Author Topic: [DONE] Time to clean up user options  (Read 6188 times)

Online Meridian

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #30 on: February 06, 2019, 11:50:23 pm »
What happens when you mind control an alien? Do mind controlled aliens get default unit light (I honestly don't remember) and so auto-NV is prevented?
I might sound rude but to simplify my point: I don't like night vision and I don't want to use it ever; if this rework can accidentally activate NV, then I'd prefer it to be optional.

This check would be done only once... at the beginning of the mission (before turn 1). If at least one of your soldiers generates at least some light, NV will not activate.
For example, in normal vanilla game, it would never activate.

Your point is definitely not rude, I don't like night vision either... if you ever have any problems with it... I will be the first to implement a hard switch off for you.

Offline robin

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #31 on: February 07, 2019, 12:06:32 am »
This check would be done only once... at the beginning of the mission (before turn 1). If at least one of your soldiers generates at least some light, NV will not activate.
For example, in normal vanilla game, it would never activate.

Your point is definitely not rude, I don't like night vision either... if you ever have any problems with it... I will be the first to implement a hard switch off for you.
I see.
What if someone is making a Cthulhu mod set in 1910, using 0 unit light to force the player to equip (occupying one hand) cumbersome lanterns/torches? Would night vision turn on since unit light is 0? In that kind of setting NV would be out of place. A fantasy setting could have the same issue I guess.
Maybe I'm missing something because I don't use NV: is it always available or do I have to define its availability in the armor definition?

Online Meridian

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #32 on: February 07, 2019, 12:15:21 am »
I see.
What if someone is making a Cthulhu mod set in 1910, using 0 unit light to force the player to equip (occupying one hand) cumbersome lanterns/torches? Would night vision turn on since unit light is 0? In that kind of setting NV would be out of place. A fantasy setting could have the same issue I guess.
Maybe I'm missing something because I don't use NV: is it always available or do I have to define its availability in the armor definition?

1/ No worries, I will check the light level of tiles where soldiers spawn too... if there is any external light, NV won't be triggered.
As I said, only if you don't see fucking anything when the battle starts and you think the game crashed... then NV will activate to tell you that the game didn't actually crash.

2/ Yes, NV is always available, there is nothing to define on the armor.

Offline robin

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #33 on: February 07, 2019, 12:24:09 am »
Alright got it.

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #34 on: February 07, 2019, 12:35:16 am »
I don't really like night vision either, but it's like democracy: nobody has ever came up with anything better.

Online Meridian

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #35 on: February 07, 2019, 12:39:04 am »
IMO personal light is at least equally good, arguably much better.

Offline Stoddard

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #36 on: February 07, 2019, 01:38:32 am »
IIRC NV was done because either you had personal lights on and got shot up from darkness, or had them off and could not see a damn thing.

Anything changed in this respect?

Offline Ethereal

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #37 on: February 07, 2019, 03:42:01 am »
1/ No worries, I will check the light level of tiles where soldiers spawn too... if there is any external light, NV won't be triggered.
As I said, only if you don't see fucking anything when the battle starts and you think the game crashed... then NV will activate to tell you that the game didn't actually crash.

2/ Yes, NV is always available, there is nothing to define on the armor.

Please leave this function alone. Personally, even in this form, do not need automatic night vision.

But if you really want to redo this function so much, then you do not need to check for "personal Light" at all. It is better to make a test for the equality of indicators "visibilityAtDay" and "visibilityAtDark", which determines the presence of night vision systems in the armor.
And the darkness only creates additional complexity. Not to mention the presence of incendiary ammunition, which in the original nothing but lighting areas are not suitable. And the Electro-flare in the game has not been canceled. Must be a complete idiot to go without them on a night mission with no means of night vision.

IMO personal light is at least equally good, arguably much better.

No better. In the "personal Light", not working "camouflageAtDark" and all opponents use the "visibilityAtDay" for detection targets with a personal light.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2019, 03:50:30 am by Ethereal »

Offline Alex_D

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #38 on: February 07, 2019, 05:45:56 am »
My 2 cents:

Turn off and remove:
Maximized Night Display - use NO
I agree with all of the (updated) proposed options except the above one. I, for one, use this option. I have used it since I knew it existed. It saves me a lot from switching map and iso views every few seconds.

Plus, if there is a chance to add one small item to the list (not an option but related to auto-sell), once the loot is displayed for sale after a battle, can we have a "transfer to another base" button always active, regardless of the available storage room at the base (as opposite to appear only if the storage limits are enforced) ?

Offline mumble

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #39 on: February 07, 2019, 09:11:01 am »
I feel a little torn about the idea of losing wounded base defense. It was incredibly essential for piratez, otherwise I'd have no gals often, and despite the loses from system shock, it was more doable, since otherwise I needed to skip missions just to have guards "just in case".

I also understand your qualms about making it a percentage cut off, but this not only prevents unnecessary deaths, but seems more realistic. I FIGURE In bad enough states, people would just remain bed ridden as shooting starts.

I know its a bit much to suggest the change in addition to cleaning, but it feels wrong removing a feature that wasn't implemented ideally to begin with.

Online Meridian

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #40 on: February 07, 2019, 10:52:12 am »
IIRC NV was done because either you had personal lights on and got shot up from darkness, or had them off and could not see a damn thing.

Anything changed in this respect?

No, nothing changed. That's exactly it.

But if you really want to redo this function so much, then you do not need to check for "personal Light" at all. It is better to make a test for the equality of indicators "visibilityAtDay" and "visibilityAtDark", which determines the presence of night vision systems in the armor.
And the darkness only creates additional complexity. Not to mention the presence of incendiary ammunition, which in the original nothing but lighting areas are not suitable. And the Electro-flare in the game has not been canceled. Must be a complete idiot to go without them on a night mission with no means of night vision.

Night vision is a pure visual cosmetic feature. It affects ONLY the human player sitting in front of the computer.
It DOES NOT affect any game mechanics, the xcom units and aliens are completely unaware of night vision.
It DOES NOT affect any game calculations, visibility formulas or anything else.
It does not have anything to do with "visibilityAtDay" and "visibilityAtDark"... absolutely nothing... they are affected by "personalLight", not by night vision.

No better. In the "personal Light", not working "camouflageAtDark" and all opponents use the "visibilityAtDay" for detection targets with a personal light.

Xcom(1994)... is a game using personal light... and a game voted several times as "the best game of all times".
Do I need to say more?

I feel a little torn about the idea of losing wounded base defense.

See updated proposal several posts above. The option stays.

Offline Ethereal

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #41 on: February 07, 2019, 01:02:47 pm »
Xcom(1994)... is a game using personal light... and a game voted several times as "the best game of all times".
Do I need to say more?

In the original, it turns out, and automatic night vision is not needed, as all units of the player generate light. Yes, and the aliens see by night and by day alike.

In modifications, the situation is different. There were opponents who saw worse at night than during the day, night camouflage and so on. This compels disable the generation of light in player units, because:

Quote
Yes, if you generate light the "*Day" attributes apply.
https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,4187.msg102014.html#msg102014

I just don't want to have night vision automatically activated when the squad doesn't have night vision systems.

Online Meridian

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #42 on: February 07, 2019, 04:48:43 pm »
I don't know what else to say.

visibilityAtDark and night vision are two completely unrelated things in OXCE... without understanding this, I don't think we can have a productive discussion.

Offline Ethereal

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #43 on: February 07, 2019, 06:39:34 pm »
Usually the soldiers of the player "visibilityAtDay" greater than "visibilityAtDark". Equality of indicators "visibilityAtDay" and "visibilityAtDark" in the settings of the armor, it is a night vision system. And I would like to see units with night vision activate night vision automatically, and units without night vision - no.

I just thought that since you're working on this feature, it might be possible to improve it.

Online Meridian

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Re: Time to clean up user options
« Reply #44 on: February 07, 2019, 06:44:12 pm »
If visibilityAtDark = 10 and visibilityAtDay = 20 and you turn on night vision, you will still only see 10 tiles. Night vision does not change your vision to 20.