Re: [MAIN] XPiratez - N10 24-Nov-2024 Aurora's Dawn

[ohartenstein23]

I like to think of the codex choice as similar to choosing a class in an action/RPG game; you get the same basic challenges and game no matter what class you pick, but you experience them with a different set of tools and methods. You don't lose out on contebt by choosing one over another, and it's usually balanced by not having all the tools at once, but rather a meaningful subset of them.

[khade]

I'd actually welcome different styles of playthrough, which I believe was a game goal at some point.  Where you research one of a mutually exclusive set of topics very early in the game that radically change how your crew is going to interact with the world.  Being outright heroes could be fun, or actual villains.  Aligning with different groups with different ultimate goals.

Something I'd also like to see is us actually being required to set up the protection racket we have going on, though for that, I wonder if it's possible to have base buildings either closed off and without any maintenance or lowered maintenance but with lowered utility.  Both unlocked through research or manufacturing.  The lab especially, you're not going to turn on the mainframe until you finish the research related to it, so the maintenance for the lab could be far lower before your brainers figure out the plug.

The prison, barracks and store room could have lowered capacity until you put your runts towards cleaning them up and repairing what is broken, with the maintenance going up to compensate. Maybe the hanger and radar work at half efficiency until they're fixed, with a slower refueling and scans on the hour instead of half-hour respectively.

As far as I know, none of these would require different tiles, it could just activate functions that are already there.  One thing I do see maybe being a problem is if the game can remove single use workshop projects once they're completed.

[Martin]

I like to think of the codex choice as similar to choosing a class in an action/RPG game;

Not quite as the impact is extremely limited (I am fairly sure you can finish the game without ever touching any voodoo equipment) and some options are better than the others.

[Solarius Scorch]

I'd actually welcome different styles of playthrough, which I believe was a game goal at some point.  Where you research one of a mutually exclusive set of topics very early in the game that radically change how your crew is going to interact with the world.  Being outright heroes could be fun, or actual villains.  Aligning with different groups with different ultimate goals.

Yes, it is planned, in the sense that there are long-term plans in this direction. It's a very large and complex part though, so I'd say if it ever happens, it'll be a major cause for cheering.

Not quite as the impact is extremely limited (I am fairly sure you can finish the game without ever touching any voodoo equipment) and some options are better than the others.

Maybe so, but it is still very much WIP.

[Riph]

Also, what's exactly wrong in not seeing it all in a single playthrough...? Especially if the restricted content is mostly a handful of very powerful endgame items.

Because I am an explorer (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartle_taxonomy_of_player_types)
and the idea that I'll be unable to view the entire, 100% Bootypedia makes me twitch.

In all seriousness though, I think I understand and appreciate what you're going for.  The ghost armor is goofily, game-breakingly powerful, and if you gate it away on some playthroughs then you can add other cool, powerful stuff without making the player into an unstoppable juggernaut.

I think my problem right now is that if you offered me the choice between Illusion, or Destruction+Excess+Communion, I'd probably take Illusion.

My other problem is that the game made me make this choice hundreds of hours ago when I was ignorant of its consequences.  The ufopedia entries on the codexes barely, barely imply that your choice will impact your voodoo down the road, and give no specifics.  I honestly thought that I was just choosing the paintjob color for my Bonaventura, and went with green because a recharging craft laser sounded handy.

Both of those are fixable through game balance and giving the player more info early on.

[legionof1]

I too find myself slightly irritated at the current implementation. Thou my gripe is that destruction related weapons are only fully accessible if you went red codex. The other schools items are not subdivided in this manner. Things like hellgun and hell blade are hard to come by already due to the difficulty of live deamon captures let alone multiples of the high end ones.

[Dioxine]

Because I am an explorer (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartle_taxonomy_of_player_types)
and the idea that I'll be unable to view the entire, 100% Bootypedia makes me twitch.

By that taxonomy, you're an Achiever, actually, since it's Achievers who are 100% completionists:
"Also known as "Diamonds", these are players who prefer to gain "points", levels, equipment and other concrete measurements of succeeding in a game. They will go to great lengths to achieve rewards that confer them little or no gameplay benefit simply for the prestige of having it."

While Explorers:
"hey often feel restricted when a game expects them to move on within a certain time, as that does not allow them to look around at their own pace. They find great joy in discovering an unknown glitch or a hidden easter egg."

So you can't be an explorer while demanding MOAR INFO and that everything is discoverable easily.

But in all seriousness, this taxonomy is quite flawed, as I find Explorer, Killer and Achiever all appealing to me

[Kharim]

Its in the theory, you can exceed a total 100% in this model. I feel like  70% Killer 50% Explorer with 30% Achiever and 20% Socializer.

Wysłane z mojego ZAX 1.2

[juff]

Is there a way to get an aquarium? I thought that luxury spa might work but it doesn't.

[Solarius Scorch]

Is there a way to get an aquarium? I thought that luxury spa might work but it doesn't.

Well, it's technically possible... But AFAIK it's not in the game.

Would such a building have any other function than simply keeping fish alive? It would be fine to open a SeaWorld attraction and get money from visiting Lokk'Naar folks... Especially if the income depends on what you have in it. But that's pure fantasy.

[just_dont]

Can we have some in-game indication (e.g. in bootypedia) that stun baton and cattle prod damage is considered SPECIAL?
I found it out the hard way, trying to stun a reaper with zero effect due to them having 90% special damage resist.

Or it would be even better to somehow rework this, I understand that special damage resist was implemented to make reapers protected from things like Bad Touch and the like. But their immunity to stun baton and cattle prod doesn't make much sense - especially when you can gunbutt but not zap them.

[ohartenstein23]

Can we have some in-game indication (e.g. in bootypedia) that stun baton and cattle prod damage is considered SPECIAL?
I found it out the hard way, trying to stun a reaper with zero effect due to them having 90% special damage resist.

Or it would be even better to somehow rework this, I understand that special damage resist was implemented to make reapers protected from things like Bad Touch and the like. But their immunity to stun baton and cattle prod doesn't make much sense - especially when you can gunbutt but not zap them.

It's not special damage, it's plasma damage, but working with the toStun modifier.  2x2 units are naturally immune to the toStun modifier.  By the way, what did you think was going to happen trying to use a stun baton on a reaper?  Or a cattle prod for that matter?  A reaper is about the size of some cattle, so you're just making it angry

[just_dont]

It's not special damage, it's plasma damage, but working with the toStun modifier.  2x2 units are naturally immune to the toStun modifier.  By the way, what did you think was going to happen trying to use a stun baton on a reaper?  Or a cattle prod for that matter?  A reaper is about the size of some cattle, so you're just making it angry

Well, that's even more quirky then and should be indicated somewhere.
And regarding general believability of it, sorry, it's not very natural when you can easily stun a reaper with a few gunbutt swings, but can't do so with implements specifically designed to stun (that's not even mentioning that cattle prod can, given enough tries, stun people in power armor). But I don't really mind such quirks as long as it's explained to the player.

[ohartenstein23]

Well, that's even more quirky then and should be indicated somewhere.
And regarding general believability of it, sorry, it's not very natural when you can easily stun a reaper with a few gunbutt swings, but can't do so with implements specifically designed to stun.

Perhaps you forgot the first part of the motto for the mod? "Suffering awaits"?  Some stuff you just get to learn the hard way, but it's almost never the end of the campaign.  Also mutant ubers bashing on the skull multiple times using their guns as clubs is certainly believable over voltage sources meant to stun human-sized targets not working for 2x2 units.  It's even in the name of the item - it prods and aggravates large mammals at best.

Edit: There's also CTRL+H to tell if it's doing damage or not, which is a way of telling whether the weapon is effective.

[just_dont]

Some stuff you just get to learn the hard way

It's pretty bizarre to expect that someone should learn intricacies of OpenXCOM damage-dealing mechanics by... what exactly? Asking on forums or looking at the source code? I see no other possible ways. From within the game at most you can learn that something doesn't work, with no indication why.

Also, no matter how far you stretch it, this is a very special case that needs to be highlighted in some way. For example, you "bashing on the skull" example is completely flawed, because a melee weapon with lethal damage but extra stun will never stun a reaper (e.g. spiked mace), despite totally fitting the "bashing on the skull" idiom.