OpenXcom Forum
Modding => Released Mods => Topic started by: ibanix on July 03, 2014, 12:26:50 pm
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I've always liked that XCOM allows you to use aircraft as mobile detection stations. The old trick of using a Skyranger's superior fuel and range to scout for alien bases got me thinking: Why not a dedicated mobile detection craft?
Here then is an implementation of the Boeing E-3 Sentry "AWACS" (Advanced Warning and Control System) plane. It has no weapons and no troop capacity - it is purely a flying radar base. To that end, it has superior radar range (1500 miles), a hefty fuel complement, and speed midway between a Skyranger and an Interceptor. It can be purchased for the low monthly price of $250k! (And resold later for $100k).
This is marked 'WIP' because the only thing I am missing is a sprite for the in-base image. It currently uses the Skyranger graphic. I'm not a graphic designer; anyone willing to make a sprite for the E-3 will have my undying gratitude. The UFOpedia entry is complete, however, and it works in all other senses.
Install: Drop the data folder into your OpenXCOM directory and enable.
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I like the idea... but how long can it stay airborne?
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With a fuel capacity of 2000? A long, long time. On 'patrol' setting it stayed up for just under 48 hours.
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I've always liked that XCOM allows you to use aircraft as mobile detection stations. The old trick of using a Skyranger's superior fuel and range to scout for alien bases got me thinking: Why not a dedicated mobile detection craft?
[snippity snip]
GENIOUS.
Though; an E-3 would be too big to fit in XCOM hangars and it couldn't take off from an XCOM base :-P
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[snippity snip]
GENIOUS.
Though; an E-3 would be too big to fit in XCOM hangars and it couldn't take off from an XCOM base :-P
Call it a E-2 Hawkeye... it can fit inside a carrier.
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I always sort of thought there was an attached runway to each base, with some sort of elevator carrying the planes up and down.
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I always sort of thought there was an attached runway to each base, with some sort of elevator carrying the planes up and down.
My impression as well, since the game states that the Skyranger is VTOL (although I can only think that its engines/rear wings must have to switch angles) but there's no mention to the Interceptor.
I've been thinking and an AWACS type aircraft would fit very well with a suggestion I've made regarding the UFOs attacking X-COM craft while on flight. I don't know actually how to implement this but UFOs already have a range stat, like all other craft, so it would be a matter of creating a specific trajectory for UFOs to pursue craft and another one to deal with the air combat window.
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Meanwhile I've started a new game and I've received my AWACS. This should be interesting to try out :)
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Cool idea. It's just a shame that the game effectively limits you to a hard-capped number of aircraft due to limited base size/number, otherwise we could go nuts with all kinds of specialised aircraft.
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Cool idea. It's just a shame that the game effectively limits you to a hard-capped number of aircraft due to limited base size/number, otherwise we could go nuts with all kinds of specialised aircraft.
You must be able to increase the number of craft per hangar.
I'm thinking of creating a high speed transport that only carries 6 soldiers. Meanwhile I kinda decided I prefer to use the Hawkeye instead. ;)
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you can increase the "crafts" rule in facilities
somewhere in the forum is a 3x3 hangar give this hangar 4 crafts and you have increased the crafts/tile from 1/4 to 4/9=>~80% more craft/space
if you want many crafts give it 2*bighangar=half the space in the base and you get 8 crafts (with normal hangars you need >90% of basespace for that)
downside (at the moment?) you only see one craft not 4
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Nice Hawkeye. Anyone know how to make a craft sprite for it or the Sentry?
I was thinking more about specialized aircraft, but I'm not sure what more could be gained with the current engine/ruleset limitations. Only the luck of having a radarRange option in the craft rulesets let me implement a radar plane. Otherwise everything is a variation on weapons, speed/acceleration, fuel capacity, and troop capacity.
I suppose we could make ultra-fast troop transport (fast as a Firestorm) with limited capacity (8 troop total); or the reverse of a really slow craft with huge troop capacity. Either of those would require new battlescape maps. Different ship types on weapons, I'm not so sure about; is there much to be gained? The implementation of an Interceptor upgrade (the Retaliator) was done and it's nice - but what goes up from there? The Firestorm is about as good as you can get without being overpowered, until you get to the Avenger, which is just the ultimate end-game craft.
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Huh, I'd totally forgotten about the hangar mod.
As far as other roles go, let's think about real life:
Refuelling - no idea if the code could be made to allow it, but if it did I think it'd be treading a fine line between interesting logistics and boring tedium.
EW - cant think of any way that'd be relevant
Ground attack - again, no idea if the code allows it but I can see a pre-emptive CAS run being beneficial on certain missions. I suppose the trade-off would be lack of xp and artifacts compared to usual.
Can't say any of these ideas really grab me though. Besides which, in terms of lore you'd just assume the local forces deal with this stuff.
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I was thinking more about specialized aircraft, but I'm not sure what more could be gained with the current engine/ruleset limitations. Only the luck of having a radarRange option in the craft rulesets let me implement a radar plane. Otherwise everything is a variation on weapons, speed/acceleration, fuel capacity, and troop capacity.
I suppose we could make ultra-fast troop transport (fast as a Firestorm) with limited capacity (8 troop total); or the reverse of a really slow craft with huge troop capacity. Either of those would require new battlescape maps. Different ship types on weapons, I'm not so sure about; is there much to be gained? The implementation of an Interceptor upgrade (the Retaliator) was done and it's nice - but what goes up from there? The Firestorm is about as good as you can get without being overpowered, until you get to the Avenger, which is just the ultimate end-game craft.
One possible way to see it is that the small transport becomes obsolete by the introduction of the Lightning/Avenger, like the Skyranger/Interceptor. Even the AWACS becomes obsolete once you get a global network of decoders. The fast transport is a way to get better odds to reach landed scout UFOs but at the loss of bringing a limited squad.
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As far as other roles go, let's think about real life:
Refuelling - no idea if the code could be made to allow it, but if it did I think it'd be treading a fine line between interesting logistics and boring tedium.
I had the same thought about refueling, but from a different angle - what if we had to buy and fuel regular craft? Should be easy enough to implement. On the other hand, that might be something I want not to have to deal with.
Also, unless the minimum size for an object can be smaller than 0.1, holding fuel is going to be a massive PITA - as a full fuel load for a Skyranger would be like 150 units of size.
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now if only UFOs could attack Xcom craft... that would be really cool. I could imagine a game variant where you cannot build base radars but have to rely on radar craft... and protect them from the UFOs all the time :)
on the matter of ultra-fast troop carriers, you can always give the interception craft (very) limited troop carrying capacity. 2 soldiers for an interceptor and 4 for a firestorm would totally make sense... :)
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Also, unless the minimum size for an object can be smaller than 0.1, holding fuel is going to be a massive PITA - as a full fuel load for a Skyranger would be like 150 units of size.
Yes it can, one tank minigun bullet in my mod has size 0.001. :)
As for the AWACS itself, it's nice and creative, but I also feel it's a bit... anal to use. I don't scout with aircraft, except when I know an alien base is there, and I fear the day when it becomes obligatory. Hence I don't really think this craft has any use.
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One thing that is interesting is that actual E-3 Sentry AWACS has only a 400 mile radar while the default radar range in X-Com is 600 miles.
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It's for game play, not reality :P
A highly advanced jet fighter (ala Interceptor) wouldn't cost only $600k, either....
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It's for game play, not reality :P
A highly advanced jet fighter (ala Interceptor) wouldn't cost only $600k, either....
But you can actually buy (https://www.aviatorsale.com/aix10216/) a MiG jet fighter for §260k (and just like in the game, you have to purchase its armaments separately)... so with §600k you can get two MiGs in real life ;)
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It's for game play, not reality :P
A highly advanced jet fighter (ala Interceptor) wouldn't cost only $600k, either....
I know. Renting combat aircraft is also pretty absurd.
(https://i.imgur.com/0r9Msyk.png)
But you can actually buy (https://www.aviatorsale.com/aix10216/) a MiG jet fighter for §260k (and just like in the game, you have to purchase its armaments separately)... so with §600k you can get two MiGs in real life ;)
It's a 43 years old type and additionally a training model with removed radar.
Interceptor is a cutting edge craft. By the way, its description says that it has pulse detonation engines. The purpose of pulse detonation engines is to allow hypersonic speed. Interceptor's speed is supersonic 3,1 mach. It should have speed of about 3500 knots instead of 2100 knots.
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The F-22 Raptor, which has sort of a resemblance to the Interceptor, has a unit cost of $150 million.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/46/Lockheed_Martin_F-22A_Raptor_JSOH.jpg/800px-Lockheed_Martin_F-22A_Raptor_JSOH.jpg)
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The F-22 Raptor, which has sort of a resemblance to the Interceptor, has a unit cost of $150 million.
and is in use for 25 years -> 10 million/year -> 500k/month its not that far off
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I think you wanted '17' years; the F-22 had first flight in 1997. (Which actually makes it a good candidate for being the Interceptor).
Besides, the unit cost is how much it costs to purchase one at the date of manufacture. We're not assuming X-COM gets to own it for 25 years!
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no idea i have no military knowledge and dont care much about that
but we rent this thing - if we would buy it there would be no monthly costs
if the difference is still just a bit too much then just imagine there are aliens attacking the world! wouldnt you give the defenders some sort of price bonus :)
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That's true. We're also way off topic - it's not meant to be real, it's meant to be a fun game to play.
I hope the AWACS plane gives some interesting options to players.
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I present you the Dark Star.
(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/NHPCINSC070420140833.png)
I've reduced its speed and acceleration by half and increased the fuel capacity by three. From my current experience the AWACS needs longer legs to be more useful.
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6000 fuel!? Does that thing ever need to land?
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and is in use for 25 years -> 10 million/year -> 500k/month its not that far off
I don't think anyone would assume that it's going to survive more than a few months at the best.
That's true. We're also way off topic - it's not meant to be real, it's meant to be a fun game to play.
I hope the AWACS plane gives some interesting options to players.
It's a very good idea. I decreased detection radius of Interceptor to 200 miles and of Skyranger to 50 miles and added a specialized Skyranger AWACS with 400 mile radar radius.
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6000 fuel!? Does that thing ever need to land?
Depends on the flight profile but for instance a Darkstar based on Europe can stay airborne for about 72 hours over South America. Now it is was possible to assign it to automatically patrol an area then it would be perfect to watch over a region.
EDIT: I've actually even increased the fuel to 15000 units since the craft's speed has been reduced to 750 and the time it takes to reach its patrol area actually can cut a bit of the time patrolling.
It is an interesting craft to use. Besides patrolling regions for days you can also send it after a UFO that just flew out of ground radar coverage and it can redetect it quicker than an interceptor. The drawbacks are the max speed which doesn't allow it to keep up with fast UFOs and refueling takes a while.
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For me, I'd leave it at 2000 fuel. More than that feels like a cheat to me.
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For me, I'd leave it at 2000 fuel. More than that feels like a cheat to me.
To me the AWACS requires a longer loiter time to be useful, otherwise it's either having to go through the chore of launching it every day or not being that useful. And it is becoming useful... I got lucky and detected two UFO scouts by patrolling Australia with it this month and I think I'd actually buy it on another playthrough.
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I'm playing a new game with the E-3 and it's working the same way, being useful either to scout or to tail alien ships.
The other downside to the 6000 fuel version is refuel time, unless you bump that up.
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Some nice ideas here, I will follow this thread 8)