Author Topic: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run  (Read 1279598 times)

Offline Juku121

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4665 on: July 30, 2022, 09:27:13 pm »
The targeting trick has been mostly disabled for a while now. There are a couple of missions that allow it, but these are largely special one-off events.

Technically, there are separate penalties for letting the mission despawn and aborting. Never really looked if there's a pattern there.

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4666 on: July 31, 2022, 01:13:10 pm »
Maybe remove sniping from the lowest-level RD dudes, at least Gangers and possibly also Lads? Or reduce their sniper values so they won't be sniping a lot.

OK, I have disabled it on gangers and drastically decreased for lads. I agree that it was a bit too much.

Who says they want to use said biotech in exactly the same way (+HP steroids instead of weapon grafts, mind-machine interfaces, combat drugs, etc)?

Nobody said that, but in most cases they'd want more resilient troops regardless.

The Syndicate Supersoldiers and Minotaurs, okay. These are already pretty tough, and another 10-15 HP wouldn't make them all that much tougher. The others are mercs/hired goons for the most part, no need to feed the temps the good juice. :P

MiB guys are actually pretty wimpy HP-wise. I wouldn't mind the more advanced versions getting some steroids.

The UAC Space Marines could get a boost, too. Memetic Doomguy toughness, you know. :)

I agree, all this can be done, but I'd rather not do any big rebalances if they can be avoided. Frankly I'm torn on this - wouldn't want to make early game even harder, it's the later game which is a problem.

If you don't care about any of them, why are you using RL guns as a basis? You could have just used generic names for most things, kind of like Piratez does for a lot of its weapons. Or even how you have a 'Colt .45' in the game that's a pretty blatant expy of an M1911.

Well it's not like I completely disregard them, it's just very hard to meet their exotic requirements.

What's so involved about that? I made some hostile female farmers with little trouble. Granted, you can't research them, but that's not all that much more work.

I can't remember right now, only that it was a pain due to how MiB/zombie missions are coded. Not saying it's impossible to do, just a little too complex for me to get off my ass. Maybe later.

The other angles are fine, it's a thin line there. But the back view is pretty much the same size as their visor from the front. I actually had trouble telling which way the guy was facing because of this and the weapon sprite looking very similar on both ends. The only real hint was the legs.

You're right, I worked on this a little. Hope it is OK now.

I assume you can recolour the Piratez sprite on your own? I did notice that these guys need the 'Muton' drawingroutine, or pistols will look bad.

I kinda thought about them replacing the Coordinators, since those guys share their paperdoll with the maniacs, and look a bit too edgy overall. But I don't think a giant telnyashka-clad dude qualifies as top dog, either.

After some thinking I decided that another new unit for a starting cult wouldn't be the best idea, since I need to focus on the later game instead. It's just a little too much at once.

That reminds me, you never said anything about the red Salamandrons. I guess they didn't pan out?

Sorry, I need more context here.

Psiclones seem to be excessibely rare these days before getting rid of EXALT, while there are several uses for those.

Not any rarer than before.

Also, the way a lot of (mainly melee) weapons scale with stats makes highly leveled agents ridiculously effective. A baseball bat is a weapon of mass destruction far better than a high-caliber rifle now. :o

As designed. It's the only way to have meaningful melee.

BTW, what happened to the original RD base map? Haven't seen it anywhere this time around.

It definitely exists. Check the deployments if you're interested.

Edit4: Upon reflection, I quite dislike how the Syndicate arc goes out with a whimper instead of a bang. To wit:
(...)

Much of this is "kinda planned", so I won't address these remarks directly, but they've been heard.

Edit6: Are nooses supposed to kill people?

Very much so.

Edit7: Not sure if it's intended, but Deep One villages/trading posts and Embassies of T'Leth still use the tiny sub when I've unlocked the Trident and raided the Underwater City, but haven't progressed beyond that yet.

Not as much intended as inevitable; implementation of a certain request in OXCE would let us be more robust, so we'll see.

Hi, found OpenXcom and this Mod recently and I am having a blast (as well as being blasted with everything and the kitchen sink), thanks for all your work. Just wanted to chime in, hope this the right thread to do it, sorry if not.

Thanks a lot! :)

Is the MAGMA corporation a reference to something, or is it just something you came up with?

It's a reference to the Alien Shooter series, especially Alien Shooter 2 (the good version, like AS 2 Gold, before they ruined it by removing skills).

Looking it up, turns out they were a real company up until 2011, when they merged with Plutonic Power Corp to become Alterra Power Corp.

Not sure if Solarius Scorch knew this though.

I didn't!

Hi Solarius and OXC community, I haven't played XComFiles in what must have been in over a year. I loved the mod and I came back to UFO and just got done with a run on Final Modpack so I'm currently trying XComFiles again on beginner (I know, I know) and I'm finding it a lot harder and frustrating than I remember.

I don't think the mod actually got straight up harder, but it certainly got more complex, so things can go sideways in new unexpected ways.
Also thank you, and good luck!


Offline Juku121

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4667 on: July 31, 2022, 02:03:19 pm »
I agree, all this can be done, but I'd rather not do any big rebalances if they can be avoided. Frankly I'm torn on this - wouldn't want to make early game even harder, it's the later game which is a problem.
...
It's just a little too much at once.
Fair enough.

The mercs do look better. Could be a little darker just below the 'green line', but that's not so important.

Sorry, I need more context here.
This. The green ones didn't exist yet at that point. I do like them, and they go well together with Reptoids, but a fiery death-dealer accompanying Snakemen looks better red. Well, orange. :)

Not any rarer than before.
Depend on what you consider 'before'. I recall Psiclones and Alien Communicators being much more plentiful, and seeing deployment data deleting those as well.

It's the only way to have meaningful melee.
No, there are other -and IMO better - ways. Weapon unlocks with more armour piercing and/or different damage types. Having some generally troublesome enemies weak to melee (Lobstermen pioneered this :P ). Melee-enhancing equipment (e.g. Synthsuit). HP drain a la Shadowbats. I'm sure there are even more creative solutions instead of just giving out bigger numbers.

It definitely exists. Check the deployments if you're interested.
Well, I did and SIBERIA seems to be missing altogether. ???

...they've been heard.
:)

Not as much intended as inevitable; implementation of a certain request in OXCE would let us be more robust, so we'll see.
Didn't that thread get deleted?



Edit: One thing I've gradually come to dislike is how electric shocks are the answer to stunning everything. Cow? Prod it. Plain ole human? Prod it, too. Little green grey men from Mars? Prod them. Robotank that's supposedly at least somewhat isolated/hardened? Prod it, of course. Bunch of microscopic insects? Prod them, seven ten thousand at one blow. A Deep One Gillman that's got a built-in electric shock weapon? Weak to electric prods. A floating ball of spikiness that shoots lightning out of its ass? Of course it's weak to getting tasered!
« Last Edit: August 02, 2022, 12:35:12 am by Juku121 »

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4668 on: August 05, 2022, 01:26:14 pm »
This. The green ones didn't exist yet at that point. I do like them, and they go well together with Reptoids, but a fiery death-dealer accompanying Snakemen looks better red. Well, orange. :)

Ah, the mini-T-Rex!
It's pretty cool, but I'd rather stick with the ore "compact" build, since it's a 2x2 unit.

Depend on what you consider 'before'. I recall Psiclones and Alien Communicators being much more plentiful, and seeing deployment data deleting those as well.

I don't recall any changes to their availability. Well, maybe through UFO density - this is changed periodically. Is this what you think is the case?

No, there are other -and IMO better - ways. Weapon unlocks with more armour piercing and/or different damage types. Having some generally troublesome enemies weak to melee (Lobstermen pioneered this :P ). Melee-enhancing equipment (e.g. Synthsuit). HP drain a la Shadowbats. I'm sure there are even more creative solutions instead of just giving out bigger numbers.

All that is true, but we're talking general level now.
Frankly, I like how it works. It's just the right balance for me.

Well, I did and SIBERIA seems to be missing altogether. ???

SIBERIA was removed years ago, for obvious reasons. Why dig up this long dead carcass now?

Didn't that thread get deleted?

It did, but the request is still valid.

Edit: One thing I've gradually come to dislike is how electric shocks are the answer to stunning everything. Cow? Prod it. Plain ole human? Prod it, too. Little green grey men from Mars? Prod them. Robotank that's supposedly at least somewhat isolated/hardened? Prod it, of course. Bunch of microscopic insects? Prod them, seven ten thousand at one blow. A Deep One Gillman that's got a built-in electric shock weapon? Weak to electric prods. A floating ball of spikiness that shoots lightning out of its ass? Of course it's weak to getting tasered!

Perhaps a review is in order... Then again, electric damage is usually a PITA to deliver, so.

Offline Juku121

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4669 on: August 05, 2022, 02:04:26 pm »
I don't recall any changes to their availability. Well, maybe through UFO density - this is changed periodically. Is this what you think is the case?
No, equipment lists in AlienDeployments. A lot of Alien Communicators were deleted sometime after 1.9. Psiclones seem to be the same, but I never felt they were scarce before they became consumables for Gun Kata, so that's probably that. But I have 74 of them after nearly three years of farming EXALT, and that's roughly the same as the number of missions I've done against them.

I'm not saying any of this needs to change. But Psiclones are a moderatelt rare resource now (before EXALT gets the axe), what with several uses (Skulljacks, Gun Kata, direct morale damage).

Frankly, I like how it works. It's just the right balance for me.
Well, it's the same solution as giving bosses more and more HP in various games. A lot of people don't like that, myself included. If it works for you and others, fine.

SIBERIA was removed years ago, for obvious reasons. Why dig up this long dead carcass now?
What did you mean by 'original RD base map' 'exists', then? Was there another one between SIBERIA and NOOBERIA that I missed?

Perhaps a review is in order... Then again, electric damage is usually a PITA to deliver, so.
My point was that you're never required to change tactics. Electricity always works if you can deliver it. If you use clubs or fists, there are some enemies who don't care. If you use darts, there are enemies who don't care. Being forced to adapt is a good thing in my book.

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4670 on: August 05, 2022, 02:41:55 pm »
No, equipment lists in AlienDeployments. A lot of Alien Communicators were deleted sometime after 1.9. Psiclones seem to be the same, but I never felt they were scarce before they became consumables for Gun Kata, so that's probably that. But I have 74 of them after nearly three years of farming EXALT, and that's roughly the same as the number of missions I've done against them.

I never removed any Psiclones the way I dealt with alien communicators, why are you trying to wear me down like this? Is this for something my ancestors did? :P

What did you mean by 'original RD base map' 'exists', then? Was there another one between SIBERIA and NOOBERIA that I missed?

I meant the STORMMOUNTAIN terrain. The previous one.

My point was that you're never required to change tactics. Electricity always works if you can deliver it. If you use clubs or fists, there are some enemies who don't care. If you use darts, there are enemies who don't care. Being forced to adapt is a good thing in my book.

Well, the damage type is the same, but the tactics not necessarily. I mean, I get your point, I just don't think it's that bad. Electricity indeed works on almost everything, but it is counterbalanced by limited means to apply it - you have the taser, the club, the various better versions of the club, some very unwieldy Cyberweb weapons...

Offline Juku121

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4671 on: August 05, 2022, 03:45:09 pm »
I never removed any Psiclones the way I dealt with alien communicators...
No, but you added Gun Kata and Skulljacks. I'm saying some stuff got removed (and I thought some Psiclones got removed, too, but I clearly misremembered, so my bad), some other stuff got added and now Psiclones feel more rare than before (because there are still just as many of them, but demand has gone way up). It kinda feels weird to me that an organisation hopped up on these has so few to go around (unlike Psyke that was just swimming in the stuff). OTOH, maybe they're careful with their joytrodes and hide them away before going out. But you'd think at least their HQ would have a couple dozen to go around. But nope, a few is all you get, usually.

It's not really a problem for me, but it's a change and one that crept up on players indirectly. Also a mystery where they keep all these Psiclones their whole membership is addicted to. Make of that what you will.

I meant the STORMMOUNTAIN terrain.
Oh. I don't actually recall playing a version with that one. But I must have, since I did play 2.1 for a while. Going senile, I guess. :-\

Well, the damage type is the same, but the tactics not necessarily. I mean, I get your point, I just don't think it's that bad. Electricity indeed works on almost everything, but it is counterbalanced by limited means to apply it - you have the taser, the club, the various better versions of the club, some very unwieldy Cyberweb weapons...
Fair. But I'd still like at least a couple of situations where I go and try my standard approach and it just doesn't work so I need to work out something else. Swarmids, perhaps. No idea how someone is going to club a bunch of Swarmids. ???

Is this for something my ancestors did?
Ask your parents. :P
« Last Edit: August 05, 2022, 03:48:45 pm by Juku121 »

Offline Kozinsky

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4672 on: August 06, 2022, 08:26:29 am »
I suggest adding a random number of enemy units in all missions. This is especially important for the initial missions, where their number is very small and always fixed. For example, for the Cult Apprehension mission:
Spoiler:
alienDeployments:
...
  - type: STR_CULT_APPREHENSION_BLACK_LOTUS
...
    data:
      - alienRank: 5
        lowQty: 1 #the same value
        highQty: 4 #the same value
        dQty: 1 #change from 0
        extraQty: 1 #added tag
...
The idea is that the player knows for sure that there are always two enemies on this mission (for Veteran difficulty) and, having discovered them, he stops being cautious. Whereas the possibility of a third enemy would force the player to be more cautious and continue to perform proper tactical maneuvers.

If this idea seems bad to you, is there any way I can make this idea into a separate submod without having to completely copy all the data from the "alienDeployments_XCOMFILES.rul" file? Perhaps I need to use "refNode" or "!add" tags somehow?

Offline Vakrug

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4673 on: August 06, 2022, 11:15:50 am »
The idea is that the player knows for sure that there are always two enemies on this mission (for Veteran difficulty) and, having discovered them, he stops being cautious.
... and gets surprised when other cultists with AK-47 appears behind a corner, because this particular mission decides to be "highQty" type. I think anti-stop-being-cautious measures are already implemented.

Offline Juku121

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4674 on: August 06, 2022, 02:33:47 pm »
...make this idea into a separate submod without having to completely copy all the data from the "alienDeployments_XCOMFILES.rul" file?
I think (but I am not an authority on YAML) that the nearest thing that can actually be referenced is 'data: ' A submod should inherit other values (briefing, music, map size, etc), so that's all you need to change. But once you start touching 'data: ', you need to include all entries, since it's a list without any identifiers. Itemsets can be referenced, but for full convenience I suspect you'd need Solarius to anchor each end every itemset. Otherwise, have fun copying all of these over. :(

...because this particular mission decides to be "highQty" type.
The mission doesn't get to choose. highQty is the minimum number on Superhuman, and dQty is the additional random range.


It usually doesn't matter all that much, given how high enemy counts are in XCF. But some of the starter missions could indeed be more random. I've actualy changed Apprehension and Crop Circle missions in such a way for myself (plus female farmers :) ). And it's a little wierd to encounter exactly 32 (or whatever the value is for that difficulty) beetles, spiders, etc. Exactly who is gathering them in such exact quantities just before X-Com arrives? :P

Also note that quite a few missions already have dQty set to a non-zero value.

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4675 on: August 08, 2022, 11:42:13 am »
No, but you added Gun Kata and Skulljacks. I'm saying some stuff got removed (and I thought some Psiclones got removed, too, but I clearly misremembered, so my bad), some other stuff got added and now Psiclones feel more rare than before (because there are still just as many of them, but demand has gone way up). It kinda feels weird to me that an organisation hopped up on these has so few to go around (unlike Psyke that was just swimming in the stuff). OTOH, maybe they're careful with their joytrodes and hide them away before going out. But you'd think at least their HQ would have a couple dozen to go around. But nope, a few is all you get, usually.

It's not really a problem for me, but it's a change and one that crept up on players indirectly. Also a mystery where they keep all these Psiclones their whole membership is addicted to. Make of that what you will.

OK, many thanks; now I get your point. I guess adding a few more to their big buildings won't hurt. Did that.

Fair. But I'd still like at least a couple of situations where I go and try my standard approach and it just doesn't work so I need to work out something else. Swarmids, perhaps. No idea how someone is going to club a bunch of Swarmids. ???

Fixed that, hopefully.

As for randomization of enemy units - well, I kinda like the semi-predictability we have now. rebalancing this would be really tricky anyway.

Offline MoonKid

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4676 on: August 11, 2022, 09:05:00 pm »
In earlier version it was quit easy to build a AI unit. After an update it was only possible to re-animate a killed AI unit.
Now in the current last release version I only can "build" a AI unit when I have an alenium shart . I don't know what this is and how to get it.

I can I get a new AI unit?

Offline Juku121

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4677 on: August 11, 2022, 09:55:52 pm »
...an alenium shart . I don't know what this is and how to get it.
It's a dormant alien AI crystal or something like that.
Spoiler"Where are the shards?":
You get your first three or so from the Kiryu-Kai research. Alien bases (including anything else using some of their map blocks, e.g. Hybrid Embassies) can have shards as loot, and so can Osiron Haciendas, Osiron crates and Jars of Grey Goo (which come from Haciendas in the first place). The bases are probably the most reliable source.

I can I get a new AI unit?
What do you mean? You want a return to the 'muggle' and 'wizard' AI dichotomy? :P

Offline MoonKid

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Re: The X-Com Files - 2.5: Silent Run
« Reply #4678 on: August 11, 2022, 10:10:08 pm »
In that case I should stop to use to much elirium explosivs. I think that is the problem I destroy everything. I use more elirium explosivs then usual bullets or plasma beams. :D