OpenXcom Forum
OpenXcom => Offtopic => Topic started by: Kilgore T.M. Replicant on October 22, 2018, 10:56:54 am
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(or how I stopped worrying and learned to love the CoC)
The Free Software (and open source) world has been much too focused on producing software. Instead of striving for excellent code quality, we must focus on what's really important: feelings and diversity. The Post-Meritocracy Manifesto (https://postmeritocracy.org/) outlines the wave of the future: no more judging based on merit, but inclusion based on ethnicity, gender identity and expression, or socio-economic status.
The main weapon in this fight for justice is the Code of Conduct (https://www.contributor-covenant.org/version/1/4/code-of-conduct.html) from the Manifesto author. Recently, it has replaced (https://git.kernel.org/pub/scm/linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux.git/commit/?id=8a104f8b5867c682d994ffa7a74093c54469c11f) the Linux "Code of Conflict", getting rid of regressive cruft such as
Your code and ideas behind it will be carefully reviewed, often resulting in critique and criticism. The review will almost always require improvements to the code before it can be included in the kernel. Know that this happens because everyone involved wants to see the best possible solution for the overall success of Linux.
and focusing on the main point of Free Software:
In the interest of fostering an open and welcoming environment, we as contributors and maintainers pledge to making participation in our project and our community a harassment-free experience for everyone, regardless of age, body size, disability, ethnicity, sex characteristics, gender identity and expression, level of experience, education, socio-economic status, nationality, personal appearance, race, religion, or sexual identity and orientation.
Concurrently, Linus Torvalds has been convinced (https://lwn.net/Articles/764901/) that shouting at people and calling crap code crap is holding his hobby project back and that he must clean up his act. A clear victory for us! That foul-mouthed, long standing blemish in Free Software's face has finally been fixed. Now you can feel safe to post your wonderful patches and not be put down in a blunt manner. If you still are, complain and get the rude developer excommunicated. Nobody's time is more valuable than your feelings, regardless of your level of experience.
Further inquiries (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-45664640) revealed that Linus adopted our CoC for exactly the right reasons:
I absolutely do not want to be seen as being in the same camp as the low-life scum on the internet that think it's OK to be a white nationalist Nazi, and have some truly nasty misogynistic, homophobic or transphobic behaviour.
The Manifesto urges you to seek out members of various minorities to include and personally coach in your project. Drop that $EDITOR and get your posterior on Twitter! Remember that diversity brings salvation and focusing of technical issues alone won't get your project far. Your time is better spent on outreach than coding.
Instead of simply accepting code from anyone (or anything), we must enumerate our under-represented and repressed classes in our guidelines and promise punishment for those who cross the line. Let's fill out the forums with discussion on identity politics instead of C/C++, bugs or 25 year old games. On the Internet, everyone knows you're a dog. And if they do not, shout it aloud!
We need more tribalism, harassment, censorship and discrimination in our Free Software. Linux has finally joined us on our path. Embrace the post-meritocracy world and take in a CoC today! Or are you a Nazi?
I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the content of their patches but by the color of their skin.
PS. Enlightened by Python's move (https://developers.slashdot.org/story/18/09/13/1523229/python-joins-movement-to-dump-offensive-master-slave-terms), I shall replace every instance of "Master" with "Parent" in my projects.
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I am sorry for you.
The feeling of being morally superior is infectuous and self-reinforced.
It blinds.
And it compels one to enforce one's own 'moral' 'standards' upon everyone else.
All those CoCs are but the tools to do that.
It is disgusting, but to see that one first has to reject the notion of own infallibility. Which is very hard once the superiority complex settles in.
Citing wikipedia:
Pride (Latin, superbia) is considered, on almost every list, the original and most serious of the seven deadly sins: the perversion of the faculties that make humans more like God—dignity and holiness. It is also thought to be the source of the other capital sins. Also known as hubris (from ancient Greek ὕβρις), or futility, it is identified as dangerously corrupt selfishness, the putting of one's own desires, urges, wants, and whims before the welfare of people.
In even more destructive cases, it is irrationally believing that one is essentially and necessarily better, superior, or more important than others, failing to acknowledge the accomplishments of others, and excessive admiration of the personal image or self (especially forgetting one's own lack of divinity, and refusing to acknowledge one's own limits, faults, or wrongs as a human being).
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I have been wondering why the color of skin of your four little children was blue. After all, isn't that a sign of a lack of oxygen?
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And it compels one to enforce one's own 'moral' 'standards' upon everyone else.
All those CoCs are but the tools to do that.
What is the point of Free Software if not to impose morals on others?
Some misguided individuals such as Richard M. Stallman think that instead of our CoC we should have some guidelines (https://lwn.net/Articles/769167/) for getting along with each other. That gun nut Eric S. Raymond has made the preposterous suggestion (https://lwn.net/ml/linux-kernel/20181021233614.GA17140@thyrsus.com/) of replacing our beloved class enumeration with "every individual".
The previous Linux Code of Conflict simply urged to "be excellent to each other". It was replaced for a reason: the deconstruction of meritocracy.
Citing wikipedia:
I thought Pride was when we don our leather chaps and dance on the streets. That quote speaks of the divine. Perhaps you'd prefer the SQLite CoC (https://web.archive.org/web/20181024180502/https://sqlite.org/codeofconduct.html)? (EDIT: link changed to archived version from when this post was written)
Meanwhile...
Oh no! The Linux folk are about to water down (https://lwn.net/ml/linux-kernel/20181020134932.GB32218@kroah.com/) the CoC by removing an essential part:
Maintainers who do not follow or enforce the Code of Conduct in good faith may
face temporary or permanent repercussions as determined by other members of the
project’s leadership.
How can we build a better tomorrow if punishing community members for wrongthink is not the responsibility of all maintainers? Eternal vigilance is the price we pay for our ddreamland!
I have been wondering why the color of skin of your four little children was blue. After all, isn't that a sign of a lack of oxygen?
Revolution, children. Asphyxiation's cheap!
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I thought Pride was when we don our leather chaps and dance on the streets. That quote speaks of the divine. Perhaps you'd prefer the SQLite CoC (https://www.sqlite.org/codeofconduct.html)?
I think this is good idea :D (second part not former)
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What is the point of Free Software if not to impose morals on others?
If you do not see anything wrong with imposing your will on others then you accept that you are against freedom and self-determination, and, consequentally, any possible form of inclusiveness and diversity (whatever that last one means).
Do you now see how your position is self-contradictory?
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If you do not see anything wrong with imposing your will on others then you accept that you are against freedom and self-determination, and, consequentally, any possible form of inclusiveness and diversity (whatever that last one means).
Do you now see how your position is self-contradictory?
I think Kilgore is using that most dreaded of tools: sarcasm.
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If you do not see anything wrong with imposing your will on others then you accept that you are against freedom and self-determination, and, consequentally, any possible form of inclusiveness and diversity (whatever that last one means).
It's like censorship: we must silence and (in the enlightened countries) imprison those who sprout hate speech. How can there be freedom if someone is free to say something blasphemous or hateful (https://github.com/opal/opal/issues/941)?
How can we be inclusive if we do not promise that they will not be harassed, regardless of
age, body size, disability, ethnicity, sex characteristics, gender identity and expression, level of experience, education, socio-economic status, nationality, personal appearance, race, religion, or sexual identity and orientation
? (Hmm, funny how that list does not contain "political opinion".)
The strategy of "patches welcome from anyone" lead to the current nightmarish Linux developer landscape: male and pale. How can they be expected to produce quality software? "Homogeneity is an antipattern", as the Manifesto states.
Self-determination is clearly not sufficient for diversity. This is why we need quotas for universities, companies, etc.
I'm sure James Damore (https://news.slashdot.org/story/17/08/11/2024224/james-damore-explains-why-he-was-fired-by-google) can fill in on the details on what diversity is. He went to a seminar about it.
Do you now see how your position is self-contradictory?
Logical inconsistencies in a progressive movement? Impossible! Those are quite difficult to see for those who have drunk the Kool-Aid. Next you're telling me that punching Nazis or calling out [trigger warning]rape apologists (https://otter.technology/blog/2018/09/20/linux-kernel-hastily-adopts-standard-code-of-conduct/)[/trigger warning] is not cool.
As the Manifesto states, "interpersonal skills are at least as important as technical skills". Thanks for letting me practise those while I'm procrastinating on learning network programming.
PS. Have you read the 1oom CoC (https://gitlab.com/KilgoreTroutMaskReplicant/1oom/blob/master/CODE_OF_CONDUCT)?
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Allow to just point out one significant inconsistency! No one at Jonestown drank the Kool-Aid, not one single member.
Jim got a bunch of Flavor-Aid to spike with cyanide.
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PS. Have you read the 1oom CoC (https://gitlab.com/KilgoreTroutMaskReplicant/1oom/blob/master/CODE_OF_CONDUCT)?
Is using our preferred pronoun "Royal We" a correct language in case of this CoC?
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FWIW, here goes my personal CoC:
I do not recognize any project's CoC being of any consequence whatsoever apart from diminishing my estimate of said project's maintainers' sanity.
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I think Kilgore is using that most dreaded of tools: sarcasm.
Poe's Law is a bitch bummer.
Is using our preferred pronoun "Royal We" a correct language in case of this CoC?
Well put, your highness. I was mostly aiming to get rid of poor spelling and grammar. And non-English.
When a participant (say, SupSuper) succumbs to the unacceptable behaviour of bad punctuation, I (the maintainer who does not enforce the CoC) face the repercussions I (the project leader) have chosen: self-flagellation.
I do not recognize any project's CoC being of any consequence whatsoever apart from diminishing my estimate of said project's maintainers' sanity.
This is a very healthy approach. The only winning move is not to play.
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From the Manifesto:
We must make room for people who are not like us to enter our field and succeed there. This means not only inviting them in, but making sure that they are supported and empowered.
"Not like us" is the key to diversity. Any young, lean and sober person willing to port 1oom for OSX?
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No wonder Linux is going to shit. I'm not really a linux expert, but how comes the Gnome interface reached its peak around 2010 (these crazy crazy multiple desktops, displayed on surfaces of spinning polyhedrons) and then was progressively cut down? Joke's on us.
However I do not like the title of this thread. What has any -cracy to do with Linux? OS should never be about any sort of power.
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No, linux-the-kernel isn't going anywhere even though they managed to send Linus to a re-education camp, complete with a struggle session (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Struggle_session).
Linux-the-desktop is, well, not going anywhere either, because there is no such thing as _the_linux_desktop_.
There's KDE, there's XFCE, there's Gnome (which decided on a seppuku for version 3 and it was successful as you've seen).
And tons of less visible stuff.
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However I do not like the title of this thread. What has any -cracy to do with Linux? OS should never be about any sort of power.
It's not about the OS itself. It's about how the Linux (kernel) project is governed.
In the Free/Open Source Software world the power within a project is based on meritocracy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meritocracy). Simply put: the ones who write the software get to make the decisions about the project.
The Post-Meritocracy Manifesto is a direct attack on this prevailing F/OSS culture. It's a power grab by those who wish to value non-technical contributors equally to technical contributors. It's an attempt to inject a PR department to software projects. It's about focusing on building diverse communities instead of producing software. It's about shoving politics into blissfully apolitical places.
The manifesto and the new Linux CoC is written by the same person. Among the manifesto signatories is a certain Patricia Torvalds. The CoC was adopted shortly before this (https://www.newyorker.com/science/elements/after-years-of-abusive-e-mails-the-creator-of-linux-steps-aside) piece of character assassination was published. Draw your own conclusions; tin foil hat optional.
This thread is about what it says on the title. Linux is not the only project to be burdened by this nonsense.
"First they came for FreeBSD (https://yro.slashdot.org/story/18/02/17/0826206/freebsds-new-code-of-conduct), but I did not speak because I do not use it.
Then they ..."
Dear F/OSS project leader: When someone makes a pull request adding a CoC, think very hard about who you wish to call the shots in your project.
No, linux-the-kernel isn't going anywhere even though they managed to send Linus to a re-education camp, complete with a struggle session (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Struggle_session).
Given your earlier note on sanity, "Linus lost his marbles" is an apt summary.
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Given your earlier note on sanity, "Linus lost his marbles" is an apt summary.
More like tortured into losing them, or so I prefer to believe. The end result is the same.
I'm fascinated how this all is reminiscent of the cultural revolution.
(btw, the first part of Cixin Lui's Three Body Problem is mostly a memoir of exactly that).
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More like tortured into losing them, or so I prefer to believe. The end result is the same.
Indeed. Just to ruin the bad and horrible joke, "marbles" was also alluding to testicles. (The OP mentions fixing Linus.)
I like to play with words. The Linux CoC speaks of inclusive language which is a delightful morsel of newspeak to describe excluding words (aka newspeak). Bravo!
I'm fascinated how this all is reminiscent of the cultural revolution.
(btw, the first part of Cixin Lui's Three Body Problem is mostly a memoir of exactly that).
It's about as pretty. Great book! The footnotes in the English translation were helpful.
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On the face of it, sounds like a CoC is trying to bring new people into the development of open-source software, anything to invite and encourage people to learn coding and participate. But as far as I've seen, any major open-source project has already done that for years, if not decades. They just don't merge bad code.
It makes me wonder, for projects that are trying to look more inclusive . . . are they including code that is best left in the recycle bin? Or are they just speaking out their asses and continuing as normal?
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It makes me wonder, for projects that are trying to look more inclusive . . . are they including code that is best left in the recycle bin? Or are they just speaking out their asses and continuing as normal?
It's not about code. Just otherwise irrelevant people getting high on perceived power.
Another variation of Those who can, do; those who can't, teach.
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On the face of it, sounds like a CoC is trying to bring new people into the development of open-source software, anything to invite and encourage people to learn coding and participate. But as far as I've seen, any major open-source project has already done that for years, if not decades. They just don't merge bad code.
I disagree on the "major" part. Have you ever heard of any project turning down code because the patch submitter is woman/gay/black/whatyouhave?
I see F/OSS as the most egalitarian collaborative thing humans have come up with. Anyone can submit a patch, only the code is relevant. So of course some busybodies on a mission want to fix that.
It makes me wonder, for projects that are trying to look more inclusive . . . are they including code that is best left in the recycle bin? Or are they just speaking out their asses and continuing as normal?
GNOME (and others) play with Outreachy (https://www.outreachy.org/):
We expressly invite women (both cis and trans), trans men, and genderqueer people to apply. We also expressly invite applications from residents and nationals of the United States of any gender who are Black/African American, Hispanic/Latin@, Native American/American Indian, Alaska Native, Native Hawaiian, or Pacific Islander. Anyone who faces under-representation, systemic bias, or discrimination in the technology industry of their country is invited to apply.
Fighting perceived discrimation with actual discrimination. Yay? (As a sidenote, the photo was taken by the same person who threw the previously linked rape apologist accusations at a Linux maintainer. Small world!)
As for the recycle bin, see the seppuku comment on the previous page. (Although I wouldn't blame the design problems on interns.)
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I see F/OSS as the most egalitarian collaborative thing humans have come up with.
Truth.
As for the recycle bin, (Although I wouldn't blame the design problems on interns.)
Gnome 3 disaster is different. It's project leads getting a "vision" and getting drunk on perceived power. They flew Gnome into the ground, but it's FOSS, so Mate and XFCE became a better Gnome 2.
All working as intended, in this case.
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I disagree on the "major" part. Have you ever heard of any project turning down code because the patch submitter is woman/gay/black/whatyouhave?
I see F/OSS as the most egalitarian collaborative thing humans have come up with. Anyone can submit a patch, only the code is relevant. So of course some busybodies on a mission want to fix that.
That's exactly what I meant, those projects accept code from anyone who writes anything decent, they don't turn anyone away for any reason besides writing anything from just shit to actual malware, or getting abusive with the team or other contributors. And even being abusive in e-mail probably isn't a big deal with most of them, unless it crosses into doing something illegal where the police need to be called in. So, basically, they've already been doing what a CoC is supposed to call for.
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[...] or getting abusive with the team or other contributors. And even being abusive in e-mail probably isn't a big deal with most of them, unless it crosses into doing something illegal where the police need to be called in.
What counts as abusive? Citing Python in your general direction is harassment (https://lkml.org/lkml/2018/8/15/510). Remember: Professional conduct! No jokes! RIP hacker culture. To be fair, memorizing a 40+ year old comedy film should not be a requirement.
So, basically, they've already been doing what a CoC is supposed to call for.
They weren't responsible for policing each others' conduct outside the projects scope. At least that bit got removed from the Linux CoC.
The old Code of Conflict was short and to the point. The new CoC needed an even longer interpretation document added along with it.
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I like Linus even more. And yeah, that would be something I'd say to tell the "harassed" to get over it and go check out the movie. On the other hand if you have the guy who keeps telling people to go kill themselves, that one at least needs a talking to. And there need to be very strict limits of what's police outside the project, and by that I mean unless they let slip they're doing something else that calls of the real police. i.e., if they should let slip on the project forum plans to commit an actual serious crime, yeah, get concerned about that. If they instead mention going to a political rally, or hitting a party with a shitload of pot . . . don't get concerned.
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Citing Python in your general direction is harassment (https://lkml.org/lkml/2018/8/15/510).
First though was is Python language is not PC any more? Maybe something not right in they CoC, or something?
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On the other hand if you have the guy who keeps telling people to go kill themselves, that one at least needs a talking to.
Is it the responsibility of all maintainers to monitor the Facebook/Twitter accounts of all participants for this? Is the failure to do so an punishable act? The Covenant CoC is pushing for this. That "ddreamland" was not a typo.
Adding responsibilities is a sure way to suck fun out. Next up: TPS reports.
And there need to be very strict limits of what's police outside the project
I maintain the limit should be "never police outside".
If they instead mention going to a political rally, or hitting a party with a shitload of pot . . . don't get concerned.
How about transphobia (https://github.com/opal/opal/issues/941)? That's the Post-Meritocracy Manifesto and Covenant CoC author trying to get a developer kicked out of a project (which the Manifesto author is not participating in) for shit said on Twitter. Is this the kind of policing you wish that all project maintainers are obligated to do?
Apropos of Linux/policy/police: Should patches by Hans Reiser (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_Reiser) on ReiserFS be rejected? The Covenant CoC does not cover non-participants or discourage murder, but the (now replaced) SQLite CoC does. Does being welcoming cut both ways?
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EDIT:
And yeah, that would be something I'd say to tell the "harassed" to get over it and go check out the movie.
Would you be as dismissive knowing that interaction with Linus left him "emotionally dead for several weeks" (https://lwn.net/Articles/764325/)?
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In case there was any doubt: the Covenant CoC is anti-egalitarian (https://github.com/ContributorCovenant/contributor_covenant/pull/580#discussion_r220052065) by design.
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EDIT2:
First though was is Python language is not PC any more? Maybe something not right in they CoC, or something?
It's extra PC now that they got rid of the master/slave terminology (see OP). In the interest of fostering correct language, I do believe your highness means "their CoC".
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Have you heard what SQLite did? They oficially adopted rules of a monastic order: https://www.sqlite.org/codeofethics.html When this caught attention last week, they made it "Code of Ethics of the Project Founder" and for others replaced it with Mozilla guidelines.
No wonder Linux is going to shit. I'm not really a linux expert, but how comes the Gnome interface reached its peak around 2010 (these crazy crazy multiple desktops, displayed on surfaces of spinning polyhedrons) and then was progressively cut down? Joke's on us.
It was a gimmick. Compiz is still there, if you know how to set up the cube. At least, in Ubuntu 16. It's just that nobody wants the cube anymore.
Gnome 3 disaster is different. It's project leads getting a "vision" and getting drunk on perceived power. They flew Gnome into the ground
With Red Hat being sold something may change soon.
And there need to be very strict limits of what's police outside the project,
That is the big problem. Sage Sharp is stalking Theodore T'so since 2013 for disagreeng with her overly broad definition of rape.
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I would say if they use the project forum, or if a project member directly reports a criminal level of harassment, then it's time to deal with the situation. If it doesn't actually come to the attention of project management, they don't go out looking for it, but once it's in their lap, it needs to be dealt with appropriately for what it is. A simple disagreement on what people think is right and okay doesn't require anything.
Continued harassment and even attempts to get around blocks in communication should get arbitration, and a troublemaker possibly removed from the project. If they're going to take those steps to mess with someone else, they'll take those steps to mess with anyone else.
An actual threat of violence or a reported plan for serious criminal activity does need police called.
Other than these, yeah, stay hands off an let project contributors deal with their own problems. Even if the problem is one of them doesn't have a sense of humor. There certain don't need to be special rules to deal with it.
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Have you heard what SQLite did? They oficially adopted rules of a monastic order: https://www.sqlite.org/codeofethics.html When this caught attention last week, they made it "Code of Ethics of the Project Founder" and for others replaced it with Mozilla guidelines.
I heard. I even went back and edited my link to point at an acrhived version once I found out they caved in. They even catered to Catholics:
69. Love your juniors.
I see two ways to deal with this creeping disease:
- atheist: ignore and it will go away
- pastafarian: ridicule to expose the stupidity
IMO the monastic CoC was a brilliant piece of satire. I guess Mozilla did not agree; not that surprising after the Eich debacle.
An actual threat of violence or a reported plan for serious criminal activity does need police called.
Serious criminal activity in which jurisdiction? Seemingly benign things can get you beheaded in some corners of the world. In the USA, judging by the harshness of the punishment, sharing Michael Jackson's music is a crime worse than killing Michael Jackson.
If you're in favor of policing contributor speech, please draw the line. It may end up awfully squiggly. (Or call it "violence" and move on with out lives.)
Other than these, yeah, stay hands off an let project contributors deal with their own problems. Even if the problem is one of them doesn't have a sense of humor. There certain don't need to be special rules to deal with it.
RAmen.
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Bored? Typing "man socket"[1] in a terminal made you feel vaguely sexist? Read an article (https://modelviewculture.com/pieces/the-dehumanizing-myth-of-the-meritocracy) from the Manifesto author on why meritocracy is bad:
In the Ruby world, we insist that “Matz Is Nice And So We Are Nice,” ignoring the sexist statements he has made with regard to diversity outreach efforts. We write off Linus Torvalds' dismissal of diversity as an “unimportant detail” and justify it based on the utility of his creations.
But why is it that we can proudly refuse to use software created by corporations whose often aggressive business policies we disagree with, but continue to adopt software written by sexists, racists, homophobes, transphobes?
Welp.
Perhaps you'd prefer an account (http://paul-m-jones.com/archives/6214) on PHP and CoC instead.
[1] For the benefit of non-developers: the command opens up a manual related to network programming.
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https://github.com/unwireddevices/RIOT/commit/fc51d09... (https://github.com/unwireddevices/RIOT/commit/fc51d09d71a5b170bdec9a46530f71bbf213d0b1?fbclid=IwAR1eiSziDTvoBF_JWaCk0CT5Wp_sGM5hFImD6BBcZSiTw7LuBGEBRB4FIHY#diff-a1ee87dafebc22cbd96979f1b2b7e837)
the guy keeps his own fork in part because of upstream maintainers' asshattery
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https://github.com/unwireddevices/RIOT/commit/fc51d09... (https://github.com/unwireddevices/RIOT/commit/fc51d09d71a5b170bdec9a46530f71bbf213d0b1?fbclid=IwAR1eiSziDTvoBF_JWaCk0CT5Wp_sGM5hFImD6BBcZSiTw7LuBGEBRB4FIHY#diff-a1ee87dafebc22cbd96979f1b2b7e837)
the guy keeps his own fork in part because of upstream maintainers' asshattery
Community split, CoC working as planned. This is how you get rid of the undesirables who have an unhealthy obsession in actually producing software (and are probably racist too).
Hey, hold my beer:
Examples of unacceptable behavior by participants include:
- The use of sexualized language
You can prick a finger, but not finger a prick. Also, masturbating monkeys (https://www.cio.com/article/2434264/open-source-tools/torvalds-calls-openbsd-group--masturbating-monkeys-.html)! Redundant at this point, but I'll throw in a "fuck" for good measure.
unwelcome sexual attention or advances
Hello, sailor! ;) I put on my robe and wizard hat (http://bash.org/?104383)...
... the creators of Bottled Outrage and NaziCard bring you the latest in virtue signal processing: the Unwanted-Pass Filter! It adaptively filters messages based on source status and destination mood. The perfect tool for high-fidelity lifestyle! Employing Fat Furry Transform, the operating range is 0 to 20 kiloHunks with Total Harmony Destruction of ...
- Trolling
Does this count?
insulting/derogatory comments
Your father does have a elderberry-like whiff going on...
personal
... you silly person.
political attacks
Free Tibet!
- Public or private harassment
SupSuper, you fucking idiot! What kind of a douche sets the forum rules to something simple, tested and agreeable?!
- Other conduct which could reasonably be considered inappropriate in a professional setting
Pants constrict my coding flow.
*whew* There! Now I've pre-emptively ejected myself from any project that employs the Covenant CoC.
Have you?
Are you sure about that?
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As far as the harassment is concerned, usually it won't call for the police, but if someone has been told to no longer contact another user, contact should stop right there. After all, unlike a professional setting, contributors don't really have to talk, so if one is being a pain in the ass it is, and certain should be, easy to cut them off. Even in a professional setting, if someone's behavior is interfering with the job, something needs to be done. As such, if someone is blocked and sets up new accounts to circumvent the block and continue messing with another member, the admin staff should get involved, but the only way they should know is if the harassed person reports it.
I don't put it to just violence, because not all the things that certainly need intervention are violent. There is the matter of if someone is dumb enough to share their kiddie porn . . . call the police right away! Really, it should just be considered if anything is found that has a high potential to cause injury to others is the time to get outside authorities involved, anything is really none of the law's business.
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(Apologies to SupSuper for using you in an example. I hope your keen eye on sarcasm and level head will let that slide.)
As far as the harassment is concerned, usually it won't call for the police, but if someone has been told to no longer contact another user, contact should stop right there. After all, unlike a professional setting, contributors don't really have to talk, so if one is being a pain in the ass it is, and certain should be, easy to cut them off.
I agree. The project leaders must have the power to do (or not do) this. The decision must remain in their hands and not given to Twitter mobs and CoC-enabled rule lawyers. If the asshole in question happens to be the leader, the F/OSS solution is to fork the project.
I don't put it to just violence, because not all the things that certainly need intervention are violent.
Did you know that Linus is advocating for physical intimidation and violence (https://marc.info/?l=linux-kernel&m=137390362508794&w=2)?
I do agree that there is a point where the cops need to be called. However, not surveilling the general interwebs for participants' misconduct should not be be punishable.
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Now that Linus has said (https://lwn.net/Articles/769117/) that the pivotal New Yorker article (https://www.newyorker.com/science/elements/after-years-of-abusive-e-mails-the-creator-of-linux-steps-aside) was the reason for the hasty CoC adoption, let's take a look at it.
In a response to The New Yorker, Torvalds said, “I am very proud of the Linux code that I invented and the impact it has had on the world. [...]"
Code... invented? The probabilility of that being a direct quote is zero.
Torvalds’s decision to step aside came after The New Yorker asked him a series of questions about his conduct for a story on complaints about his abusive behavior discouraging women from working as Linux-kernel programmers.
"Abusive behaviour" being calling crap code crap.
According to Squire’s tabulations (http://flossdata.syr.edu/data/insults/hicssInsultsv2.pdf), more than a thousand of the twenty-one thousand e-mails Torvalds sent in a four-year period used the word “crap.” “Slut,” “bitch,” and “bastard” were employed much less frequently during that period.
Ooh, me too!
According to Replicant's hasty counts, more than ten of the eighty-seven posts Replicant sent in a half-year period used the word "fuck." "Slut," "bitch," and "hysterectomy" were employed much less frequently during that period.
Both reports are factually correct. Guess which words were used zero times.
This article is trying hard to make Linus look like a misogynist without using actual lies. Combining the phrase "abusive behavior discouraging women" with the (sneakily injected) words "slut" and "bitch" paints a very dishonest picture of his communication. Now the readership think of Linus yelling "shut up bitch and make a sandwich" at every female coder.
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These Westerners have way too much time on their hands.
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These Westerners have way too much time on their hands.
Wise words from someone with 7846 posts under their belt on a forum about an engine reimplementation for a 25 year old game.
Not that you're wrong in implying this thread would not exist if I received more than 1 bug report / feature request per three days. Still, a rather Puritan view.
Meanwhile...
Linus has calmed down (https://linux.slashdot.org/story/18/11/03/1833213/how-new-polite-linus-torvalds-points-out-bad-kernel-code) after the operation. No more swearing. And they all lived happily ever after.
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A clarification: I certainly did not meant you, or any other forum member. I meant the Linux "community".
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I don't put it to just violence, because not all the things that certainly need intervention are violent. There is the matter of if someone is dumb enough to share their kiddie porn . . . call the police right away!
This reminded me of one individual who suggested Linux devs who dislike the CoC to rescind their license grant (https://lwn.net/ml/linux-kernel/185b786a2bd6e8d527dca161dc42e4f1@redchan.it/). From that email:
Since none of you woman worshiping anti-marry-little-girls** faggots are lawyers you believe whatever you're told by "SFConservancy"*)
[...]
**(YHWH explicitly allows men to have female children as brides (Devarim chapter 22, verse 28 (na'ar) (same expressed in the Septuagint (padia)) (including in cases of a forceful taking (taphas))
How should this guy be dealt with? From the CoC:
[...] harassment-free experience for everyone, regardless of [...] religion, or sexual identity and orientation.
Is sending armed thugs to raid your home harassment?
Examples of unacceptable behavior by participants include:
- [...] unwelcome sexual attention or advances
Given that the kernel dev age distribution does not quite reach single digits, I can't see this one causing trouble for the guy.
Examples of unacceptable behavior by participants include:
- Publishing others’ private information, such as a physical or electronic address, without explicit permission
Does informing the authorities count as publishing? Arrest records etc tend to be public.
Why does this guy oppose the CoC? Seems like his under-represented minority is protected by it.
(For the Illiterati: I'm ridiculing the CoC. I'm not advocating this guy's mission or lifestyle. Don't break Linux. Don't diddle kids. OK? Cool.)
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This whole CoC thing is BS from beginning to end. Linux is neither meritocracy or anti-meritocracy, it is anarchy/communism, whether you like it or not, and that is possible because copying cost is negligible. The only sensible model is people writing code they need/want, then anyone who wants the code, copies it. This leads to shitty code simply becoming landfill. I think the same should go for the whole computer world, by the way. "Piracy" is a joke. Programming was never meant to be commercially profitable in itself. And these dumb CoC people? They may appear like some sort of leftists, but their actual endgame is to end this anarchist utopia and commercialize linux. Or destroy it so it stops being competition to commercial systems. Mark my words.
PS.
And Mr. Torvalds was likely given choice between:
- Comply to demands
- Go Snowden
- Go to prison for rape and/or pedophilia, it's so easy nowadays. All they need is to drop some child porn on any computer you're working on and you're toast.
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Linux is neither meritocracy or anti-meritocracy, it is anarchy/communism, whether you like it or not, and that is possible because copying cost is negligible.
Are you confusing Linux-the-kernel with Linux-the-desktop-OS? Linux is a Unix-like kernel[1] project created and managed by Linus Torvalds. What you get when you download Ubuntu Linux is a collection of software that uses Linux as the kernel; to avoid further confusion, let's call such things... I dunno, "GNU/Linux".
Linus is the Benevolent Dictator For Life (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benevolent_dictator_for_life) of Linux. He has chosen (based on merit) trusted "lieutenants" to be subsystem maintainers, but the last word on if to merge any given patch is Linus'. That is the meritocracy we're talking about.
Copying (aka "forking") a project is free. Maintaining it or convincing, say, Ubuntu to switch from Linux to MyBetterLinux is not. How is the forked project governed?
I can buy the anarchy/communism claim in the larger GNU/Linux (or F/OSS) ecosystem context. Within a project, it's (typically) meritocracy.
This leads to shitty code simply becoming landfill.
If only...
They may appear like some sort of leftists, but their actual endgame is to end this anarchist utopia and commercialize linux. Or destroy it so it stops being competition to commercial systems. Mark my words.
You do realize that the GPL allows you to copy Linux, GNOME and OpenXcom a flash drive and sell it in a street corner?
Did you know that IBM just bought Red Hat (https://lwn.net/Articles/769762/), a commercial GNU/Linux vendor that employs many Linux, GNOME and other F/OSS project developers (including a notorious Mr. Poettering)?
Did you know that Android phones use a (forked) Linux kernel? Did you know that Microsoft claims that Linux infringes upon numerous patents and collects royalties (https://www.geekwire.com/2014/microsofts-patent-royalties-take-hit-android-market-shifts/) from Android device makers (and makes more money that way than from any Windows Phone ventures)?
Anarchist utopia? Hardly. I do agree that the CoC is a fantasic way to sow discord and tear projects apart.
And Mr. Torvalds was likely given choice between:
- Comply to demands
- Go Snowden
- Go to prison for rape and/or pedophilia, it's so easy nowadays. All they need is to drop some child porn on any computer you're working on and you're toast.
That seems plausible if you happen to believe ESR's informant (http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=6907). Seeing one of Linus' daughters appear in the Manifesto signatories gives credence to a different conspiracy theory.
Regardless of motive and tactics, this whole mess is disgusting. Linus was one of my heroes. Seeing him cave in to bullies' demands makes me sad.
[1] A kernel is the piece of software that controls the hardware, manages multitasking, handles the networking stack and such things. No person uses a kernel directly[2]; programs use it, and the vast majority of those only via other libraries. Haven't checked, but I very much doubt that OXC has any Linux-specific code in it (and POSIX is not Linux).
[2] inb4 cat /dev/random > /dev/sda1 (FFS don't do this!)
(EDIT: typical tipsy tuesday typos)
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That seems plausible if you happen to believe ESR's informant (http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=6907). Seeing one of Linus' daughters appear in the Manifesto signatories gives credence to a different conspiracy theory.
it was a deliberately planned and persistent campaign to frame Linus and feed him to an outrage mob.
I believe there was no conspiracy, plans or campaigns, just random attention whoring with a bit of protection racket/power grab smell to it.
All in all, this phenomenon is well-known in academia and business, there were numerous posts, rants, articles, you name it written on the topic in last 10-15 years.
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I believe there was no conspiracy, plans or campaigns, just random attention whoring with a bit of protection racket/power grab smell to it.
Reality tends to be dull. For more conspiracy fuel, check the announcement (https://lwn.net/Articles/764901/) email closely: Linus seems to use two different apostrophe characters.
(No, I don't believe there was a conspiracy. Just a panicky reaction to a vile mainstream news article that someone took as an opportunity to shove a bad CoC in.)
Perhaps the whole mess shows a flaw in meritocracy: just because someone is a good subsystem/stable branch maintainer, they can't be trusted to introduce good policy updates.
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check the announcement (https://lwn.net/Articles/764901/) email closely: Linus seems to use two different apostrophe characters.
Oh, how could I miss that?! This changes the whole deal!
besides, maybe I should make a subfaction to humanists in piratez so that "progressives" are properly represented. complete with pink hats, frothing at the mouth (this would require a minor change to the engine so that their blabberings can be shoven down the player's throat) and a "rescue Linus" mission ala the siberian base.
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academia
This Cult of Diversity is well represented in those circles. How about Harvard discriminating Asian-Americans (https://www.npr.org/2018/06/15/620368377/harvard-accused-of-racial-balancing-lawsuit-says-asian-americans-treated-unfairl)? It would be a shame if being egalitarian resulted in a too yellow campus. Tip: If you discriminate by race, you just might be a racist!
Oh, how could I miss that?! This changes the whole deal!
Someone else noticed that and wrote about it on LWN. I found it funny. Still too lazy to search for the message...
It does bring a certain "these are my words and nobody is holding a gun to my head" air to it; solid conspiracy nut fuel (that can't melt steal beams!!!1)
besides, maybe I should make a subfaction to humanists in piratez so that "progressives" are properly represented. complete with pink hats, frothing at the mouth (this would require a minor change to the engine so that their blabberings can be shoven down the player's throat) and a "rescue Linus" mission ala the siberian base.
Better make sure the gender variable is a float.
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besides, maybe I should make a subfaction to humanists in piratez so that "progressives" are properly represented. complete with pink hats, frothing at the mouth (this would require a minor change to the engine so that their blabberings can be shoven down the player's throat) and a "rescue Linus" mission ala the siberian base.
I'm fairly sure this falls under the Academy. Not so literally, but they tend to represent all examples of information/culture warfare.
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This whole CoC thing is BS from beginning to end. Linux is neither meritocracy or anti-meritocracy, it is anarchy/communism, whether you like it or not, and that is possible because copying cost is negligible.
anarcho/captialsim, GNU slogan is:
To understand the concept, you should think of “free” as in “free speech,” not as in “free beer”
https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.en.html
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I'm fairly sure this falls under the Academy. Not so literally, but they tend to represent all examples of information/culture warfare.
This is a tough choice, the Academy being closer in modus operandi, but Humanists being closer in mockability/irony.
But I'm totally reusing the TFTD Cthulhu coffin. Oh, wait, it might be that RMS deserves being carbonited in it way more, complete with his beard ...
Okay, two coffins.
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But I'm totally reusing the TFTD Cthulhu coffin.
Hold your unicorns! From the previously linked anti-meritocracy article (https://modelviewculture.com/pieces/the-dehumanizing-myth-of-the-meritocracy):
Much of the literature that we love and respect as geeks was written by extraordinarily bigoted individuals, from H.P. Lovecraft’s rampant racism to Orson Scott Card’s aggressive homophobia. But these serious flaws are generally either ignored or explained away by cultural, historical or generational differences. We hide behind the motto of “love the art, hate the artist” to justify our preferences despite the faint voice of conscience, persistent in telling us that something is amiss.
Lovecraft was racist! "Death of author" is not an excuse: going "Iä! Iä! Cthulhu fh'tang!" makes you guilty by association. (Citing epithets from the Howard's Cat Naming Convention book is a bit more clear cut case.)
Stop perpetuating mythology coined by ungood people!
(Hmm... where does that leave Islam?)
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Hold your unicorns!
Nice suggestion, thank you. In lieu of just letting them free, I shall first take advantage of them and then make the unicornburgers. I now see that this is in their best interests.
Lovecraft was racist!
He was also a homosexual child-molesting Elder God from Outer Space.
Here's the proof:
https://www.newyorker.com/books/page-turner/the-complicated-friendship-of-h-p-lovecraft-and-robert-barlow-one-of-his-biggest-fans (https://www.newyorker.com/books/page-turner/the-complicated-friendship-of-h-p-lovecraft-and-robert-barlow-one-of-his-biggest-fans)
(although this one (http://file:///dev/null) is even more damning).
Him being not from Middle East, Africa or South America there can be no excuse.
Stop perpetuating mythology coined by ungood people!
You will not stop my Quest for Justice!
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In lieu of just letting them free, I shall first take advantage of them and then make the unicornburgers. I now see that this is in their best interests.
Careful now. Threathening or mocking imaginary beings can land you in jail (or worse) in some jurisdictions.
Also: medium-rare, thanks.
He was also a homosexual child-molesting Elder God from Outer Space.
Here's the proof:
https://www.newyorker.com/books/page-turner/the-complicated-friendship-of-h-p-lovecraft-and-robert-barlow-one-of-his-biggest-fans (https://www.newyorker.com/books/page-turner/the-complicated-friendship-of-h-p-lovecraft-and-robert-barlow-one-of-his-biggest-fans)
Interesting read. Suicidal gay man in the '50s... reminds me that having Turing in a file called HACKING probably paints me homophobic. Anyway, white gay men are not far enough down on the intersectional oppression ladder to matter for Diversity.
(although this one (http://file:///dev/null) is even more damning).
... it started to stare back at me. Nietzsche had some other quip about fighting dragons that applies quite well to the people pushing CoCs. (Feel free to throw that back at me when I start slandering them instead of their work.)
You will not stop my Quest for Justice!
But it offends me, a random observer with zero investment in the project! Sorry, the progressive demand censorship and witch hunts. Freedom and justice are mutually exclusive. Freedom is slaveryworker-y. Ignorance is strength. A trout weights as much as a duck.
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разгром
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZYQpge1W5s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZYQpge1W5s)
edit: esp the bit after 56:30
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anarcho/captialsim, GNU slogan is:https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.en.html
To understand the concept, you should think of “free” as in “free speech,” not as in “free beer”
Let's not be ridiculous, there is no free beer in any non-imaginary system, including communism. I specifically stated communism is only possible there due to cost of copying being negligible. Computer language is speech too...
Anarcho-capitalism... not, because NAP is a joke. Human being works on aggression principle. So it becomes CNAPP (Circumvention of NAP Principle). So Anarchocapitalism could only work if every human was either perfectly isolated from all the others, or working with them within a tight, exceptionalist, nepotistic (((belief system))). And then it wouldn't need money. Oy Vey. Maybe you're into something after all. Shrouded in deep darkness of his digital fortress, a lone man, or a member of secret cult, prowls the internet of Eldricht Things. The dumb pariahs are immediately cast into deadly light of being unmasked, and thus rendered powerless. Maybe not such a bad idea.
This is a tough choice, the Academy being closer in modus operandi, but Humanists being closer in mockability/irony.
Definitely Academy, that was the intention... they also do love CoCs. Therefore how can you say there is no irony :)
Freedom is slaveryworker-y. Ignorance is strength. A trout weights as much as a duck.
Regressive is Proggressive.
And what do you mean that Lovecraft wasn't a racist. He knew his antropology pretty well, as befits of an educated man.
PS. To explain my gripe with the word meritocracy... Those who call for meritocracy not infrequently understand it as "rule by those who grant diplommas".
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Let's not be ridiculous, there is no free beer in any non-imaginary system, including communism. I specifically stated communism is only possible there due to cost of copying being negligible. Computer language is speech too...
You completely miss my point. I only point outs that you attribute wrong ideology to FOSS.
You said that is "anarcho-communism" aka deny of all property rights where FOSS is more protection of my property rights to my hardware.
We could compare this to books, in FOSS world you can prevent anyone else to touch or read your book but when you sell it he can do any thing he want with it and you do not have any right to prevent that. He can copy it and sell new copies to other peoples.
This is completely different to ACom where book do not belongs to you and others can take it when they need it and you currently do not reading it.
Anarcho-capitalism... not, because NAP is a joke. Human being works on aggression principle. So it becomes CNAPP (Circumvention of NAP Principle). So Anarchocapitalism could only work if every human was either perfectly isolated from all the others, or working with them within a tight, exceptionalist, nepotistic (((belief system))). And then it wouldn't need money. Oy Vey. Maybe you're into something after all. Shrouded in deep darkness of his digital fortress, a lone man, or a member of secret cult, prowls the internet of Eldricht Things. The dumb pariahs are immediately cast into deadly light of being unmasked, and thus rendered powerless. Maybe not such a bad idea.
What NAP have to do with FOSS? And discussion with FOSS is more ACom or ACap? Both can be equal utopias that cant work or two systems that work currently in real life. This is irrelevant to discussion what basic ideology of FOSS is.
And for NAP, you are right that humanity make wars from from beginning but you forget one important fact, each side of conflict have NAP in own group. This mean if we split people to autonomous unit number of conflict will increase than decrease because they will have no incentive to respect each other, one of this incentives is trading that exists same long time like war (europe trade with chines for very long time even if both barely know each other).