interesting to follow the development of mod. Probably, this can also be considered a mod game 

[termidor]

Congrats on the new release, very good to see the mod alive and well 👍

[Solarius Scorch]

Thanks, guys! I'm already working on the next release, which will finally see the introduction of Anti-E115 weapons (similar to Chryssalid Gas from Piratez).

[Fiskun1]

Thank you for the good news! And also, if I'm not mistaken, someone promised to pay more attention to the late stage of the game...

[Solarius Scorch]

Thank you for the good news! And also, if I'm not mistaken, someone promised to pay more attention to the late stage of the game...

Anti-E115 is... late-ish...?

But yeah, you're right.

[alexander steel wolf]

Hi!

I have tried version 2.6, and I have to say that the confrontations with the ghosts have seemed incredible to me (special mention to the music). They feel very novel and have a fairly appropriate difficulty. I hope this arc continues to develop and brings many more surprises.

I would also like to ask you a couple of questions that have arisen:

1º Do you plan to further develop the arc of the harheads (those robots that pass for humans and have factories). I think they're associated with T'leth, but it might be interesting if there was an AI like Skynet, and try to infiltrate the council or something. (I haven't played since version 2.2, but I don't think there has been any news about it. If so, I'm sorry I didn't let you know sooner)

2º Are there plans to explain and expand in arc form, those creatures from the sewers? (silt I think they were called), which look a lot like silacoids.

Thanks!

[Solarius Scorch]

I have tried version 2.6, and I have to say that the confrontations with the ghosts have seemed incredible to me (special mention to the music). They feel very novel and have a fairly appropriate difficulty. I hope this arc continues to develop and brings many more surprises.

Glad to hear that.
Kudos to Cosmic Afro, who is the main creator behind this arc!

1º Do you plan to further develop the arc of the harheads (those robots that pass for humans and have factories). I think they're associated with T'leth

Yes, they are made using T'leth tech. (Although it would be more accurate to say that they are humans that pass for robots...)

but it might be interesting if there was an AI like Skynet, and try to infiltrate the council or something. (I haven't played since version 2.2, but I don't think there has been any news about it. If so, I'm sorry I didn't let you know sooner)

We have a lot of factions already... Perhaps too many.

Some computer cult would be possible, but I have no such plans.

2º Are there plans to explain and expand in arc form, those creatures from the sewers? (silt I think they were called), which look a lot like silacoids.

Not really.

[alexander steel wolf]

Thanks for the answers!

I have some suggestions on that:

1º I think either the sewer quest should be removed, or those creatures should be associated with the syndicate. Right now it is a mission with a derisory penalty, it does not add anything to the investigation and the story, and on top of that it gives the feeling that it is "residual" content. The content should always be focused on making the player want to "replay" and go deeper into those missions, and not as a simple paperwork.

2º I'm playing x-piratez and I have seen to my surprise that there are "paths" (codex, gals are superior...), I thought that maybe the excess of factions could be solved in a similar way. By getting promotion three, the secret factions would contact you (illuminati, the grid...) and you could choose one of them or none ("masochistic" path). In this way, you would choose who you want to have as enemies and who you don't (I don't know if that can be done currently in the mod). For example, if you choose the illuminati, the men in black would be your allies and missions from them would never appear (and if one day there was already a different ending based on this choice, it would be perfect). I know that as a player it's easy to "imagine" too much, but I'll leave it there just in case.

[Solarius Scorch]

1º I think either the sewer quest should be removed, or those creatures should be associated with the syndicate. Right now it is a mission with a derisory penalty, it does not add anything to the investigation and the story, and on top of that it gives the feeling that it is "residual" content. The content should always be focused on making the player want to "replay" and go deeper into those missions, and not as a simple paperwork.

Sorry, I don't understand. Are you saying the mission is too boring? Or that it doesn't fit the overall theme of the mod? Because "it's not related to a bigger arc" doesn't tell me much.

2º I'm playing x-piratez and I have seen to my surprise that there are "paths" (codex, gals are superior...), I thought that maybe the excess of factions could be solved in a similar way. By getting promotion three, the secret factions would contact you (illuminati, the grid...) and you could choose one of them or none ("masochistic" path). In this way, you would choose who you want to have as enemies and who you don't (I don't know if that can be done currently in the mod). For example, if you choose the illuminati, the men in black would be your allies and missions from them would never appear (and if one day there was already a different ending based on this choice, it would be perfect). I know that as a player it's easy to "imagine" too much, but I'll leave it there just in case.

I do have such ideas, in fact! But I don't know if I ever get there...

[alexander steel wolf]

Ok, I hope to see ideas like that one day (although I suppose it will be very difficult and tedious to program).

Regarding the sewer mission, I don't mean one thing or the other. Let's see if I can explain myself with google.

As a player I perceive that this mod offers a perspective of a more detective x-com. That is, not only is there to stop the invasion, but to solve all kinds of mysteries. In that sense, the mission of the sewers would not be out of place (and personally I don't find it boring either).

The problem is that I see that the mod has an "internal logic". Threats fall into two categories:

1º Those that are part of popular folklore (they are myths and legends about creatures and events that do not appear in the mod)

2ºThose that in the end do turn out to be real.

Everything that is part of the second group becomes a priority for x-com, either destroying the threat and investigating where it comes from (and already reaching the conclusion if it is better to "leave it alone", as if it happens with the dimension x, or try to destroy it permanently).

It is true that not everything has to have an explanation (in fact, sometimes it is for the best), but there is no investigation after the mission that tries to reflect that x-com has tried to investigate the nature of the threat (or at least is very vague, treated more like a legend than something real).

The "wizard did it" philosophy could also be applied, but I think it would then work better as a self-contained quest, like the thing's quest, that had a reward upon completion (eg receiving 1000 points).

In conclusion: it does not add anything to the story, it does not pose any threat (as it has a very low penalty and there are many other missions to do each month), it does not have any reward, and I feel that it does not follow an internal logic either. Since there are many ideas to develop, it is still better to discard this idea (or at least reform it, even if it is not in the form of an arc).

Thanks for the patience!

[Vakrug]

I think they're associated with T'leth

Yes, they are made using T'leth tech.

But how does jarheads related to "The Bureau: XCOM Declassified"? Or may be they are related to "UNIT"? But I can't figure out what was the basis for that "UNIT". This is not an XCOM game, right?

Let's see if I can explain myself with google.

Well, let me help you! 
It was a brilliant idea from a storytelling perspective to combine every single piece of XCOM lore (including Xenonauts) into a single game. You should have stopped there, but you didn't and included in this game completely unrelated stuff: ghosts, xenomorphs, that goo from sewer and even DOOM! Right now that stuff is incorporated in the game pretty badly. Technically mutnat-animals, zombies and underground creatures also are not part of XCOM lore, but their stories are written better.

By the way, after I started to play XPiratez I made a conclusion, that XCOM Files is actually a prequel to XPiratez (an older mod), and not so much an extension to original XCOM. Is it true?

[Solarius Scorch]

@alexander steel wolf:
All right, now I think I fully get your point.

I understand the need for consistency, but I have to say, your standards are very strict.

I added this mission mostly for a gameplay reason - to make the player battle under atypical circumstances (special environment and special enemies). It is not the only one-off mission like this; for instance, Asylum Apparitions was a good example for years (although more ghost missions were added later).

I am not going to remove this mission, that's for sure. It's there for a reason. What should I do - make a whole arc with an ooze invasion? Nah. Tie this to some already present force, like the Syndicate? Maybe...

But how does jarheads related to "The Bureau: XCOM Declassified"? Or may be they are related to "UNIT"? But I can't figure out what was the basis for that "UNIT". This is not an XCOM game, right?

I... don't get what you mean. What about X-Com Declassified? What is a "basis for UNIT"? What is not an X-Com game (because XCF definitely is)?

By the way, after I started to play XPiratez I made a conclusion, that XCOM Files is actually a prequel to XPiratez (an older mod), and not so much an extension to original XCOM. Is it true?

Yeah, I mean it's not super set in stone or whatever, but in general Dioxine and I are following the same canon. So yes, you can think of Piratez as "XCF 600 years after X-Com lost", if you want.

Maybe one day we'll make a mod 600 years after X-Com won!

[Vakrug]

I... don't get what you mean. What about X-Com Declassified? What is a "basis for UNIT"? What is not an X-Com game (because XCF definitely is)?

Research tree: https://xcf.trigramreactor.net/master/article/STR_XCOM_HISTORY_UNIT
You need to research Xenonauts and Jarheads to research UNIT. (And "Bureau" is next in line.) Is that a pure coincidence?

Yeah, I mean it's not super set in stone or whatever, but in general Dioxine and I are following the same canon. So yes, you can think of Piratez as "XCF 600 years after X-Com lost", if you want.
Maybe one day we'll make a mod 600 years after X-Com won!

That is one sensational revelation!
In that case few things bother me in this story.
First, originally (in original XCOM) Deep Ones were dormant and only the destruction of Cydonia awoken them. But it looks like this is not the case in XCOM Files. So why nobody noticed them earlier?
Second, when zombie parasite was researched initially, player was told that basically aliens are spreading them from UFOs. But then it appears that zombies existed for a long time. And in XPirates they are referred as cosmic plague or something. Sadly I haven't finished zombie arc (because it is much easier to kill an alien brain than to figure out how to progress in secondary stories  ), so may be answers are there, but right now I feel like numbers does not adds up...

[alexander steel wolf]

Ok, having the creatures from the sewer quest become part of the syndicate would be a good solution. In that case, I would add that the mission had a higher penalty (at least -150), so it would already have the incentive of being a threat to the monthly score.

[Solarius Scorch]

Research tree: https://xcf.trigramreactor.net/master/article/STR_XCOM_HISTORY_UNIT
You need to research Xenonauts and Jarheads to research UNIT. (And "Bureau" is next in line.) Is that a pure coincidence?

It's not a coincidence. They just aesthetically fit the concept of UNIT... So why not them?

That is one sensational revelation!
In that case few things bother me in this story.
First, originally (in original XCOM) Deep Ones were dormant and only the destruction of Cydonia awoken them. But it looks like this is not the case in XCOM Files. So why nobody noticed them earlier?

Yeah, this is a bit of a sensitive topic. Gnerally speaking, during the events of XCF, T'Leth is sleeping (and will take a couple decades after your victory for it to truly activate), but some of its agents (mostly Deep Ones) are somewhat active, mostly chilling in depths or making periodical incursions into the surface world to probe it.

It is not 100% in line with TFTD's story, but to be perfectly honest the game was mostly a rushed reskin of X-Com 1 and its writing was questionable in many places. In general I do consider it canon, but I don't fret over all the little details, because the studio didn't care much about consistency either.

Second, when zombie parasite was researched initially, player was told that basically aliens are spreading them from UFOs. But then it appears that zombies existed for a long time. And in XPirates they are referred as cosmic plague or something. Sadly I haven't finished zombie arc (because it is much easier to kill an alien brain than to figure out how to progress in secondary stories  ), so may be answers are there, but right now I feel like numbers does not adds up...

Well, long story short, both are true: UFOs experiment with them, much like they experiment on cows and humans. But still, the zombie presence on Earth is very old... Finishing that arc should answer your question at least partially.

Ok, having the creatures from the sewer quest become part of the syndicate would be a good solution. In that case, I would add that the mission had a higher penalty (at least -150), so it would already have the incentive of being a threat to the monthly score.

OK; right now I can't put it very high on the priority list, but I'll keep this in mind.