Author Topic: Hideout Defense  (Read 2837 times)

Offline Zharkov

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Hideout Defense
« on: February 14, 2019, 02:15:06 pm »
I am aware that it has been mentioned before but it is still my opinion that Hideout Defense would be more interesting and more balanced if opponents:
•   would not storm your Hideout with weapons untypical for their faction
•   would actually storm your hideout instead of squatting in the hangers
Personally I think Hideout Defense is the most tedious mission you are often in a position that you cannot skip. Even if you have the upper hand it takes forever to clear out the hangers and god forbid some of them make it to the tunnels...

Offline Ridаn

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2019, 02:19:02 pm »
I do agree. More than once I just rebuilt the base, rather than playing through adother tedious Crackdown.

Offline JustTheDude

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2019, 02:34:30 pm »
There are some "tactics" to deal with Hideout defences and I personally enjoy every attack. Unlike some RNG city maps, or Ship from TFTD where it's a chore to sweep and not lose your gals, becouse enemy can be "patroling" every room and stay there forever.

My most successfull tactic is to just place barracs/burrows next to Hangar/Hangars and elevator while keeping empty space between anything else.
I don't think it's that unusuall.

Keep few dogs to send them into tunnels, then place gals in the hallways leading to hangar. Those will snipe anything coming out. Keep few Shotgun/melee gals around the corridors. Send "harass" parties by maintenance tunnels above.

Something changed during the last update? Academy sends Ambulance with proper weapons, dark ones comes with UAC weaponry and ratmen/bandits go with various crap guns.

Even if there are some untypical guns, it can be explained by the fact that they took the initiative, they geared up for this assault a bit, since it's not their normal job.

Offline Dakkdakk

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2019, 09:38:59 pm »
My biggest gripe with hideout defense missions is also that the enemies don't really disperse into the actual hideout that much. The worst you'll have to handle is them getting into the 2nd level corridors and the sewers. They dont really disperse into the corridors all that much, or at least not as much as they disperse into the airways and the sewers, where its way more annoying to find them.

Offline legionof1

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2019, 12:22:51 am »
Hideout defenses can be tedious if you have built your hideouts for defense. Building your base in that way indirectly affects the AI behavior. Most AI units dont travel very far unless they spot an enemy. But hideouts break up lines of sight very effectively. So clumping all the hangers and elevator off from the rest of the base denies the los for the AI to act normally. It's the the TFTD ship closets problem but at a grand scale.

Late game where i know i can win a more open battle, i add more facilities to speed up the rate of contact and speed up the whole process. But without those choke points early base defenses are very risky. 

Offline sanyaskillpro

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2019, 12:26:34 am »
Something changed during the last update? Academy sends Ambulance with proper weapons, dark ones comes with UAC weaponry and ratmen/bandits go with various crap guns.
I think he refers to raiders\spartans who normally are restricted to medium makeshift warships with mid tier weaponry but suddenly here's a destroyer\cruiser with full plasma crew.

niculinux

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2019, 06:38:33 pm »
I am aware that it has been mentioned before but it is still my opinion that Hideout Defense would be more interesting and more balanced if opponents:
•   would not storm your Hideout with weapons untypical for their faction
•   would actually storm your hideout instead of squatting in the hangers
Personally I think Hideout Defense is the most tedious mission you are often in a position that you cannot skip. Even if you have the upper hand it takes forever to clear out the hangers and god forbid some of them make it to the tunnels...

Agree on the firts poin; for the rest enemy acess i think it's just fine ss it is now.

I think he refers to raiders\spartans who normally are restricted to medium makeshift warships with mid tier weaponry but suddenly here's a destroyer\cruiser with full plasma crew.

On jack sparrow i got crackdowns from academy, ratmen, osiron with plasma weapons (!!!), once from the Star Gods themselves  :o and very very frequently from the dark ones, though my research/activity has nothing to do with them🤔

Online Rince Wind

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2019, 11:25:32 pm »
Dark Ones just wanna have fun!

Offline ajnunezr

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #8 on: February 16, 2019, 12:52:43 am »
Ratmen and Dark Ones tend to be pretty common.... But maybe is RNG (I know is RNG, what I wanted to say is that in my plays, maybe I have that kind of luck), I do not know the actual weights.


Offline legionof1

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2019, 12:59:34 am »
Rats and dark ones merely start much earlier then full faction retaliations. The dark ones for instance can happen as early as the 8th month. Full factions on the other hand are 24 months in(aside from JS). So the weaker attacks have about half to a third more time to happen in the average campaign, though the per month weights are similar.

Offline Dioxine

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2019, 04:29:09 pm »
I am aware that it has been mentioned before but it is still my opinion that Hideout Defense would be more interesting and more balanced if opponents:
•   would not storm your Hideout with weapons untypical for their faction

Really, considering the number of varied hideout defences nowadays, I find this statement insulting. Unless you haven't played in years, it used to be much less polished back then. (I don't rule out rare bugs). Solid examples? Or is this just an ungrounded whine?

•   would actually storm your hideout instead of squatting in the hangers
Personally I think Hideout Defense is the most tedious mission you are often in a position that you cannot skip. Even if you have the upper hand it takes forever to clear out the hangers and god forbid some of them make it to the tunnels...

Again it seems like you havent played in a while, OXC lately changed their behaviour to actively seek and destroy base key tiles. As for tediousness, there are multitude of ways of finding and dealing with last 2-3 enemies nowadays. Unless ofc you're chokepointing the hangars; but in such a case, the tediousness is your own fault.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2019, 04:31:20 pm by Dioxine »

Offline Zharkov

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2019, 05:27:23 pm »
Yes, of course I have choke points in most bases.

Very recently I had some Humanists visiting with Plasma Weapons. They were running in little circles in the hangers, but their tanks at least were raiding the rest of the hideout. Boring.

Then, there came some Dark Ones. Their behavior was actually exemplary. They were equiped faction specific and ran totally amok. After a few turns they were everywhere despite choke points. Very entertaining.

Offline Dioxine

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2019, 10:08:43 pm »
So why do you think Humanists can never get any Plasma? Also try chokepointing less, if you don't like enemies camping the hangars. Your post makes me even consider adding an extra ladder down from the hangar, so chokepointing will make them more likely to go into sewers.

Offline BBHood217

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2019, 11:51:11 pm »
Since it takes a long time for plasma-toting minor factions to do crackdowns, one could assume that they were figuring out how to unlock gauss and plasma weaponry just like you are.

Offline Martin

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Re: Hideout Defense
« Reply #14 on: February 18, 2019, 01:14:38 am »
How abotu the majpor factions occasionally misplace some high end equipment in place where the minor factions can find it in return for a minor favour?