Author Topic: [DONE] Time to clean up user options  (Read 2834 times)

Offline Stoddard

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #45 on: February 07, 2019, 07:12:06 pm »
Usually the soldiers of the player "visibilityAtDay" greater than "visibilityAtDark". Equality of indicators "visibilityAtDay" and "visibilityAtDark" in the settings of the armor, it is a night vision system.

it is not. Equality of these two settings means exactly nothing.

Quote
And I would like to see units with night vision activate night vision automatically, and units without night vision - no.

There is no "activation" or any state to this. They see this far at day and that far at night. Period.


You are misunderstanding. Night vision as discussed here is the option to show the player the terrain at night.

It has zero, nothing, nada, nilch to do with what there is in armor settings.


Offline Ethereal

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #46 on: February 07, 2019, 07:30:38 pm »
If visibilityAtDark = 10 and visibilityAtDay = 20 and you turn on night vision, you will still only see 10 tiles. Night vision does not change your vision to 20.

That's what I'm saying. In the scenario described by you, Night Vision should not be activated. The highlight itself must be available when visibilityAtDark = visibilityAtDay.

So I propose to make automatic activation of Night vision mode focusing not on "generate enough light", but on the equality of visibility indicators.

Offline Meridian

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #47 on: February 07, 2019, 07:43:47 pm »
That's what I'm saying. In the scenario described by you, Night Vision should not be activated.

That's totally against what night vision does now. If it wasn't activated, the player would not see anything... which is why night vision was implemented in the first place.

The highlight itself must be available when visibilityAtDark = visibilityAtDay.

Why equal? Why couldn't a modder want vision during dark = 10, vision during dark with NV gear = 15 and vision during day = 20?
I don't see a reason to hardcode something like that.
Not to mention this is a feature request unrelated to this thread and belongs in its own thread.

Offline Ethereal

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #48 on: February 07, 2019, 07:51:41 pm »
Okay, fine. Only one thing I ask-do not remove "Automatic Night Vision" from the options menu.

Offline ajnunezr

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #49 on: February 08, 2019, 02:43:42 am »
Thanks for the feedback everyone.
Here's the updated proposal.

Turn off and remove:
---------------
Maximized Night Display - use NO
Less-Spoilers Tech Tree Viewer - use NO

Turn on and remove:
---------------
Martial training at any time - use YES
Display if weapon is two-handed - use YES
Show 2-handed indicator in inventory - use YES
Extra bleeding indicator - use YES
High Stun indicator - use YES
Show item weight in inventory - use YES
Friendly craft escort - use YES
Single-handed weapon unloading - use YES

Rework and remove:
---------------
Automatic Night Vision - if xcom units generate enough light that the screen is not pure black, don't do anything... if "pure black", turn NV on automatically
Remove wounded soldiers from training - remove them, but remember if they want to return to training after recovery (automatically)
Display map borders on the Minimap - turned off by default, turn on by pressing ALT

Convert into a mod option (instead of user option):
---------------
Statistical Bullet Saving - default NO
Draw enemy radar circles - change to 0 (never draw), 1 (draw if hyperdetected), 2 (always draw) => default 1

Hidden (in options.cfg), modder can fix (it's not possible to convert this into a mod option, that's why it unfortunately needs to stay here):
---------------
Start-Up Text Mode - default 0 # 0 = vanilla, 1 = remove dos4gw and soundblaster text, 2 = remove all text

Keep (as user option on the GUI):
---------------
UFO landing alert - default NO
Wounded fight if base attacked - default NO
Play Briefing music longer - default NO
Select Night Vision color - default 8
Auto-Sell Manager - default NO

Well. My humble 2 cents.

I do get the difference and switch normally between maximized Night vision and not maximized. And I do not use automatic NV, I always turn it on and off with the space key (Not toggling, turning it on and off). But I will accept the decisions made by all.

I like a lot the Remove wounded soldiers rework.

I do use map borders.... Ok for me if they appears with alt.

I will miss statistical bullet saving, but as a mod options seems like the correct decision.

I love auto sell manager.

I would like a "Wounded fight if they are above %" option. But is up to the developers (Yankes and Meridia in this case. I do not know if those changes are going to be translated to OXC)

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #50 on: February 08, 2019, 11:02:54 am »
IMO personal light is at least equally good, arguably much better.

Excuse me, why would I advertise my presence to every sniper on the map, especially if they're not returning the favour?

Offline Meridian

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #51 on: February 08, 2019, 11:09:30 am »
Excuse me, why would I advertise my presence to every sniper on the map, especially if they're not returning the favour?

I'm not talking about real world, I'm talking about in-game experience.

What makes sense in real world can be completely stupid in-game; and vice versa. We're designing a game here, not a US military battle simulator.
« Last Edit: February 08, 2019, 11:11:27 am by Meridian »

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #52 on: February 08, 2019, 11:12:23 am »
This has absolutely no relation to real world, it's about my x00dz getting sniped by hidden d00dz because they are walking Christmas trees.
What else is there to explain?

Offline Meridian

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #53 on: February 08, 2019, 11:18:43 am »
So let me return to the beginning and quote you again.

I don't really like night vision either, but it's like democracy: nobody has ever came up with anything better.

I politely disagree with statement that nobody came up with anything better... I say that Julian Gollop came up with "something better" in xcom1994... the "walking christmas tree" mechanic works as intended there and largely contributes to the game being as amazing as it is.

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #54 on: February 08, 2019, 11:40:27 am »
(I think we're off topic, so feel free to move these posts.)

Yes, the vanilla system works for vanilla, which has a very specific setting and a very specific concept of combat. It only works with these assumptions that your soldiers are clueless and the enemy has superior night vision. It is a very narrow and very specific design, which doesn't really allow any scenarios with a different premise.
The moment you started adding the options to modify night vision and lighting, like visibilityAtDark, these design assumptions stopped being relevant. The entire point of these OXCE additions were to go beyond Gollop's assumptions, because without revising those assumptions, you can't really go beyond the original concept. For example, you can't have human enemies who are comparable to your units; they must always be superior aliens (or equivalent). The point of these OXCE additions is to allow for other enemy templates, the original concept didn't require them at all; Gollop's mechanics was 100% sufficient.
Just to be clear, I don't think the current system is bad or that it requires any additions. I am happy with it. And I certainly don't think OXCE vision options were a mistake and should be ignored in favour of going back to exclusively shooting Cydonians. :)

Offline Meridian

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Re: [DONE] Time to clean up user options
« Reply #55 on: February 10, 2019, 09:01:29 pm »
Done.
Details below.
Also, all the remaining options have been renamed, so players need to set them to their expectations again... and modders can change their fixed defaults if they so choose.


Turn off and remove:
---------------
* Less-Spoilers Tech Tree Viewer - use NO

Turn on and remove:
---------------
* Martial training at any time - use YES
* Display if weapon is two-handed - use YES
* Show 2-handed indicator in inventory - use YES
* Extra bleeding indicator - use YES
* High Stun indicator - use YES
* Show item weight in inventory - use YES
* Friendly craft escort - use YES
* Single-handed weapon unloading - use YES

Rework and remove:
---------------
* Maximized Night Display - replace with hybrid night vision = local NV (with max shade 4) + global "maximized" NV (with max shade 8 )
* Automatic Night Vision - if craft interior is too dark (tile shade 12-15); or outside map is too dark (global shade 12-15) and all units have personal light <= 5... turn on NV
* Remove wounded soldiers from training - remove them, but remember if they want to return to training after recovery (automatically)
* Display map borders on the Minimap - turn on by pressing ALT

Convert into a mod option (instead of user option):
---------------
* Statistical Bullet Saving - default NO
* Draw enemy radar circles - change to 0 (never draw), 1 (draw if hyperdetected), 2 (always draw) => default 1

Code: [Select]
statisticalBulletConservation: false
drawEnemyRadarCircles: 1

Hidden (in options.cfg), modder can fix (it's not possible to convert this into a mod option, that's why it unfortunately needs to stay here):
---------------
* Start-Up Text Mode - default 0 # 0 = vanilla, 1 = remove dos4gw and soundblaster text, 2 = remove all text

Keep (as user option on the GUI):
---------------
* UFO landing alert - default NO
* Wounded fight if base attacked (health >= x%) - default 100%
* Play Briefing music longer - default NO
* Night Vision color - default 8
* Auto-Sell Manager - default NO

Code: [Select]
fixedUserOptions:
  oxceAutoSell: false
  oxceNightVisionColor: 8
  oxcePlayBriefingMusicDuringEquipment: false
  oxceStartUpTextMode: 0
  oxceUfoLandingAlert: false
  oxceWoundedDefendBaseIf: 100

Offline ajnunezr

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Re: [DONE] Time to clean up user options
« Reply #56 on: February 11, 2019, 06:46:07 am »

Rework and remove:
---------------
* Maximized Night Display - replace with hybrid night vision = local NV (with max shade 4) + global "maximized" NV (with max shade 8 )
* Automatic Night Vision - if craft interior is too dark (tile shade 12-15); or outside map is too dark (global shade 12-15) and all units have personal light <= 5... turn on NV

If I understand well, now the NV for the areas the units have vision, are going to be more lighted than the areas were there is not vision, but all the map going to have some kind of NV, even if you don´t have anyone looking there?. 

Keep (as user option on the GUI):
---------------
* Wounded fight if base attacked (health >= x%) - default 100%

GREAT!!!.

Offline Meridian

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Re: [DONE] Time to clean up user options
« Reply #57 on: February 11, 2019, 11:23:08 am »
If I understand well, now the NV for the areas the units have vision, are going to be more lighted than the areas where there is not vision, but all the map going to have some kind of NV, even if you don´t have anyone looking there?. 

And if the area is discovered in the first place.

Offline Ethereal

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Re: [DONE] Time to clean up user options
« Reply #58 on: February 11, 2019, 03:17:22 pm »
* Play Briefing music longer - default NO

Well, why did the music prevent you? Leave her alone please.

Offline Meridian

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Re: [DONE] Time to clean up user options
« Reply #59 on: February 11, 2019, 03:36:02 pm »
Well, why did the music prevent you? Leave her alone please.

The default was NO before as well... I didn't change anything here!!