Active Alien Geoscape AI - has anyone ever taken a stab at this?

[Solarius Scorch]

Thank you. One last question, what palette does it use?

[ivandogovich]

Thank you. One last question, what palette does it use?

Geoscape at a guess.

[Hobbes]

Geoscape at a guess.

Yup, Geoscape palette it is and I'd advise to stick to the top row of colors because all the other ones are used for the terrain textures, space background, etc. You'll also notice that each color on the top row has 2 different tones. The 2nd tone is used for the 'blinking' effect on Geoscape, I think, so you can't assign that one as well.

[Solarius Scorch]

Thank you guys. This is valuable info.

Now, getting back on topic... I wonder how aggressive alien air force would work in the vanilla. I guess Skyranger would be too much of an iron coffin to be in use, so before you get Lighting you would be really stressed, and that would kinda suck - there's nothing you can do, you just lose your entire team sometimes. Unless you could give your Skyranger some escort, that would actually be interesting.

Speaking of formations... Yes, formations. Three planes that act like one (at least as long as all have enough fuel). Would help with managing interceptions.

And UFOs in formations? That would be so wicked. What's worse than being attacked by an alien vessel? Being attacked by two alien vessels. Want to shoot down that Terror Ship? Deal with these three Large Scouts first.

[Hobbes]

Now, getting back on topic... I wonder how aggressive alien air force would work in the vanilla. I guess Skyranger would be too much of an iron coffin to be in use, so before you get Lighting you would be really stressed, and that would kinda suck - there's nothing you can do, you just lose your entire team sometimes. Unless you could give your Skyranger some escort, that would actually be interesting.

Send the Interceptor first to scout and engage possible hostile UFOs? Of course, if your Interceptors don't have range, then you either risk sending the Skyranger without protection or don't the mission at all. Or send a Darkstar or another AWACS type craft to monitor the hostile UFOs and then maneuver the Skyranger to avoid their paths. Plenty of possibilities there.

Speaking of formations... Yes, formations. Three planes that act like one (at least as long as all have enough fuel). Would help with managing interceptions.

And UFOs in formations? That would be so wicked. What's worse than being attacked by an alien vessel? Being attacked by two alien vessels. Want to shoot down that Terror Ship? Deal with these three Large Scouts first.

To me this feature would not require formations to work - add the ability for airborne UFOs to detect and engage XCOM craft, add a new alienMission to regularly generate Alien Patrols (in addition to specific flags for some UFOs in the vanilla mission to act as escorts) and you're all set.

Formations come from Xenonauts, and from the reviews I've read 80-95% times you simply click on the autoresolve button to skip aerial combat. Which makes sense because these game is all about tactical combat, the air combat is mainly for show.

[Solarius Scorch]

Send the Interceptor first to scout and engage possible hostile UFOs? Of course, if your Interceptors don't have range, then you either risk sending the Skyranger without protection or don't the mission at all. Or send a Darkstar or another AWACS type craft to monitor the hostile UFOs and then maneuver the Skyranger to avoid their paths. Plenty of possibilities there.

To me this feature would not require formations to work - add the ability for airborne UFOs to detect and engage XCOM craft, add a new alienMission to regularly generate Alien Patrols (in addition to specific flags for some UFOs in the vanilla mission to act as escorts) and you're all set.

It depends on how exactly it works, I am somewhat sceptical about the ability to outmanoeuvre UFOs on the globe, if they go for the kill. I mean they can simply ignore the Interceptor and go around it, plus keeping the Interceptor close to the much slower Skyranger would be a chore (unless X-Com craft can follow another, I never tried).

Formations come from Xenonauts, and from the reviews I've read 80-95% times you simply click on the autoresolve button to skip aerial combat. Which makes sense because these game is all about tactical combat, the air combat is mainly for show.

Well, in my opinion that was the best part of the game. And it was somewhat tactical, though simple.

[Yankes]

It depends on how exactly it works, I am somewhat sceptical about the ability to outmanoeuvre UFOs on the globe, if they go for the kill. I mean they can simply ignore the Interceptor and go around it, plus keeping the Interceptor close to the much slower Skyranger would be a chore (unless X-Com craft can follow another, I never tried).

Then we should add option for "follow" your crafts. After that it should be rule that if one craft is attacked and have another very close by (they could start interception) they can join fight.

I think another important element is that ufo should switch to "combat speed" that is slower than max speed. This will allow sometimes run away from it before ufo start chase you at max speed again.

[Arthanor]

It depends on how exactly it works, I am somewhat sceptical about the ability to outmanoeuvre UFOs on the globe, if they go for the kill. I mean they can simply ignore the Interceptor and go around it, plus keeping the Interceptor close to the much slower Skyranger would be a chore (unless X-Com craft can follow another, I never tried).

Well, in my opinion that was the best part of the game. And it was somewhat tactical, though simple.

The aerial combat was the only thing I've ever seen that appealed to me in Xenonauts, it sure is more interesting that XCom's. Although since I never played, I don't know if I'd have gotten bored of it. And it raises the question: If UFOs are as maneuverable as they should be (from UFO reports they do all kinds of crazy things no plane could), wouldn't they just outclass your interceptors and dance around you?

I think what Hobbes was going for is to scout the area and stay away from the detection range of UFOs, if present. If they don't see you, they can't go for the kill (hence the AWACS being useful). The ability to follow a skyranger with an interceptor and, if engaged by an UFO, to automatically start a 2vs1 battle as both the skyranger and interceptor engage the UFO, would be really neat too.

[Hobbes]

I think another important element is that ufo should switch to "combat speed" that is slower than max speed. This will allow sometimes run away from it before ufo start chase you at max speed again.

How about adding a 'Evasive Maneuvers' button  (or replacing the vanilla button to disengage) where the craft attempts at 50% chance to break off from the ufo, if successful the ufo has to reacquire your craft on radar before attacking again? This evasion chance could then increase to 75% once UFO Navigation is researched.

To me having a combat speed vs maximum speed makes perfectly sense for current human planes built to our current understanding of physics, which places limits both on the pilot and craft, but an extraterrestrial civilization capable of building craft magically moved by anti-gravity waves might not have that limitation and use its max speed whenever it wants (or as long as there's Elerium)

[Solarius Scorch]

Then we should add option for "follow" your crafts. After that it should be rule that if one craft is attacked and have another very close by (they could start interception) they can join fight.

See? A formation!

How about adding a 'Evasive Maneuvers' button  (or replacing the vanilla button to disengage) where the craft attempts at 50% chance to break off from the ufo, if successful the ufo has to reacquire your craft on radar before attacking again? This evasion chance could then increase to 75% once UFO Navigation is researched.

I like this idea. It's simple and does the job, and doesn't break anything.
I imagine it would have a cooldown, yes?

To me having a combat speed vs maximum speed makes perfectly sense for current human planes built to our current understanding of physics, which places limits both on the pilot and craft, but an extraterrestrial civilization capable of building craft magically moved by anti-gravity waves might not have that limitation and use its max speed whenever it wants (or as long as there's Elerium)

I kinda agree... Well, it could be different, but why complicate things?

[Yankes]

How about adding a 'Evasive Maneuvers' button  (or replacing the vanilla button to disengage) where the craft attempts at 50% chance to break off from the ufo, if successful the ufo has to reacquire your craft on radar before attacking again? This evasion chance could then increase to 75% once UFO Navigation is researched.

To me having a combat speed vs maximum speed makes perfectly sense for current human planes built to our current understanding of physics, which places limits both on the pilot and craft, but an extraterrestrial civilization capable of building craft magically moved by anti-gravity waves might not have that limitation and use its max speed whenever it wants (or as long as there's Elerium)

I think that current disengage will work as evasive maneuvers if click multiple times or something.

[Stoddard]

A bit of an update.

The nightvision mode, sca work and another upcoming patch doesn't mean I abandoned geoscape ai. It's just I got a bit burned out reworking the coordinate system and then relearning how to code autopilots given non-dead-trivial constraints. So the work is continuing.

Current short-term goals are:

• Finish UFO intercept-mode autopilot given that now 'accel' stat really means acceleration as in 'thrust available for changing speed and/or altitude' and not some irrelevant number in ufopaedia.
• Do a patrol/scout-mode autopilot. It's peanuts compared to the intercept mode
• Fix up last bits of dogfight UI code.
• Flights, both player and ufo.
• Throw together some rudimentary dogfight stragegy for ufos. Most likely just a criteria when to run, if ever. Can be expanded later.
• Release already.

The first release will include:

• Nothing flies without a challenge, except very small, very low, very fast and very short. Or if decided otherwise by the mod author.
• Detection of player craft (also evasion/chance to hit) based on the same size scale as ufos, the size being inferred from craft capacity and hardpoints' type and count
• You can flee, if you have the accel and the speed. And if you're still alive. Otherwise, eject (not implemented).
• A disgustingly artificial limit of 4 dogfight participants per side.. but required so as to not have to design a whole new dogfight UI.
• Ufos joining dogfights as they progress.
• And player craft too.
• Dogfights no longer have their own spacetime, it's all in the same geoscape, as soon as you get in range as said in the weapon stats, you can fire (but fog dogfight slots).
• Above three points require that dogfights don't stop geoscape time. So they don't, bring that much more firepower if you like to choose the crash site
• Altitude tracked to a meter. Gaining altitude costs accel or speed, losing it gains speed, or restricts either descent or speed if the craft is about to overspeed.

Those points round up the base. After that's done the following will be trivial to do and will follow shortly:

• Transfers, purchases and sells generate their own flights, and you better escort them if you'd like to get the cash, or the goods.
• All alien missions have a point of orign and a point of return, and no more random zigzagging around unless it's some kind of scouting or a hunt. If they go to orbit, it's still ~100km of alititude you can try to catch them in. Just pack more boosters.
• Cities and bases generate traffic between them, and to and from orbit. Remeber the apocalypse space liners.

I often found whatever was happening in the geoscape to be either too boring or too short, and the game consisting mostly of the same ground missions over and over again. Dioxine made a great work of fixing the issue by enormously expanding research, manufacture and ground mission variety, for which I'm eternally grateful. But still the geoscape minus basescape looks dead-ish. Not as dead as in vanilla, but still. This will fix it.

[Yankes]

How your code will handle old saves? And when I save in new exe, old one could open it without crash?

What will be default behavior? UFO always attacks? Or its config that enable it?

To include to my branch (Meridian could have different criteria for his brach) I would like that overall default behavior will stay same (same time for dogfight and geoscepe is detail that can be changed).
Another thing is that save file do not change its structure, if you need add something its better if it separate node not used by normal OXC.

[Stoddard]

Since there are so many things built on existing alien mission system, I made all my changes separate.
It's in fact another class of Ufos, driven by separate code, they just share the stats and icons.
Old code and ufos that belong to it operate as usual.

How your code will handle old saves? And when I save in new exe, old one could open it without crash?

Old saves have old UFOs, old missions, so old code handles that. It's not going anywhere.

Load code just ignores stuff it doesn't know about, if it's separate enough, so I don't see any crashes forthcoming.

What will be default behavior? UFO always attacks? Or its config that enable it?

New code does not automatically take over over anything, this has to be done in the mods.
All old missions work exactly as they did before. So do the ufos they spawn.

To include to my branch (Meridian could have different criteria for his brach) I would like that overall default behavior will stay same (same time for dogfight and geoscepe is detail that can be changed).

From the start it all was done so that if one turns off the new ai, or opens the save in an old build, all new features just vanish.
So the old dogfight code will have to stay. I have yet to think this through though.

Another thing is that save file do not change its structure, if you need add something its better if it separate node not used by normal OXC.

That's the plan.

[Yankes]

Great, I looking forward to steal it when you finish it