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Author Topic: [EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion -- General Feedback Thread  (Read 424297 times)

Offline hellrazor

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #405 on: September 11, 2015, 02:51:15 pm »
Agree with you fully that it's probably just a minor visual glitch and as you said you certainly don't get to see the enemy units and if, as I have you been,you've been playing openxcom for a good while you'll know the general layout of the vanilla ufos at least. So it can't be used as a major exploit, I just thought it was a bit odd. Those pictures were just from a test I ran in battle mode to see how often this "oddity" occurred.

Well it essentially occurs on every UFO Map and it has todo with MCD Patches to make the North Walls tiles Walkable. In the Original DOS game you could not cross these.
Those MCD Patches are applied in the xcom1 ruleset.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2015, 03:43:36 pm by hellrazor »

Offline hellrazor

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #406 on: September 28, 2015, 10:53:41 pm »
Due to my upcoming exams and my need to search for a new appertment,
i have to postphone any work on my Mod for the time being.

But i will be back :>

Offline ivandogovich

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #407 on: September 28, 2015, 11:05:43 pm »
Catching up on the thread:  Really nice work with your custom HandObs!! :)

Offline Hobbes

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #408 on: September 28, 2015, 11:06:38 pm »
Due to my upcoming exams and my need to search for a new appertment,
i have to postphone any work on my Mod for the time being.

But i will be back :>

Good luck with everything! :)

Offline SIMON BAILIE

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #409 on: September 29, 2015, 12:19:13 am »
Finally almost at the end, just kicking over the last non Ethereal bases, 2 Muton bases to go including the one I'm doing atm.
Spoiler:
But will have to do an Ethereal base and go to Cydonia soon as I've noticed the aliens seem to only building Ethereal bases now, well I'm into June of the second year. I'm just trying to wait for my crack team to all have a psionic defence strength of at least 100, the lowest is 96 atm so I'm not mind raped all over the place. Am I right on thinking at this stage it's only Ethereals that build bases or have I been unlucky as the last 3 set up have all been Ethereal?

Offline hellrazor

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #410 on: September 29, 2015, 02:24:41 am »
Catching up on the thread:  Really nice work with your custom HandObs!! :)

Thanks ivan ;>

Good luck with everything! :)

Well to find a a new appartment in Berlin in 1 month is kinda uhhhh.... hard? So yes i hope everything goes well.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2015, 02:26:33 am by hellrazor »

Offline hellrazor

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #411 on: September 29, 2015, 02:42:22 am »
Finally almost at the end, just kicking over the last non Ethereal bases, 2 Muton bases to go including the one I'm doing atm.
Spoiler:
But will have to do an Ethereal base and go to Cydonia soon as I've noticed the aliens seem to only building Ethereal bases now, well I'm into June of the second year. I'm just trying to wait for my crack team to all have a psionic defence strength of at least 100, the lowest is 96 atm so I'm not mind raped all over the place. Am I right on thinking at this stage it's only Ethereals that build bases or have I been unlucky as the last 3 set up have all been Ethereal?

I presume your playing on Superhumane difficulty? If so make sure you find the Brain Asap, if you can or, well lets say, nasty things come your way.
Spoiler:
Ethereals are immune towards human PSI Attacks (Psi Str is like ~200 or so) but there PSI Attack Strength should be roughly the same as in vanilla. I suppose that you will not be mindraped with psistr 90+ same as vanilla. I could change this if you do not like it thou.
There is a extra alienMission which starts first time in month 13 or 14 when Ethereal first appear and it lets them build a alien base each month, so you have multiple chances to capture a Ethereal Commander.
And SIMON a strong advise: the Alloy Sword in Version 0.93b is excellent for killing Armored Sectopods! Even on Soldier with only Melee Accuracy 40, it applies the STR towards the damage of the weapon, if i remember right in 0.93b it did 160 damage on a +70 STR Soldier, so 320 Damage Maximum, enough to crit the throu the front armor with some random god luck ;>

Maybe i find some time inbetween and finish the last changes towards the ruleset, so i can release a version with a tighter Economy. Don't know if i find the time.
It will only consist of some new Items, the new Sectoid Elites lots of fixes mainly Economic changes, some other smaller changes. So no special Missions or so, because doing them is timeconsuming, which i at the moment simply do not have, i hope you all understand.

Offline SIMON BAILIE

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #412 on: September 29, 2015, 03:27:38 am »
I think I'm still using v0.93 with the cydonia research fix though it could be the full 0.93b as I was that far along I didn't see the point in upgrading fully to 0.93b but
Spoiler:
if the nasty surprise on Cydonia is "spitter Chryssalids" then I'll probably upgrade to 0.93b just before Cydonia if I'm not on that already. Though I could be thinking of what you might have planned for v0.94.
Ta for the response during your busy studies and I'll keep you informed.

Offline hellrazor

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #413 on: September 29, 2015, 11:35:48 am »
I think I'm still using v0.93 with the cydonia research fix though it could be the full 0.93b as I was that far along I didn't see the point in upgrading fully to 0.93b but
Spoiler:
if the nasty surprise on Cydonia is "spitter Chryssalids" then I'll probably upgrade to 0.93b just before Cydonia if I'm not on that already. Though I could be thinking of what you might have planned for v0.94.
Ta for the response during your busy studies and I'll keep you informed.

Nope Chryssalid Spitters are only in 0.94.
You are actually using the same ruleset as 0.93b :> (Why do i even write changelogs and document every change in it?)
The only change applied was the research fix in it, yes it is indeed basically full 0.93b so to say.
Cydonia will still be nasty on Superhuman. (even thou Base Attack values in Route files could make it even nastier but i need to talk with hobbes on how he used them first and look at the missionmaps he made).
I am serious about the usage of Alloy Swords thou, dead serious.

Any signing off for now.

Offline DeltaEpsilon

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #414 on: October 03, 2015, 04:45:25 am »
Argh, I can't hold it anymore. How am I supposed to get alien food and alien reproduction using only Earth weaponry when assaulting an Alien Base? Like man, I skipped first two terror missions just because I have no good weapons to kill terror units. Cyberdiscs are PAIN. There are usually 7-9 cyberdiscs per terror mission and I am obligated to use HE packs to destroy them reliably. Tasers won't do anything, stun prods as well. Carrying rocket launcher with an elerium rocket seems useless as you are not guaranteed to kill a disc in one shot and also they weight a lot.
Man, I like how difficult XCom became with this mod, but this is just ridiculous. I can literally kill floaters, snakemans or sectoids for hours without a single loss, but should a cyberdisc appear and I am done for. Cyberdiscs are like sectopods in original game but at least sectopods had their weaknesses. Cyberdiscs for now are just overly tough and you are forced to deal with them using special weapons, which you bring just for the sake of killing cyberdiscs. And actually I see only two ways of killing discs: HE packs and rocket launcher. Alien grenades can cripple a disc quite a bit, but for most part you will need at least two alien grenades to bring one cyberdisc down and you need to throw them subsequentially as the explosion of one grenade destroys another. Heavy cannon won't do a thing, I managed to bring only one cyberdisc after about 15 hits (I play with TFTD damage formula) with AP. Rocket launcher is a better way of destroying cyberdisc if only it wouldn't weight so much that you need to either switch to lighter primary weapon or just sacrifice some cannon fodder. Also I found out the hard way shotguns are awesome for cyberdiscs as well but a little problem with that - cyberdisc explode if they are killed with anything but explosives or not stunned.
My rage is out.
Also chryssalids are pain too, but not as much as cyberdiscs. At least chryssalids don't explode and don't have resistances to common weapon.
« Last Edit: October 03, 2015, 10:26:39 am by EditorRUS »

Offline hellrazor

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #415 on: October 03, 2015, 10:27:42 am »
Argh, I can't hold it anymore. How am I supposed to get alien food and alien reproduction using only Earth weaponry when assaulting an Alien Base? Like man, I skipped first two terror missions just because I have no good weapons to kill terror units. Cyberdiscs are PAIN. There are usually 7-9 cyberdiscs per terror mission and I am obligated to use HE packs to destroy them reliably. Tasers won't do anything, stun prods as well. Carrying rocket launcher with an elerium rocket seems useless as you are not guaranteed to kill a disc in one shot and also they weight a lot.
Man, I like how difficult XCom became with that mod, but this is just ridiculous. I can literally kill floaters, snakemans or sectoids for hours without a single loss, but should a cyberdisc appear and I am done for. Cyberdiscs are like sectopods in original game but at least sectopods had their weaknesses. Cyberdiscs for now are just overly tough and you are forced to deal with them using special weapons, which you bring just for the sake of killing cyberdiscs. And actually I see only two ways of killing discs: HE packs and rocket launcher. Alien grenades can cripple a disc quite a bit, but for most part you will need at least two alien grenades to bring one cyberdisc down and you need to throw them subsequentially as the explosion of one grenade destroys another. Heavy cannon won't do a thing, I managed to bring only one cyberdisc after about 15 hits (I play with TFTD damage formula) with AP. Rocket launcher is a better way of destroying cyberdisc if only it wouldn't weight so much that you need to either switch to lighter primary weapon or just sacrifice some cannon fodder. Also I found out the hard way shotguns are awesome for cyberdiscs as well but a little problem with that - cyberdisc explode if they are killed with anything but explosives or not stunned.
My rage is out.
Also chryssalids are pain too, but not as much as cyberdiscs.

Switch of the TFTD damage formula, if the normal cyberdiscs already give you trouble, i will not hear your raging if blue cyberdiscs appear. Or blue Sectopods or special Mutons and such. All the new units are been balanced against normal UFO damage rules. And a Elerium Rocket should easily be able to handle a normal Cyberdisc, even with TFTD Damage formula.
And btw it is just a floater base, one of the easiest races to fight against, they have low health, they are somewhat stupid.
And remember:
"He who is not courageous enough to take risks will accomplish nothing in life." Muhamed Ali

Offline DeltaEpsilon

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #416 on: October 03, 2015, 09:52:46 pm »
Quote
Switch of the TFTD damage formula, if the normal cyberdiscs already give you trouble, i will not hear your raging if blue cyberdiscs appear. Or blue Sectopods or special Mutons and such. All the new units are been balanced against normal UFO damage rules. And a Elerium Rocket should easily be able to handle a normal Cyberdisc, even with TFTD Damage formula.
I already did. TFTD formula doesn't change the range of damage for explosives BTW, it's still 50% to 150%.

Quote
And btw it is just a floater base, one of the easiest races to fight against, they have low health, they are somewhat stupid.
It's not a floater base. It's Sectoid+Snakeman's base, with cyberdiscs and chryssalids at once.

After some research I came up with a creative solution. It seems like alien bases are AWESOME for HE packs. Lots of corners which provide you cover while explosives clear these long hallways, it is just interesting. And so I took 10 my most suicidal meat, gave them tons of primed HE packs and loaded shotguns and boy, this one fight has been fun as hell. Unfortunately I failed nevertheless because I lost 9 out of 10 of my men and the last guy, who made it to command center, had only 1 shot left and no explosives. What a shitty situation when you have only one shotgun shell and two enemies in front of you. He died due to blaster launcher in his face. RIP SomeName /Meat.

However after that experience I finally know how to deal with that base and get alien slate and reproduction already.
« Last Edit: October 03, 2015, 09:58:47 pm by EditorRUS »

Offline hellrazor

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #417 on: October 04, 2015, 04:12:34 am »
I already did. TFTD formula doesn't change the range of damage for explosives BTW, it's still 50% to 150%.
It's not a floater base. It's Sectoid+Snakeman's base, with cyberdiscs and chryssalids at once.

Uhhh, the normal UFO damage modifier goes from 0 - 200% for all weapons, High Explosives included.
Not a Floater Base? Are you sure it's the first first alien base (Alien Base Number 1), since it is set to be built
in the first month you play and has 100% chance to be floaters.

After some research I came up with a creative solution. It seems like alien bases are AWESOME for HE packs. Lots of corners which provide you cover while explosives clear these long hallways, it is just interesting. And so I took 10 my most suicidal meat, gave them tons of primed HE packs and loaded shotguns and boy, this one fight has been fun as hell. Unfortunately I failed nevertheless because I lost 9 out of 10 of my men and the last guy, who made it to command center, had only 1 shot left and no explosives. What a shitty situation when you have only one shotgun shell and two enemies in front of you. He died due to blaster launcher in his face. RIP SomeName /Meat.

However after that experience I finally know how to deal with that base and get alien slate and reproduction already.

I always used a combination of Heavy Canons, Rocket Launcher, Shotguns and Proxy Grenades, also worked to some degree.
You should not fall behind to much research wise, since Lasers will only help you until Muton Elites occur.

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #418 on: October 04, 2015, 04:41:26 am »
Uhhh, the normal UFO damage modifier goes from 0 - 200% for all weapons, High Explosives included.

I am... sceptical.

Have you ever had a low-level alien survive a grenade? I don't think so.

Offline DeltaEpsilon

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Re: [WIP][EXPANSION]Hardmode Expansion - Beta - v0.93b Cydonia or Bust Fix
« Reply #419 on: October 04, 2015, 04:52:09 am »
Quote
Uhhh, the normal UFO damage modifier goes from 0 - 200% for all weapons, High Explosives included.
UFOPaedia states otherwise.
https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Explosions
Quote
Second, they impart Damage within a narrower interval than weapons. Weapons impart from 0 to 2 times their rated strength. (In other words, the UFOpaedia is showing you their average strength.) Explosives also impart the average listed damage from the UFOpaedia, but they have a minimum of average/2 and a maximum of 3/2*average. So a blaster (HE 200) does from 100 to 300 damage at ground zero (GZ). You will still receive the damage listed in the UFOpaedia at GZ, on average. But you are guaranteed to get some damage if caught within its blast radius, unlike a firearm, which will hit you (if it hits!) for 0 to 2x damage, regardless of range. Of course, if your armor is high enough relative to the damage roll, it always blocks any actual damage.

Quote
Not a Floater Base? Are you sure it's the first first alien base (Alien Base Number 1), since it is set to be built
No, it was second base.

Quote
I always used a combination of Heavy Canons, Rocket Launcher, Shotguns and Proxy Grenades, also worked to some degree.
I have statstrings showing "class" of a soldier and I give them weapon according to their class. Suprisingly my best units are my throwers, which act both like an accurate long-range artillery and scouts.

Nevertheless I spent 1.5 hour to clear the Floater Base and oh god, it was hard as hell. None of my battleship assault can be compared by difficulty to this one base assault. Losing 13 soldiers out of 14, blowing 28 HE packs, using _only_ explosives and shotguns and it took me 85 turns to finally end this suffer.
Spoiler:


While I was doing my job, I noticed one bug though - floaters never used the lift to XCOM green area and so I could kill them easily. I don't think it belongs to this mod though, but whatever.
And also a question: what are new spawn count values? It is abnormal for an alien base to have ~40 enemies in.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2015, 05:11:32 am by EditorRUS »