[SOURCEMOD] Brutal-OXCE 7.12.1

[Abyss]

Went through base defense mission with BAI aggression 2.
I liked it.
Camping MiB sectopod is beyond good and evil.

[Dioxine]

I tried playing the current version. After first taste, I like it so far. Enemies no longer wait like lambs to be slaughtered and move in a bit more coordinated fashion. I'm a bit apprehensive about missions dragging out if they hide too much, but that can be solved by the use of explosives.

[Dioxine]

Something is borked at a very basic level in reaction fire.

In one picture, you have agents lined one behind another. As soon as cultist came out of the door, they both reacted.

On the other one, the situation is the same, except you have them standing abreast. Only the agent next to the wall reacted, despite cultist burning all his TUs on shooting, and the other agent having high REA, half TUs and clear sight.

That's some really serious bug; and I have no explanation why it happened except using Brutal AI.

EDIT: after loading the save in OXCE 7.9.8, no Brutal AI, in the same situation both agents reacted as they should when standing abreast.

[Xilmi]

EDIT: after loading the save in OXCE 7.9.8, no Brutal AI, in the same situation both agents reacted as they should when standing abreast.

This sounds really odd.

Can you share this save with me? I'd like to investigate this issue.

I tried to reproduce the issue in a battle-scenario. To no avail. Everyone who I put in a line for the purpose of reaction-firing did so when it was their turn according to the rules. So something about the situation on the screenshot must be special.

Edit:
I'm seeing that it is rather dark on the screenshot. So I guess night-vision applies.
A unit that is in a badly lit tile can only be seen from up to 9 tiles away.
In a straight line the agent next to the wall is exactly 9 tiles away. The one standing abreast has a distance of 9.055 according to the pythagorean theorem. So more than 9. This is my hypothesis as for why he doesn't do reaction-fire.

[Dioxine]

I did not clarify what I meant by 'clear sight'. It means the cultist was within LoS; he advanced up to 6 tiles distance to both agents before opening fire.

To be honest, playing XPiratez for a couple of days (20-25 missions) before that I already had an impression that player units sometimes don't react when they should, but the situation was always too complex/chaotic to be sure and therefore I attributed it to Brutal AI saving lots of TU before advancing or me misjuding LoS.

Also your answer does not explain how both agents were able to react in exact same situation when I switched to normal OXCE (this time at range of 9 not 6, too).

Save attached.

[Xilmi]

I did not clarify what I meant by 'clear sight'. It means the cultist was within LoS; he advanced up to 6 tiles distance to both agents before opening fire.

To be honest, playing XPiratez for a couple of days (20-25 missions) before that I already had an impression that player units sometimes don't react when they should, but the situation was always too complex/chaotic to be sure and therefore I attributed it to Brutal AI saving lots of TU before advancing or me misjuding LoS.

Also your answer does not explain how both agents were able to react in exact same situation when I switched to normal OXCE (this time at range of 9 not 6, too).

Save attached.

I can't reproduce the issue even with your save:

https://youtu.be/LjNBKM01jwE

[Abyss]

So, what do you think of aggression 2.5, Xilmi?

[Xilmi]

So, what do you think of aggression 2.5, Xilmi?

Your wish has been granted. Check out the patch-notes for 7.2.0.

[Solarius Scorch]

I can't reproduce the issue even with your save:

For what it's worth, I can confirm Dio's problem - saw it with my own eyes.

I wish I could be more specific, but all I can say is that it's happened and it is a major problem.

[Xilmi]

For what it's worth, I can confirm Dio's problem - saw it with my own eyes.

I wish I could be more specific, but all I can say is that it's happened and it is a major problem.

I think I need concrete reproduction-steps. Ideally in video-form. In the save he attached the units aren't where they are on the screenshots. And if I move them there, they reaction-kill the enemy before he even can do anything. Maybe there's also sub-mods involved or specific option-settings. Ideally I'd like to have a zip with the options.cfg and all the relevant mods & submods.

I mean Speedislife has been streaming XCF with Brutal-OXCE since ages and neither him, me or any of his other viewers have reported anything the like.

Edit: Okay, I tried it again. I dropped Kaupo's weapon, so he can't kill the enemy. In this case Karim did not react 27,39,0 while the enemy was at 18,38,0. I switched both agents in the next attempt and in this case Karim reacted and Kaupo didn't. The enemy also couldn't attack the agent on 27,39,0. So it really seems that my initial hypothesis about the range being >9 is the issue here. It's right at the edge to be visible from 27,38,0 but not from 27,39,0.

Also when I don't enable night-vision, it is pitch-black there. On Dioxine's screenshot it is much more bright.

I'll now try with OXCE...
Screenshot is with OXCE 7.8.5 and as expected I didn't get a reaction either.

Edit 2: Tried with official 7.9.8 too and same result. Unit on 27,39,0 does not react to unit on 18,38,0. As it should be due to the darkness limiting vision to 9 tiles.

My current hypothesis as for why it supposedly has worked with that version is that there probably was some sort of always daytime mod enabled. This hypothesis is backed by how much brighter it is on Dioxine's screenshot than it is on the second one I just attached when I disable night-vision.

[panzer]

Hello. I found a small bug in version 7.2.2. Melee enemies attack you from a distance. Here is the save. Just boot up and make a move. Or turn your back on the enemies and make a move)))

[psavola]

My current hypothesis as for why it supposedly has worked with that version is that there probably was some sort of always daytime mod enabled. This hypothesis is backed by how much brighter it is on Dioxine's screenshot than it is on the second one I just attached when I disable night-vision.

I doubt that; using such a mod would show up in the save -- and you can adjust the brightness of the screen in OXCE, which will make even pitch-dark appear relatively bright (but does not affect the actual visibility). I suspect that's what's going on. Don't know about the rest, though.

[Xilmi]

Hello. I found a small bug in version 7.2.2. Melee enemies attack you from a distance. Here is the save. Just boot up and make a move. Or turn your back on the enemies and make a move)))

What mod is this save for? It doesn't show up in Vanilla.

[Xilmi]

I doubt that; using such a mod would show up in the save -- and you can adjust the brightness of the screen in OXCE, which will make even pitch-dark appear relatively bright (but does not affect the actual visibility). I suspect that's what's going on. Don't know about the rest, though.

Right. I would have gotten a message about different mods. So this is ruled out. What I can't rule out though is that the situation was probably not exactly the same with the tiles I mentioned.

[Xilmi]

Hello. I found a small bug in version 7.2.2. Melee enemies attack you from a distance. Here is the save. Just boot up and make a move. Or turn your back on the enemies and make a move)))

I loaded the save in X-Com-Files and got a message about missing mods.
But other than that there were Chupacabras and they all went into melee-range before attacking.
So this is the next bug-report I'm having trouble reproducing. :\