Author Topic: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)  (Read 558980 times)

Offline Kjotleik

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2400 on: October 22, 2016, 09:34:45 am »
The real error is just ABOVE. The 'delete' key shall be indented like the 'type' key on the reported line (including the preceding dash).

Puh! Thanks gix!

I appreciate the help in finding that it was the "delete-line" and not the colon itself. I would've thought of that too late for me to fix it before running out of patience.   :-[

Now it works, after I deleted the whole delete-line.   ::)
First I tried indent, but I got another error-message. Not same as before. So I deleted the line. And now it works.

Thanks again...

Offline gix

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2401 on: October 22, 2016, 10:32:38 am »
Hi Kjotleik
First I tried indent, but I got another error-message. Not same as before. So I deleted the line. And now it works.
To see how indent works, see e.g. items_FMP.rul in FMP... And also the white-spaces(no mixing white-spaces and tabs) count as well, the dash, everything...
The message made perfect sense when you read the rul. The YAML parser thought that you inserted a main category called delete, but the OXC doesn't had it, so it couldn't understand your key presence there...

Offline BTAxis

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2402 on: November 06, 2016, 08:47:18 pm »
So during my FMP game, I've made a few tweaks in a submod to fix some perceived issues. My submod currently reads:
Code: [Select]
items:
  - type: STR_LASER_PISTOL_MIB
    accuracyAuto: 38
    accuracySnap: 65
    accuracyAimed: 80
    tuAuto: 25
    tuSnap: 20
    tuAimed: 30
  - type: STR_NUCLEAR_LASER_PISTOL
    accuracyAuto: 38
    accuracySnap: 65
    accuracyAimed: 80
    tuAuto: 25
    tuSnap: 20
    tuAimed: 30
    listOrder: 3480
  - type: STR_GAUSS_PISTOL
    accuracySnap: 55
    accuracyAimed: 80
    tuSnap: 21
    tuAimed: 35
  - type: STR_NUCLEAR_LASER_RIFLE
    listOrder: 3485
  - type: STR_NUCLEAR_HEAVY_LASER
    listOrder: 3492
  - type: STR_SCATTER_LASER
    autoRange: 30
  - type: STR_PHOTON_BLADE
    listOrder: 1910

I made tweaks to the laser pistols and the gauss pistol, because after researching these, they felt pretty useless and a waste of research. Especially the gauss pistol is slower AND less accurate than the magnum, while doing pretty much the same damage as the magnum alloy ammo. This is bad, because to get to the gauss pistol you need to invest a significant amount of time, while the magnum is available from the start. I brought the accuracy and TU cost in line with the magnum, and now it feels like a modest upgrade to the hand cannon type sidearm. Similarly, the tweaks to the laser pistol make it a fair upgrade to the regular pistol. I did not touch the rail pistol, because it does so much more damage than any other sidearm, so worse performance there is fine.

The scatter laser got its auto range upped to 30, to match the minigun. I think this is fair, as it is written up to be a laser version of the minigun, and frankly without this change I would never even consider using it.

I also added/changed the list orders for some items that didn't have one, particularly the nuclear laser weaponry, and moved the photon blade up with the rest of the melee weapons.

Now, I'm still not happy with a few things. First and foremost is the way the rail weaponry unlocks. The entire arsenal becomes instantly available once the master rail weapons tech is unlocked, which is weird because you have to separately research every single other weapon in the game. Yes, they're supposedly improved versions of the gauss weapons, but the nuclear lasers are improved versions of the MiB lasers, and you don't get those free either.

Next, I think the rail weapons are altogether too good. They have pretty much no drawback beyond being AP weapons (which isn't much of a drawback) while dealing absurd amounts of damage. I'm okay with them as top tier weaponry, but I'm thinking perhaps they should be a little less end-all. I'm thinking about lowering the amount of shots per clip. I've never ever had to reload a rail weapon, or indeed any weapon past the starting weaponry. It'd lend a bit of personality to the family, I'd say. Also: lose the auto-shot on the heavy railgun. The heavy class is rather defined by its high-damage, low rate of fire character, and I think an auto-shot doesn't fit the profile.

Moving on, I find that the laser weapons have gotten rather snowed under, compared to older versions of FMP. Moving up from MiB lasers to "proper" lasers is fine, but the nuclear family unlocks pretty late, well past gauss, and by then you don't need it anymore. The gauss family outperforms lasers in every way, and then not long after the railguns one-up the gauss weapons rather badly. This leaves the nuclear lasers nowhere (apart from the scatter laser, which is great).

This is especially true for the poor laser sniper rifle. I want to like it, I really do, but it's just such a bad weapon. It's the least accurate of all sniper rifles, AND it does less damage than even the tactical sniper rifle. The only weapon it outperforms is the basic sniper rifle, which is hardly difficult. I considered buffing it a bit, but... well. In the UFOpaedia it's written up as basically being a slightly souped-up laser rifle, and I suppose that's exactly what it is. Its current stats make sense. Alas.

One more thing I'd like to say about the weapons: it's a bit sad that the variety in weapons the starting arsenal provides is nowhere to be found in the other families. I wouldn't mind seeing improved cousins of the LMG and HMG for example. At least there's the scatter laser to take over from the minigun, and there's a laser shotgun (even though it's kind of crap).

Finally, given the longer game FMP offers, I think Elerium income should be lower. Because I went on so many missions I had Elerium coming out of my ears after a while. Especially the MiB were showering me with the stuff. I'd say reducing the amount per item to 25 would help keep things in check, and for myself I might go as low as 10. That said it would be nice if bases yielded a lot of Elerium, but I don't think there's an easy way to do that.

--- posts merged - Solarius Scorch ---

By the way, there's a small map error on the large storage facility. A wall behind a cabinet is missing.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2016, 02:11:13 pm by Solarius Scorch »

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2403 on: November 07, 2016, 02:30:44 pm »
I made tweaks to the laser pistols and the gauss pistol, because after researching these, they felt pretty useless and a waste of research. Especially the gauss pistol is slower AND less accurate than the magnum, while doing pretty much the same damage as the magnum alloy ammo. This is bad, because to get to the gauss pistol you need to invest a significant amount of time, while the magnum is available from the start. I brought the accuracy and TU cost in line with the magnum, and now it feels like a modest upgrade to the hand cannon type sidearm. Similarly, the tweaks to the laser pistol make it a fair upgrade to the regular pistol. I did not touch the rail pistol, because it does so much more damage than any other sidearm, so worse performance there is fine.

The scatter laser got its auto range upped to 30, to match the minigun. I think this is fair, as it is written up to be a laser version of the minigun, and frankly without this change I would never even consider using it.

I also added/changed the list orders for some items that didn't have one, particularly the nuclear laser weaponry, and moved the photon blade up with the rest of the melee weapons.

OK, this should be interesting. Sadly I don't really have the time to balance FMP, so if you post your sub-mod, I think many people would want to try it.

Many of your issues were already fixed in the X-Com Files mod, but I can't just copy this because of some mechanics that are missing from the nightly.

Good point on the Gauss Pistol, I'll fix it. Laser Pistol stays the same for now to keep it more compatible with vanilla - its laser damage type is also a boost.

Now, I'm still not happy with a few things. First and foremost is the way the rail weaponry unlocks. The entire arsenal becomes instantly available once the master rail weapons tech is unlocked, which is weird because you have to separately research every single other weapon in the game. Yes, they're supposedly improved versions of the gauss weapons, but the nuclear lasers are improved versions of the MiB lasers, and you don't get those free either.

I'll probably tackle it at some point. It's been good enough for quite some time, but I agree it's somewhat awkward.

Next, I think the rail weapons are altogether too good. They have pretty much no drawback beyond being AP weapons (which isn't much of a drawback) while dealing absurd amounts of damage. I'm okay with them as top tier weaponry, but I'm thinking perhaps they should be a little less end-all. I'm thinking about lowering the amount of shots per clip. I've never ever had to reload a rail weapon, or indeed any weapon past the starting weaponry. It'd lend a bit of personality to the family, I'd say. Also: lose the auto-shot on the heavy railgun. The heavy class is rather defined by its high-damage, low rate of fire character, and I think an auto-shot doesn't fit the profile.

OK, I'll give them a nerf in clip size. The explanation was that the "bullets" are quite small, but maybe they need relatively bigger magazines?

Moving on, I find that the laser weapons have gotten rather snowed under, compared to older versions of FMP. Moving up from MiB lasers to "proper" lasers is fine, but the nuclear family unlocks pretty late, well past gauss, and by then you don't need it anymore. The gauss family outperforms lasers in every way, and then not long after the railguns one-up the gauss weapons rather badly. This leaves the nuclear lasers nowhere (apart from the scatter laser, which is great).

I think it's not that bad, but I'll give it more thought.

This is especially true for the poor laser sniper rifle. I want to like it, I really do, but it's just such a bad weapon. It's the least accurate of all sniper rifles, AND it does less damage than even the tactical sniper rifle. The only weapon it outperforms is the basic sniper rifle, which is hardly difficult. I considered buffing it a bit, but... well. In the UFOpaedia it's written up as basically being a slightly souped-up laser rifle, and I suppose that's exactly what it is. Its current stats make sense. Alas.

The problem with X-Com lasers is that they're generally inaccurate. So I'm not sure what can be done without making it more accurate or powerful...

One more thing I'd like to say about the weapons: it's a bit sad that the variety in weapons the starting arsenal provides is nowhere to be found in the other families. I wouldn't mind seeing improved cousins of the LMG and HMG for example. At least there's the scatter laser to take over from the minigun, and there's a laser shotgun (even though it's kind of crap).

Some upgrades are possible, but there are some technical limitations... For example you can't give bigger weapons to Mutons only (you can in OXCE+, which is what I've done). I'll think about it too.

Finally, given the longer game FMP offers, I think Elerium income should be lower. Because I went on so many missions I had Elerium coming out of my ears after a while. Especially the MiB were showering me with the stuff. I'd say reducing the amount per item to 25 would help keep things in check, and for myself I might go as low as 10. That said it would be nice if bases yielded a lot of Elerium, but I don't think there's an easy way to do that.

I'll check. :)

--- posts merged - Solarius Scorch ---

By the way, there's a small map error on the large storage facility. A wall behind a cabinet is missing.

[/quote]

Thanks, I'll fix it too.

Many thanks for sharing your thoughts! A very productive post. :)

Offline BTAxis

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2404 on: November 07, 2016, 03:56:25 pm »
OK, I'll give them a nerf in clip size. The explanation was that the "bullets" are quite small, but maybe they need relatively bigger magazines?

Yeah, I figured that. I was also thinking about maybe nerfing accuracy or power instead, but that just doesn't make much sense. There's no reason why they should be less accurate than early game weapons, and their power is what they're all about.

Quote
The problem with X-Com lasers is that they're generally inaccurate. So I'm not sure what can be done without making it more accurate or powerful...

Agreed, really. The lasers are about being mediocre BUT generally better than early game weapons. My gripe is mostly that the nuclear lasers came into play well past their time to shine, but that might have been due to bad luck and/or poor research priorities on my part. Stats wise I think they're probably where they need to be.

Quote
Some upgrades are possible, but there are some technical limitations... For example you can't give bigger weapons to Mutons only (you can in OXCE+, which is what I've done). I'll think about it too.

I've been keeping an eye on OXCE, once it's brought up to speed with the nightlies it might be worth looking if some of its features can be used for FMP. Some of the alien races could do with a little more diversity I think - particularly the Chtonites and Waspites don't feel much different than, say, Anthropods or Floaters. We'll see.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2016, 03:59:22 pm by BTAxis »

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2405 on: November 07, 2016, 04:02:04 pm »
I won't be converting the FMP for OXCE+, as it's supposed to be easily accessible and promote the project. But if you want more, go play X-Com Files. :) It contains the entire FMP material.

Buffing aliens is also an OXCE+ thing, since I can go crazier there.

Offline Ragshak

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2406 on: November 15, 2016, 09:54:28 pm »
At the very beginning I would like to thank for this great mod. I came back after a years of break from UFO Defence and game experience is just brilliant! New XCom and XCom 2 are way behind, especially with such great mods and mod comunnity as yours!

My game core rules and tweaks: Superhuman, TFTD damage rules, PSI only at LOS, Alien weapons sefl destruct

Some feedback:
- Still, after years, there is no "gym faciillity" mod :) Really would like to see something like this.
- MiB addition - there is no way to capture Commander. Stunned Commander leaves Cooperator corpse.
- All "Very Large" ufo landing missions got one and the same ufo layout (three level  ship with "orbit" in the middle level").
- Variety of armors. It is really nice to see such additions BUT I dont see a point in giving penalties while wearing armor. Vests are useless at every stage of the game. Personal Armor is an illusion of protection. Personal Armor -15TU is too punishing. Last few rmors are really good if not OP. Way more effective are smokre grandes and "smoke armor" - if they cannot see you, they cannot shoot at you.
- Grav Module - IF I would know earier that floaters corpses are so crucial for the campaign I would never sold them. Now I am stuck with no such modules and no Floaters running around.
- New enemies. For half of the current game I was stuck with Anthropods. Then Gazers and MiB. Few times Sectoids and Floaters. Now something have changed and I see from time to time Snakemen.
- Weapon damage. Even with Railguns I have problems with killing enemies  like Gazers or their terror unit (I hate those snails). I found that the most efficient way of killing is by using High Explosives - even in late game.
- Is there a pattern for Gazers terror unit to "stand up" and leave its shell? First teerorr mission with those guys was really dramatic without proper amunts of Explosives.
- UFOPAEDIA shows some weapons like Hunting Rifle etc. How to get acces to them?
- Love new research tree :) You should also give some love to aliens Soldier class and use them in research.
- MIND PROBE comes to late. There sould be other way to see some basic info about enemies (some sort of scanner maybe in Motion Scanner research path).
- For some reason I had no need to shoot a single ufo so far - I always wait and see where they land.
- Some sort night-vision device would be nice.
- Soldiers DNA modifications maybe?
- I am running millitary orgnization and still need to gamble soldiers stats? There should be way to buy soldiers for specific role.
- Money comes to easy with production.
- I see that some aliens have different color patterns - is there an info which alien class have which color?
- and finally would like to see a list of all implemented mods to know what to avoid.

Best regards!

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2407 on: November 16, 2016, 10:59:30 pm »
At the very beginning I would like to thank for this great mod. I came back after a years of break from UFO Defence and game experience is just brilliant! New XCom and XCom 2 are way behind, especially with such great mods and mod comunnity as yours!

Thank you very much good sir!

My game core rules and tweaks: Superhuman, TFTD damage rules, PSI only at LOS, Alien weapons sefl destruct

It's not my role to tell people how they should play their games, but if you want to know my opinion:
- TFTD damage rules disqualify some weapons and is overall weird. It eliminates critical hits and lucky saves, making the game more grindy in general. So I don't like it much.
- Alien weapons self destruct mechanics is so retarded that I don't even know where to start; I'll just say that if the weapons worked like that, we could blow up the entire Cydonia by simply hitting it with a correctly modified beam. :) But I consider it useful as a sort of self-imposed challenge, if one is into that.
- I hope you're using the UFO Extender Accuracy too, otherwise the game is just cheesy (shooting an alien across the entire map is exactly as hard as 15 tiles away when using aimed shots, for example).

Some feedback:
- Still, after years, there is no "gym faciillity" mod :) Really would like to see something like this.

There is no code for it in the vanilla game. X-Com Files, my next project, contains it, as it's based on OXCE+ branch of the exe - see here for more details.

- MiB addition - there is no way to capture Commander. Stunned Commander leaves Cooperator corpse.

Yes, it was reported already... It's fixed, but I'm waiting for the mod portal to work again to publish the next version.

- All "Very Large" ufo landing missions got one and the same ufo layout (three level  ship with "orbit" in the middle level").

Eh? You mean the Lab Ship? But it's not the only Very Large - there's also the vanilla Battleship.

- Variety of armors. It is really nice to see such additions BUT I dont see a point in giving penalties while wearing armor. Vests are useless at every stage of the game. Personal Armor is an illusion of protection. Personal Armor -15TU is too punishing. Last few rmors are really good if not OP. Way more effective are smokre grandes and "smoke armor" - if they cannot see you, they cannot shoot at you.

So what's new in X-Com. :D
The problem aren't the armours, but lack of enemies other than standard aliens with plasma rifles. The abovementioned X-Com Files address this problem much more thoroughly.

- Grav Module - IF I would know earier that floaters corpses are so crucial for the campaign I would never sold them. Now I am stuck with no such modules and no Floaters running around.

Tough. :) But you can also produce grav modules on your own.

- New enemies. For half of the current game I was stuck with Anthropods. Then Gazers and MiB. Few times Sectoids and Floaters. Now something have changed and I see from time to time Snakemen.

Looks pretty normal for X-Com.

- Weapon damage. Even with Railguns I have problems with killing enemies  like Gazers or their terror unit (I hate those snails). I found that the most efficient way of killing is by using High Explosives - even in late game.

Yep. On the other hand, they have little good points other than toughness...

- Is there a pattern for Gazers terror unit to "stand up" and leave its shell? First teerorr mission with those guys was really dramatic without proper amunts of Explosives.

Eh? No, they have no stages.

- UFOPAEDIA shows some weapons like Hunting Rifle etc. How to get acces to them?

They are sometimes used by Hybrids. They're not really worth finding though, except for collection purposes.

- Love new research tree :) You should also give some love to aliens Soldier class and use them in research.

What would they speak about? Serioously, I'm open to suggestions.

- MIND PROBE comes to late. There sould be other way to see some basic info about enemies (some sort of scanner maybe in Motion Scanner research path).

Present me with more details and I'll think about it. Maybe an early device with range 1?

- For some reason I had no need to shoot a single ufo so far - I always wait and see where they land.

Which is a perfectly valid strategy in X-Com. :)

- Some sort night-vision device would be nice.

X-Com Files again :)

- Soldiers DNA modifications maybe?

There are some difficulties with it, namely producing a new unit from an old unit with their stats, name etc. carried over.

- I am running millitary orgnization and still need to gamble soldiers stats? There should be way to buy soldiers for specific role.

Could be added rather easily, but I think it would go against the game's spirit. The FMP is meant to remain close to the original concept, just with more content added.

- Money comes to easy with production.

Then don't abuse the system. :P Again, this is how the game has worked since forever. I don't really have the ambition to overhaul the entire economy.

- I see that some aliens have different color patterns - is there an info which alien class have which color?

Not exactly, but you can learn it through experience. Otherwise it'd be too boring. :)

- and finally would like to see a list of all implemented mods to know what to avoid.

Ummm... Did something happen to the readme file?

Offline Ragshak

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2408 on: November 20, 2016, 08:59:47 pm »
Anthrpod's terror unit Spitter comes in few variations: standing on his feet with shell (easy to kill), standing on his feet without shell (hatching from his shell if enough damage is done) and lying in shell (higly resistant to damage in this form). From time to time that terror unit change stance from 1 to 2 and vice versa. Wuld like to know is there a way to force that unit to stand up.

About Soldiers. I had in mind weapon prototypes and arena like bulding for passive train with alien soldiers. Or another way to increase soldiers stats. Or maybe forced fake base defend mission with only one room full of captured aliens :)

Mind Probe. I would suggest Scout tank unit (that little one) with scanning module instead of smoke. Effect similar to Mind Probe with 10-15 activation range.

Huh, magically now I see readme file :D Thanks.

I'm eager to try X-COM Files after ending current run.

Edit:
1) In myopinion Stormtrooper and Power armor adaptation (from dead MiB) shouldnt be allowed without Power/Stormtrooper armor tech discovered. Same for MiB Commander and Power Armor.

2) Game allows to keep more live aliens than avaible slots in AC facillity. There probably should be pop up message "Not enough room" like for Storage facillity that is full after a mission.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2016, 09:42:05 pm by Ragshak »

Offline Kjotleik

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2409 on: November 21, 2016, 06:26:44 am »
2) Game allows to keep more live aliens than avaible slots in AC facillity. There probably should be pop up message "Not enough room" like for Storage facillity that is full after a mission.

All you need to do is to go to Options/Advanced and set a "YES" for "Storage limits for recovered items" and "Live alien sale." This is standard OXC settings you can turn on/off to your liking. Default is off, I think.   :)

Offline Ragshak

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2410 on: November 21, 2016, 09:15:44 pm »
Thanks Kjotleik. I have both options enabled but for some reason only storage limit works. And yes I have more than 20 aliens in AC.

EDIT: How to reaserach Plasma Sword? Is there a research path for this or I need to take one of those from enemy? (I use weapon self destroy option).
« Last Edit: November 21, 2016, 09:17:34 pm by Ragshak »

Offline R1dO

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2411 on: November 22, 2016, 12:36:41 am »
If you enabled the option after getting those 20 in the AC it is entirely possible that the game won't complain until the next mission (with live aliens as trophy). It depends if the check occurs on geoscape time interval or on mission end.

Also, unless something has changed, i believe the option "weapon self destruct" is not recommend for FMP (makes it almost impossible to research some weapons).

Offline Solarius Scorch

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2412 on: December 15, 2016, 07:50:10 pm »
Hi, I'd like to ask you for opinion. I would like to add a new starting craft, a smaller and cheaper version of Skyranger (as an addition, not replacement). I have two candidates:



Working name "Cuteranger", final name likely to be "Skyraider". Made by Dioxine.



This one comes from the War of Shadows mod by jackstraw2323, but was reworked by me due to being unfinished. Originally named "Dragonfly" and I'd stick with it.

Both crafts have space for 8 people.

So, which one do you like better?

Offline Starving Poet

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2413 on: December 15, 2016, 08:08:02 pm »
Given the two - the cuteranger - having that rear exit makes all the difference.

Offline ohartenstein23

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Re: [COMPILATION] Final Mod Pack (FMP)
« Reply #2414 on: December 15, 2016, 08:22:06 pm »
I really like the look of the Dragonfly, but having the side doors like the Cuteranger is a huge step up in deployment tactics... could you possibly edit the Dragonfly map to have a second exit?