'Equal Terms' 1.0 Mod Discussion.

[KingMob4313]

Hello everyone.

Very happy to see all the amazing work done for the Open X Com project.

Right now I am working on an openxcom version of my Equal Terms mod, which seemed very popular previously.  I have been maintaining this mod since 2000 and with the widening of capabilities that Open X Com presents, I am excited to contribute to this project.

The concept of this modification is to make some unused weapons useful again and to convert certain weapons to a real life equivalent, ie: weapons NATO would be using against these UFO attacks, starting with a .45 calibre machine pistol, and an 6.8spc Assault Rifle, a Squad Automatic Weapon and a .50 calibre M107 Anti-Materiel rifle Sniper rifle.  It also increases some explosive damages and tweaks the other damages, accuracies and fire rates for the other weapons to create some sort of game balance.

Additionally, I am a professional Visual Studio developer, and I am looking forward to trying to work with the team with attaching more hooks for modding into the software.

This would facilitate mods such as a more natural version of my 'Highlander' mod, where soldiers are only lost if they are MIA, those who are 'KIA' instead are wounded for months at a time (My old version of it used batch files).  I am also looking to put together a more realistic autofire mod where each shot after the first gets less accurate.

Currently my v0.8 of Equal Terms for OpenXCom is up at: https://www.openxcom.com/mod/equal-terms

[darkestaxe]

Welcome to OXC! Always good to see new devs come to this little corner of the internet.

[niculinux]

Thanks! Palyed ufo since 1998 but never heard of equal terms mod but seems cool  . Please may we het screenshots as the mods progresses? Thanks again!

[AlienMuncher]

Welcome KingMob4313! I like the idea of gradually lowered accuracy after each fired shot with chemical propellent weapons or any weapons with significant recoil on that matter!

I've always appreciated work you put in ETM, although have never felt the need of introducing real ammo or weapons equivalents to the game. There are of course those who like it I just think Pistol, Assault Rifle, LMG work good as well!

[KingMob4313]

Welcome KingMob4313! I like the idea of gradually lowered accuracy after each fired shot with chemical propellent weapons or any weapons with significant recoil on that matter!

I've always appreciated work you put in ETM, although have never felt the need of introducing real ammo or weapons equivalents to the game. There are of course those who like it I just think Pistol, Assault Rifle, LMG work good as well!

Much appreciated.

The awesome part about this mod is that now, with everything exposed, I can modify the game to my taste and expand things wildly, although it seems others have beat me to it, with the awesome mods I've been seeing!

[KingMob4313]

Just added a link to my mod at https://www.openxcom.com/mod/equal-terms

[wsmithjr]

Took a look at the weapon specs and looks interesting.  Some things at first glance I was like "really?" but of course it's completely unfair to make comments like that before trying it.  I'll look forward to trying it out in the game.

Just wondering about the choice to add the HE/I rounds to the SAW, though that is a nifty and interesting option.  If you add a the grenade launcher into it, then that would give you those options while letting the machine gun it's role.  Something to think about.  It'd also be really cool to supply new graphics for the "new" weapons. 

I guess I'm in the minority but I really like the heavy and auto canon of the original (though not the graphics so much) and will miss them, particularly the auto canon loaded with HE for rookies who can't hit the broad side of a barn.  'Course, you also need to stand back when they let loose.  Don't know how "realistic" that is, but I like it. 

Thanks for sharing.

[KingMob4313]

Took a look at the weapon specs and looks interesting.  Some things at first glance I was like "really?" but of course it's completely unfair to make comments like that before trying it.  I'll look forward to trying it out in the game.

Just wondering about the choice to add the HE/I rounds to the SAW, though that is a nifty and interesting option.  If you add a the grenade launcher into it, then that would give you those options while letting the machine gun it's role.  Something to think about.  It'd also be really cool to supply new graphics for the "new" weapons. 

The HE/I rounds are to mimic the old rifle-launched grenades.  There's an oversight, where I left the grenades off the sniper rifle as well.  Each 'mag' for the HE/I only hold one shot, so it's very limited.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M7_grenade_launcher is an example of one in real life.

Also, there is some balance breaking here, the power weapons are doing much better damage compared to before (the assault rifle and sniper rifles are especially guilty), with the assault rifle doing more than the vanilla auto cannon's AP rounds.  But it's to draw a different balance than what is seen in the vanilla game, where for certain soldiers or playstyles, you might want to take powder weapons deep into the game, maybe all the way to Cydonia!

I guess I'm in the minority but I really like the heavy and auto canon of the original (though not the graphics so much) and will miss them, particularly the auto canon loaded with HE for rookies who can't hit the broad side of a barn.  'Course, you also need to stand back when they let loose.  Don't know how "realistic" that is, but I like it. 

I do like those too, the insane randomness of two guys in a hallway, firing HE rounds everywhere like a drunken fireworks show.

Thanks for sharing.

Thanks for the feedback!

[KingMob4313]

Progress keeps soldiering on.  Added a pair of shotguns based on Warboy1982's code, graphics to the sniper rifle from Toshiaki2115, Warboy1982 and new sounds from the gun range to the sniper rifle.

I am also at work on a Designated Marksman Rifle and an SMG, which I'll put through the test ringer before I release.

[Aldorn]

Progress keeps soldiering on.  Added a pair of shotguns based on Warboy1982's code, graphics to the sniper rifle from Toshiaki2115, Warboy1982 and new sounds from the gun range to the sniper rifle.

I am also at work on a Designated Marksman Rifle and an SMG, which I'll put through the test ringer before I release.

On mod site, perhaps should you add some warning at end of your short description. Something like "TO AVOID ISSUES, PREFER NOT TO USE WITH OTHER WEAPONS MODS"
(also in a better english...)

[KingMob4313]

On mod site, perhaps should you add some warning at end of your short description. Something like "TO AVOID ISSUES, PREFER NOT TO USE WITH OTHER WEAPONS MODS"
(also in a better english...)

Bawooop.

Will do.  That's a very good point.  I will also switch around folder and pathnames so that they do not conflict.

[yrizoud]

The compatibility issues I reported are not about files (I didn't check that) it's that in the ruleset you select existing default weapons (like STR_PISTOL) and modify them until they are nothing like the original.
If your mod is designed to replace the starting inventory, you should :
1) Add your weapons as "new" weapons (STR_somethingnew)
2) Add a non-existing requirement for every original item that you want to suppress (see the bottom of page: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Rulesets_(OpenXcom) ) and costBuy: 0 so that it's not listed in the store
3) redefine the starting base so that it doesn't contain the removed pistols etc, and instead contains your new weapons

[Solarius Scorch]

The compatibility issues I reported are not about files (I didn't check that) it's that in the ruleset you select existing default weapons (like STR_PISTOL) and modify them until they are nothing like the original.
If your mod is designed to replace the starting inventory, you should :
1) Add your weapons as "new" weapons (STR_somethingnew)
2) Add a non-existing requirement for every original item that you want to suppress (see the bottom of page: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Rulesets_(OpenXcom) ) and costBuy: 0 so that it's not listed in the store
3) redefine the starting base so that it doesn't contain the removed pistols etc, and instead contains your new weapons

+1

This is indeed a very good approach.

[yrizoud]

KingMob, I wanted to contribute more than just critics, so here's a modification of your ruleset which looks better as an OpenXCOM mod. It implements the above recommendations, plus:

For changes that modify only a few fields of an existing item, I kept only lines that change something. Personnally, I also keep the "original value" as a comment, I think it's friendlier as a reminder, and helps user see what the MOD brings.
Added  some listOrder numbers so that the items are listed "in the right place" in lists, especially if other mods insert weapons.
Defined a "starting equipment" which brings the right clips with the weapons
Added strings for the new ammo types

[KingMob4313]

KingMob, I wanted to contribute more than just critics, so here's a modification of your ruleset which looks better as an OpenXCOM mod. It implements the above recommendations, plus:

For changes that modify only a few fields of an existing item, I kept only lines that change something. Personnally, I also keep the "original value" as a comment, I think it's friendlier as a reminder, and helps user see what the MOD brings.
Added  some listOrder numbers so that the items are listed "in the right place" in lists, especially if other mods insert weapons.
Defined a "starting equipment" which brings the right clips with the weapons
Added strings for the new ammo types

Hey! Much appreciated with the help and the recommendations.  I was already attrib-ing you in the readme in preparation of doing the code changes.  I'm sorry I made a mess of things, but I'm coming from the modding days of Xcom where you could only really replace items, rather than add items.  So the 'new' weapons ended up replacing the weapons that were already there, since the served similar roles.

Everything you are saying makes perfect sense.  Keeping original values keeps me from having to go to ufopedia to look up the original stats.

I'll be working to incorporate this for a version 0.86, which will include the DMR, SMG and Incendiary grenades.

Thanks again.