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Author Topic: [FIXED] Confusion in Sell/Sack Basescape Screen and MMB  (Read 1828 times)

Offline Flaubert

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[FIXED] Confusion in Sell/Sack Basescape Screen and MMB
« on: April 30, 2023, 07:06:08 pm »
Hello,
   first of all, sorry if this is not a bug but a sought behavior. I just report here because current behavior "feels strange" -for me-. In Sell/Sack screen, MMB response fo the inventory entries is different whether object needs research or it's just added to UFOPaedia without researching, no matter if the item has been already researched....but peeking at the code I found that pressing Ctrl + MMB at researched items, they are shown in UFOPedia.
It's strange, because the different behavior of researchable or not-researchable items -first ones need MMB-Ctrl; second ones only MMB).

I will suggest "flip" Ctrl use, so when pressing Ctrl+MMB you go to Tree Tech Viewer, and only with MMB you go tu UFOPedia entry for all known items (researched or not researchable).
It would be just change in "Sellstate.cpp", line 961 : "if (selectedTopic && !ctrlPressed)" to "if (selectedTopic && ctrlPressed)" 

Thanks!
« Last Edit: May 07, 2023, 05:22:07 pm by Meridian »

Offline Meridian

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Re: Confusion in Sell/Sack Basescape Screen and MMB
« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2023, 07:35:12 pm »
It's not a bug, but it has been reported a few times and I agree that it is confusing.

In the order of importance (when I play), the actions/questions are:
1. is this something I still need for research? (MMB)
2. is this something I still need for manufacture? (RMB)

If not, sell.

3. I don't know if anyone uses UFOpedia here, or for what... honestly I can't think of any reason right now... but there's no more mouse buttons for it :) So, we can leave it at Ctrl+MMB only.

Feedback from players welcome.

PS: there is no such thing in the Manufacture screen yet... but it has been requested: https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,7281.0.html

Offline Meridian

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Re: Confusion in Sell/Sack Basescape Screen and MMB
« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2023, 07:40:15 pm »
Also, the condition is not whether the item is researched or not.

The condition is whether a corresponding research topic exists or not... even already researched items bring up the TechTreeViewer GUI (not the Ufopedia).

Offline Nerro

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Re: Confusion in Sell/Sack Basescape Screen and MMB
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2023, 09:36:37 pm »
I've always been confused by the fact that some items bring the UFOpedia while others will bring the Tech Tree.
But it is clearly more usefull for me to have the Tech Tree in this screen rather than the UFOpedia.
Actually, if the middle-click was not doing anything on the items without Tech Tree entries, it would make more sense for me.

Also, I would have never been able to figure out that ctrl+middle-click was the way to display UFOpedia in there. I guess their are no easy way to communicate that to the player, but that would have cleared my confusion if I had known about it.

Offline Flaubert

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Re: Confusion in Sell/Sack Basescape Screen and MMB
« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2023, 12:12:56 am »
I've always been confused by the fact that some items bring the UFOpedia while others will bring the Tech Tree.
But it is clearly more usefull for me to have the Tech Tree in this screen rather than the UFOpedia.
Actually, if the middle-click was not doing anything on the items without Tech Tree entries, it would make more sense for me.

Also, I would have never been able to figure out that ctrl+middle-click was the way to display UFOpedia in there. I guess their are no easy way to communicate that to the player, but that would have cleared my confusion if I had known about it.
I use the ufopaedia at sell/sack to fast-comparing different weapons so I know which is better to keep or sell. Also, if ufopaedia doesn't open I know I've not researched that item, so better not selling it for now (yes, I know I can see it at Tech tree viewer by the color, but it is not so obvious)
I can't seem any obvious uses of Tree Tech at Sell/Sack screen (apart from the last one I told before)

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Offline Meridian

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Re: Confusion in Sell/Sack Basescape Screen and MMB
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2023, 09:26:24 am »
It's not so much about if the item itself is researched or not, I can usually remember that.

It's about whether the item is still needed for research or not.

For example, can this prisoner tell me anything more? And if yes, are those some rare topics or can I learn them from many other prisoners?
Already in vanilla, the getOneFree sections have around 10 items, in mods they are even bigger, impossible to remember.

Offline Flaubert

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Re: Confusion in Sell/Sack Basescape Screen and MMB
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2023, 09:56:28 am »
It's not so much about if the item itself is researched or not, I can usually remember that.

It's about whether the item is still needed for research or not.

For example, can this prisoner tell me anything more? And if yes, are those some rare topics or can I learn them from many other prisoners?
Already in vanilla, the getOneFree sections have around 10 items, in mods they are even bigger, impossible to remember.

That's a good point. I must admit that Tech Tree viewer could be useful here. But I still think that different behavior of the same buttons with different items is confusing, and it could be "MMB alone" does one thing, and "Ctrl+MMB" does the other, maintaining the same behavior for all the items.

Offline Meridian

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Re: Confusion in Sell/Sack Basescape Screen and MMB
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2023, 10:01:18 am »
That's a good point. I must admit that Tech Tree viewer could be useful here. But I still think that different behavior of the same buttons with different items is confusing, and it could be "MMB alone" does one thing, and "Ctrl+MMB" does the other, maintaining the same behavior for all the items.

Yes, definitely.

I tried to say that in the first reply, sorry if it wasn't clear.
I will change the behavior in the next version.

Offline psavola

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Re: Confusion in Sell/Sack Basescape Screen and MMB
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2023, 10:07:09 am »
It's not so much about if the item itself is researched or not, I can usually remember that.

It's about whether the item is still needed for research or not.

For example, can this prisoner tell me anything more? And if yes, are those some rare topics or can I learn them from many other prisoners?
Already in vanilla, the getOneFree sections have around 10 items, in mods they are even bigger, impossible to remember.

MMB in sell screen seems to work well for all entries that do have a tech tree entry at least. The coloring in the top corner at "ITEM DESTROYED" shows whether you have already researched it at least once, looking at the right column you can scroll through whether you have already obtained all getOneFree items. With this you can discard those prisoners that can no longer tell you anything more.

What seems to be missing and what could be somewhat useful is that especially in mission debriefing auto-sell manager you could check whether you already have that item in the stores (useful if you haven't researched it already). For example, with X-Com Files with ridiculous number of different items you can get from battlescape, you'd rather research all the items at some point for completion (and possibly dependencies) but you might know even without researching it that you don't need a stockpile of them so you would want to sell any extras you get. But this is not a big deal, you can do just manual store cleanups now and then.

Offline Flaubert

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Re: Confusion in Sell/Sack Basescape Screen and MMB
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2023, 10:23:51 am »
Yes, definitely.

I tried to say that in the first reply, sorry if it wasn't clear.
I will change the behavior in the next version.
Thank you!

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Offline Meridian

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Re: [FIXED] Confusion in Sell/Sack Basescape Screen and MMB
« Reply #10 on: May 07, 2023, 05:23:07 pm »
Fixed in OXCE 7.9.2

New action mapping attached.