Author Topic: [Suggestion] Please Clairfy BOXCE Advanced Option 'shot dispersion'  (Read 436 times)

Offline 0xEBJC

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Xilmi,

In the advanced game menu for "Realistic accuracy shot dispersion". I am still confused as to what is realistic and what is normal?  I think it would be helpful to clarify the descriptions better.  Sorry I think I discussed this before but am still confused about the setting, which is enabled and which isn't and if I understand the feature correctly.

Is the following true?
0.) Realistic = tighter shot dispersion, more grouped around target location
1.) Normal = default OXC calculation

It's hard to tell if I understand these calculations correctly or have them backwards.  Another reason I'm confused is that 0 usually means disabled and 1 means enabled, so having 'realistic' as 0 is confusing also as it seams that 1 means enabling the feature but the word normal more appropriately describes the setting disabled.

This is how I would show and describe it in the menu, 0 for DISABLED, 1 for ENABLED.
0.) Normal, default OXC calculation
1.) Realistic, tighter shot dispersion, more grouped around target location



I understand that this feature was merged in from Joy Narical, but hoping for your help and insight, thank you.

Battlescape:
"Realistic accuracy and cover system" => Feature developed by Joy Narical and merged into Brutal-OXCE. Find the full documentation here: https://github.com/narical/openxcom-accuracy


Offline Xilmi

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Re: [Suggestion] Please Clairfy BOXCE Advanced Option 'shot dispersion'
« Reply #1 on: February 16, 2024, 12:15:28 am »
As far as I know "Normal" is not the same as the default OXC-calculation. The result is supposed to look similar to the result of the OXC-default-calculation but it uses a different algorithm to that.

If I remember correctly it was added for the sole reason that I said it's actually more furstrating for me to almost hit all the time as opposed to the missing shots spraying in a wider radius around the target.

Offline 0xEBJC

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Re: [Suggestion] Please Clairfy BOXCE Advanced Option 'shot dispersion'
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2024, 01:51:15 am »
I started looking at the code on github and found that '0' "Realistic" is more accurate & has a tighter grouping.  Until I actually looked at the code, I didn't know if 'Realistic" or "Normal" was more accurate.

Normal
accuracyDivider; // Default - Unchanged
distanceDivider = 3;

Realistic:
if (Options::battleRealisticShotDispersion == 0) {
  ++accuracyDivider; 
  distanceDivider = 5;
}

int accuracy_deviation = (accuracy_check - real_accuracy) / accuracyDivider;
int distance_deviation = distanceTiles / distanceDivider; // 1 voxel of deviation per X tiles of distance


I looked around the code a bit and found that the value for battleRealisticShotDispersion is used in a few locations, it might easier to leave the logic untouched and just change the text in the advanced config menu.




Here's my recommendation for clarification. Update the text in the advanced options menu to something like the following, otherwise I wouldn't have a clue what either option is doing.

"0> Realistic, higher accuracy, tighter shot dispersion grouping 1> Normal, closer to original OXC logic, lower accuracy and wider shot dispersion."
         

Offline Xilmi

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Re: [Suggestion] Please Clairfy BOXCE Advanced Option 'shot dispersion'
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2024, 04:55:41 pm »
Here's my recommendation for clarification. Update the text in the advanced options menu to something like the following, otherwise I wouldn't have a clue what either option is doing.

"0> Realistic, higher accuracy, tighter shot dispersion grouping 1> Normal, closer to original OXC logic, lower accuracy and wider shot dispersion."
Will do for 8.2.4. Should have for 8.2.3 but it was already too late. :o

Offline jnarical

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Re: [Suggestion] Please Clairfy BOXCE Advanced Option 'shot dispersion'
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2024, 10:22:38 am »
I started looking at the code on github and found that '0' "Realistic" is more accurate & has a tighter grouping.

Believe me, it was really hard to name those options. In their current (at the moment you wrote here) state, it was like 5+ iterations. OXC engine gives limited space for options' descriptions. The main intention was that "Realistic accuracy shot dispersion" option name implies this option works with Realistic accuracy only. If you want to get "original OXCE dispersion" you shoud disable RA alltogether.

"Normal" in that context means "closer to basic OXCE" - you get wider spread but (hopefully) not that insane 120 degree wide fire cone which you can encounter in base OXCE on a regular basis. "Realistic" means shots will land tightly around a target, with high probability of destroying its cover.

I agree that those options could have better description, I just haven't found the right wording yet.

Here's my recommendation for clarification. Update the text in the advanced options menu to something like the following, otherwise I wouldn't have a clue what either option is doing.

"0> Realistic, higher accuracy, tighter shot dispersion grouping 1> Normal, closer to original OXC logic, lower accuracy and wider shot dispersion."
"lower accuracy" is extremely confusing here, 'cause it stays the same in a game terms. "Tigher/wider shot dispersion" is also confusing - tigher than what? wider than what? What's the base point to count from? I've tried different variants of descriptions (more or less like yours) - and I didn't like them all. That's why I've decided to make them the way they are now... To me, it's better when player gets confused, knows that he got confused, tries both options and determines which one is best for him personally. Instead of player thinking he knows what different options means, but actually being confused by wrong wording.

upd:
my current guess how the description should look like:

Realistic accuracy shot dispersion:
0> Realistic - tight spread, high chance to destroy target cover  1> Normal - tigher than vanilla, wider then "Realistic"
« Last Edit: April 09, 2024, 10:37:24 am by jnarical »

Offline Xilmi

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Re: [Suggestion] Please Clairfy BOXCE Advanced Option 'shot dispersion'
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2024, 11:53:42 am »
@jnarical:
Do you think you'll have time to take a look at the interaction of force-shooting and realistic accuracy?

I did some experiments with that yesterday and it seems like force-shooting at visible targets drastically increases hit-chance. At least according to the numbers on the cursor.

Offline 0xEBJC

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Re: [Suggestion] Please Clairfy BOXCE Advanced Option 'shot dispersion'
« Reply #6 on: April 10, 2024, 05:28:37 pm »
Believe me, it was really hard to name those options. ...
...
...
upd:
my current guess how the description should look like:

Realistic accuracy shot dispersion:
0> Realistic - tight spread, high chance to destroy target cover  1> Normal - tighter than vanilla, wider then "Realistic"

Those updated descriptions look good and are clear.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2024, 07:38:13 pm by 0xEBJC »