Is grenade launcher damage nerfed?

[hth]

I'm very new player, only about a year into my first game (on second difficulty), and got a strong feeling what standard HE 46mm grenade (black) damage is noticeable lower compared to throwing grenades or similar launcher weapon from FMP OXC. Because way to often I see how low-ranking cultists, gangers and small animals survive direct aimed hits! Actually, I under impression what it happens even more frequently than fatal hits.

Btw, hello and thanks for such amazingly immersive mod!

[psavola]

Grenade damage is 50, grenade launcher HE is 48. This has not changed in the last couple of years at least. I have not played FMP, but looking at the rulesets, those are the same. So there's no real difference, though the blast radius of grenade is 5 instead of HE grenade's 4. Both have damage spread of 50-150 %. With this kind of damage you can't really depend on even weaker cultists dying of one hit, though the weaklings often do.

BTW: it does not make sense to directly target enemies with grenade launcher. If you score a direct hit, your unit is marked as spotted and enemy sniper units can fire at the unit or throw grenades at it even though they don't see your unit. Throwing grenades does not have this issue, and you can also target an adjacent tile.

[Rag]

I've never used the explosive rounds for the grenade launcher so can't speak to them, but I do like the stun rounds so would recommend trying those for some long range stuns, they work surprisingly effectively compared to the shotgun stun rounds.

I'm not sure if grenade launchers still hit the under armour on direct hits or if they hit the front armour instead, if that is the case then it could explain direct hits being weaker than expected but I'm probably wrong on that as don't know the explosion mechanics

[hth]

Grenade damage is 50, grenade launcher HE is 48. This has not changed in the last couple of years at least. I have not played FMP, but looking at the rulesets, those are the same. So there's no real difference, though the blast radius of grenade is 5 instead of HE grenade's 4. Both have damage spread of 50-150 %. With this kind of damage you can't really depend on even weaker cultists dying of one hit, though the weaklings often do.

Yes, I have seen these numbers too. May be some mechanic has changed from OXC? In FMP grenade launcher do well even on aliens which are much better protected than early x-files scum.

it does not make sense to directly target enemies with grenade launcher. If you score a direct hit, your unit is marked as spotted and enemy sniper units can fire at the unit or throw grenades at it even though they don't see your unit. Throwing grenades does not have this issue, and you can also target an adjacent tile.

Thanks for tip! Which I assume related to any shooting weapon? In any case this make throwing grenades even more overpowered than I thought.

Personally I used GL in FMP simply as much faster (and reliable in rough terrain) RL variant.

I'm not sure if grenade launchers still hit the under armour on direct hits or if they hit the front armour instead, if that is the case then it could explain direct hits being weaker than expected but I'm probably wrong on that as don't know the explosion mechanics

Not much an issue for low level enemies.

[psavola]

Thanks for tip! Which I assume related to any shooting weapon? In any case this make throwing grenades even more overpowered than I thought.

Yes, it affects any shooting weapon, and melee as well. It does not apply to "area effects", so thrown grenades or splash damage from grenade launchers, rocket launchers, etc. does not trigger this behavior.

Yes, I have seen these numbers too. May be some mechanic has changed from OXC? In FMP grenade launcher do well even on aliens which are much better protected than early x-files scum.

Let's take a look at first-level cultists in XCF:
- Red Dawn Ganger: 50 health + 5 armor
- Supporter of Dagon: 40 health + 5 armor
- Black lotus follower: 35 health + 5 armor
- Exalt infiltrator: 30 health + 5 armor

So it's unlikely that you kill even an initial RD ganger with one grenade, you'll need to roll quite a bit higher than 100%. For the rest a 100 % damage roll is enough, and with some by quite a large margin. None of them are guaranteed however. In vanilla and FMP, sectoids are 30 health and 2-4 points or armor. So they are essentially comparable to exalt infiltrators. A very likely kill with one, but not guaranteed. In XCF sectoids are tougher, because they also have PSI shields.