Author Topic: Terror From the MCDEdit: Big_Wall:33  (Read 2072 times)

Online robin

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Terror From the MCDEdit: Big_Wall:33
« on: August 18, 2014, 11:10:50 pm »
So I've started doing tiles like there's no tomorrow. And of course I'm using MCDEdit (v113), aaand

UFO:


TFTD:


Same tile. The UFO version seems bugged/incomplete (no LOFTs at all), the TFTD one seems "complete" but it also has "1" into the "Big_Wall:33" entry..
What do I do? Just put the LOFTs in and leave the "Big_Wall:33" thing alone?
TFTD crates also use "Big_Wall:33".

Thanks.

(Maybe I should have posted this into the MCDEdit topic..).
« Last Edit: August 18, 2014, 11:50:14 pm by robin »

Offline Hobbes

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Re: Terror From the MCDEdit: Big_Wall:33
« Reply #1 on: August 19, 2014, 01:42:19 am »
I've also noticed before that the UFO tile 90 does not have LOFT settings but the same applies to tiles 89 and 91 so my guess is that it was a design decision. Without the LOFTs shots can go through the tile without being stopped, so it's a matter of choice whether you want the terrain to give more cover or not.

No one really has an idea about what Big_Wall does or why it is necessary.

Online robin

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Re: Terror From the MCDEdit: Big_Wall:33
« Reply #2 on: August 19, 2014, 02:04:18 am »
Thanks. I think I'm going to add LOFTs then, doesn't make much sense to me LOFTs-less.

Extra questions:
Is it possible to add/change the map graphics for tiles?
Is it possible to add extra, custom, LOFTs shapes, to the shapes pool?

Offline Hobbes

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Re: Terror From the MCDEdit: Big_Wall:33
« Reply #3 on: August 19, 2014, 02:39:20 am »
Is it possible to add/change the map graphics for tiles?
Is it possible to add extra, custom, LOFTs shapes, to the shapes pool?

The Scang (used for the map graphics) and the LOFT shapes are saved on the https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=SCANG.DAT and https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=LOFTEMPS.DAT files on the GEODATA folder of either UFO or TFTD.

Theoretically it could be possible to use a HEX editor to modify those files but I have no idea if you could add new entries or simply replace the existing ones. The issue would be that you'd have to include the SCANG or LOFTEMPS files with your mod but if you replaced the original entries then that could affect the original tiles.

My advice would be not to worry too much about changing both files since the work involved is not worth the return you get out of it. 

The existing LOFT shapes can give a rough approximation to whatever the shape of your new tiles, unless you are creating some really complicated tiles, plus the player never sees those. The Scang are a bit more problematic since they are used for the overhead map view and they can look weird but again players (or at least me) don't use it that much.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2014, 02:46:31 am by Hobbes »

Offline Hobbes

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Re: Terror From the MCDEdit: Big_Wall:33
« Reply #4 on: August 19, 2014, 03:06:27 am »
Something else that might help with the LOFTs. MCDEdit allows you to rotate the LOFT shape with the ruler underneath it, although I suspect that it is more to see it from different angles rather than to actually rotate it during the game.

Online robin

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Re: Terror From the MCDEdit: Big_Wall:33
« Reply #5 on: August 19, 2014, 10:28:11 am »
The Scang (used for the map graphics) and the LOFT shapes are saved on the https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=SCANG.DAT and https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=LOFTEMPS.DAT files on the GEODATA folder of either UFO or TFTD.

Theoretically it could be possible to use a HEX editor to modify those files but I have no idea if you could add new entries or simply replace the existing ones. The issue would be that you'd have to include the SCANG or LOFTEMPS files with your mod but if you replaced the original entries then that could affect the original tiles.

My advice would be not to worry too much about changing both files since the work involved is not worth the return you get out of it. 

The existing LOFT shapes can give a rough approximation to whatever the shape of your new tiles, unless you are creating some really complicated tiles, plus the player never sees those. The Scang are a bit more problematic since they are used for the overhead map view and they can look weird but again players (or at least me) don't use it that much.
I'm into perfectionism.
:P
But you're right, I should leave them alone. It's the map I'm a little less happy about.. eventually I'll advise users against using it when my mod is activated.


Something else that might help with the LOFTs. MCDEdit allows you to rotate the LOFT shape with the ruler underneath it, although I suspect that it is more to see it from different angles rather than to actually rotate it during the game.
Yeah that function is to check if the LOFTs is ok from all the sides, I think.

Offline Hobbes

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Re: Terror From the MCDEdit: Big_Wall:33
« Reply #6 on: August 19, 2014, 04:17:42 pm »
I'm into perfectionism.
:P

But you're right, I should leave them alone. It's the map I'm a little less happy about.. eventually I'll advise users against using it when my mod is activated.

True artists are never satisfied with their work :D

As I said before, it might be possible to add new Scang entries although it would be required to figure out how:
* What is a limit to the number of entries on the SCANG.DAT file. UFO has 453 entries, TFTD has 549 so it *may* be possible to add a few more.
* How the entry is defined on the SCANG.DAT. But editing a new entry is the real killer since you have to do it manually.

PS - I've just suggested to Volutar if editing the Scang/LOFT could be added to MCD View/Edit.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2014, 04:42:41 pm by Hobbes »