Author Topic: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!  (Read 41889 times)

Offline Eddie

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #90 on: August 04, 2018, 01:42:45 am »
Another option would be to have more gating, i.e. you transition between enemy types only at a time when you are reasonably prepared.

I think this is a mentality issue. Most video games today are structured that you will nearly always face a situation that you can solve/win. XCOM is more like an open world game were your level 1 character can actually meet a dragon. The game does not prevent you from biting off more than you can chew. Lasers are meant to defeat personal armor, but not power armor. Gauss would be the tech tier equivalent weapon to power armor.

On research:
We already got the tech tree viewer to improve things. But yeah, you have some valid points there. A new player would not know which tech is crucial for progess and which is not. Maybe some more strategy articles can be added, similar to the "What do?" topic?
For example to get aircombat started, there could be an article like this:

*Shooting down shippings*

Shippings can only be boarded on the ground. Some shippings land on their own in the wild where we can assault them, those that don't can be "persuaded" to land by sending a few missiles and cannon rounds their way. However, our airbus cannot mount any weapons.
To get some airborne firepower, we need to do a few things:
- The car thieves can sell us vehicles that can mount weapons
- The smugglers can sell us missiles
The missiles are quite expensive and should only be used on the right targets. Police patrol ships for example. We are told with missiles, these craft can be shot down without risk and risk of retribution. The point is to loot their 25mm cannons and ammo, which is the best (and cheapest) option to force civilians to land. Shooting missiles at civilians might outright destroy their ship, leaving nothing to be salvaged.

Upon researching this article, an article about the megapol craft could also be added so the player really knows what they look like in the interception window. An argument could also be made that smugglers should sell the 25mm cannon instead of seagulls, and the seagulls should be sold by Krazy Hanna. Would be more newbie friendly that way.

Some more thoughts on early air combat:
The air balls tech is a noob trap. The chance to actually down anything with them is very low. You either miss and run out of ammo, or you blow your target to pieces (civie shipping assumed). They are also expensive to make. I know they are supposed to be bad, but maybe not that useless.
Goblin Rokkits are somewhat similar. Total damage is so low you can only go after civilians, but there is still a chance to blow them up or run out of ammo. Also, they are quite expensive to make and require integrated devices. So you need to use a limited item to make a mediocre air weapon, while you can pay a little more to get reliable seagulls for just cash. Seagulls seem the better deal to me.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2018, 02:17:00 am by Eddie »

Offline khade

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #91 on: August 04, 2018, 09:42:18 am »

4) how about ancient firearms, like a , a possible "early" version of the mortar? may be unlocked with the blaxk market, and supposed to be oitdated when gals learn to manufacture assault cannon? or even a gatling machinegun, an early black market machinegun?


Uh, the early mortar kind of required a team of horses to move, I'd estimate it at 600 lbs easily.  If I'm remembering correctly, it wasn't useful for anything beyond removing a castle wall, though admittedly it was pretty good at that.

We do in fact get early access to a gatling, or something similar, it only requires an extractor to build.  Though I can't remember what techs are needed to get it.


On another note:  I'm pretty sure the air balls are more of an emergency weapon, for if you have to get the air game up but haven't had luck with drops.  But I agree that they're not exactly designed to be useful, based on the description, they're literally large grenades thrown out the hatch.  More useful if you are trying to bomb a ground target, but that's not something we generally have to do in this game.  Think early WW1 air combat.


Note the third:  Any attempts at a long war version? where research beyond the very basics take a while and ramping up to frequent crackdowns and mercenary or star god presence is delayed a great deal?  That could allow for the crude early firearms to actually have some time in the sun before being replaced.  Maybe make it harder to get enough trust to actually buy better guns, muskets and pistols seem to be replaced by revolvers almost instantly, despite the lower damage, twice the ammo per unit is just that valuable.

Offline BBHood217

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #92 on: August 04, 2018, 12:03:40 pm »
I thought Piratez already is OpenXcom's Long War.

Offline Martin

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #93 on: August 04, 2018, 12:44:08 pm »
Nah, X-Com files is the Long War of OpenXCom.

Offline rezaf

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #94 on: August 04, 2018, 01:10:35 pm »
That is complete bullshit my friend and you know it. Farming Supply Ships does not count as normal experience.

I actually was not aware of this (that I was "farming supply ships") since I have no full hyperwave decoder coverage (getting there), but in an unsurprising turn of events you are correct. Within those constrains, I am still correct, but yeah, not nearly as bad this way.
Kinda funny that there are few (and worse armed) bodyguards in the actual base (I discovered it and took it down meanwhile).
I was also able to took down this guild guard with slugthrower and laslock shotgun fire. Find myself relying on that more and more often now, I gave one to a lot of gals as a sidearm since it's so versatile.

Offline Dioxine

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #95 on: August 04, 2018, 01:21:28 pm »
Well if you farmed supply ships by accident, you're in a minority :)

Offline rezaf

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #96 on: August 04, 2018, 01:55:25 pm »
Well if you farmed supply ships by accident, you're in a minority :)

Does it even constitute farming if you have to flee the field most of the time, tail between your legs? I never found a solution to the guy launching a nuke when turn 1 concludes.

I think this is a mentality issue. Most video games today are structured that you will nearly always face a situation that you can solve/win.

Maybe ... then again, I don't feel like I'm falling victim to the tropes of modern video games all that much. Franky, I feel most of them stink.
But what's so bad about having a possible solution when facing a situation? Even in the original X-Com you usually had some means to deal with situations most of the time. Autocannons and especially Heavy Cannons could down Mutons and the likes, and I'm pretty sure orchestrated rocket launcher fire could take down Sectopods. Advancing to flying armor and plasma weaponry was mostly a good thing because it made throwaway battles much easier/faster, whist you still needed to be on your toes in more difficult encounters.
In XPiratez, so much stuff is just useless. And it's gotten much worse. In the 2016 version, I remember going from bows to gyro stabilized smartguns as my mainstay weapon. This time around, by that time projectile weapons are generally outdated and/or there are better alternatives. My main gripe really are the over-armored enemies, Marsec Bodyguards, Hovertanks, Sectopods, Guild Masters, Zombie Troopers. Even gear supposedly specialized to deal with such enemies MASSIVELY underperforms.
Everything else I've seen so far is fine and dandy by my standards, with the possible exception of Star God Guardians and their PSI.

As for tech itself, I agree the tech tree viewer is a tremendous help (once you realize you're supposed to guide your research using it), but there are just sooooo many research opportunities and it's often non-intuitive how to get things.
IIRC ,the 2016 version didn't have the trophies/favors/tokens mechanic, which the game doesn't make clear on how important it is.
I think I already had the deliverator or something by the time I finally got around to unlock the Skyranger. Unlocking Back to School is very intricate.

Offline Martin

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #97 on: August 04, 2018, 02:07:13 pm »
Nah, we need more heavily armoured enemies. I propose:

-Marsec Supersoldier (slightly scalled down guildmaster than appears in multiples in the endgame)
-all church units gets except civilians and trainees get at least 1st level shields, the ones already with shields get their shield upgraded by single grade
-Church Crusader (improved zealot in bestmaster armor)
-upgraded cyberdiscs that get 2nd level shields and better armor

Offline Dioxine

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #98 on: August 04, 2018, 02:07:43 pm »
But what's so bad about having a possible solution when facing a situation?

Not really bad as impossible to provide in the multifaced scope of the game: lots of missions, lots of enemy types, lots of weapons. Also what is impossible for one player, is possible for another. Like, supply ship missions are so absurdly pumped-up as many players routinely farm them. Maybe some stuff underperforms, but it is hard to adress that in general terms (as in, what stuff specifically). Also there is the matter of every playthrough being different.

Offline Martin

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #99 on: August 04, 2018, 02:45:53 pm »
I farm supply ships for baby nukes.

Offline legionof1

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #100 on: August 04, 2018, 05:29:03 pm »
Speaking from the farmer end of the spectrum too. There will always be very underperforming equipment. But what those are is a fluid state as content changes and even campaign to campaign and player to player.

Ive had many discussions over the time ive been here about whats good and isn't. I swear by melee and close range assault, but eschew shotguns entirely. So i lean on SMGs most of the game. No one person is right, since the test is does it work.   

Offline rezaf

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #101 on: August 05, 2018, 11:51:02 am »
Complaints aside, here's one thing I would really like to see but fear is impossible to realize without significant changes to the game code: "Wandering merchants".
That is to say, trading opportunities where you can get stuff not readily available at the global market (which could be scaled down in return).
These merchants would have limited stock (i.e. 3 Anti-Grav Harnesses or 1 Old Fighter Hull or or 57 Bandages) and would only buy certain wares from you.
Their pricing would vary wildly, sometimes being much more expensive and sometimes being much cheaper. They could also have faction allegiances.
Like I said, I would presume this idea to be a non-starter for technical reasons, but I thought I'd still throw it out there.  ;)

Offline Zippicus

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #102 on: August 06, 2018, 03:48:32 am »
If you're concerned about equipment being useless, sell it.  Now it's not useless anymore, it helps fund the operation.  In a less broad sense all the various weapons have strengths and weaknesses, and micromanaging the right weapon into the right gals hand can turn a piece of junk into something pretty badass if you use it against the right target.  The reverse is also true, using the wrong weapon against the wrong target with the wrong gal will make anything seem useless.

Offline ivandogovich

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #103 on: August 06, 2018, 04:59:11 pm »
But what's so bad about having a possible solution when facing a situation? Even in the original X-Com you usually had some means to deal with situations most of the time.
<snip>

In Piratez there are two extremely reliable solutions to tough problems.  Melee, in the case of those tough nut Bodyguards, try axing them a question.  An ax to the back solves almost every problem.  The second solution is just bug out.  There is no shame in skipping missions in Piratez.  You won't lose the campaign if you fail a few missions like you would in NuCom.  These are two fundamental design approaches that differ from most of the rest of the xcom franchise.  If you play with these in mind, Piratez becomes much more approachable.

Offline Martin

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Re: Stuff I'd love to see in XPiratez!
« Reply #104 on: August 07, 2018, 11:05:08 am »
I found poisoned dagger to be the most reliable solution to Marsec Bodyguard problem.