Author Topic: Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - L9 30-Apr-2021 Personal Attention  (Read 1783146 times)

Offline Dioxine

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #900 on: October 09, 2015, 11:17:26 am »
Dioxine, I need to add two more weapons to the bootypedia ingame? What list index do you suggest? The way they are now they are overwriting two other weapons...

Haha, tough question :) There is a complex pattern to it, but it's too complex for me to remember or write down here, plus it often changes as the weapon library grows :3 My rulesets were never intended to be friendly to anyone. If you have something to submit, better leave incorporating it to me...

Offline Cristao

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #901 on: October 09, 2015, 01:13:55 pm »
Haha, tough question :) There is a complex pattern to it, but it's too complex for me to remember or write down here, plus it often changes as the weapon library grows :3 My rulesets were never intended to be friendly to anyone. If you have something to submit, better leave incorporating it to me...

Already added. I must say it is a whole different game to the normal OpenXCOM. I have a question. I was able to build a Kraken and a pachymeter ( sp?). However what weapons can they equip? I think I only get 1 Bonny Ventura throughout the game.

Offline Dioxine

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #902 on: October 09, 2015, 02:02:29 pm »
Answers for that are all in the Pedia - craft weapons have varied types, and each craft can take only some types. If you think the game needs new weapons, why don't you share your ideas? Otherwise you can end up either adding what's already there (or not supposed to be there), therefore ruining the experience for yourself; if you share and consult with someone who knows how the mod is balanced and everything that is there, eg. myself, you can, conversely, improve the experience for us all.

Offline Hobbes

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #903 on: October 09, 2015, 05:24:15 pm »
Naw, it's checked and re-checked dozens of times, got these problems when I was a beginner but not nowadays.

(the map is Dawn City, it's crash-free afaik; map crashes happen on Railyard and Commercial).

I've already rechecked last night Dawn City's MCD files, which are the usual culprits for terrain bugs. Even though I've checked and rechecked those files several times I still find the occasional wrong value  (wrong ScanG settings appeared last night), although on this case nothing that justifies a crash, since ScanGs are used for the minimap and that is crash free.

My point is, being experienced is not a guarantee that you won't make beginner mistakes anymore. If you have 100 settings to check than chances are that you'll miss one of them. And the more stuff you have to check the bigger the odds that you'll do a slip up.

Or, an even better analogy - when I was learning to drive my instructor told me this: "you don't need to worry much the first or second year of driving, because mistakes there are normal and you'll be worried enough to try to avoid them. What you need to be concerned is when you believe that you are already a good driver - that's when people decide to take unnecessary risks because they are too overconfident and cause crashes"
« Last Edit: October 09, 2015, 05:30:31 pm by Hobbes »

Offline Dioxine

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #904 on: October 09, 2015, 07:32:11 pm »
I've never had a map crash on Dawn City before, so no need to get overworked, Hobbes :)

After indepth analysis and many experiments, I think I know what causes the problem.
1. Spartan Scout #1 ends turn
2. Spartan Scout #2 tries to throw grenade
3. Game crashes - probably to LOF issues, since the throw is very tricky, going up the elevator.

All the equipment works normally, and after removing grenades from this spartan (and yet another one who tries to throw grenade inside a building as well), the game doesn't crash. The grenades work normally when the player uses them, as well as when AI uses them - most of the time, at least :) They're vanilla grenades.

So my verdict is, OXCom engine + complex map = AI grenade throw crash (probably any arcing weapon will cause it, not only a grenade), probably due to AI trying to throw grenade up/down an elevator (the ladder, in this case). Otherwise, there is something peculiar about your ladders, Hobbes - make sure to re-check them :) I can't pester the devs about this because it's not vanilla, so they'll probably tell me to beat it - mods are a hell to debug :)

Offline Arthanor

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #905 on: October 09, 2015, 07:46:41 pm »
Nice work Dioxine! :)

Could we reproduce a similar throw in vanilla OpenXCom with, say, a sectoid wanting to throw a alien grenade up a 1x1 UFO elevator shaft?

Ex.: Take a supply UFO save, delete all aliens but 1, move him at the bottom of the shaft that goes to the 3rd floor with only a grenade as weapon and put a soldier at the top of the shaft.

Although the devs might not want to look into a modded game, if it is an OpenXCom bug, that should get their attention.

Offline Dioxine

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #906 on: October 09, 2015, 08:27:41 pm »
Yes we can, but don't look at me, I use my free time to care after my mod :)
Besides there's no guarantee the vanilla elevators are the same as Hobbes' ladders. Although I think I had AI-used Flamer related crash on a vanilla ship map... there is of course also related bug that stops arcing autofire mid-burst (and thus conserves ammo) if the target drops out of LOS... but Arcing Autofire Is Not Vanilla!!! ;)

Offline Arthanor

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #907 on: October 09, 2015, 08:36:07 pm »
haha no worries! I am looking for ways to contribute to OpenXCom and my mod is pretty much fallen into neglect now, so I might look more into that (eventually, I have little time these days :() If we can reproduce it with 100% non-modded game, then it could get looked at.

How did you manage to remove the grenades from the soldiers, btw? I thought one had to wait until after the "aliens' turn" but I never got there since the game would crash first.

Also, interesting bug that of arcing autofire. It's not vanilla, but it's a feature that available in the main branch of OpenXCom, so presumably, since the devs put the feature there, they might be inclined to debug it, especially if it is a side-effect of the (potentially 100% vanilla) grenade throwing thing.

Anyhow.. no more of this in XPiratez, I'll look into it when/if I have time and post in the proper place. Sorry for blaming spartans for the bug :P

Offline Dioxine

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #908 on: October 09, 2015, 08:45:55 pm »
How did you manage to remove the grenades from the soldiers, btw? I thought one had to wait until after the "aliens' turn" but I never got there since the game would crash first.

Deleted them from the save file (unit 1000001 is 2nd Spartan, for example, 1000002 is 2nd and so on; knowing that, look for items that have these numbers as owners).

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #909 on: October 09, 2015, 08:46:44 pm »
Sorry for blaming spartans for the bug :P

Poor Spartans, nobody loves them... :(

Offline Arthanor

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #910 on: October 09, 2015, 08:50:28 pm »
Deleted them from the save file (unit 1000001 is 2nd Spartan, for example, 1000002 is 2nd and so on; knowing that, look for items that have these numbers as owners).
Aah! I didn't look into the contents of the save enough... Thanks!

Poor Spartans, nobody loves them... :(

Ha! I quite "love" them actually! I'd much rather face a bunch of redneck elitist survivalists than academicians with cyberdiscs on my first terrors ;)

Offline robin

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #911 on: October 09, 2015, 08:52:51 pm »
related bug that stops arcing autofire mid-burst
could you explain a little? the spitter (erected stance) has arching autofire (usual 3-shots); i never noticed anything wrong (but my testing environment isn't as melee oriented as piratez, so i'm usually too far away to trigger autofire spam).

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #912 on: October 09, 2015, 08:59:27 pm »
could you explain a little? the spitter (erected stance) has arching autofire (usual 3-shots); i never noticed anything wrong (but my testing environment isn't as melee oriented as piratez, so i'm usually too far away to trigger autofire spam).

bug that stops arcing autofire mid-burst (and thus conserves ammo) if the target drops out of LOS...

Well, it's this one; I don't know how to explain it any further. In other words, if you attack the target with a flamethrower and kill/stun the target, and the target is no longer targetable (because it's no longer height 22, but now height 0 - laying on the ground), the weapon stops firing right then and there, without finishing the entire auto shot (which is 8 shots). It usually happens if you attack a flying unit and it drops behind some fence, or attack a unit that is below you through a lift (when you can target the unit, but not the tile the unit stands on).

Offline robin

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #913 on: October 09, 2015, 09:06:00 pm »
I see. Sorry for the little derail.

Offline Yankes

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Re: [TOTAL CONVERSION] Piratez Extended - 0.95A - 3 Oct - Star Gods' Revenge
« Reply #914 on: October 10, 2015, 02:09:02 am »
I've never had a map crash on Dawn City before, so no need to get overworked, Hobbes :)

After indepth analysis and many experiments, I think I know what causes the problem.
1. Spartan Scout #1 ends turn
2. Spartan Scout #2 tries to throw grenade
3. Game crashes - probably to LOF issues, since the throw is very tricky, going up the elevator.

All the equipment works normally, and after removing grenades from this spartan (and yet another one who tries to throw grenade inside a building as well), the game doesn't crash. The grenades work normally when the player uses them, as well as when AI uses them - most of the time, at least :) They're vanilla grenades.

So my verdict is, OXCom engine + complex map = AI grenade throw crash (probably any arcing weapon will cause it, not only a grenade), probably due to AI trying to throw grenade up/down an elevator (the ladder, in this case). Otherwise, there is something peculiar about your ladders, Hobbes - make sure to re-check them :) I can't pester the devs about this because it's not vanilla, so they'll probably tell me to beat it - mods are a hell to debug :)
Could you provide save game and list of used mods to reproduce this bug on my side? Then I could try fix it in my branch or in master branch (depending who fault is it :) ).