OpenXcom Forum
OpenXcom => Playthroughs => Topic started by: 7Saturn on March 30, 2016, 03:47:16 pm
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I'm quite positive, that the game states (and always respected) the fact, that enemy units in base attacks will always start from hangars and main access lift. Well, it's the very first round and I got this:
(https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4458.0;attach=21042;image)
How can that be? It's clearly not in a hangar, not at the main access lift. And the attack has just begun, very first round. Either this fellow was fast enough to run in 0 rounds to this spot (JK) or this is a bug. Anyone else experienced that before? I have version 249101d-dirty (it's a while ago). And as I'm in the middle of an iron man base attack, I can't simply update and reload this one.
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In vanilla XCOM, XCOM and aliens will take each others' spawning spaces if there aren't enough valid spawning spaces for their own team. But I would expect OpenXCOM to have fixed that.
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You could check out this link for further info on spawning points. Unless openxcom has changed this, you only have a total of 40 points available for xcom at the start of a base defence(HWP's use 4 points). So don't have too many HWP's in your base. If all alien spawning points which usually are the hangers and access lift are used up they start to use xcom spawning points. Personally I always have 3 hangers in a base to try and avoid this but if you're playing on Superhuman there's still a chance the aliens will start in nasty positions.
https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Spawn_Points
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They're coming outta of the goddamn walls! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJQ_7jKIm24)
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Nice one, forgot about that!
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And just to be sure, since your build is flagged "dirty". You didn't make any changes to the spawning algorithm yourself?
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it's a bad spawn node. use the universal patch.
aliens don't use xcom spawn points or vice versa, and they never did. the general store contains a terror unit spawn point by mistake.
the only way to fix it is to replace the .RMP file (which the universal patch does).
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You could check out this link for further info on spawning points. Unless openxcom has changed this, you only have a total of 40 points available for xcom at the start of a base defence(HWP's use 4 points). So don't have too many HWP's in your base. If all alien spawning points which usually are the hangers and access lift are used up they start to use xcom spawning points. Personally I always have 3 hangers in a base to try and avoid this but if you're playing on Superhuman there's still a chance the aliens will start in nasty positions.
A base with one hangar, but only 10 soldiers and one tank.And just to be sure, since your build is flagged "dirty". You didn't make any changes to the spawning algorithm yourself?
Nope, didn't even change a letter of the source.it's a bad spawn node. use the universal patch.
I thought I did. It's automatically copied in, when building and installing. Unless there have been changes recently to the universal patch, I did apply it.
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my mistake, that module's actually a workshop (XBASE_03) and also has a bad spawn node (or three)
here's an updated patch, will be added to the download section soon.
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Thanks, I'll integrate that into mine, too.
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my mistake, that module's actually a workshop (XBASE_03) and also has a bad spawn node (or three)
here's an updated patch, will be added to the download section soon.
Question about this patch thing. When I originally downloaded OXC I used 1.0 and I believe the windows installer automatically applied the universal patch to my game files. Then when I upgraded to the nightlies, I just copied the game files from my 1.0 folder and put them in the nightlies folder. That should be fine right? Moving them doesn't change anything or the patch hasn't changed since 1.0 has it? I don't think I've experienced any of the bugs from the original, but since I'm not a vet I might not recognize them if I did (case and point, the situation in this thread).
On that note, how does one apply a patch? I googled it (https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=how%20to%20apply%20a%20.patch%20file) and I must be less computer literate than I thought because I couldn't find instructions that seemed to apply to this case.
I've only played the original, but plan on getting TFTD and didn't know if there was a patch I'd need to apply for that.
Thanks for any advice.
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the patch i've included above is for the universal patch, updated to the current nightly folder structure, and includes a few extra fixes, as well as a bunch of stuff for TFTD.
when updating from 1.0 to nightly, and moving your game files from the old "data" folder to the new "UFO" folder, make sure you remove all the old xcom data folders as well (Shader, SoldierName, Language, etc.) other than that, it's totally fine to update it that way.
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when updating from 1.0 to nightly, and moving your game files from the old "data" folder to the new "UFO" folder, make sure you remove all the old xcom data folders as well (Shader, SoldierName, Language, etc.) other than that, it's totally fine to update it that way.
Thanks for the quick response. And cool, that's exactly what I did except for some reason I didn't remove Shader. Removed that from here forward. No idea if it affected anything since I've played a lot and not noticed any problems, but good to have it the right way now rather than push my luck.
the patch i've included above is for the universal patch, updated to the current nightly folder structure, and includes a few extra fixes, as well as a bunch of stuff for TFTD.
All right, I'll be sure to figure out how to apply the patch file before I do TFTD then.
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the patch i've included above is for the universal patch, updated to the current nightly folder structure, and includes a few extra fixes, as well as a bunch of stuff for TFTD.
So I got a base defense mission with a sectopod spawned in my psi lab on the first turn (see screen shot). Obviously I do not want that, so I came here and downloaded the updated universal patch and applied it (was a lot simpler than I thought, I mistakenly thought it was going to be a .patch file) and re-loaded my campaign from 5-days before the base attack. Let the time run, got the base defense mission and the sectopod still spawned in the same place in my psi lab.
Is that another bad spawn point or will the patches only prevent this in NEW saves and not ones you've already started (since my base was already built)?
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it kinda worries me that this is happening so much recently, and not so much in the past, almost like something has changed in the spawning procedures (it hasn't, not in a while) but maybe it's been there the whole time and it's just luck that it hasn't popped up? seems unlikely, but it's the best i've got.
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I can only say, that it pretty much screws up any strategy relying on having your back free from enemies. Which on usual base defense missions is the case. I've had quite a lot of them in the past, but you're right: This never happened before, at all. Is there a way to define the base defense layout, for starting instant battles? This way it could be tested to quite an extend. But if you always start with the same starting layout, there's no variety for useful testing.
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I can only say, that it pretty much screws up any strategy relying on having your back free from enemies. Which on usual base defense missions is the case. I've had quite a lot of them in the past, but you're right: This never happened before, at all. Is there a way to define the base defense layout, for starting instant battles? This way it could be tested to quite an extend. But if you always start with the same starting layout, there's no variety for useful testing.
This is my base layout attached for what it's worth. Just a small radar base so not a lot of places to spawn in general. So far, I almost never get base defense missions so I can't say anything from experience.
Anyway, I kind of felt like the "chokepoint" base setup strategy was a bit "cheaty" so this kind of evens it a little bit.
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In my case it was also on small bases (in terms of spawn points for aliens): one hangar, the lift, and then just a straight line away from the lift, to get them no means of outflanking you. I think, it comes with the lack of space to spawn. Just one hangar it is, for all enemy units, not counting the lift (which is always present).
Which brings me to a question, I've asked myself a while ago: What's happening, when there's no hangar at a base? Let's imagine a radar outpost: the lift, 1 x stores, 1 x quarters and 1 radar of some kind. Where will they spawn? Spawning only at the lift will make that thing quite cramped, especially if there's one of those big invasion platoons, consisting of 3-5 2x2 units and ~25 further 1x1 units.
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Which brings me to a question, I've asked myself a while ago: What's happening, when there's no hangar at a base? Let's imagine a radar outpost: the lift, 1 x stores, 1 x quarters and 1 radar of some kind. Where will they spawn? Spawning only at the lift will make that thing quite cramped, especially if there's one of those big invasion platoons, consisting of 3-5 2x2 units and ~25 further 1x1 units.
Your question made me curious, so I re-loaded the save I mentioned before, dismantled the hangar/psi lab and let the time run again. I entered debug mode and took some screen shots to show what happens. All Ethereals in the lift and in my hyper-wave decoder. No sectopods. I played the mission and lost, but didn't meet any sectopods so I guess the big units won't spawn in small base without a hangar. Seems fair; they'd send a smaller platoon for a smaller base.
Save file attached if you want to give it a try just for kicks. I got my ass kicked. It's on Superhuman and the base is full of untrained rookies in mostly personal armor. Also when I equipped at the start of the mission I forgot to not give explosives to my psi weak guys so you can imagine how that went.
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Thanks for your tests. It pretty much shows, where the problem lies. It seems like, the problem mentioned during the earlier postings in this thread, is still there. It's simply to little of spawning points, so the alien units are places somewhere else, where usually the players units are spawned. I suspect, the lack of Sectopods is due to lack of spawning points all together. They are at the end of the unit list, also in other mission types. But if the spawning points are used before reaching them in the list, they simply don't occur, as they aren't spawned at all. (And no, I won't try that safe. :P If it were my game, I'd try to kill as many of those b******s as I could, for the points. But this base is lost, unless you have at least one or two guys around, that stand a chance against their psi attacks.)
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Countdown
I think your save may be more useful before alien assault.