OpenXcom Forum

Modding => Released Mods => Area 51 => Topic started by: Hobbes on June 21, 2014, 05:41:50 pm

Title: Terrain Pack - Info & Feedback
Post by: Hobbes on June 21, 2014, 05:41:50 pm
Announcement

After over a year of hiatus while I was finishing Area 51, the Terrain Pack is back with all the goodies created for Area 51! :)

Latest version can be downloaded at the mod portal - https://openxcom.mod.io/terrain-pack

List of features
* 100 new terrains, including TFTD's Port, Mu and Atlantis terrains, for UFO, Terror Site and Alien Base missions
* Reworked Geoscape, originally based on Volutar's mod with more landform detail, and latter added several additional textures
* Total of 144 cities, both vanilla and new ones. Each city can now have 1-3 specific terrains assigned for terror missions out of 31 possible terrains. The terrains assigned to cities match their geographical location
* 2 new alien base terrains added, Alien Colony and Alien Hive. Colony has a ground level which will change according to the geographical location of the base
* Terrains for UFO missions are now divided into several biomes: Farm, Desert, Forest, Jungle, Mountain, Polar, Grassland, Savanna, Steppe, Taiga and Tundra. Each biome can several terrains assigned, with more/less hills, crashed planes, temples, swamps, etc. It is also possible to see UFOs landed in city terrains like Industrial, Native or the vanilla Urban
* 80+ new civilians have been added, some will only appear at certain Terror Site terrains, and some will carry weapons of their own
* Terror missions can happen now in the Pacific, North and South Atlantic and Indian oceans. It is also possible now to get Alien Research missions on the Atlantic and Indian oceans since Mission Zones were added to those areas. Terror missions can now be composed of Port attacks
* The Country and Region Zones have been redesigned, using the Improved Nations mod and additional work
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 21, 2014, 06:37:22 pm
I'm very excited about the future maps!

One suggestion I could give is a middle-eastern town. I mean something like the Xenonauts have, a collection of small, Arabic-style houses, a bit more cramped except for an occasional large mansion with open gardens/yards. I think it would add a lot to the game, after all most combat in the media nowadays take place in this environment. :)

Speaking of Xenonauts, they also had separate map sets for Soviet towns (the game takes place in 1979). And I think UFO: Aftermath did too. This is actually an interesting idea, since the affected terrain is quite large (the former USSR and half the Europe, and possibly China), but I'm not sure if OpenXCom graphics is detailed enough to show the difference.

It's not like I do not have any other ideas, but there's one more Xenonauts terrain I remember: a military base. It would be cool to help defend a base with tanks and everything, though as of now the game does not support armed civilians.

And finally, we have the TFTD cruise liners. 8)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: the_third_curry on June 21, 2014, 06:59:04 pm
Is it possible to assign specific maps to certain cities or is it randomly generated?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: phobos2077 on June 21, 2014, 07:03:42 pm
I just want to say that I'm really excited about this effort. This is THE thing that will really bring second breath into the old game. I mean, going through the same farms and towns over and over again is really boring, despite all the great mods out there (weapons, armors, etc.). New UFO layouts and THIS will really make OpenXcom shine to it's full potential.

Btw, how do you create new maps? What tools do you use?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 21, 2014, 07:27:54 pm
I'm very excited about the future maps!

One suggestion I could give is a middle-eastern town. I mean something like the Xenonauts have, a collection of small, Arabic-style houses, a bit more cramped except for an occasional large mansion with open gardens/yards. I think it would add a lot to the game, after all most combat in the media nowadays take place in this environment. :)

Speaking of Xenonauts, they also had separate map sets for Soviet towns (the game takes place in 1979). And I think UFO: Aftermath did too. This is actually an interesting idea, since the affected terrain is quite large (the former USSR and half the Europe, and possibly China), but I'm not sure if OpenXCom graphics is detailed enough to show the difference.

It's not like I do not have any other ideas, but there's one more Xenonauts terrain I remember: a military base. It would be cool to help defend a base with tanks and everything, though as of now the game does not support armed civilians.

And finally, we have the TFTD cruise liners. 8)

The issue with adding new maps like the ones you mentioned above is this: it takes a LOT of time and skills to design original images. Most of what is mentioned above simply reuses images from UFO/TFTD, with the exception of Dawn City, but there I had Nachtwolf's assistance since he created the setting.

This isn't as simple as creating 1 weapon: you need to create from 100-300 different images for ground, north & west walls and objects for each terrain. That takes a lot of time and effort.

Is it possible to assign specific maps to certain cities or is it randomly generated?

You can specific if the map is used on either northern/southern hemispheres, or both, but it's not possible to do more than that.

I just want to say that I'm really excited about this effort. This is THE thing that will really bring second breath into the old game. I mean, going through the same farms and towns over and over again is really boring, despite all the great mods out there (weapons, armors, etc.). New UFO layouts and THIS will really make OpenXcom shine to it's full potential.

Btw, how do you create new maps? What tools do you use?

MapView for designing the map blocks, PCKView for replacing the images, MCDEdit for editing the tiles, GIMP for small graphic touches.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 21, 2014, 07:39:42 pm
The issue with adding new maps like the ones you mentioned above is this: it takes a LOT of time and skills to design original images. Most of what is mentioned above simply reuses images from UFO/TFTD, with the exception of Dawn City, but there I had Nachtwolf's assistance since he created the setting.

This isn't as simple as creating 1 weapon: you need to create from 100-300 different images for ground, north & west walls and objects for each terrain. That takes a lot of time and effort.

As a long-time modder, I naturally realize this. Still, I believe that having a great vision helps when doing little stuff. Plus, who said it can't take many years? :)

As for making the graphics, I perhaps some contributors would like to participate? I certainly would like to help myself a little. I'm not much of an artist, but I'm pretty good at stealing objects from other games and making them look inconspicuous. ;)

Anyway, at least the military base idea should be doable with little to no new tiles. And I wasn't joking with the cruise liners either, though I doubt it's possible to do without new code available (because of the obvious fact that it must happen on the open sea).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on June 22, 2014, 12:04:25 am

The Terrain Pack for OpenXcom consists of terrains for UFO and/or UFO2000 (multiplayer remake of the original game) created mostly by me and otherUFO/UFO2000 players. Several were published on my site (https://area51.xcomufo.com/) () to replace the Terror Site (Urban) terrain while the rest were released by UFO2000 (https://ufo2000.sourceforge.net/). For download of the current versiion, full credits and complete change log, please check the mod's page (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack).


Possible Future Terrains:
* Railyard - Urban terrain. Uses UFO and TFTD tilesets, maps require slight adaptations, no routes for AI.
* Modified Farm - Replaces/suplements the Culta (Farm) terrain. Will add versions of the Farm buildings facing other directions and/or new map blocks/buildings. Some maps are designed but there are no routes for AI to use.
* Polis - Urban terrain, uses the Terror Site tilesets. Currently it has 2 versions: a set of 40x40 and 50x50 buildings; or several 10x10 map blocks that connect with one another. Both have no routes for AI.
* Siberia - possible replacement/supplement for Mountain/Polar terrain but requires redesigning the maps and creating all of the route files.
* Slums - possible supplement to Urban terrains. Requires converting the TFTD tileset images to UFO, map redesign and creating route files.
* Area51 - tileset is currently being redesigned to be used in the maps of a new mission type (Alien Raid (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2336.0)). May also be used later to create map sets for other mission types (Terror Sites, Base Defense).
* Polar/Jungle/Forest/Mountain/Desert - no plans to any new terrains/changes since the focus of these terrains are the UFOs and there are already plenty of UFO mods available. 

Feedback/suggestions/questions about all of the above are most welcome.

On your site there are a lot of contents and you are the more knowing for select them

With some  efforts i will try to convert palette of TFTD .PCK (island, port, liner, deck, cargo, etc)

could it be an help for you ?



Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 22, 2014, 04:11:35 am
As a long-time modder, I naturally realize this. Still, I believe that having a great vision helps when doing little stuff. Plus, who said it can't take many years? :)

As for making the graphics, I perhaps some contributors would like to participate? I certainly would like to help myself a little. I'm not much of an artist, but I'm pretty good at stealing objects from other games and making them look inconspicuous. ;)

Anyway, at least the military base idea should be doable with little to no new tiles. And I wasn't joking with the cruise liners either, though I doubt it's possible to do without new code available (because of the obvious fact that it must happen on the open sea).

I just finished selecting the images and finished the .PCK files. I've attached below the PNGs of the tilesets, any feedback/improvements will be most welcome.

On your site there are a lot of contents and you are the more knowing for select them

With some  efforts i will try to convert palette of TFTD .PCK (island, port, liner, deck, cargo, etc)

could it be an help for you ?

Thanks for the offer but the TFTD tilesets are not a priority since eventually TFTD will get ported to OpenXCom and I only use specific tiles that I can easily convert.

The best help I could use right now has to do with the Area 51 tileset since there are a few tiles that I'm not too satisfied since my skills as a graphics designer are not that great.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 22, 2014, 04:16:21 am
It's really good, as expected. Great job.

The only thing I seriously dislike is the preserved Chryssalid. It's way too visible in the tank, so it looks flat. I suggest moving it "deeper" - move the sprite a bit higher and give it some blueish hue, especially near the legs. Ideally, its most protruding elements would fade into the blueness, like the lobsterman:
(https://www.ufopaedia.org/images/8/81/Lobsterman.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 22, 2014, 04:20:28 am
It's really good, as expected. Great job.

The only thing I seriously dislike is the preserved Chryssalid. It's way too visible in the tank, so it looks flat. I suggest moving it "deeper" - move the sprite a bit higher and give it some blueish hue, especially near the legs. Ideally, its most protruding elements would fade into the blueness, like the lobsterman:
(https://www.ufopaedia.org/images/8/81/Lobsterman.png)

I'l look into that. That tile will be animated with bubbles rising on the liquid.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 22, 2014, 08:07:14 pm
Hobbes, reporting that I'm experiencing constant crashes on the map I'm attaching. Well, not exactly crashing, it just freezes on the hidden movement screen. I think it happens after alien turn, before civilian turn, seemingly at random (sometimes it happens, sometimes if doesn't; and if I reload, it doesn't always replicate).

Now, I admit I combined your mod with Luke's terror mod, but I don't think it would be a problem. Nevertheless, here's the code (omitting the actual terrains section):

Code: [Select]
alienDeployments:
  - type: STR_TERROR_MISSION
    width: 60
    length: 60
    height: 10
    civilians: 18
    terrains:
      - URBAN
      - URBAN2
      - MADURBAN
      - DAWNURBAN
      - PORTURBAN
      - NATIVEURBAN
      - INDUSTRIALURBAN

I swear this has never happened before.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 22, 2014, 08:20:13 pm
My first guess would be that it is related to combining both mods and those map dimensions (60x60x4). Try reducing it to 50x50x4 and see if it still happens.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 22, 2014, 08:25:38 pm
My first guess would be that it is related to combining both mods and it has to do with the FPS count from those map dimensions (60x60x4)

Frankly, I don't understand what you meant.
FPS as in "frames per second"? How does this relate to stability?
And the height is 10, not 4 (Which admittedly might cause problems, since your maps were meant to have height 4, but I don't think it's the problem - the game adds extra layers on top of the rest, so we just have more air above the buildings.)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 22, 2014, 08:40:57 pm
Frankly, I don't understand what you meant.
FPS as in "frames per second"? How does this relate to stability?
And the height is 10, not 4 (Which admittedly might cause problems, since your maps were meant to have height 4, but I don't think it's the problem - the game adds extra layers on top of the rest, so we just have more air above the buildings.)

Ignore the FPS mention. What I meant is that the map has 60x60x10 with both mods combined, while by themselves it should be either 50x50x10 or 60x60x4. Try resetting the dimensions to 50x50x10 to see if the problem still remains.

Also: didn't Luke maps had a cellar?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 22, 2014, 08:55:55 pm
Ignore the FPS mention. What I meant is that the map has 60x60x10 with both mods combined, while by themselves it should be either 50x50x10 or 60x60x4. Try resetting the dimensions to 50x50x10 to see if the problem still remains.

It works now, though I got a different map (one with parking lots and cars). [EDIT: no, it's the same tileset I guess.]

Oh well, I guess I'll have to discard Luke's designs for now. I can't fix the ruleset every time I get a terror mission, and I don't think I can make both mods work at the same time.

Also: didn't Luke maps had a cellar?

Yes, well, some of his houses do. The trick is that his ground level is actually level 3 (or was it 4?), with 99% of lowest levels filled with dirt.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 22, 2014, 09:04:25 pm
I just had a look at that specific map block and I can't find anything wrong about it.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 22, 2014, 09:20:53 pm
I just had a look at that specific map block and I can't find anything wrong about it.

Yeah, I don't think so either. Must be something about these dimensions, I guess...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 22, 2014, 10:09:31 pm
Yeah, I don't think so either. Must be something about these dimensions, I guess...

It's not the dimensions. I just tried 60x60x10, Dawn City with the building on the pic on the battlefield and I had no issues.

Are you running any alien mods?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 22, 2014, 11:03:17 pm
It's not the dimensions. I just tried 60x60x10, Dawn City with the building on the pic on the battlefield and I had no issues.

Are you running any alien mods?

I am, but now I saw this:
https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2370.new;topicseen#new

So perhaps it's not related to any mod at all.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on June 23, 2014, 11:00:14 am
A big doubt : is It possible have maps

- with size 70 x 40 x 4 (such as TFTD maps of Pleasure Liner and Cargo Ship)
- with size 100 x 40 x 8  (a hypothetical joined version)

Thank you
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 23, 2014, 02:14:12 pm
A big doubt : is It possible have maps

- with size 70 x 40 x 4 (such as TFTD maps of Pleasure Liner and Cargo Ship)
- with size 100 x 40 x 8  (a hypothetical joined version)

Thank you

Just tried 70x40x4 without a problem a Terror Site, although those TFTD terrains are actualy 40x70x4. I'm assuming the other dimensions should work as well, but you can always try that for yourself if you edit the ruleset of the terrain pack.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 24, 2014, 11:10:03 am
Just tried 70x40x4 without a problem a Terror Site, although those TFTD terrains are actualy 40x70x4. I'm assuming the other dimensions should work as well, but you can always try that for yourself if you edit the ruleset of the terrain pack.

Yes, it was confirmed by devs to be a problem with Reapers, and already fixed. Therefore it has nothing whatsoever to do with your mod.
Many apologies for the confusion.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 25, 2014, 03:25:30 pm
Has anyone asked for a Skyranger? :)

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on June 25, 2014, 03:31:52 pm
Has anyone asked for a Skyranger? :)
Hé hé  ;D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 25, 2014, 04:18:20 pm
Has anyone asked for a Skyranger? :)

+1! :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on June 25, 2014, 04:34:22 pm
Thank you, its mine!

I nevere remember where I park my car !!!

 ;D ;D

very good


PS:

It is lootable ? 8)


I mean, may I bring it to my base after the combat ?  ::)


Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on June 25, 2014, 05:10:18 pm
After the joke


Is it  possible render partial random terrain such as Plane Crash Site of UFO2000
 :'(

It was defined by programmative script by language LUA.

Some maps have mandatory position constraint.

Hobbes do you remove maps with docks from TFTD Port terrain for this reason ?

Some TFTD Island maps have sea on the left border too.









Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 25, 2014, 06:11:03 pm
After the joke


Is it  possible render partial random terrain such as Plane Crash Site of UFO2000
 :'(

It was defined by programmative script by language LUA.

Some maps have mandatory position constraint.

Hobbes do you remove maps with docks from TFTD Port terrain for this reason ?

Some TFTD Island maps have sea on the left border too.

I don't recall the specifics of the Plane Crash LUA script but essentially on OpenXCom we're currently limited to either complete random placement (UFO & Alien Base terrains) or random + 2 possible roads (Urban terrain). I had to remove the docks maps, plus a couple of others that had mandatory placement, from Port exactly for this reason.

If TFTD is implemented then it will be required to create scripts for Island and Port to deal with these situations. Hopefully at that point the map generation code is changed so that it can be modded for specific conditions.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 25, 2014, 10:34:02 pm
A few more Area51 concepts:
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Mr. Quiet on June 26, 2014, 02:48:56 am
Hey Hobbes, I love your maps, you're awesome! Anything you can do to add maps to the crash-sites? A good chance for City maps on crash-sites and I don't mind farm maps on landing sites, since I shoot down every ship I see. Thank you mate.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 26, 2014, 04:47:42 am
Hey Hobbes, I love your maps, you're awesome! Anything you can do to add maps to the crash-sites? A good chance for City maps on crash-sites and I don't mind farm maps on landing sites, since I shoot down every ship I see. Thank you mate.

One of my intentions would be to add some variety to the crash/landed UFO terrains. The easiest possibility would simply be to combine  Jungle/Forest/Desert/Polar/Mountain with the City terrain.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: wsmithjr on June 27, 2014, 12:54:23 am
Hey Hobbes, I love your maps, you're awesome! Anything you can do to add maps to the crash-sites? A good chance for City maps on crash-sites and I don't mind farm maps on landing sites, since I shoot down every ship I see. Thank you mate.

I got at least 1 UFO recovery battle that had buildings from the original terror maps, warehouses and such.  Was pretty cool.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 27, 2014, 03:02:30 am
I got at least 1 UFO recovery battle that had buildings from the original terror maps, warehouses and such.  Was pretty cool.

This mod is not responsible for that behavior. You must also be using the MiB mod. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 27, 2014, 04:39:52 am
A little update.

I'm currently working on integrating the Alien Raid mod into the Terrain Pack and testing some features in the process.

I've discovered meanwhile that the hemisphere settings aren't used by Terror Sites, so the Native terrain can actually appear on any hemisphere. Another thing that doesn't seem possible is to have randomized terrain for the UFOs (i.e. getting Farm or Native) like it is for Terror Sites, but each UFO terrain needs to be either specified to a terrain texture or a hemisphere. One idea would be to have Native assigned to UFO missions taking place in Farm terrain on the southern hemisphere.

I haven't made my mind but meanwhile I'm still designing the tilesets and map blocks for Area51. I will only released this map until I get more than 1 map block ready though.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on June 27, 2014, 07:30:48 am
A suggestion : it would be nice to add a link in your first heading post for direct access to your mod on wonderful Jo5hua's mod portal

Something like Terrain Pack available on mod portal (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 27, 2014, 02:44:28 pm
Davide linked this page (https://area51.xcomufo.com/depot2.htm) in another thread.

These are works by several people, I wonder if they would like to participate... :)

That page is actually hosted on my site. As far as I know all of the other contributors aren't active anymore (Kratos, Twilight Owl, Exo2000, Violazr, Nachtwolf) since the UFO2000 project essentially died a few years ago. The page is still active but there has been no updates to the engine since 2012 and the forums are also inactive since then.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 27, 2014, 02:47:09 pm
That page is actually hosted on my site. As far as I know all of the other contributors aren't active anymore (Kratos, Twilight Owl, Exo2000, Violazr, Nachtwolf) since the UFO2000 project essentially died a few years ago. The page is still active but there has been no updates to the engine since 2012 and the forums are also inactive since then.

Yeah, I noticed it was yours afterwards, so I deleted my post. Apparently not fast enough. :P

Looks cool though.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 28, 2014, 11:56:10 pm
Added version 1.9 (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack), reintroducing Area 51 terrain and using it for the Alien Raid missions.

Here's an introduction of the new mission:
* Alien Raids - New mission that consists of a single UFO (Raider Ship) sent by the aliens to attack critical targets essential for Earth's defense. The UFO will only appear over the major continents and the raid has roughly the same change of being generated than the original alien missions. The Raider Ship will be heavily armed, fast and dangerous and doesn't require scout UFOs to attack its target. Failing to detect, destroy the UFO or stop the alien attack on the targeted human facility will bring a significant boom to the alien invasion. Alien Raids take place on maps designed using the Area 51 terrain.

There is also an additional new UFO mission:
* Alien Flyby - The aliens can now send several waves of UFOs to intimidate a targeted area by overflying its territory.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: moriarty on June 29, 2014, 12:45:17 am
I just installed your terrain pack, and it overwrote my AVENGER.pck, .tab and .mcd files - is that intentional, and if yes, what does it change/fix? (if it is intentional, I think you should mention it in the description)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 29, 2014, 12:49:04 am
I just installed your terrain pack, and it overwrote my AVENGER.pck, .tab and .mcd files - is that intentional, and if yes, what does it change/fix? (if it is intentional, I think you should mention it in the description)

Ooops, not intentional, I gonna fix that right away on the .zip file. I actually haven't changed on the Avenger files, although they made have altered dates. Sorry about that and thanks.

Just uploaded a new version without the unneeded files.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 29, 2014, 02:56:17 am
Would you consider it acceptable if I include your mods in the Final Mod Pack?

I was going to leave them out, since terrain maps are easily compatible with anything and therefore don't require adding in a compilation, but since you started adding missions and such, it's no longer possible. And I would hate to take away such gems from the players. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 29, 2014, 04:12:29 am
Would you consider it acceptable if I include your mods in the Final Mod Pack?

I was going to leave them out, since terrain maps are easily compatible with anything and therefore don't require adding in a compilation, but since you started adding missions and such, it's no longer possible. And I would hate to take away such gems from the players. :)

That's completely acceptable to me :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 29, 2014, 04:49:20 am
That's completely acceptable to me :)

Thank you :)

I promise to keep it updated and everything!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Vulgar Monkey on June 29, 2014, 06:16:57 am
I'm not sure this is the ideal place to ask, but I expect you'd be the person who knows.

I'm curious - if the dev team is now working on OpenTFTD, does that mean map assets would be cross-compatible with both versions?
And if so, does that mean we could have a mod where, say, a terror mission in Xcom has a chance to take place on a TFTD cruise ship, using the cydonia multi-stage mission structure?

Obviously there may have to be a difference in where on the globe the mission is spawned, but other than that?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 29, 2014, 06:28:39 am
I'm not sure this is the ideal place to ask, but I expect you'd be the person who knows.

I'm curious - if the dev team is now working on OpenTFTD, does that mean map assets would be cross-compatible with both versions?
And if so, does that mean we could have a mod where, say, a terror mission in Xcom has a chance to take place on a TFTD cruise ship, using the cydonia multi-stage mission structure?

Obviously there may have to be a difference in where on the globe the mission is spawned, but other than that?

The multistage missions are already implemented but they can't be used in mods since they are restricted to the Cydonia mission. I don't know the maps will be converted.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on June 29, 2014, 08:45:20 am
I spend some efforts to insert TFTD terror mission into OX

yet It was in early stage too

There are variuos problem

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 29, 2014, 02:47:31 pm
multistage mission.
 
For Ship scenarious  an alternative could be a build a couple of  unique huge maps  40 x 100 x 8
without multistage. I think that MapView must be upgrade to join maps too.

I guess you could make an 8-level map of a ship, squeezing both stages into one mission. The only problem is the transition point, so you probably would have to play with the map to connect stairs/elevators. Looks like a lot of work, but doable.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on June 29, 2014, 09:57:56 pm
Yes you are right.

Multistage mission was a better solution but it require OX engine upgrade.

I hope that OX Commanders relese this feature for modders too
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 29, 2014, 10:03:55 pm
For Ship scenarious  an alternative could be a build a couple of  unique huge maps  40 x 100 x 8
without multistage.

I'm getting close to finish the new Area 51 map and it will be 50x80x4.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on June 29, 2014, 10:09:10 pm
I'm getting close to finish the new Area 51 map and it will be 50x80x4.

Yes but you are a guru of map making.

I do not sure if I will able  to join the maps with proper connection stairs/elevators.... :-[
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on June 29, 2014, 10:29:00 pm
Nice job dudes, already really a great mod  :)

EDIT : I know it's wip, however, bear in mind to add getOneFree to alien engineers (raid and flyby) and navigators (raider ship)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 30, 2014, 03:26:59 am
Nice job dudes, already really a great mod  :)

EDIT : I know it's wip, however, bear in mind to add getOneFree to alien engineers (raid and flyby) and navigators (raider ship)

That's for the next version. For version 1.9.1 you can start checking the new building the aliens are targeting on their Alien Raids :

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/LATOFNPW062920140812.png)

In addition, Native terrain now replaces Farm terrain on the southern hemisphere.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 30, 2014, 04:45:35 am
This is beyond great. :)

I've also had a thought today: would it be possible to use the street generation procedure to make a street in some other terrain than urban?
Well, what I actually had in mind was not a street, but a shallow river (for the forest and/or jungle). Would require new tiles of course. High movement cost (6, like the wheat field), no other special considerations.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on June 30, 2014, 04:59:20 am
This is beyond great. :)

I've also had a thought today: would it be possible to use the street generation procedure to make a street in some other terrain than urban?
Well, what I actually had in mind was not a street, but a shallow river (for the forest and/or jungle). Would require new tiles of course. High movement cost (6, like the wheat field), no other special considerations.

Like this?

Unfortunately, like you said, the street generation procedure should only work for Terror Sites.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 30, 2014, 05:22:25 am
Yes, looks good. :) Though I meant something different, this at least doesn't require new water tiles.

Pity it's not possible. I was hoping for some Jagged Alliance-like jungle rivers.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: mercy on June 30, 2014, 11:02:26 am
OMG! These maps look amazing!!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 01, 2014, 04:43:37 pm
Hobbes, I noticed that some of your files have lowercase names (map.pck) while other don't (Map.PCK or MAP.PCK). This is fine, but any discrepancy between the ruleset declaration and the actual file name will break the game for Linux users (Windows doesn't care).

Therefore, I would suggest sticking to uppercase names only, since that's how the original files are. This will help keep it clean and playable on all operating systems. That's what I do anyway.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 02, 2014, 12:41:42 am
Hobbes, I noticed that some of your files have lowercase names (map.pck) while other don't (Map.PCK or MAP.PCK). This is fine, but any discrepancy between the ruleset declaration and the actual file name will break the game for Linux users (Windows doesn't care).

Therefore, I would suggest sticking to uppercase names only, since that's how the original files are. This will help keep it clean and playable on all operating systems. That's what I do anyway.

I know about the Linux requirement, I've been trying to keep it all uppercase names, looks like some got it with the copy/pasting. Thanks for the heads up.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 02, 2014, 12:59:11 am
I know about the Linux requirement, I've been trying to keep it all uppercase names, looks like some got it with the copy/pasting. Thanks for the heads up.

No problem. I hope these files were really yours, since my map folders are damn messy. :P
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 02, 2014, 03:09:52 am
No problem. I hope these files were really yours, since my map folders are damn messy. :P

Mine are messy as well. I've uploaded a new version fixing the uppercase file names. It also has additional maps for Port terrain, UFOPaedia entries for the new alien missions and a couple of tweaks.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 05, 2014, 01:54:41 am
Anyone playing any campaigns with the new missions?

I'm 5 months through my current one and I've only had 8 combat missions so far, and my 5th terror site just popped up. Haven't encountered any of the new missions but from the graphs there was an alien raid on South America on March. And terror sites have gone more difficult with the new terrains, so I'm considering restricting their size back to 50x50 otherwise the fights get too long.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 10, 2014, 03:12:10 pm
I noticed this:

Code: [Select]
  - type: STR_EUROPE
    missionWeights:
      STR_ALIEN_RAID: 20
      STR_ALIEN_FLYBY: 120

Shouldn't it be 20 on both, or is it intentional?

(It's similar for many other regions, though not all.)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 10, 2014, 05:10:50 pm
I noticed this:

Code: [Select]
  - type: STR_EUROPE
    missionWeights:
      STR_ALIEN_RAID: 20
      STR_ALIEN_FLYBY: 120

Shouldn't it be 20 on both, or is it intentional?

(It's similar for many other regions, though not all.)

That will be 20 on the next version, I used those values to increase the odds of actually seeing a flyby.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 16, 2014, 05:39:18 pm
A little update is due. I've been focusing on enlarging Dawn City and while there's still a ton of work involved, below you can find a few examples of what is to be expected in the future. :)

I should publish the updated version by the end of this week, if all goes well. I haven't made my mind but most likely Dawn City will be added as 2 terrains for terror sites.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 16, 2014, 07:06:42 pm

Is AREARAID00.MAP (Area51) an UFO map  ?  :o

because studing the soure code I suspect that single map block bigger than 20x20 are not supported or at list there are some risk of issue.

I open a post about it
https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2628.0 (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2628.0)

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 16, 2014, 07:23:33 pm
Is AREARAID00.MAP (Area51) an UFO map  ?  :o

because studing the soure code I suspect that single map block bigger than 20x20 are not supported or at list there are some risk of issue.

I open a post about it
https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2628.0 (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2628.0)

Yes, it is considered a UFO for the game.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 16, 2014, 11:06:12 pm
You are a genius!!! ;D

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 16, 2014, 11:29:58 pm
You are a genius!!! ;D

robin come up with the idea for his MiB mod. :)

I'm not an expert with coding but does this issue mean that maps larger than 20x20 will not be used unless they are UFOs?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 17, 2014, 12:10:58 am
I suspect it Tonight i cannot prove it because my PC was blocked by my mother in law she  sleep  in my  living rooma for few days ii hope.
Now i mai using an ipad to' write on forum

In and case i am sure to Fix them .
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 19, 2014, 10:49:29 pm
Almost there... :D



Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 19, 2014, 11:10:01 pm
Is this the Skyranger airfield (or something to that effect) you mentioned once? Cool! :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 19, 2014, 11:23:55 pm
Is this the Skyranger airfield (or something to that effect) you mentioned once? Cool! :)

This is the new version of Dawn City... still a ton of work involved but I'll posting an update either today or tomorrow.

The current version was designed for the original game and I had to cut out a lot of sprites and maps from the UFO2000. This new version will introduce more of those.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 20, 2014, 12:04:28 am
Oops, my bad. But this does look kinda military...

Actually, the entire Dawn City looks just like a huge prison compound. :D Not that I'm complaining, it's a kickass prison compound to murder aliens in!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 20, 2014, 05:55:14 pm
Oops, my bad. But this does look kinda military...

Actually, the entire Dawn City looks just like a huge prison compound. :D Not that I'm complaining, it's a kickass prison compound to murder aliens in!

LOL, well I can assure you that me and Nachtwolf didn't had that in mind when we were designing it.

Something I just remembered to ask. I've been thinking of adding my Alien Mix mod that adds the possibility of mixed alien squads for all missions alongside vanilla single races, as well as the Muton Commander mod. You think that will conflict a lot with the Final Mod Pack?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on July 20, 2014, 07:45:18 pm
LOL, well I can assure you that me and Nachtwolf didn't had that in mind when we were designing it.

Something I just remembered to ask. I've been thinking of adding my Alien Mix mod that adds the possibility of mixed alien squads for all missions alongside vanilla single races, as well as the Muton Commander mod. You think that will conflict a lot with the Final Mod Pack?
I think Muton Commander mod is already included in FMP
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 20, 2014, 11:20:42 pm
Hobbes, I don't think it'd conflict with FMP on principle. But if you do add them to vanilla missions, I think I'll just do the same in the FMP, since your raid mission is already in. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Mr. Quiet on July 21, 2014, 01:13:37 am
I'm itching for an update Hobbes. Also love your name, it reminds me of the old comics I used to read. Shoot, I still have them too. Should get back to them someday...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 21, 2014, 02:29:38 pm
Hobbes, I don't think it'd conflict with FMP on principle. But if you do add them to vanilla missions, I think I'll just do the same in the FMP, since your raid mission is already in. :)

I think it's going to give you a lot of work updating all of the AlienMissions. I haven't integrated the Alien Remix into the Terrain Pack yet but here's an example of the possibilities on the 7th month for terror missions:
Code: [Select]
      7:
          STR_SECTOID: 20
          STR_SNAKEMAN: 30
          STR_ETHEREAL: 20
          STR_MUTON: 20
          STR_FLOATER: 10
          STR_SECTOID_FLOATER: 10
          STR_SECTOID_SNAKEMAN: 10
          STR_FLOATER_SNAKEMAN: 10
          STR_SECTOID_MUTON: 10
          STR_FLOATER_MUTON: 10
          STR_SNAKEMAN_MUTON: 10
          STR_SECTOID_ETHEREAL: 10
          STR_FLOATER_ETHEREAL: 10
          STR_SNAKEMAN_ETHEREAL: 10
          STR_MUTON_ETHEREAL: 10
          STR_MIXED_VERY_EARLY: 10
          STR_MIXED_EARLY: 10
          STR_MIXED_MID_EARLY: 10 
          STR_MIXED_MID: 10
          STR_MIXED_MID_LATE: 10 
          STR_MIXED_LATE: 10   
          STR_MIXED_VERY_LATE: 10 
          STR_MIXED_ALL: 10   
          STR_SECTOID_SECTOPOD: 10
          STR_SECTOID_CHRYSSALID: 10
          STR_MUTON_CHRYSSALID: 20
          STR_MUTON_SECTOPOD: 20
          STR_ETHEREAL_CHRYSSALID: 20

As you can see, this adds quite a variety of possible aliens for missions and the Mutons also include the Muton Commander mod.

I'm itching for an update Hobbes. Also love your name, it reminds me of the old comics I used to read. Shoot, I still have them too. Should get back to them someday...

Sorry, I've just been distracted with small things rather than finishing designing maps but I should be posting something shortly.

I love Calvin and Hobbes too - my nick comes from those comics :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 21, 2014, 04:59:58 pm
I think it's going to give you a lot of work updating all of the AlienMissions. I haven't integrated the Alien Remix into the Terrain Pack yet but here's an example of the possibilities on the 7th month for terror missions:

Ah, okay. Well, I still don't think they'd collide, but the ratio will probably be screwed in some way. Well, as the old Japanese saying goes, shikata ga nai - there's nothing we can do about that. :)

I love Calvin and Hobbes too - my nick comes from those comics :)

It's ingenious. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 21, 2014, 09:31:32 pm
Ah, okay. Well, I still don't think they'd collide, but the ratio will probably be screwed in some way. Well, as the old Japanese saying goes, shikata ga nai - there's nothing we can do about that. :)

It's ingenious. :)

Well, for the time being I'll keep them separate since I want to test the Alien Remix first. I've been finishing it today and it now adds 36 new possible alien deployments to the original 6. You can get mixtures Sectoids with Floaters or with Chryssalids as the terror unit, or squads composed of multiple alien types.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 21, 2014, 09:57:16 pm
Well, for the time being I'll keep them separate since I want to test the Alien Remix first. I've been finishing it today and it now adds 36 new possible alien deployments to the original 6. You can get mixtures Sectoids with Floaters or with Chryssalids as the terror unit, or squads composed of multiple alien types.

I personally would prefer to keep these new combinations rather rare, not to stray too far from the vanilla feeling - certain regularity helps, IMHO. But an occasional surprise like floaters with sectopods could be amusing, to say the least. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 21, 2014, 10:33:58 pm
I personally would prefer to keep these new combinations rather rare, not to stray too far from the vanilla feeling - certain regularity helps, IMHO. But an occasional surprise like floaters with sectopods could be amusing, to say the least. :)

Depends on the mission and the month, but it's more likely to get a combination than the vanilla aliens. I'm trying to keep the relative weight of specific species on certain months though.

One interesting bit about this is that the Hyperwave will still only reveal one of the primary races of any combined UFO crew and never the secondary race, or that it is Mixed, in the case of multi race alien crews. This can lead to unexpected surprises :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Mr. Quiet on July 21, 2014, 10:52:48 pm
Thanks for replying Hobbes. Last question, will we be able to change how rare or frequent we'll get mixed crews? At first, I'd like to be able to keep it at no chance. Then after finishing a play-through on your maps, I'll increase the chance of fighting mixed crews. I do like the idea as it will change the game a lot for the better, and as Solar said vanilla feeling is also important :-)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 21, 2014, 11:10:57 pm
Thanks for replying Hobbes. Last question, will we be able to change how rare or frequent we'll get mixed crews? At first, I'd like to be able to keep it at no chance. Then after finishing a play-through on your maps, I'll increase the chance of fighting mixed crews. I do like the idea as it will change the game a lot for the better, and as Solar said vanilla feeling is also important :-)

I'm keeping an eye on Solaris feedback regarding vanilla and quite right now that might be a good argument to keep both mods separated but recommending the Alien Remix on the Terrain Pack notes.

Trying to figure the odds of getting a mixed crew mission is difficult, because sometimes you can end up fighting only one type when some alien ranks aren't generated.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 22, 2014, 06:13:18 am
I need to call it a night... but this is the last thing I saw on OpenXCom :)

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/WJSMNKEW072120141111.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 22, 2014, 10:57:36 am
I need to call it a night... but this is the last thing I saw on OpenXCom :)

(https://media.247sports.com/Uploads/Boards/651/4651/145861.jpg)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 22, 2014, 11:11:07 am
How do you force the maps position ?

there is a street but house block ?

do you use rectangular map block ?

In this case I did some mistake reading the sorce code :-[
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 22, 2014, 11:26:08 am
not to stray too far from the vanilla feeling
I hope that this requirements, a little boring,  do not "cut the wings" of community creativity
with    pleasantness to all
:-*
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 22, 2014, 02:29:47 pm
How do you force the maps position ?

there is a street but house block ?

do you use rectangular map block ?

In this case I did some mistake reading the sorce code :-[

No violence towards map blocks or source code was performed while designing this terrain :)

I have only use the current code of Urban. The house block is one of the 'roads'.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 22, 2014, 02:56:24 pm
Do I guess ?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 22, 2014, 03:06:50 pm
Do I guess ?

Correct. You've won a cookie :)

Those 20x20s are not supposed to appear so many times though.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 22, 2014, 03:20:07 pm
It depends on terrain attribute named  "LargeBlockLimit":
the battlescape generator algorithm try to add this number of maps 20x20
after that it fills the remained map holes with 10x10 maps with type default
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 22, 2014, 03:55:16 pm
It is a point of my great interest.

In my opinion, the algorithm has to:

-it should try to add ONE(?) map with at least a dimension greater or equal to 50
(Polish map set has 8 huge maps of size 60x60, TFTD terrain "cargo/cruise line" has maps 70x30 and 50x30)

-it should try to add "SOME" maps with at least a dimension equal to 30 or 40 and the other less or equal to 40
 (all combinations from 40x40 to 30x10)
"SOME" should be drive by a new terrain attribute "largeBlockLimit30to40"
(TFTD terrain "cargo/cruise line" has maps 20x30)

-it should try to add  max "largeBlockLimit" maps with at least a dimension equal to 20 such as 20x20, 10x20, 20x10.

The attribute "frequency" of map block has to be applied to randomize their selection into their map pool.

For uniformity a will prefer to add an other terrain attribute "largeBlockLimit50orMore"

I am very interesting in any remarks ???
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 22, 2014, 04:13:40 pm
It is a point of my great interest.

In my opinion, the algorithm has to:

-it should try to add ONE map with at least a dimension equal to 50 or 60

To be honest, IMO 60x60 is the maximum Battlescape size that is still playable without fights taking forever, so 50x50 or 60x60 map blocks should be rather rare.

Quote
(Polish map set has 8 huge maps of size 60x60)

What polish map set?

Quote
-it should try to add "SOME" maps with at least a dimension equal to 30 or 40 and the other less or equal to 40
 (all combinations from 40x40 to 30x10)
"SOME" should be drive by a new terrain attribute "largeBlockLimit30to40"

-it should try to add a map with at least a dimension equal to 20 such as 20x20, 10x20, 20x10.

The attribute "frequency" of map block has to be applied to randomize their selection into the own map pool.

I am very interesting in any remarks ???

One way is:
* Place roads
* Place XCOM craft
* Place 10x10s to fill the rest of the space
* Check to see if there is a 10x20 space, if so, occupy those spaces with a 10x20 map block. Repeat until all available 10x20 or 20x10 spaces are occupied with respective 10x20 or 20x10 map blocks.
* Check to see if there is a 20x20 space (currently occupied by 10x10s or 20x10s), if so, occupy those spaces with a 20x20 map block. Repeat until all available 20x20 spaces are occupied with 20x20 map blocks.
* Check to see if there is a 30x20 space, if so, occupy those spaces with a 30x20 map block. Repeat until all available 30x20 or 20x30 spaces are occupied with 20x20 map blocks.
* Check to see if there is a 30x30 space, if so, occupy those spaces with a 30x30 map blocks.
* Etc., etc.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 22, 2014, 04:17:47 pm
What polish map set?

Ehm I want to write Polis ... :-[
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 22, 2014, 04:23:05 pm
Ehm I want to write Polis ... :-[

No polish map set? I was starting to get curious and excited... :(
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 22, 2014, 04:32:23 pm
I loose my cookie ...sigh

Here the Guru of MapMaker is You I am only a supporter :)



Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 22, 2014, 07:50:21 pm
I need only to make 3 or 4 more 20x20 maps then the terrain will be ready. Don't ask me how many map blocks Dawn City now has...

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/AVXAFLWY072220141248.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 23, 2014, 01:08:37 am
Version 1.9.4. now available (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-missions-pack).

List of changes:
- Redesigned Dawn City tilesets and added 2 terrains, DAWNURBANA and DAWNURBANB.
- Increased Terror Site battlescape size to 50x50x6.
- Reduced numbers of civilians back to vanilla.
- Reduced chance of Alien Flyby missions (previous value merely for testing).
- Added vanilla Urban to the list of possible Terror Site terrains.
- Increased penalty for Alien Raid missions from 250 to 500 points.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Recruit69 on July 23, 2014, 02:53:45 am
Wow v. good.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on July 23, 2014, 07:48:58 am
Hello,
I was using the Terrain Pack a lot lately - the Dawn City is really a bleak, rundown place, in other words, beautiful :) I can't imagine playing without these terrains anymore.

Alas- there were a couple of things that spoiled the experience somewhat...
1. The cars are built like tanks. Power 140-150 is required to damage them - a bit jarring.
2. Forget the cars - the low, striped black and white barriers are of pure neutronium. I haven't tried a Blaster on them, but they shrugged off multiple Power 150 detonations (just changed status to "scratched paint"). There are few more annoying things in games than flimsy, unassuming, indestructible fences :)
3. I can't seem to be able to walk through destroyed wire fence, and the second-stage fence remains seem to be indestructible .
4. For some reason, I can't throw explosives on top of the blue, multiple-domed roofs. Oh, and they seem to be indestructible as well :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 23, 2014, 12:02:59 pm
Hello,
I was using the Terrain Pack a lot lately - the Dawn City is really a bleak, rundown place, in other words, beautiful :) I can't imagine playing without these terrains anymore.

Alas- there were a couple of things that spoiled the experience somewhat...
1. The cars are built like tanks. Power 140-150 is required to damage them - a bit jarring.

IIRC, I reduced a little their armor on 1.9.4 but I also made the cars' engine to explode upon getting hit.

EDIT: right now they are at 50 armor, let me know if you think it should be reduced.

Quote
2. Forget the cars - the low, striped black and white barriers are of pure neutronium. I haven't tried a Blaster on them, but they shrugged off multiple Power 150 detonations (just changed status to "scratched paint"). There are few more annoying things in games than flimsy, unassuming, indestructible fences :)

That's how Port terrain was designed on TFTD - most of it simply cannot be destroyed and it forces you to get close instead of shooting at a distance. Like yourself, I always hated those black and white barriers while playing TFTD but I my rule #1 is to try to stick to the original games as possible.

Quote
3. I can't seem to be able to walk through destroyed wire fence, and the second-stage fence remains seem to be indestructible .

Just checked and both destroyed wire fences seem alright (on Area51 and Port tilesets). Could get a pic next time you ran into this issue and post it here? Thanks.

EDIT: The Dawn City fences were changed for this version. On 1.9.3 it would cost an additional 2 TUs to cross them so that might explain not being able to cross them even though you thought you had enough TUs. This was removed in 1.9.4 since I decided to make it easier for units to move.

Quote
4. For some reason, I can't throw explosives on top of the blue, multiple-domed roofs. Oh, and they seem to be indestructible as well :)

Check the MCD and it seems alright as well. I'll test this later.

Edit: Just tried a Port mission and I can't also throw anything on those blue domed roofs but I've rechecked both the original Port01.MCD and the PORTROADS.MCD I adapted for UFO and they have the same exact values. But they also have the Big_Wall property, which I strongly suspect it's the cause of not being able to throw explosives. If so, this is possibly a deliberate design decision to shield those buildings.

Thanks a lot for the comments :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on July 24, 2014, 04:16:38 am
Thanks for the answer! The Port isn't as indestructible as it seems, as I managed to ruin half of it in my heroic (and ultimately lost) fight against Nazi tanks, although everything is heavily reinforced - which is a nice change of pace imho - just these barriers and domes seemed to be able to survive everything. But if it's recreation of vanilla TFTD you're aiming at, I can't say anything :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on July 24, 2014, 12:10:15 pm
fight against Nazi tanks
Are you making a mod on 39-45 ?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on July 24, 2014, 12:19:45 pm
I though everyone already knew what mod I am making :)
But yeah, there are (fantasy) Nazis in it, and it caused quite an uproar amongst the people who find shooting Nazis offensive :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 25, 2014, 12:24:03 am
Getting back to topic, now that Dawn City has been redone, I'm considering what to do next.

I still want to add more 50x50 map blocks to the Alien Raid missions but I'm also thinking about the Alien and XCOM bases. With the Alien Base there are already a few interesting ideas made by Luke and civilian and I'm considering adding or expanding either of their mods.

With the XCOM base it might also be an interesting challenge to adapt the Area51 tilesets and it is also possible to add a further Terror Site terrain based on Area51 but since there are already 6 different terror terrains, it would be better to focus elsewhere.

What about you guys? Any suggestions?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: moriarty on July 25, 2014, 12:32:28 am
I'd like to see a "warzone" or "ruined city" map... perhaps with higher structures that are open at the sides? I liked xcom2012's demolition site map - a 3d battlefield with not too much cover, where death will come from above as often as from the same level...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 25, 2014, 12:46:34 am
I know it's not very exciting, and I might come off as a weirdo, but I would like to see more forest maps. :)

No, really. I feel forest is really repetitive. I wanted to do it myself, but I never had the time. I only did this for fun:

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/ForestHut.jpg)

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/ForestHut2.jpg)

Yeah, I know it's a poor job. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on July 25, 2014, 11:13:21 am
Hobbes I'm going to auto-shoot you with questions. 999% accuracy.

Could you describe a bit your work process?
Let's say you have to make a new tileset, how do you proceed (like: you copy-paste the most similar tileset and rename it and start working on it)?

Also I saw you made "ufo-like" maps for special missions: do you know a way to do these quickly? I mean: I can copy-paste map blocks to build the layout quickly, but then I would still have to place routes/spawns by hand (and for a 50x50 thing).. or I am missing something?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 25, 2014, 02:57:55 pm
What about you guys? Any suggestions?

I am interesting to your terrain "Railyard" because it is different by others.

I wish a pre-stage mission ALIEN_BASE_LANDING.
For that some unused exists maps/terrains could be recycled,
I think to  Hobbes's "Siberia", ufo2k "Sand Storm".

And/Or standard earth terrains could be integrate with some new map of alien structure such as Luke's "Pyramid"
other than the lift to access the next mission stage of internal alien base.

I read a post about a big map named "The Maze", probably of ufo2k community,  but I do not found any maps.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on July 25, 2014, 03:04:47 pm
There was a modular map for the Cultist Mod which could only be described as a maze from hell :)
It also contained a nice alternate farm - suburbia (all made from vanilla tilesets).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 25, 2014, 03:13:53 pm
Hobbes I'm going to auto-shoot you with questions. 999% accuracy.

Could you describe a bit your work process?
Let's say you have to make a new tileset, how do you proceed (like: you copy-paste the most similar tileset and rename it and start working on it)?

0) Determine number of maps required and check number of MCD entries
1) Choose/design images/theme for the PCK file
2) Pick one of the existing PCK and start replacing the images
3) After I have enough images to start, I edit the MCD file to fix the tile type (objects, walls, etc.) settings of the new tiles for MapView to properly display them by type.
4) Build/edit the map(s)
5) Add/edit images to the PCK file as required. Back to 4) as required
6) Edit the tiles characteristics (armor, LOFT, etc.) on the MCD file
7) Create the .RMP files for alien spawning and patrol routes
8) Create the ruleset file and playtest the map. Go back to 4-7 as required.

Quote
Also I saw you made "ufo-like" maps for special missions: do you know a way to do these quickly? I mean: I can copy-paste map blocks to build the layout quickly, but then I would still have to place routes/spawns by hand (and for a 50x50 thing).. or I am missing something?

The Fill and Autoconnect options can help a lot with tile and route placing but this is something that simply takes time. Another shortcut that helps is that right clicking on a square on MapView places the selected tile on the highlighted type location (walls, etc.). But yeah the single Area51 map is 50x50 and has over 130 nodes and that's why I haven't released anymore of them yet since they take time.

I am interesting to your terrain "Railyard" because it is different by others.

Railyard only needs the .RMP files but I haven't given it much attention since graphically it is very close to both Port and Industrial. But I can finish it later.

Quote
I wish a pre-stage mission ALIEN_BASE_LANDING.
For that some unused exists maps/terrains could be recycled,
I think to  Hobbes's "Siberia", ufo2k "Sand Storm".

And/Or standard earth terrains could be integrate with some new map of alien structure such as Luke's "Pyramid"
other than the lift to access the next mission stage of internal alien base.

I read a post about a big map named "The Maze", probably of ufo2k community,  but I do not found any maps.

Can you point me towards that post? I don't remember what that map is.

My issue with the pre-stage mission ALIEN_BASE_LANDING is that it's repeating one of TFTD's mistakes, which is adding a lot of 2 part missions will cause the missions to take longer to finish and become a chore.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 25, 2014, 03:19:50 pm
Railyard only needs the .RMP files but I haven't given it much attention since graphically it is very close to both Port and Industrial. But I can finish it later.

I can do the RMPs for you if you want, I've done a crapload of them already. For this or any other map. :) It is  time-consuming, yes, but it's not unpleasant work.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 25, 2014, 03:46:10 pm
I can do the RMPs for you if you want, I've done a crapload of them already. For this or any other map. :) It is  time-consuming, yes, but it's not unpleasant work.

Appreciated, I've attached the relevant files.
The tilesets used and their sequence are: PORTROADS, PORTURBITS, ROADS, URBITS; FRNITURE
Ignore the RAILYARDINDUSTRIAL10.MAP since it is a 30x30 but it isn't possible to make it work for terror sites.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 25, 2014, 04:07:34 pm
Appreciated, I've attached the relevant files.
The tilesets used and their sequence are: PORTROADS, PORTURBITS, ROADS, URBITS; FRNITURE
Ignore the RAILYARDINDUSTRIAL10.MAP since it is a 30x30 but it isn't possible to make it work for terror sites.

OK, I'll do it ASAP and attach the maps one by one as they are ready.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 25, 2014, 04:33:03 pm

Can you point me towards that post? I don't remember what that map is.


From this picture ...

I am searching the original link ...
HERE : https://www.xcomufo.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3294&page=2 (https://www.xcomufo.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3294&page=2)

I found this concept farm terrain extension too

https://www.xcomufo.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=242034915 (https://www.xcomufo.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=242034915)
(https://www.xcomufo.com/forums/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=10738)
(https://www.xcomufo.com/forums/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=10745)
(https://www.xcomufo.com/forums/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=10748)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 25, 2014, 04:37:41 pm
From this picture ...

I am searching the original link ...

The first picture of the 'prison' building is a map that was used for Modified City (one of the first UFO2000 terrains that got discarded afterwards). The rest are map blocks from the Warehouse terrain but the way the map is designed it doesn't allow for XCOM craft landing areas.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 26, 2014, 10:55:32 am
Ignore the RAILYARDINDUSTRIAL10.MAP since it is a 30x30 but it isn't possible to make it work for terror sites.

I am working about it,
I submit a proposal on this post
https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2628.msg27906#msg27906 (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2628.msg27906#msg27906)

I am waiting some feedback/review from Commanders before release on GITHUB to avoid (or at  least minimize) the risk of a reject

I hope that  them  read mine proposal.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 26, 2014, 01:46:07 pm
Hobbes,

Since there's no option to attach files to PMs, and I don't have your contact details, here's the first five map routes.

They do not contain spawning yet, I want to do it at the end, but for now you can just have a look if you want. And I'll have a backup :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 26, 2014, 02:14:07 pm
I have enable debug info on config to begin test on firt modification on generate terrains

What are the commands available ?
 ???

I wish see coodinate and full maps without fog at list

There are other tip & trics ?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 26, 2014, 02:55:21 pm
Hobbes,

Since there's no option to attach files to PMs, and I don't have your contact details, here's the first five map routes.

They do not contain spawning yet, I want to do it at the end, but for now you can just have a look if you want. And I'll have a backup :)

Thanks, I just had a look and they look good in general but I usually don't use so many nodes.

The thing to keep in mind is that the route nodes are used for 2 proposes: unit spawning and patrol routes. Each alien unit controlled by the AI can have several modes: patrol, engage, flee, take cover, etc. Patrol is used when there are no XCOM units detected by the unit and the nodes connections with one another define the routes following during the patrols. But when the AI engages in combat the routes are not used anymore, so at the beginning the routes followed by the aliens are very important but once you start engaging the aliens they are used less and less.

The AI is also fairly competent in finding a path to move an alien from node A to B even if they are 10 squares away, so it doesn't need a lot of nodes, as long as they are properly connected. But the most important is to consider the position of the alien unit when it reaches a certain node: which direction will it be facing and what areas can it see. And if it reaches that position and finds an enemy unit it will switch to engage mode, where the routes will not be used anymore.

I have enable debug info on config to begin test on firt modification on generate terrains

What are the commands available ?
 ???

I wish see coodinate and full maps without fog at list

There are other tip & trics ?

CTRL + D reveals the entire map and shows the aliens turn. That's the only command I know and use with debug.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 26, 2014, 03:42:38 pm
Thanks Hobbes. Yeah, I know how it works (more or less), but I prefer to have excessive nodes than too few. I think it makes the AI more unpredictable, and I don't think there's any harm in this. Tough of course it's much work. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 26, 2014, 04:46:28 pm
Thanks Hobbes. Yeah, I know how it works (more or less), but I prefer to have excessive nodes than too few. I think it makes the AI more unpredictable, and I don't think there's any harm in this. Tough of course it's much work. :)

The main thing that can happen is that an alien will spend most time moving inside a 10x10 mapblock rather than going to adjacent map blocks. This behavior can actually be desirable but there's an easy way to achieve this, which is the Flag field: the higher the number the most likely the alien is to choose going to that node when patrolling.

Also, the reason why the route system was designed without the need for so many nodes also has to do with the limitations of the original game. The game engine could only load 256 route nodes, and if you consider a 50x50 battlescape, then on average each 10x10 map block can have up to 5 nodes.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 26, 2014, 04:58:55 pm
The main thing that can happen is that an alien will spend most time moving inside a 10x10 mapblock rather than going to adjacent map blocks. This behavior can actually be desirable but there's an easy way to achieve this, which is the Flag field: the higher the number the most likely the alien is to choose going to that node when patrolling.

All right, I'll keep this in mind. I'll need to rethink the philosophy of this map though.

BTW it has way more nodes than what I usually create, since it's so complex.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: niculinux on July 26, 2014, 11:01:49 pm
just trying the 1.9.5 version along piratez 0.78, and when the game trigger a terror misison (mutant progrom 2 in my case) the game crashes and quits to desktop!!!  :'(

I'm on ubuntu 14.04 (on my work laptop :D ) and it showed the desktop and  the terminal (i started the game via terminal)

Code: [Select]
MAP/URBAN12.MAP
in 640x480 resolution! (i use that mode because i'm average shortsoghtened) loggin out and in adn i'm on the resolution i choose in ubuntu (1366x768)

maybe missing files or compatilbility problems? Thanks
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 27, 2014, 01:51:32 am
Code: [Select]
MAP/URBAN12.MAP

There isn't any map with that name on the latest versions of the Terrain Pack. The path seems also wrong, since the name of the subfolder is /MAPS
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on July 27, 2014, 11:16:13 am
Piratez is more or less its own game at this point with a lot of unique resources, so there's no guarantee that any mod for Openxcom is going to work well with it. Even some of the in game options can have a negative effect on Piratez.

This is untrue; only mods that modify vanilla assets will cause problems. Mods that add extra stuff are fine. I'm playtesting the mod with Hobbes' terrain pack enabled (just with new missions disabled; any editing of Mission Weights seems to disable all missions that aren't hard coded), and there was never any trouble.

EDIT: I have no such map as URBAN12 either.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: niculinux on July 27, 2014, 12:21:56 pm
Sry i was not able to to take a screenshot, so can't remember exactly tat error  :'(
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 27, 2014, 03:24:35 pm
Sry i was not able to to take a screenshot, so can't remember exactly tat error  :'(

I think i got it. The error message you got concerned one of the MADURBAN maps since I checked the files on version 1.9.5 and there are a few MADURBAN files that have the .map in lowercase. Sorry about that, I got no idea how but the extensions of several files got renamed into lowercase.

I've uploaded 1.9.6 with the filenames fixed.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: the_third_curry on July 27, 2014, 04:09:06 pm
This is untrue; only mods that modify vanilla assets will cause problems. Mods that add extra stuff are fine. I'm playtesting the mod with Hobbes' terrain pack enabled (just with new missions disabled; any editing of Mission Weights seems to disable all missions that aren't hard coded), and there was never any trouble.

EDIT: I have no such map as URBAN12 either.

Sorry, comment removed.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: niculinux on July 27, 2014, 05:00:18 pm
I've uploaded 1.9.6 with the filenames fixed.

thanks Hobbes you're (one fo mine) heroes around here!!! :-* :-*

Edit: mod portal link is updated, not so the first post ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on July 29, 2014, 12:44:36 am
I am integrating your update, thanks for it  :)

Did you know Civilian had proposed some addon for alien base too ?
https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2082.msg20310#msg20310

I merged both your resources but I did not yet really tested it, do you think there could be some incompatibility ?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 29, 2014, 01:14:20 am
I am integrating your update, thanks for it  :)

Did you know Civilian had proposed some addon for alien base too ?
https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2082.msg20310#msg20310

I had only seen the Tiny Alien Base (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2091.0) add on. I'll have a look at that one, thanks.

I'm currently more inclined into first designing a new terrain, both based on the Tiny Alien Base and using some of Hive terrain's tiles. But I'd like also to add an expansion to the vanilla Alien Base terrain using Luke's maps so I guess some of civilian's maps could also be included.

Quote
I merged both your resources but I did not yet really tested it, do you think there could be some incompatibility ?

If you mean the Terrain Pack and the Alien Remix they are completely compatible and I'm currently thinking of including the Alien Remix ruleset file in the Terrain Pack since they go quite well together (I always play with both).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on July 29, 2014, 02:36:54 am
I had only seen the Tiny Alien Base (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2091.0) add on. I'll have a look at that one, thanks.
The Alien Base Cave, yes, I integrated it too

I'm currently more inclined into first designing a new terrain, both based on the Tiny Alien Base and using some of Hive terrain's tiles. But I'd like also to add an expansion to the vanilla Alien Base terrain using Luke's maps so I guess some of civilian's maps could also be included.
Go on, dude, we are waiting for this !

If you mean the Terrain Pack and the Alien Remix they are completely compatible and I'm currently thinking of including the Alien Remix ruleset file in the Terrain Pack since they go quite well together (I always play with both).
(I meant Terrain Pack + Civilian Add on, but I will test it)
It's your mods, but...
If I could tell you my meaning, please think about it a while, as Alien Remix is/could be/could become subjective ; idea is interesting so I integrated it too, but I want to test it, and perhaps modify to make it very rare, I don't know yet
On the other hand, your Terrain Pack, from my point of view, is like Luke's Ufos* : both greatest mods that really bring new stuff without changing vanilla atmosphere ; I am quite sure anyone activate both these mods, as we could call them "vanilla mods"
It's just a point of view...  :P
And I can also understand that maintaining them separately could be arduous, so it's up to you...


EDIT : I made some tests. Beware that I integrated your mod so it may be that I did something wrong (as defining a 50X100 terror mission map  :P also x6 as you propose)

I made 5 tests with each terrain type (activated one by one)
Following work fine :
      - MADURBAN
      - PORTURBAN
      - INDUSTRIALURBAN
      - URBAN
      - URBAN_NEW (Civilian)

I met some issues with :
      - DAWNURBANA (screen shots 1 and 2)
      - DAWNURBANB (screen shots 3 and 4)
a) Some black mapblocks (screen shots 1 to 3)
b) Sometimes, civil units are grouped (screen shot 4)
Regarding a), I guessed it was linked to number of aliens, but I did not meet any of these both issues with other terrain types

EDIT : I forgot to mention the third one, Robin and its fantastic vanilla alien races addon
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Mr. Quiet on July 29, 2014, 05:51:08 am
Please please Modified Farm please Hobbes! Basicly needing more maps for crash-sites. Hobbes you're one of the best here, help us since nobody else is doing it yet!

About the Alien Remix mod, I really like it and it changes the game a lot. Could you make it a separate .rul file to make this change optional any time during our play-throughs? I'd like to be able to enable and disable it as I'm playing long games. In my mind, this change in the Alien's strategy would fit perfectly after you've been exposed to every alien and have crossed them multiple times. Thanks mate :)

Also would your Alien Remix mod be compatible with other alien race mods, and if your mod also automatically mixes up the modded aliens with the native aliens?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 29, 2014, 06:56:49 am
EDIT : I made some tests. Beware that I integrated your mod so it may be that I did something wrong (as defining a 50X100 terror mission map  :P also x6 as you propose)

The black map blocks are related with the 50x100 dimensions. I also wouldn't recommend the 60x60 dimensions (I went back to 50x50 a few builds ago) because the 10x10 map blocks can only appear twice per battlescape and the black areas are because there aren't anymore map blocks to place. You can manually edit this in the maxCount line for each map block on the ruleset.

The last screenshot is weird - did you change the number of the aliens?

Please please Modified Farm please Hobbes! Basicly needing more maps for crash-sites. Hobbes you're one of the best here, help us since nobody else is doing it yet!

About the Alien Remix mod, I really like it and it changes the game a lot. Could you make it a separate .rul file to make this change optional any time during our play-throughs? I'd like to be able to enable and disable it as I'm playing long games. In my mind, this change in the Alien's strategy would fit perfectly after you've been exposed to every alien and have crossed them multiple times. Thanks mate :)

Also would your Alien Remix mod be compatible with other alien race mods, and if your mod also automatically mixes up the modded aliens with the native aliens?

Mod Farm for later, now I've already started on the Alien Base :)

The Alien Remix mod will always have a separate ruleset from the Terrain Pack, because people might prefer to stick to the single races.

The Alien Remix should be compatible with mods that add other races, as long as they don't change the raceWeights of the vanilla alien missions. And the mixed crews don't add automatically any new modded race.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: the_third_curry on July 29, 2014, 07:02:19 am
Please please Modified Farm please Hobbes! Basicly needing more maps for crash-sites.

Civilian made some new tiles for city, farm, and alien base terrians a while back if you're interested: https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2082.0
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on July 29, 2014, 11:48:37 am
The black map blocks are related with the 50x100 dimensions. I also wouldn't recommend the 60x60 dimensions (I went back to 50x50 a few builds ago) because the 10x10 map blocks can only appear twice per battlescape and the black areas are because there aren't anymore map blocks to place. You can manually edit this in the maxCount line for each map block on the ruleset.
Nice, I will try it !

The last screenshot is weird - did you change the number of the aliens?
For sure, but you are right as I made an error in Terror mission (a 8 became 28 comparing to Terror ship...)
But the number of civils is 30 compared to vanilla (16 I mean)

I will correct both and report

Thanks for answers


EDIT : This works like a charm !
Also :
- no more issue with black mapblocks
- no more issue with grouped civilians
- a good surprise : the number of civilian units is varying depending on used terrain and I guess mapblocks or number of aliens (from 16 to 30 : I saw at least 16, 19, 20, 23, 29, 30 while abandoning mission)

Buildings are very impressive

Thanks for the mod  :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 29, 2014, 12:57:54 pm
Hobbes, I think I've finished placing nodes and connections. All that's left to do is doing the flags, ranks and spawns. I may go back to the first maps and make them better, but that's if I feel it's necessary.

Still, some routes appear weird, like they were corrupted or something. Take a look at the map 21, for example: node 6 at level 0 has a weird line going off towards the east, although it should be a connection to node 7 at level 1. Can you tell me what it is?

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/map21routes.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 29, 2014, 03:04:16 pm
Still, some routes appear weird, like they were corrupted or something. Take a look at the map 21, for example: node 6 at level 0 has a weird line going off towards the east, although it should be a connection to node 7 at level 1. Can you tell me what it is?

Usually that's simply an graphic error made by MapView that has no impact in the game. To clear it, try saving the map, switch to a different one and then back to the first map.

I'm curious to see the maps :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 29, 2014, 03:31:20 pm
Usually that's simply an graphic error made by MapView that has no impact in the game. To clear it, try saving the map, switch to a different one and then back to the first map.

Well, the thing is, it doesn't go away. But I also think it won't have an impact on the game, so I'm leaving it as it is now.
BTW it seems to be caused by removal of nodes.

I'm curious to see the maps :)

OK, I'll attach them here. They're not set in stone yet, I may still change a thing or two when doing flags/ranks/spawn points, but they're more or less done. (Except map 10, which I omitted as you said.)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on July 29, 2014, 03:43:52 pm
If you have time to do it too
I will use it for test mine map generation upgrade

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 29, 2014, 04:23:15 pm
Well, the thing is, it doesn't go away. But I also think it won't have an impact on the game, so I'm leaving it as it is now.
BTW it seems to be caused by removal of nodes.

OK, I'll attach them here. They're not set in stone yet, I may still change a thing or two when doing flags/ranks/spawn points, but they're more or less done. (Except map 10, which I omitted as you said.)

Looking good. I'm curious to see how all of those Flying nodes will work out.

Something I noticed: I need to redesign the maps RAILYARDINDUSTRIAL03-07 to be similar to RAILYARDINDUSTRIAL02. I started doing it but I got distracted with other things. But I'll do that later and readjust the spawn points.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 29, 2014, 05:27:49 pm
Looking good. I'm curious to see how all of those Flying nodes will work out.

Me too. :) I spent way more time on them than the ground nodes, so hopefully it'll be worth it.

Something I noticed: I need to redesign the maps RAILYARDINDUSTRIAL03-07 to be similar to RAILYARDINDUSTRIAL02. I started doing it but I got distracted with other things. But I'll do that later and readjust the spawn points.

Sure, if you send me new versions, I'll have a look at them.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 29, 2014, 05:35:21 pm
Sure, if you send me new versions, I'll have a look at them.

I haven't worked anymore on them but they should be quick to finish - whenever you're ready with the routes just send them to me and I'll complete the terrain so that we can playtest it before it's released.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 30, 2014, 05:31:26 pm
Meanwhile I've been doing some testing to see how the missions can be expanded with additional terrains. There are essentially two types of missions: the UFO missions that depend on the location on globe to determine the terrain, namely Farm, Polar, Mountain, Desert, Forest and Jungle; and the missions that don't depend on the location, namely Terror Sites, Alien & XCom Base and Cydonia.

The most important difference is that the terrains of the UFO missions cannot be chosen randomly while the others can. Which brings  3 options:
- Keep the original terrain
- Expand it with additional maps
- Replace it with something new

I'd really like to keep all 3 options, since this is what I've done with the Terror Site, where you can play the original Urban terrain, or an expanded version (Mad City) or several other new terrains (Dawn City, etc.).

So, I'm currently looking to something else:
(https://www.ufopaedia.org/images/2/2e/TEXTURE.gif)

These are the 13 textures used in Geoscape to represent the different types of terrains that will be encountered on UFO missions (the textures on the 2nd and 3rd lines are used for zoom in). Farm is 1 - 4, Polar is 9 and 12, Forest/Jungle are 0, 6, 10, 11, Desert is 7 and 8, Mountain is 5. According to the UFOpaedia, texture 11 is not actually used in the game, so there are 12 playable textures.

Here's a map of the textures:

(https://www.ufopaedia.org/images/thumb/d/d3/Xcom_render2.gif/800px-Xcom_render2.gif)

Since each texture is assigned a terrain and it can have different terrains for northern/southern hemisphere, this means that it is possible to use 12 terrains on UFO missions, or 24 if they are further subdivided into hemispheres. Which means that it would be possible to consider something like this:

This means essentially that it should be possible to add 7 new mod terrains, without considering hemisphere distinctions. This could be expanded for 20 new terrains if there are northern/southern versions, but I think that the return won't match the investment of making 13 more new terrains, since some textures are only used in a few locations (texture #6 is only used in Siberia and the Gulf of Guinea for instance).

Now, the good news in all of this is that it isn't required to design new sprites for tilesets since I think that by combining the original tilesets it would be possible to add a different look and feel to these 7 new terrains. And they also don't really require more map blocks than the original terrains. The bad news is that it is needed to design 7 new terrains.

So, what I'd like to ask is if anyone is willing to contribute by designing one or more new terrains listed above. It can be made through a combination of different tilesets (for instance taking the hills and canyons of the original Mountain terrain but setting them on a Desert enviroment) or simply designing a new set of map blocks.

Any takers?[/list]
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Falko on July 30, 2014, 05:39:19 pm
as a first step one can take a look here
Code: [Select]
terrains:
  - name: CULTA
    textures: [1, 2, 3, 4]
..
  - name: DESERT
..
    textures: [7, 8]
you can make terrain sets and say this texture [1,2] is CULTA (vanilla) this [3,4] is CULTA_EXTENDED or some such
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 30, 2014, 05:55:14 pm
as a first step one can take a look here
Code: [Select]
terrains:
  - name: CULTA
    textures: [1, 2, 3, 4]
..
  - name: DESERT
..
    textures: [7, 8]
you can make terrain sets and say this texture [1,2] is CULTA (vanilla) this [3,4] is CULTA_EXTENDED or some such

This is exactly what I mean above. Texture 1 is Original Farm, 2 is Expanded Farm, etc.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on July 30, 2014, 06:28:01 pm
I'm going to do some tiles/terrains/maps in the future. The theme will be retro-futuristic but you're free to rip everything you find suitable.


About globe textures and terrains: in the MiB Mod I hijacked a "farm texture" to use a urban terrain, so if you need a reference it's in there.

I'd also like to see a "rationalization" of the globe textures: right now the "mountain texture" is too rare and "farm texture" is too ubiquitous for example; I don't even know if this is doable though, and I understand that this might be out of the scope of this mod.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 30, 2014, 06:39:10 pm
I'm going to do some tiles/terrains/maps in the future. The theme will be retro-futuristic but you're free to rip everything you find suitable.there.

Thanks. I'll get them a look when you finished them.

I'd also like to see a "rationalization" of the globe textures: right now the "mountain texture" is too rare and "farm texture" is too ubiquitous for example; I don't even know if this is doable though, and I understand that this might be out of the scope of this mod.

This proposal solves partially those issues: instead of 4 possible textures for Farm terrain there is only 1, and by applying the  Forest/Desert/Polar tilesets to Mountain's blocks (or the other way around, applying the Mountain tileset.

However to completely balance the several terrains it would be required to change the Geoscape itself.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 31, 2014, 12:30:04 pm
Hobbes, regarding nodes: Rank determines what alien gets spawned, Flag determines attraction, but what does Spawn do? Does it determine preference for aliens to be spawned on this node?

EDIT: I think I have all the route files ready. Attaching here, please have a look at them.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 31, 2014, 07:34:33 pm
Hobbes, regarding nodes: Rank determines what alien gets spawned, Flag determines attraction, but what does Spawn do? Does it determine preference for aliens to be spawned on this node?

EDIT: I think I have all the route files ready. Attaching here, please have a look at them.

:)

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/NQOFAWLO073120141225.png)

I had a look at the ROUTES files and I fixed a few things. Basically you all the spawn points were set to Civ/Scout so I set a few of those for Soldier. The other issue was that some spawn points inside buildings had their type set for All, which would mean that large terrorists could spawn inside and get trapped.

One very important issue related to this is that when you place a spawn point defined to all, the node is considered to be the top sprite on the alien, so it needs to have the two squares immediately below and an additional square underneath those two to be clear. This is important because some nodes were placed on the bottom left/right edges of map blocks, which could mean that, if the map block was in one of the bottom left/right edges of the battlescape, a large alien could be generated but half of it wouldn't be present on the battlescape, which could create all sorts of problems.

In any case, overall the routes looked fine, I didn't manage to check all of them but that's what playtesting is for! :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on July 31, 2014, 07:53:01 pm
Is that randomly generated or fixed?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 31, 2014, 07:55:53 pm
Is that randomly generated or fixed?

It is currently defined on the ruleset as terror site terrain so it uses the road generation definitions.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on July 31, 2014, 08:01:09 pm
Warning, aliens are attacking gold mines !

The human society was not prepared for this !!

Look at this reaper, it hides something in its pockets  8)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 31, 2014, 09:40:39 pm
I had a look at the ROUTES files and I fixed a few things. Basically you all the spawn points were set to Civ/Scout so I set a few of those for Soldier.

Ah, OK. I saw there were no Soldier type nodes on some terrains, like the Farm, so I decided it wasn't really necessary... But on the other hand, Urban Terror has them. I don't know which one of these two would be closer to the Railyard. :)

The other issue was that some spawn points inside buildings had their type set for All, which would mean that large terrorists could spawn inside and get trapped.

Possibly; although I tried avoiding this, I didn't do a proper quality control. The maps were really in a beta state. :)

One very important issue related to this is that when you place a spawn point defined to all, the node is considered to be the top sprite on the alien, so it needs to have the two squares immediately below and an additional square underneath those two to be clear. This is important because some nodes were placed on the bottom left/right edges of map blocks, which could mean that, if the map block was in one of the bottom left/right edges of the battlescape, a large alien could be generated but half of it wouldn't be present on the battlescape, which could create all sorts of problems.

Aaaah, so that's how it works! I was wondering about that. BTW where do you get this info from? That's some extremely obscure and precious data! :)

In any case, overall the routes looked fine, I didn't manage to check all of them but that's what playtesting is for! :)

I've attached 1.9.7 below for us to test before I add it to the Mod Portal.

Well, I'm getting to it then! :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 31, 2014, 10:45:40 pm
Aaaah, so that's how it works! I was wondering about that. BTW where do you get this info from? That's some extremely obscure and precious data! :)

Observation, Trial and Error. A lot of the last one :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on July 31, 2014, 11:23:13 pm
Well, I'm getting to it then! :D

Great :)

Meanwhile I'm working on the new Farm, Polar and Desert terrains to see if I can finish and include a few of them for 1.9.7 as well.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 01, 2014, 02:53:58 am
OK, I finished Expanded Farm terrain and for 1.9.7 I am going to completely reorganize the Farm textures and assign the terror site terrains to replace some of the textures.

Which means that UFOs are going to start landing on cities, railyards, ports, etc. ;)

Stay tuned.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 01, 2014, 02:56:13 am
OK, I finished Expanded Farm terrain and for 1.9.7 I am going to completely reorganize the Farm textures and assign the terror site terrains to replace some of the textures.

Which means that UFOs are going to start landing on cities, railyards, ports, etc. ;)

Stay tuned.
Also terror missions without civilians, but with a ufo landed ?  :o
Like an after terror mission, hum
Do you have the possibility to place some corpses on the ground ?

Will you keep some terrains exclusively for terror missions, so that they remain very special missions ?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 01, 2014, 03:29:56 am
Do you have the possibility to place some corpses on the ground ?

Yeah, it's possible, but only with the nightly builds - 1.0 as such does not allow placing items on the ground.

But for the nightlies you can do this:

Code: [Select]
      - name: UBASE_03
        width: 20
        length: 20
        items:
          STR_ELERIUM_115:
            - [2, 14, 1]

(Taken from vanilla.)

The numbers in brackets are tile coordinates.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 01, 2014, 03:54:18 am
Do you have the possibility to place some corpses on the ground ?

I thought about that as well and yes, it is possible.

Quote
Will you keep some terrains exclusively for terror missions, so that they remain very special missions ?

Yes but I've changed my mind a bit after looking at how the textures are spread across the globe. The issue is really trying to match the terrain to the geoscape and it would be required to redo the whole globe for some terrains to really fit, like Port. 

Also, some terrains are really too built up and having to clear them before assaulting the UFO can turn the whole missions into a chore.

I'm about to test if everything is working but the general idea is this:
* Expanded Farm A is assigned texture #2, northern hemisphere. It is composed of Farm + 22 new map blocks.
* Mad City goes to texture #2, southern hemisphere. The only area where it will be generated is Eastern Australia. Mad City is also kept as a terror site terrain. 
* Expanded Farm B is assigned texture #3, both hemispheres. It only contains the 22 new Farm map blocks.
* Industrial is assigned texture #1, both hemispheres. This is the smallest texture per total Geoscape area and the locations more or less match industrialized areas like Chicago, England or the Ukraine. Industrial is also kept as a terror site terrain.
* Farm is assigned texture #4, northern hemisphere.
* Native is assigned texture #4, southern hemisphere.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 01, 2014, 04:33:44 am
I'm about to test if everything is working but the general idea is this:
* Expanded Farm A is assigned texture #2, northern hemisphere. It is composed of Farm + 22 new map blocks.
* Mad City goes to texture #2, southern hemisphere. The only area where it will be generated is Eastern Australia. Mad City is also kept as a terror site terrain. 
* Expanded Farm B is assigned texture #3, both hemispheres. It only contains the 22 new Farm map blocks.
* Industrial is assigned texture #1, both hemispheres. This is the smallest texture per total Geoscape area and the locations more or less match industrialized areas like Chicago, England or the Ukraine. Industrial is also kept as a terror site terrain.
* Farm is assigned texture #4, northern hemisphere.
* Native is assigned texture #4, southern hemisphere.
That sounds nice
Glad to see at least two of them reserved for terror  ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 01, 2014, 04:42:01 am
That sounds nice
Glad to see at least two of them reserved for terror  ;)

Several of them reserved for terror actually: vanilla Urban, Railyard, Dawn City A and B and Port. :)

Solaris, have you changed anything? Otherwise I'm uploading 1.9.7 tonight.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: the_third_curry on August 01, 2014, 06:14:10 am
Is there any chance of a swamp terrain type, as in a place with a mixture of thick vegetation (like the jungle map) and water?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 01, 2014, 06:46:48 am
Is there any chance of a swamp terrain type, as in a place with a mixture of thick vegetation (like the jungle map) and water?

It depends.  Can you design water tiles to fit with the existing jungle terrain?

I'm gonna wait before releasing the next version. I might be able to complete tomorrow both the new Polar and Desert terrains.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 01, 2014, 11:33:10 am
I'm testing the Railyard, nothing really bad for now. Even if I propose changes, they don't have to be in the first release.

Regarding non-polar water tiles, it's a very exciting idea that has been stuck in my head for months. I mean shallow water that you can cross on foot, with maybe double TU cost (higher than wheat). I'm thinking about pools, but also small rivers that would use road generation procedure, so technically they would be roads.
Deep, impassable bodies of water would also be cool, especially when combined with the passable ones.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 01, 2014, 10:57:36 pm
I'm testing the Railyard, nothing really bad for now. Even if I propose changes, they don't have to be in the first release.

OK, I've released it meanwhile. Version 1.9.7 is now available at the Mod portal (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-missions-pack).

It adds 3 new terrains: Railyard (pic already on the previous page), Expanded Farm and Polar Mountain.

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/thumb_QYFNLGMP080120140352.png)
(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/thumb_BYNOKGHP080120140352.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 02, 2014, 12:09:40 am
Good job Hobbes
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on August 02, 2014, 12:10:44 am
Beautifull !!!! :P

Thank you very much! :-*

Thanks to Solarius too
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 02, 2014, 12:50:55 am
Awesome, I'll download and integrate it ASAP.

I'm the meantime, I think I've got an extremely unfortunate group of tourists here. :)

(turn 1)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 02, 2014, 12:58:42 am
I'm the meantime, I think I've got an extremely unfortunate group of tourists here. :)

"Smile for the grenade... I mean photo" ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 02, 2014, 01:00:00 am
Hobbes,
In 1.9.6, there were 181 elements both under Maps and Routes
In 1.9.7, there are :
- 245 elements under Maps
- 244 elements under Routes

Is it possible the RAILYARDURBAN10.RMP file is missing ?

To Solars, be aware while integrating that
Code: [Select]
# TerrainPack
  - name: CULTA
    textures: [4]
will bump with
# MIB
Code: [Select]
  - name: CULTA
    textures: [1, 2, 4]

(I'll trust Hobbes an keep Terrain/Mission Pack version)


EDIT :
I forgot that I integrated Civilian Terrain Addon (two lines after... :o) that is defining CULTA terrain as below
Code: [Select]
  - name: CULTA
    mapDataSets:
      - BLANKS
      - CULTIVAT
      - BARN
    textures: [1, 2, 3, 4]
and uses some CULT_NEWxx
Code: [Select]
    mapBlocks:
      ...
      - name: CULT_NEW00
        width: 10
        length: 10
        type: 1
        subType: 0
        maxCount: 3
      - name: CULT_NEW01
        width: 10
        length: 10
        maxCount: 3
      ...

What could be the impact of changing texture from [1, 2, 3, 4] to [4] from your point of view ? Incompatibility issue ?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Falko on August 02, 2014, 01:29:34 am
what happens if you have two terrains competing for the same texture?
crash or first  mod/entry or last mod/entry or random choice ?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 02, 2014, 02:13:22 am
Hobbes,
In 1.9.6, there were 181 elements both under Maps and Routes
In 1.9.7, there are :
- 245 elements under Maps
- 244 elements under Routes

Is it possible the RAILYARDURBAN10.RMP file is missing ?

I included the RAILYARDURBAN10.MAP without noticing. But it isn't needed (or even listed on the ruleset).

Quote
What could be the impact of changing texture from [1, 2, 3, 4] to [4] from your point of view ? Incompatibility issue ?
what happens if you have two terrains competing for the same texture?
crash or first  mod/entry or last mod/entry or random choice ?

The settings of the last mod loaded prevail. IIRC that means the mod last on the list.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 02, 2014, 02:47:32 am
I bumped to an error message while making tests of terror missions under battle generator

Is it one of yours ?

My guess is that it was DAWNURBAN15.MAP, but part of it was deleted in the ruleset.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 02, 2014, 02:53:23 am
No this name was belonging to civilian, I fixed it
Thanks for the track anyway

EDIT : forgot to mention my last tests are ok, all seems to work nicely
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 02, 2014, 07:32:21 pm
Well, after the last update I've just realized that the goal of adding new terrains to all of the Geoscape textures is going to be finished quicker than I thought. Here's the situation so far regarding the texture, with bold for completed terrains:

#0 - Original Forest (Northern hemisphere) / Jungle  (southern hemisphere)
#1 - Industrial (N/S hemispheres)
#2 - Expanded Farm A (N) / Mad City (S)
#3 - Expanded Farm B (N/S)
#4 - Original Farm (N) / Native (S)
#5 - Original Mountain (N/S)
#6 - Forest Mountain (N/S)
#7 - Original Desert (N/S)
#8 - Desert Mountain
#9 - Polar Mountain (N/S)
#10 - ?
#12 - Original Polar

Desert Mountain is essentially a reskin of Mountain using Desert tileset, like it was done with Polar Mountain where I simply took the existing maps and replaced the tiles, which saved the work of designing new maps and routes. The same applies to Forest Mountain and in the future I may design new maps for these terrains. They apply to both terrains since their area doesn't really warrant developing separate northern/southern versions.

Texture #10 is used only in Africa and Southeast Asia so I'm thinking of designing a terrain for both hemispheres combining both Jungle and Forest tilesets.

In conclusion, only 3 terrains to go :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 02, 2014, 08:06:52 pm
This Hobbes is a mad man  ::)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 02, 2014, 11:08:35 pm
This Hobbes is a mad man  ::)

Dude, I've been talking about redoing all of the terrains for the original game for years. OXC was just what I needed to finally make this come true :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 03, 2014, 05:43:07 pm
Hobbes, the readme for 1.9.7 mentions new polar maps, but I couldn't find them, neither in files nor the ruleset.

Is it possible that you uploaded some older version, or am I wrong?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 03, 2014, 07:09:41 pm
Hobbes, the readme for 1.9.7 mentions new polar maps, but I couldn't find them, neither in files nor the ruleset.

Is it possible that you uploaded some older version, or am I wrong?

Code: [Select]
  - name: POLARMOUNT
    mapDataSets:
      - BLANKS
      - MOUNT
      - POLAR
      - POLARMOUNT
    textures: [9]
    largeBlockLimit: 2
    mapBlocks:
      - name: MOUNTPOLAR00
        width: 10
        length: 10
        type: 1
        subType: 0

Is this what you are looking for?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 03, 2014, 09:39:02 pm
Weird, it wasn't in the 1.9.7 version that I had on my disc, despite having the 1.9.7 label in the first line and everything... When I downloaded again, it was there.

I blame aliens.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 04, 2014, 05:04:42 pm
I blame aliens.

 8)
(https://www.quickmeme.com/img/98/983b2dcb4875008670ec340c410e8f96a9fa1219ab322fcf4d09780962b89641.jpg)

This is the new Forest Mountain terrain that I'm working on:

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/AFQRPZIW080420141003.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 04, 2014, 09:06:10 pm
Excellent !
This one was missing, because forest was a little... too much forest...
And there was no other green terrain
I really like this one, well done

The unique problem is... this one is perfect for an ambush !
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on August 04, 2014, 09:41:46 pm
I've noticed something strange - it looks like certain harbour facility has no floor texture (see below). Is that a bug or were TFTD creators that lazy? :)

Also, I've noticed something about your spawning point patterns - in TFTD terrain, as well as the Dawn City, units tends to spawn in packs - like 3-6 units spawned next to each other. Usually mixed aliens & civilians, with predictable results... I'm not sure if it's a perfect design choice.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XCOMFan419 on August 04, 2014, 09:44:10 pm
(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/AFQRPZIW080420141003.png)

I swear I've been there somewhere over in BC :P

But really, this is perfect for Western Terrain in places like Canada and America, plus many others.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 04, 2014, 10:07:27 pm
Excellent !
This one was missing, because forest was a little... too much forest...
And there was no other green terrain
I really like this one, well done

The unique problem is... this one is perfect for an ambush !

It should only take me a few hours to finish it and upload 1.9.8. :)

I've noticed something strange - it looks like certain harbour facility has no floor texture (see below). Is that a bug or were TFTD creators that lazy? :)

Could you point exactly the tile? I just checked the maps and everything looks OK but it's completely possible that it is a bug since that terrain is Industrial, and not the original Port.

Quote
Also, I've noticed something about your spawning point patterns - in TFTD terrain, as well as the Dawn City, units tends to spawn in packs - like 3-6 units spawned next to each other. Usually mixed aliens & civilians, with predictable results... I'm not sure if it's a perfect design choice.

I don't see this behavior at all either during the quick battle or the full game mode. From the description what it seems is that the number of aliens/civilians has been increased by another mod. I can make a couple of adjustments though but it might not solve that issue completely if it is being caused by another mod.

I swear I've been there somewhere over in BC :P

But really, this is perfect for Western Terrain in places like Canada and America, plus many others.

What to do you all think of the look of rock vs green present in the terrain? Does it look 'natural'?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Arthanor on August 04, 2014, 11:18:26 pm
I'm not 100% sure about the "cliff castle with lots of trees on top" on the left (where the mouse cursor is). It looks like someone plonked a whole slab of heavy forest and bedrock on top of the hill. The feature is nice, but it doesn't meld very well with the hill (and looks quite square/symmetric/organized). It is also the most heavily forested area, which makes it stand out more.

On the other hand, the landscape on the right of the picture, or the two smaller hills on the left, are spot on I think.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 04, 2014, 11:22:18 pm
I'm not 100% sure about the "cliff castle with lots of trees on top" on the left (where the mouse cursor is). It looks like someone plonked a whole slab of heavy forest and bedrock on top of the hill. The feature is nice, but it doesn't meld very well with the hill (and looks quite square/symmetric/organized). It is also the most heavily forested area, which makes it stand out more.

On the other hand, the landscape on the right of the picture, or the two smaller hills on the left, are spot on I think.
Be sure alien select their favorite terrain as they know we will come

What to do you all think of the look of rock vs green present in the terrain? Does it look 'natural'?
I find it perfect for OXC  :)
I'm sure once in game...  8)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 04, 2014, 11:24:23 pm
I'm not 100% sure about the "cliff castle with lots of trees on top" on the left (where the mouse cursor is). It looks like someone plonked a whole slab of heavy forest and bedrock on top of the hill. The feature is nice, but it doesn't meld very well with the hill (and looks quite square/symmetric/organized). It is also the most heavily forested area, which makes it stand out more.

On the other hand, the landscape on the right of the picture, or the two smaller hills on the left, are spot on I think.

I also was feeling that something was odd about the mix... I'll do some editing to the 'cliff' castle' to make the elevations smoother and the rock more covered. Thanks!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 04, 2014, 11:26:54 pm
I also was feeling that something was odd about the mix... I'll do some editing to the 'cliff' castle' to make the elevations smoother and the rock more covered. Thanks!
Keep a backup just in case...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Arthanor on August 05, 2014, 12:15:54 am
Keep a backup just in case...
You're welcome! I really like the work you do. I'm glad I can do something, even if it's just being a critic. I'm looking forward to this new variety of texture! I'm sick of seeing the same farms all the time.

Speaking of farms... Is it possible to add civilians to farms/industrial maps? Could be cool to rush and save the civilians in houses while trying to contain the aliens to the UFO before storming it. My battles always end up being: Find the UFO, deal with whatever attacks you on the way, clean the UFO. But my "outdoors cleanup crew" (Everyone but my hardcore assaulters, really) usually ends up having nothing to do because of too few aliens outside or it being just so much easier to blow up the empty farm than having to clear it.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 05, 2014, 12:54:06 am
Speaking of farms... Is it possible to add civilians to farms/industrial maps?

Not possible at the moment, IIRC. :(

Here's a reworked version of the map. How does it look?

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/LURNXBND080420140553.gif)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Arthanor on August 05, 2014, 01:49:24 am
Thumbs up! That looks great. Just make sure there's a fair amount of trees on the map so it doesn't look like they all walked away on the hill when the UFO crashed down ;)

Side note: That's too bad! I hope it becomes possible later. I guess for now, civilians are clever enough to pack up and leave when the see the UFO coming crashing down.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on August 05, 2014, 05:04:04 am
@Adding civvies:
I think adding civilians is possible (untested so far), but it's never map-sensitive - it is UFO-sensitive. If you, say, add civilian spawn to the Battleship deployment entry, every shot down/caught Battleship will generate civilians... this however makes little sense... As there is no way to differentiate between a shot-down and a landed UFO...
However, on the bright side, the TYPES of civilians that would be spawned do depend on the terrain.

@Industrial map bug:
I haven't studied your MCD's, the screenshots are all I have, sorry. I haven't noticed this problem anywhere else... yet.

@Spawning problems:
The only modification I had was increased civilian spawn (from 12 to 16) which shouldn't have caused any radical differences on a 50x50 map... Alien deployment was left alone, standard Terror pattern. AFAIK this is the same bug Solar noticed (6 civvies spawned next to each other), and he didn't even have the civ spawn number increased. However, this behaviour seems to be either rare or hard to nail down.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 05, 2014, 06:16:36 am
@Adding civvies:
I think adding civilians is possible (untested so far), but it's never map-sensitive - it is UFO-sensitive. If you, say, add civilian spawn to the Battleship deployment entry, every shot down/caught Battleship will generate civilians... this however makes little sense... As there is no way to differentiate between a shot-down and a landed UFO...
However, on the bright side, the TYPES of civilians that would be spawned do depend on the terrain.

Well I haven't tried this, so I honestly can't say if it works to add civilians to the UFO missions on the ruleset, but from previous experience I'd be a bit skeptical about trying to use definitions from one mission type on another type.

Quote
@Industrial map bug:
I haven't studied your MCD's, the screenshots are all I have, sorry. I haven't noticed this problem anywhere else... yet.

Just marking it on the image you posted earlier would help.

Quote
@Spawning problems:
The only modification I had was increased civilian spawn (from 12 to 16) which shouldn't have caused any radical differences on a 50x50 map... Alien deployment was left alone, standard Terror pattern. AFAIK this is the same bug Solar noticed (6 civvies spawned next to each other), and he didn't even have the civ spawn number increased. However, this behaviour seems to be either rare or hard to nail down.

Well, I've slightly increased the number of spawn points on the Dawn City tilesets so that might help a little.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 05, 2014, 06:21:13 am
Version 1.9.8 released.

I strongly advise anyone who has 1.9.7 to update to this version since I've fixed a bug that can cause the game to crash if it chooses Native for a terror site terrain.

Besides other bug fixes, 1.9.8 contains the new Forest Mountain terrain, which replaces Forest in Geoscape textures 0, 11 and 12 on the northern hemisphere. Forest is still present in the game although you'll only encounter it on missions in Central Siberia.

Here's an updated pic of Forest Mountain

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/ZQNPKOEG080420141106.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Arthanor on August 05, 2014, 06:42:45 am
Nice!!! You are doing awesome work!

Quick question: Do you decide what the area where the UFO crashed looks like? (and can you determine whether it crashed or landed?)

It would be very cool to have all kinds of debris around a crashed UFO, but more of the typical clearing around the landed one. Like.. ruins of a shed/stable in the farms maps, or tree stumps in the forest/jungles.

PS. I only ask for more because I want to see more of your work ;) It's really good, and such a breath of fresh air for the battlescape.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on August 05, 2014, 11:41:27 am
Beautiful.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 05, 2014, 03:59:32 pm
Version 1.9.8 released.

I strongly advise anyone who has 1.9.7 to update to this version since I've fixed a bug that can cause the game to crash if it chooses Native for a terror site terrain.

Besides other bug fixes, 1.9.8 contains the new Forest Mountain terrain, which replaces Forest in Geoscape textures 0, 11 and 12 on the northern hemisphere. Forest is still present in the game although you'll only encounter it on missions in Central Siberia.

Here's an updated pic of Forest Mountain

I liked the first version as there was not so much forest, but this one is nice too, good job
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on August 05, 2014, 05:29:45 pm
@Adding civvies:
Tested now, adding civilians to any deployment is fully supported. You get score for saving them & everything, sadly it makes little sense until we could have armed civilians :) Curious people converging at a crash site? Hapless victims of alien abduction ray? I don't know

@Industrial map error:
I thought I was specific enough... Is it a bug? A glitch? A feature? Doesn't look that bad just... suspicious :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 05, 2014, 06:39:05 pm
@Adding civvies:
Tested now, adding civilians to any deployment is fully supported. You get score for saving them & everything, sadly it makes little sense until we could have armed civilians :) Curious people converging at a crash site? Hapless victims of alien abduction ray? I don't know

Ah ha, nice to know, thanks.

Well, all those civilians could be... under the influence of a alien multi-phase psionic beam that made them wander off their beds into the night so that the aliens can easily perform mass abductions? Or they are being hostages by the aliens, or being targeted for termination by the aliens... this actually might be a good idea for a new mission.

Quote
@Industrial map error:
I thought I was specific enough... Is it a bug? A glitch? A feature? Doesn't look that bad just... suspicious :)

If you mean under the stairs that's due to the light levels. I've noticed that there are a lot of shadows added compared to the original game but I might be wrong. Otherwise, that map's tiles should have no problems.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on August 05, 2014, 07:38:47 pm
Umm... I meant the whole floor, there's no texture at all, just flat brown color, like in Wolf 3d... Is this how it's supposed to look?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: the_third_curry on August 05, 2014, 09:16:48 pm
Umm... I meant the whole floor, there's no texture at all, just flat brown color, like in Wolf 3d... Is this how it's supposed to look?

I believe that is simply how it's supposed to look. For the sake of comparison, buildings with similar texture appear in Ivan Dogovich's let's play of the original Terror from the Deep here:

https://youtu.be/2r0nx7qE-Vk?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: ivandogovich on August 05, 2014, 10:26:19 pm
I believe that is simply how it's supposed to look. For the sake of comparison, buildings with similar texture appears in Ivan Dogovich's let's play of the original Terror from the Deep here:

https://youtu.be/2r0nx7qE-Vk?

He he... thanks for the reference. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 05, 2014, 10:51:44 pm
He he... thanks for the reference. :)
You make let's play...
Congrats  :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 05, 2014, 11:35:04 pm
I believe that is simply how it's supposed to look. For the sake of comparison, buildings with similar texture appears in Ivan Dogovich's let's play of the original Terror from the Deep here:

https://youtu.be/2r0nx7qE-Vk?

Yup, that is how it's supposed to look.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 06, 2014, 04:01:02 am
Here's a preview of the next terrain I'm currently working, Desert Mountain.

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/SPHSBGOX080520140900.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on August 06, 2014, 04:22:55 am
I was just joking desert mountain is the only type of mountain we're missing... then I've checked this thread :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 06, 2014, 06:13:44 am
I was just joking desert mountain is the only type of mountain we're missing... then I've checked this thread :)

Wait until you see Jungle Mountain! (jk)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Arthanor on August 06, 2014, 07:24:37 am
Need more mountains! Who doesn't like getting to the top of a mountain, all exhausted and out of TUs, just to be shot in the face by an alien? :P

I think the desert mountain looks great. Just one question: what's the brown line going around the middle of the hill in the bottom left corner?

I feel bad criticizing.. but I want to say I really like your work. That's why I pay attention (and criticize ;))
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 06, 2014, 10:43:39 am
hé hé...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: BBHood217 on August 06, 2014, 03:01:28 pm
I've learned to read RUL files so I can now tell you that even though the Raider UFO has a UFOpaedia entry, it can't actually be acquired because the alien engineers are unchanged from the original so they don't recognize the Raider UFO.

I should probably also delete the Muton Commander ruleset since the Alien Remix mod already incorporates it so I'm just unnecessarily doubling it.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 06, 2014, 05:09:01 pm
I think the desert mountain looks great. Just one question: what's the brown line going around the middle of the hill in the bottom left corner?

Because I didn't had an idea of how to get rid of it (which meanwhile I did) :)

Quote
I feel bad criticizing.. but I want to say I really like your work. That's why I pay attention (and criticize ;))

There's a big difference between criticizing and giving feedback. Criticizing is when you only point towards the negative aspects, with the intent of minimizing someone's work. Giving feedback is when you point both the negative and the positive, with the intent of improving the work.

I take all ideas posted here as feedback :)

I've learned to read RUL files so I can now tell you that even though the Raider UFO has a UFOpaedia entry, it can't actually be acquired because the alien engineers are unchanged from the original so they don't recognize the Raider UFO.

I should probably also delete the Muton Commander ruleset since the Alien Remix mod already incorporates it so I'm just unnecessarily doubling it.

Thanks, I'll fix the engineers on the next release. And yes, you don't need to use the Muton Commander mod if you're already using the Alien Remix. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Arthanor on August 06, 2014, 08:28:26 pm
Awesome! I wish there were a "like" button on this forum..
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: ivandogovich on August 06, 2014, 08:37:54 pm
Awesome! I wish there were a "like" button on this forum..
 
Too True!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 07, 2014, 03:03:36 am
Just uploaded 1.9.9 (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-missions-pack) - it has the new Desert terrain plus the fixes to the alien engineers.

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/thumb_DAXTIUIA080620140744.png)

And this kinda ends the new terrains for now. Jungle is not a priority since it is restricted to only 2 textures and there's already Native which is half a mixture between it and Farm.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 07, 2014, 03:41:23 am
Got it but will integrate later, as you work far too fast for me  :o
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 07, 2014, 06:55:16 pm
I'm going through the maps I haven't converted and I'm considering adding a new mission to the pack. It will have to be based on what is possible to do with OXC, and not with what I'd actually like of it being able to do. :)

The main characteristics of what's possible to do are:
* The mission will be generated by a single "UFO" that can't be intercepted and will appear already landed, like those on the MiB mod. This is due to the impossibility of generating other missions that through UFOs (i.e. no missions generated like Terror Sites).
* During the Battlescape the "UFO" will not be an alien craft but a large mapblock (50x50 or higher). There can be several of those map blocks and 1 will be randomly chosen. The actual UFO will most likely not be present.
* The mission will most likely include civilians present (since dioxine mentioned previously that it is possible to add them to UFO missions).

Here's a little brainstorming about the mission:
* Alien Hive - mission briefing is that the aliens have started conducting biological warfare against earth. Basically a lot of civilians are present on the map and some Chryssalids, with both groups separated as much as possible.
* Alien Hunt - 1 scout has landed and the alien(s) is currently being tracked to a populated area. The objective is to kill/capture it before it causes too much damage by killing civilians.

Any ideas of other missions you'd like to add?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 07, 2014, 11:05:28 pm
Here's a little brainstorming about the mission:
* Alien Hive - mission briefing is that the aliens have started conducting biological warfare against earth. Basically a lot of civilians are present on the map and some Chryssalids, with both groups separated as much as possible.
* Alien Hunt - 1 scout has landed and the alien(s) is currently being tracked to a populated area. The objective is to kill/capture it before it causes too much damage by killing civilians.
Both are interesting ideas
- Alien Hive : would have also to deploy XCom team to make a rampart
- Alien Hunt : could make sense to my "SkySpotter" (small SkyRanger, cheaper, but with not more than 4 XCom soldiers)

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 08, 2014, 03:01:11 pm
Both are interesting ideas
- Alien Hive : would have also to deploy XCom team to make a rampart
- Alien Hunt : could make sense to my "SkySpotter" (small SkyRanger, cheaper, but with not more than 4 XCom soldiers)

Well, I've got the Polis UFO2000 maps which might be suitable for those missions. They are 60x60 maps, which means that the total Battlescape size would be 90x60 or 70x70 to allow for the Skyranger to land.  They need the routes but that shouldn't take too much to finish them.

Polis02 would be used for the Alien Hive, with the civilians/Chryssalids being placed on the storage areas and a few primary aliens on the top floor. The other maps would be used for Alien Hunt with the alien(s) being generated somewhere on the buildings. The general tactics for both would be to deploy fast from the Skyranger since there will be few or no aliens present and afterwards having to move quickly to find the aliens.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 08, 2014, 04:17:48 pm
POLISURBAN02  ::)

They are 60x60 maps, which means that the total Battlescape size would be 90x60 or 70x70 to allow for the Skyranger to land.
I have missions of 70x70, 90x90, 100x50, ... so it would be perfectly suitable  :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 08, 2014, 04:34:14 pm
*general drool*
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 08, 2014, 05:17:27 pm
OK, I've finished a test version for Alien Hive using the POLISURBAN02 map. To try, download and unzip the contents to /data folder (you'll need to already have the Terrain Pack installed).

Then choose New Battle, choose mission Alien Hive, and on Alien type select Hive Crew (should be the last entry). This mission will not appear on the campaign game, so it can only be played using New Battle.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on August 08, 2014, 05:56:01 pm
If that "warehouse" is used like an ufo, then you can also remove the earth (brown) ground tile surrounding it, leaving the tiles transparent. Like this you let the blanks underneath exposed, so your buildings will be surrounded by the correct type of ground; then maybe place some concrete tiles in front of the doors. I think it could look better. Check my MiB terror village if you want to see how it looks.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: TigerLord on August 08, 2014, 08:00:55 pm
Hi Hobbes, love the maps. Like someone said before i find that new maps are what really give extra longevity to the game. As per missions suggestions it would be cool to recreate the map and conditions from Rebel Star II for nostalgia sake. Skyranger gets shot down on way to a mission and agents must fight across the map to escape hostile terrain. If water is implemented could put in those water dwelling creatures that were on that map.

Just played Hive map and i think the size is great, bigger the better. An idea for a mission could be a huge city map invested by xenos, somewhere in a safe bunker is a scientist. If the scientist is stunned (rescued) and brought back safely then you acquire 1 special piece of equipment, some kind of super armour, weapon, ship weapon etc.

Still trying to figure out mapview and stuff so can't do it myself yet:(
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 08, 2014, 08:16:45 pm
OK, I've finished a test version for Alien Hive using the POLISURBAN02 map. To try, download and unzip the contents to /data folder (you'll need to already have the Terrain Pack installed).

Then choose New Battle, choose mission Alien Hive, and on Alien type select Hive Crew (should be the last entry). This mission will not appear on the campaign game, so it can only be played using New Battle.
How many aliens do you recommend for this huge map, more than 50 ? :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 08, 2014, 08:41:34 pm
If that "warehouse" is used like an ufo, then you can also remove the earth (brown) ground tile surrounding it, leaving the tiles transparent. Like this you let the blanks underneath exposed, so your buildings will be surrounded by the correct type of ground; then maybe place some concrete tiles in front of the doors. I think it could look better. Check my MiB terror village if you want to see how it looks.

Ah, I know what you mean. Thanks for the tip. :)

Hi Hobbes, love the maps. Like someone said before i find that new maps are what really give extra longevity to the game. As per missions suggestions it would be cool to recreate the map and conditions from Rebel Star II for nostalgia sake. Skyranger gets shot down on way to a mission and agents must fight across the map to escape hostile terrain. If water is implemented could put in those water dwelling creatures that were on that map.

Just played Hive map and i think the size is great, bigger the better. An idea for a mission could be a huge city map invested by xenos, somewhere in a safe bunker is a scientist. If the scientist is stunned (rescued) and brought back safely then you acquire 1 special piece of equipment, some kind of super armour, weapon, ship weapon etc.

Still trying to figure out mapview and stuff so can't do it myself yet:(

The ideas about the rescue mission and the scientist retrieval are nice but unfortunately it's impossible at the moment to implement them with the current engine. :(

How many aliens do you recommend for this huge map, more than 50 ? :D

I've set it to 6-9 Chryssalids and a maximum of 60 civilians at the moment...

EDIT: I've just sent a 12 soldier squad all equipped with Plasma Rifles, Alien Grenades and Power Suits. They got overwhelmed and only 3 of them got back to the Lightning... after killing 36 aliens, with 59 civilians lost.

At the moment I'm considering merging together both missions (Hunt/Hive) into the same one. Them the game could randomly select whether you got the Chryssalid or the stranded aliens crew and randomly choose a map.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 08, 2014, 09:28:30 pm
I've set it to 6-9 Chryssalids and a maximum of 60 civilians at the moment...

EDIT: I've just sent a 12 soldier squad all equipped with Plasma Rifles, Alien Grenades and Power Suits. They got overwhelmed and only 3 of them got back to the Lightning... after killing 36 aliens, with 59 civilians lost.
This sound good...
An experienced admiral does not lose his craft, well done

EDIT: Hobbes, sorry to cause some pollution in your thread...  :-[ As you are easy with terrain and I mind also routes, I would have some questions about routes regarding the Skyranger
If you have any answer, you're welcome...

Sky01 :
- Is this "Idx4" really useful ?! I believed it was used to set position of the first soldier to be placed, but it does not seem to be exact ; if I remove it, it doesn't seem to have any impact...
- Link1 set to Idx0, is it an error ? Or does it mean the 0 is hidden under the 4 ? (would explain red line) Ok the Idx0 is on ground floor (SKY3)
- What does mean this "dist" attribute ?

Sky02 :
- Why are there 3 other XCom Idx ?
- How is it that they are placed on engine and cockpit ?!

Sky03 :
- what are these fucking dist ? Distance to what ?
- what does mean this "flags" ?


Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 08, 2014, 10:55:28 pm
- Is this "Idx4" really useful ?! I believed it was used to set position of the first soldier to be placed, but it does not seem to be exact ; if I remove it, it doesn't seem to have any impact...

That node is used by the aliens to climb the Skyranger's ramp.

Quote
- Link1 set to Idx0, is it an error ? Or does it mean the 0 is hidden under the 4 ? (would explain red line) Ok the Idx0 is on ground floor (SKY3)
- What does mean this "dist" attribute ?

Link1 of node Idx1 is set to node Idx0, connecting both. Disc = distance between both nodes (in squares)

Quote
Sky02 :
- Why are there 3 other XCom Idx ?
- How is it that they are placed on engine and cockpit ?!

I've got no idea also.

Quote
Sky03 :
- what does mean this "flags" ?

Only a few nodes on all of the original's games nodes have it different to 0. The leading theory is that it tells the AI to target those locations (like in base defense).

The above applies to the 'zero' field below. This field is used to determine the importance to the node when the alien is determining where to go when patrolling.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Falko on August 08, 2014, 10:59:31 pm
oxc uses the flags as one parameter to determine the likelyhood a AI uses that way
so if like 10 other conditions are not met the route-flags are used to determine what way to go

in oxc: the higher the spawn byte the higher the chance that a spawn happens on that position
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 08, 2014, 11:23:34 pm
Welcome to Z-COM! Where you have to defend the planet from the zombie hordes! :D

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/YXAXMMIA080820140422.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 08, 2014, 11:36:08 pm
Thanks both for your answers, it's clear now
I noticed that re-selecting a link set distance to its correct value  :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on August 08, 2014, 11:39:51 pm
These polis maps use the vanilla urban terrain, right?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 08, 2014, 11:46:14 pm
These polis maps use the vanilla urban terrain, right?

Yes, at least for now. I might add the additional tileset (DECOR) I made for Mad City.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on August 09, 2014, 12:07:31 am
edit. sent PM
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 09, 2014, 12:22:23 am
You should add some snow inside  :P

A chryssalid/zombie mission is a good idea, like an undetected alien mission whose no one was alerted about, and when XCom arrives, it's too late !
(Should be very rare)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on August 09, 2014, 12:26:45 am
Dammit, you've beaten me to creating a zombie apocalypse mission! :) But mine's gonna have custom zombies! :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 09, 2014, 02:18:45 am
You should add some snow inside  :P

Not possible actually since the outside terrain is determined by the Geoscape location of the landed UFO.

Quote
A chryssalid/zombie mission is a good idea, like an undetected alien mission whose no one was alerted about, and when XCom arrives, it's too late !
(Should be very rare)

Well this mission is most likely be combined with the Alien Hunt for game proposes and can only happen in populated areas.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: BBHood217 on August 13, 2014, 05:23:39 pm
What's an "invalid vector<T> subscript"?  I'm trying to do a terror mission in the railyard with sectoids and cyberdiscs, but at some point during the alien turn on turn 1 I get that error and the game closes.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 13, 2014, 05:33:41 pm
What's an "invalid vector<T> subscript"?  I'm trying to do a terror mission in the railyard with sectoids and cyberdiscs, but at some point during the alien turn on turn 1 I get that error and the game closes.

No idea, haven't had that kind of error before. Are you sure it is related to the terrain pack?

I'm going on holidays today so it might take some time to reply to this thread.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on August 13, 2014, 06:43:28 pm
I am in a camping with an unusable Wi-Fi too
 :-\
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: BBHood217 on August 14, 2014, 11:06:24 am
After learning how to use debug mode, I narrowed down the cause.  It seems there's a cyberdisc at the SE corner of the map and when it was its turn to move, I get the error.  I really don't know why (whether it's the cause of any mod in particular or an actual game bug), only that if I kill it before it can move then there's no more error but that can't be done without debug mode.

Perhaps I could post a save file with the battle in question along with a list of the mods it uses, so that the exact cause can be found.  Maybe.

In the meantime, I guess I'll just ignore the terror mission and continue playing.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 14, 2014, 11:58:16 am
After learning how to use debug mode, I narrowed down the cause.  It seems there's a cyberdisc at the SE corner of the map and when it was its turn to move, I get the error.  I really don't know why (whether it's the cause of any mod in particular or an actual game bug), only that if I kill it before it can move then there's no more error but that can't be done without debug mode.

Perhaps I could post a save file with the battle in question along with a list of the mods it uses, so that the exact cause can be found.  Maybe.

In the meantime, I guess I'll just ignore the terror mission and continue playing.
To know if it has really something to do with Cyberdisc, try a terror mission with sectoid in battle generator
- first, activate debug mod (in options.cfg, set "debug:" to "true")
- generate terror mission, then CTRL+D
- end your turn to take hand on alien turn
- select cyberdisc and try to make it move

If it crashes, this should mean that you have an issue with Cyberdisc SpriteSheet

Then inactivate debug mod setting "debug:" parameter back to "false"
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: BBHood217 on August 14, 2014, 03:37:02 pm
It's only that one particular cyberdisc.  I just did a different terror mission with no issues with any of its cyberdiscs (and floaters).

I can't move the buggy cyberdisc anyway because the error comes up before I'm allowed to control the aliens.  Unless there's a way to control them at the start of their turn instead of after they've all moved.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 15, 2014, 01:50:09 am
After learning how to use debug mode, I narrowed down the cause.  It seems there's a cyberdisc at the SE corner of the map and when it was its turn to move, I get the error.  I really don't know why (whether it's the cause of any mod in particular or an actual game bug), only that if I kill it before it can move then there's no more error but that can't be done without debug mode.

Perhaps I could post a save file with the battle in question along with a list of the mods it uses, so that the exact cause can be found.  Maybe.

In the meantime, I guess I'll just ignore the terror mission and continue playing.

Do you mean that only a part of the Cyberdisc appeared? If so, then the problem is with that specific map block. Check the attached pic to see if that was the map block, if so, then I've found out the problem.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: BBHood217 on August 15, 2014, 12:51:26 pm
It's not that mapblock, it's another one similar to it except the building had steel walls with Xcom crates in them.  And the whole cyberdisc is there.

Actually, I've attached a pic showing it.  In hindsight, I should've done that in the first place but it didn't cross my mind until you attached a pic yourself :x
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on August 15, 2014, 07:25:07 pm
Hobbes, do you know if ufo-maps of rectangular (let's say 50x40) shape are supported?

(50x40 obviously so, once you add the extra part with the x-com craft, the final size of the battlescape is 50x50).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 16, 2014, 02:05:19 am
It's not that mapblock, it's another one similar to it except the building had steel walls with Xcom crates in them.  And the whole cyberdisc is there.

Actually, I've attached a pic showing it.  In hindsight, I should've done that in the first place but it didn't cross my mind until you attached a pic yourself :x

OK, it's definitely not the issue I thought (although this has helped me to fix a bug in another map).

I've got no idea of what might be causing it but I doubt it is related with the map since it involves moving a unit. Try posting this on the bug subforum.
 

Hobbes, do you know if ufo-maps of rectangular (let's say 50x40) shape are supported?

(50x40 obviously so, once you add the extra part with the x-com craft, the final size of the battlescape is 50x50).

Yes, rectangular maps are supported. Or should be, since the vanilla Terror/Supply Ships are 30x20.

However, you can't design a 50x40 UFO for a 50x50 battlescape, unless you remove the Lightning from the list of available craft. The Skyranger and the Avenger will fit without a problem in the space left, but the Lightning will not fit.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 17, 2014, 02:10:40 am
This is not directly related to the topic, but I hope you Hobbes will know something about this, or perhaps even be responsible for it.

While looking for modding stuff, I browsed Warboy's old mod and stumbled on a Commercial terrain set. It had 4 tilesets (COMMERCE, COMROADS, COMBITS and COMFRN) and a number of maps (even with routes). I haven't checked them in-game, but they look fine in the MapView and are actually quite awesome.

Here's some block examples:

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/COMRC14.gif)

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/COMRC09.gif)

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/COMRC08.gif)

Now, since Warboy claims to not know who made this, I wonder if you might know? Maybe it was you, or Luke?

Anyway, this needs to be included in the game somehow. After all, malls are among the most cosmopolitan terrains that would fit any city on Earth! And it looks really good.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 17, 2014, 04:02:00 am
Those are mine, they are available at my site as City terrain and it is one of the first mods I ever created. When civilian made the 1st version of the terrain pack he included it but I decided to remove the terrain because graphically some look terrible, others are badly designed (doors open and replace walls when closed) and having so many 3 level buildings gives the whole map the "where's the last alien" experience.

This was my favorite map of that terrain, the movie theatre, with "XWars" and "Dino" as featured films:

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 17, 2014, 04:22:55 pm
I knew I came to the right place. :P

Well, I like it. Maybe not 100% of it is perfect, because nothing is, but it's a really solid work with potential and I'd very much prefer if it was available in the Terrain Pack.

Dioxine also expressed interest in using parts of it fro a slum/shanty town set.

EDIT:

I added Tentacular's bathroom tiles and made a loft night club!

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/COMRC10-ground.gif)

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/COMRC10-1st_floor.gif)

Yes, I started with your condo and it shows a little.

Anyway, I wanted to prove that this set kicks ass and can be used with minimum work to achieve satisfying results. And also because I really like the idea of plasma blasts inciting panic at the disco!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 18, 2014, 03:13:17 am
Could you point me towards the thread where this was posted originally?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 18, 2014, 08:07:30 am
Could you point me towards the thread where this was posted originally?

The original png files for the bathroom set were posted here: https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=559.0

Dioxine made the mcd files recently (he didn't release them yet, AFAIK).

I think every single urban terrain should use them. :)

EDIT:

I just remembered that the bathroom MCDs were used in Dioxine' latest mod Improved Living Quarters: https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2806.0
Download it to check them out. There are 2 new MCDs.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 18, 2014, 12:54:51 pm
Thanks, but I was asking about Warboy's old mod (where the City, aka Commercial terrain was included)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 18, 2014, 01:17:57 pm
Thanks, but I was asking about Warboy's old mod (where the City, aka Commercial terrain was included)

Ah, sorry. It was included in his War mod, which is floating somewhere around the net (can't locate it now, I'm at work).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 18, 2014, 03:54:15 pm
Ah, sorry. It was included in his War mod, which is floating somewhere around the net (can't locate it now, I'm at work).

Thanks, I've found it. He or someone must have downloaded it from my site and forgot where he got it.

I've been giving it a 2nd look since I never expected that there would be interest in this terrain and it might be worthwhile to redo the whole City terrain as Commercial but it would require redoing the whole MCD files. The reason is that their are a mess of UFO and TFTD tiles put together without much consideration on how they look. I'll add this to the list of possible future additions to the Terrain Pack.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 18, 2014, 04:13:37 pm
I've been giving it a 2nd look since I never expected that there would be interest in this terrain and it might be worthwhile to redo the whole City terrain as Commercial but it would require redoing the whole MCD files. The reason is that their are a mess of UFO and TFTD tiles put together without much consideration on how they look. I'll add this to the list of possible future additions to the Terrain Pack.

Yes, it would definitely be worthwhile. I think the main interests are the following:
1) The theme, obviously. The standard suburbia map is fine, but a mall shootout has its peculiar movie-like charm. (For a similar reason I've started making a financial district map, we'll see how it goes.)
2) The ground tiles. Funny as it may sound, they're unique and have potential. They would fit a Western-themed town or something like that.
3) It can use many old tiles (the red brick factory, for example) without them looking out of place.

If you work on this set, would it be possible to keep the tiles' basic function? So that we wouldn't have to make the maps again. (I'm planning to make at least two more, a supermarket and a shop gallery.)

Oh, and to make this strictly "commercial", could we have a bit more goods to sell? Clothing and electronics come to mind.

Thanks for this, and all other terrains you made!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 18, 2014, 04:54:15 pm
Yes, it would definitely be worthwhile. I think the main interests are the following:
1) The theme, obviously. The standard suburbia map is fine, but a mall shootout has its peculiar movie-like charm. (For a similar reason I've started making a financial district map, we'll see how it goes.)
2) The ground tiles. Funny as it may sound, they're unique and have potential. They would fit a Western-themed town or something like that.
3) It can use many old tiles (the red brick factory, for example) without them looking out of place.

If you work on this set, would it be possible to keep the tiles' basic function? So that we wouldn't have to make the maps again. (I'm planning to make at least two more, a supermarket and a shop gallery.)

Oh, and to make this strictly "commercial", could we have a bit more goods to sell? Clothing and electronics come to mind.

Thanks for this, and all other terrains you made!

The ground tiles are not that unique. The ones used in the outside were removed from the Farm terrain while the others were removed from TFTD's Port, Island and the ships' terrains.

I'd actually remove the brick walls since they were taken from Port and use something else instead.

Concerning the tilesets, I usually prefer redesigning the whole tileset but that takes a lot of time. I'll have to decide that later when I complete the Area51 and Polis terrains since those are my priority at the moment.

You're welcome - I love that you guys are enjoying this as much as I :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on August 20, 2014, 03:12:15 pm
I have a (couple of) questions and I figured this would be the right place to ask...

1. How does one change the number of tiles within a tileset? Just copying old MCDs and replacing tiles seems a primitive method...
2. Are TFTD MCD's compatible with XCOM? (assuming one changes the palette?)
3. Are you open to contributions to your mod? (I'll be making the "shantytown" set at some point, and maybe more)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 20, 2014, 05:29:46 pm
I have a (couple of) questions and I figured this would be the right place to ask...

1. How does one change the number of tiles within a tileset? Just copying old MCDs and replacing tiles seems a primitive method...
2. Are TFTD MCD's compatible with XCOM? (assuming one changes the palette?)
3. Are you open to contributions to your mod? (I'll be making the "shantytown" set at some point, and maybe more)

1. That's the method I use. If you came up with something better let me know :)
2. Yes. XComUtil had a Hybrid terrain where you could play TFTD's terrains on UFO. However, I'd recheck the MCD settings.
3. Yes, if you are open to feedback to your terrains. I'm really looking for the whole pack to have some quality (that's why I removed the City and Hive terrains) and there are things that work better than others. Also, at this point I'm considering whether or not to remove the new missions and only have terrain replacements for the original missions.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on August 20, 2014, 05:59:31 pm
Thanks for the answer! From my personal POV, it'd be much more convenient if you splitted the mods - or at least made 2 rulesets, alien missions being an 'optional enhancement', dependant on enabling the main mod (if required) - that way I could simply add new civilian types and height to your .rul file, instead of having to create a custom .rul from ground up to have your terrain available... :) but then again, there are no other mods that add new civilians or modify height (well, except Luke's terror... which is malfunctioning anyway, the "underground" parts creating a problem of aliens falling into holes in the ground where you can't follow them, or even throw a grenade after them... A shame that is...)... So I guess my opinion could be skewed :)

(I've modified height to 7 for all my maps since it a) allows better use of mortars & grenade launchers, b) a soldier standing on top of a 3-story building can throw a grenade without hitting the skybox)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 20, 2014, 07:21:25 pm
Thanks for the answer! From my personal POV, it'd be much more convenient if you splitted the mods - or at least made 2 rulesets, alien missions being an 'optional enhancement', dependant on enabling the main mod (if required) - that way I could simply add new civilian types and height to your .rul file, instead of having to create a custom .rul from ground up to have your terrain available... :) but then again, there are no other mods that add new civilians or modify height (well, except Luke's terror... which is malfunctioning anyway, the "underground" parts creating a problem of aliens falling into holes in the ground where you can't follow them, or even throw a grenade after them... A shame that is...)... So I guess my opinion could be skewed :)

(I've modified height to 7 for all my maps since it a) allows better use of mortars & grenade launchers, b) a soldier standing on top of a 3-story building can throw a grenade without hitting the skybox)

I'm good with increasing the height to 7 due to the throwing arc issue and I think it would be an welcome improvement to add more civilian types. I used to have a mod that replaced the original civilians with uniformed personnel but I can't find it anymore unfortunately.

Luke's sewers are something that adds too much complexity to terrains IMHO.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on August 20, 2014, 10:40:50 pm
Luke's sewers are something that adds too much complexity to terrains IMHO.

Yes, definitely, although the bugs take away some of the pleasure - not sure if it is the question of mod (some blocks having underground levels, some not), or simply the game doesn't work well with that many dirt tiles. As for the civilians, mine won't do (they're post-war human-alien hybrids), but I have some other stuff that could be adapted  (TFTD, Warboy's old War mod, Luke's designs) - there is only the question of selection. With cut & paste, possibilities are endless (and making inv pictures and corpse floorob/bigob isn't that much work). Here's a sample:



Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 21, 2014, 03:25:47 am
As for the civilians, mine won't do (they're post-war human-alien hybrids), but I have some other stuff that could be adapted  (TFTD, Warboy's old War mod, Luke's designs) - there is only the question of selection. With cut & paste, possibilities are endless (and making inv pictures and corpse floorob/bigob isn't that much work). Here's a sample:

The only ones that I dislike are Port's bathing suit male and female civilians, all the others could be added to specific terrains.

I'm going to split the rulesets between Maps and Missions.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on August 21, 2014, 03:10:12 pm
I'll prepare the whole big civilian pack when I have the time, it also seems to be missing dark-skinned people... There will be some work, but I have 60% or so resources ready to use. Just needs free time :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 21, 2014, 03:53:47 pm
I'll prepare the whole big civilian pack when I have the time, it also seems to be missing dark-skinned people... There will be some work, but I have 60% or so resources ready to use. Just needs free time :)

No hurries. I'm going to be unable to work anymore on the mods after tomorrow and until next week since I'm going to enjoy the rest of my holidays. Meanwhile, I've already separated the rulesets but I still want to test them a little more today before publishing them.
 
Title: Russian translation for Terrain/Missions Pack v1.9.9
Post by: VSx86 on August 23, 2014, 10:41:26 am
Raider Ship in in-game Ufopedia
(https://cdn.mediacru.sh/TdKK0tUiDq8n.png)

HWD detected:
Raider Ship
Elite Raider
Alien Raid
North Africa
(https://cdn.mediacru.sh/PIOHraDsKibv.png)

Ruleset only adds translated strings while OpenXcom's language is set to Russian.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: BBHood217 on August 23, 2014, 03:04:24 pm
Are raider ships meant to be shot down?  They're basically terror ships but with double the weapon range so I think they can fire at you the moment you intercept them.

Not to mention that like supply ships on supply missions, raiders fly in, immediately land somewhere, then fly away again.  There's only a small window to attack them while they're landed, seemingly only possible to do with an Avenger (or reloading and parking a Skyranger over where the raider will land).
Title: Re: Russian translation for Terrain/Missions Pack v1.9.9
Post by: Hobbes on August 24, 2014, 03:16:01 am
Ruleset only adds translated strings while OpenXcom's language is set to Russian.

Cool, I'll add it to the next version when I release it next week (I'm still on my holidays). спасибо :)

Are raider ships meant to be shot down?  They're basically terror ships but with double the weapon range so I think they can fire at you the moment you intercept them.

Not to mention that like supply ships on supply missions, raiders fly in, immediately land somewhere, then fly away again.  There's only a small window to attack them while they're landed, seemingly only possible to do with an Avenger (or reloading and parking a Skyranger over where the raider will land).

My original idea was that it would be almost impossible for Interceptors to shoot them down and you need to be lucky for a Skyranger to reach it on time, if you're able to detect it in advance. Gameplay wise, I wanted for alien raids to be rather rare missions.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: mercy on August 24, 2014, 10:02:53 am
Awesome job you did here! Can't wait for future updates.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 24, 2014, 03:53:47 pm
Awesome job you did here! Can't wait for future updates.

Thanks. As mentioned previously, my current plans are to separate the new terrains from the new missions. And afterwards I'll want to add 2 new terrains as terror sites, the Area51 and City (Commercial) terrain and possibly a new Jungle terrain since it is the only one that hasn't had anything new added.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 24, 2014, 04:06:34 pm
Hobbes,

Since you were supposed to be on vacation, I went ahead and started working on the commercial a little. What I did so far:
- Changed all the window panes from uniform blue to transparent. Bluntly speaking, the former didn't look good at all on most walls, maybe except the white ones.
- Added the high voltage warning signs from the Railyard set.
- Added the bathroom tilesets.
- Made a few maps - the dance club I've shown before, a store gallery, a public toilet and a small power central.

Here's the new windows on one of your maps:

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/COMRC07.gif)

And here's a glance on the current state of the shopping gallery:

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/COMRC11.gif)

The gallery is technically finished, but I plan to make more merchandise to make it more varied (meat and household items dominating everything don't look too good, the shop with the green carpet looks especially bad).

Obviously I do not know if you like it or not, but I believe this would be of some use to you.

EDIT: It appears I can't add any new tiles to the COMROADS, because it messes up everything else. (I feared it would be the case.) Do I need to make yet another tileset (that would be the 7th one, so I don't really want to), or is there some other option?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 24, 2014, 06:19:32 pm
Hobbes,

Since you were supposed to be on vacation, I went ahead and started working on the commercial a little. What I did so far:
- Changed all the window panes from uniform blue to transparent. Bluntly speaking, the former didn't look good at all on most walls, maybe except the white ones.
- Added the high voltage warning signs from the Railyard set.
- Added the bathroom tilesets.
- Made a few maps - the dance club I've shown before, a store gallery, a public toilet and a small power central.

Here's the new windows on one of your maps:

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/COMRC07.gif)

And here's a glance on the current state of the shopping gallery:

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/COMRC11.gif)

The gallery is technically finished, but I plan to make more merchandise to make it more varied (meat and household items dominating everything don't look too good, the shop with the green carpet looks especially bad).

Obviously I do not know if you like it or not, but I believe this would be of some use to you.

EDIT: It appears I can't add any new tiles to the COMROADS, because it messes up everything else. (I feared it would be the case.) Do I need to make yet another tileset (that would be the 7th one, so I don't really want to), or is there some other option?

Nice. A couple of days ago I was looking through the tilesets to figure out what needed to be changed and the blue windows are on the top of my list for changes (they work on TFTD but not on UFO) although I was thinking of using the glass walls from Dawn City.

I have started replaced the brick walls (they already appear on Port, Industrial and Railyard) with Dawn City's white walls. The white walls also need windowed versions to match the ones on the interior walls and corresponding fences for the top of the buildings but meanwhile the beach was calling for me :)

I will have to create a new tileset to add a few more tiles since I decided I won't change the existing tilesets (other than a few replacements) because they are actually better organized than what I thought. Next week I'll get back to this terrain for sure.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 24, 2014, 06:23:35 pm
Oh cool. I don't mind the white walls, as long as the order stays the same.

I'm attaching the new glass panes that don't contain any brick wall elements. If you post the new white walls, I'll do the rest.

Also as I mentioned before, I'm thinking of making some more selling goods... Are you interested?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 24, 2014, 06:29:57 pm
Oh cool. I don't mind the white walls, as long as the order stays the same.

I'm attaching the new glass panes that don't contain any brick wall elements. If you post the new white walls, I'll do the rest.

Also as I mentioned before, I'm thinking of making some more selling goods... Are you interested?

The order will stay almost the same so that it isn't necessary to change a lot in the maps. The new white walls are already available on the Terrain Pack (and there's a previous post that contains .pngs of all tilesets. As for more selling goods, show me what you have. My only concern is whether they'll fit with the existing tiles - the new toilet tiles look to me a little out of place at a first look, but I need to examine them with time.

Well, I'm off to the beach - see you later :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 24, 2014, 06:44:33 pm
Well, I'm off to the beach - see you later :)

Have fun :)

Well, I don't really have anything you don't know about, except for this changing room I made in the last 20 minutes. :) (It's still subject to some polishing.) And a mirror which was a by-product of windows.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 25, 2014, 11:56:43 pm
What I managed today - some clothing shop props and a potted plant. :)

I think I should perhaps start my own thread instead of clogging yours...? Just promise me you'll come over to see. :)

EDIT: And a retro-futuristic chair.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Infini on August 26, 2014, 02:00:41 am
French Translation
______________

  - type: fr
    strings:
      STR_ALIEN_RAID: Raid Extraterrestre
      STR_ALIEN_RAID_UFOPEDIA: Les extraterrestres effectueront des missions visant à frapper directement des installations essentielles situées sur la Terre.  S'ils réussissent, cela provoquera une panique significative dans la zone ciblée.  L'OVNI ne sera pas présent lors de la reprise des installations.
      STR_ALIEN_FLYBY: Survol Extraterrestre
      STR_ALIEN_FLYBY_UFOPEDIA: Les extraterrestres enverront des vaisseaux pour intimider les gouvernements de la Terre.  Cela se traduira par des vagues d'activité OVNI au-dessus des grandes agglomérations, ce qui démontrera leur puissance. 
      STR_RAIDER_SHIP: Raider
      STR_RAIDER_SHIP_UFOPEDIA: Le Raider est un navire de guerre extraterrestre rapide et dangereux utilisé pour attaquer les infrastructures de la Terre.  Il transporte un équipage important qui, avant de s'en prendre aux installations terrestres environnantes, a ordre de détruire leur propre vaisseau advenant un crash.
      STR_RAIDERS_EARLY: Raider Léger
      STR_RAIDERS_MIDEARLY: Raider Intermédiaire
      STR_RAIDERS_MID: Raider Lourd
      STR_RAIDERS_LATE: Raider Super Lourd
      STR_RAIDERS_VERYLATE: Raider Élite
      STR_NATIVEURBAN: Indigène
      STR_CULTAFARMA: Vaste Ferme A
      STR_CULTAFARMB: Vaste Ferme B
      STR_MADURBAN: Expansion Urbaine
      STR_PORTURBAN: Port
      STR_INDUSTRIALURBAN: Industriel
      STR_RAILYARDURBAN: Gare de Triage
      STR_DAWNURBANA: Ville dès l'Aube A
      STR_DAWNURBANB: Ville dès l'Aube B
      STR_POLARMOUNT: Montagne Polaire
      STR_FORESTMOUNT: Forêt de Montagne
      STR_DESERTMOUNT: Montagne Désertique
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 26, 2014, 02:02:13 am
What I managed today - some clothing shop props and a potted plant. :)

I think I should perhaps start my own thread instead of clogging yours...? Just promise me you'll come over to see. :)

EDIT: And a retro-futuristic chair.

I like them! Keep it going and you'll come up with complete tilesets of your own, which would be much more interesting than reusing the old tiles from UFO and TFTD. And if you decide to come up with your own thread (clogging mine is fine too) I'll be sure to visit! :)

French Translation

Thanks! Will add them for the next version.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 26, 2014, 11:32:56 am
I like them! Keep it going and you'll come up with complete tilesets of your own, which would be much more interesting than reusing the old tiles from UFO and TFTD.

Yay, thanks!

Yeah, I'm making an office/bank district, so some of it may come handy... But I also like the idea of having a Commercial tileset, and yours is good, just missing some content that I'm trying to provide. And since you've stated that you want one more MCD anyway, I'm just adding stuff.

And if you decide to come up with your own thread (clogging mine is fine too) I'll be sure to visit! :)

OK, I'll think about it... I will certainly do it for any new tileset I'm making, but not sure about the Commercial stuff. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: moriarty on August 26, 2014, 12:44:51 pm
keep it up, this is so cool! Giving the old game new maps and terrains - I love this!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 26, 2014, 09:55:26 pm
Hobbes, which white walls from the Dawn City are you using to replace the brick walls? There are several possible candidates.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 26, 2014, 10:03:30 pm
Hobbes, which white walls from the Dawn City are you using to replace the brick walls? There are several possible candidates.

I've attached an image here: https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2358.msg30398#msg30398 (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2358.msg30398#msg30398)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 26, 2014, 10:05:01 pm
I've attached an image here

Oh, OK. My bad.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Aldorn on August 26, 2014, 10:18:36 pm
French Translation
______________
  - type: fr
    strings:
      STR_ALIEN_RAID: Raid Extraterrestre
      STR_ALIEN_RAID_UFOPEDIA: Les extraterrestres effectueront des missions visant à frapper directement des installations essentielles situées sur la Terre.  S'ils réussissent, cela provoquera une panique significative dans la zone ciblée.  L'OVNI ne sera pas présent lors de la reprise des installations.
      STR_ALIEN_FLYBY: Survol Extraterrestre
      STR_ALIEN_FLYBY_UFOPEDIA: Les extraterrestres enverront des vaisseaux pour intimider les gouvernements de la Terre.  Cela se traduira par des vagues d'activité OVNI au-dessus des grandes agglomérations, ce qui démontrera leur puissance. 
      STR_RAIDER_SHIP: Raider
      STR_RAIDER_SHIP_UFOPEDIA: Le Raider est un navire de guerre extraterrestre rapide et dangereux utilisé pour attaquer les infrastructures de la Terre.  Il transporte un équipage important qui, avant de s'en prendre aux installations terrestres environnantes, a ordre de détruire leur propre vaisseau advenant un crash.
      STR_RAIDERS_EARLY: Raider Léger
      STR_RAIDERS_MIDEARLY: Raider Intermédiaire
      STR_RAIDERS_MID: Raider Lourd
      STR_RAIDERS_LATE: Raider Super Lourd
      STR_RAIDERS_VERYLATE: Raider Élite
      STR_NATIVEURBAN: Indigène
      STR_CULTAFARMA: Vaste Ferme A
      STR_CULTAFARMB: Vaste Ferme B
      STR_MADURBAN: Expansion Urbaine
      STR_PORTURBAN: Port
      STR_INDUSTRIALURBAN: Industriel
      STR_RAILYARDURBAN: Gare de Triage
      STR_DAWNURBANA: Ville dès l'Aube A
      STR_DAWNURBANB: Ville dès l'Aube B
      STR_POLARMOUNT: Montagne Polaire
      STR_FORESTMOUNT: Forêt de Montagne
      STR_DESERTMOUNT: Montagne Désertique
Nice translation  :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 27, 2014, 03:55:37 pm
Back from holidays :P

I'm going start working on the new tileset for Commercial.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Infini on August 27, 2014, 05:47:50 pm
Quote
Nice translation  :)

Thank you.
My English is poor (when I'm writing) but I read it easely.

I'm not a professional translator, but for an amateur, a good one.
That's why I'm doing some translations.  The result is very acceptable.

 :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 27, 2014, 06:47:02 pm
Dawndecor windows with the same glass effect as my other windows.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 27, 2014, 07:41:57 pm
Dawndecor windows with the same glass effect as my other windows.

I've just made the windows slightly different to correspond with the inner windows. :)

Here are the reworked  tilesets, including your new tiles.  I've had to change the positions of a few tiles unfortunately to make the tilesets act better, so there will be required to change existing maps.

There is still space left for new tiles since there are some placeholder graphics, in case you have any more tiles to be added.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 27, 2014, 08:13:01 pm
Awesome!

...although the hanging shirts weren't supposed to be a tile, they don't represent anything, it's just a resource to be used... :)

I'll work some more later tonight, I want to make more clothing stuff and maybe a record store stand (should be easy enough, it'd be a vegetable stand with contents replaced). And maybe some additional wall posters for the latter?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 27, 2014, 08:23:31 pm
Awesome!

...although the hanging shirts weren't supposed to be a tile, they don't represent anything, it's just a resource to be used... :)

I'll work some more later tonight, I want to make more clothing stuff and maybe a record store stand (should be easy enough, it'd be a vegetable stand with contents replaced). And maybe some additional wall posters for the latter?

Sounds good. The main issue right now is deciding what tiles to include or not since we're about to hit the maximum MCD limit of MapView.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 27, 2014, 09:06:48 pm
Sounds good. The main issue right now is deciding what tiles to include or not since we're about to hit the maximum MCD limit of MapView.

Yeah, I'm not expecting you to take everything - it's a matter of selection.

And since you're way more experienced, I'm hoping you would do this. :)

EDIT: About those shirts on hangers... I said they were just props, but it could actually work if they were just hanging on a wall. Some repositioning may be needed.

EDIT 2: A clothing store wardrobe (2 variants). A coat to be hanged on a wall (2 variants).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 27, 2014, 10:39:50 pm
Sorry for double-posting, but there's the attachment limit per post. Anyway:

- A CD stand;
- 2 posters, for *ehm* various possible uses (base pics provided by Dioxine);
- Plastic plates? (made by Dioxine, cheers)
- A store mannequin (altered from civilian sprite).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 27, 2014, 10:48:08 pm
Double post as much as you want :)

Please list all creators so I can properly give them credits on the readme.

Two questions:
* Where are the toilet tilesets located?
* Do you want to include your maps?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 27, 2014, 11:18:18 pm
Double post as much as you want :)

Please list all creators so I can properly give them credits on the readme.

Of course. But perhaps it would be more practical if I do it after the selection process.

Two questions:
* Where are the toilet tilesets located?

Dioxine's Improved Living Quarters mod. He made the tileset from pngs made by Tentacular.

* Do you want to include your maps?

Yes, please! If you think they're worthy.
I'll add them all here.
(I would like to improve them though, at least the gallery)

EDIT: and a dress, designed to be placed in the corner (facing the player). (Yes, because I was too lazy to make a rotated one.)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: MKSheppard on August 28, 2014, 02:48:55 am
This map seems like it could be quite useful for an antarctic science station base; with some modifications; e.g:

(https://www.coolantarctica.com/Bases/south_pole_jan_2008.jpg)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 28, 2014, 03:47:56 am
Here's the latest version of the new tileset

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 28, 2014, 03:48:46 am
This map seems like it could be quite useful for an antarctic science station base; with some modifications; e.g:

(https://www.coolantarctica.com/Bases/south_pole_jan_2008.jpg)

That might be a good idea for later.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: BBHood217 on August 28, 2014, 11:41:02 am
I have the perfect place for an arctic base: An alien raid mission in polar terrain.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 28, 2014, 06:17:22 pm
Here's a better mannequin sprite, to look more like the thing and less like an actual civilian.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Recruit69 on August 28, 2014, 07:52:25 pm
Well, I assume the error I am seeing relates to this mod (as part of FMP)

See the screenshot and save file...

It seems I cannot walk down the stairs without spending LOTS of timeunits. See the path finding figure number starts at 22 then suddenly 0

Note - yes playing on Ironman (ouch)

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Recruit69 on August 28, 2014, 08:04:19 pm
And this one,

I see the alien, I want to retreat my soldier downstairs rather than risk a snap shot, but unfortunately, it wont let me other than going upstairs.

See screenshot and save file, try clicking on the poor guy to go downstairs!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 28, 2014, 11:12:10 pm
Here's a better mannequin sprite, to look more like the thing and less like an actual civilian.

Thanks. Added to tileset, I'm currently reworking the tilesets and the maps.

Well, I assume the error I am seeing relates to this mod (as part of FMP)

See the screenshot and save file...

It seems I cannot walk down the stairs without spending LOTS of timeunits. See the path finding figure number starts at 22 then suddenly 0

Note - yes playing on Ironman (ouch)

I'm afraid I can't find anything in the mod terrain or maps to justify this behavior.

And this one,

I see the alien, I want to retreat my soldier downstairs rather than risk a snap shot, but unfortunately, it wont let me other than going upstairs.

See screenshot and save file, try clicking on the poor guy to go downstairs!

Fixed. Thanks.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: wsmithjr on August 29, 2014, 04:08:15 am
Had something I thought was weird happen in the new desert/mountain map.  Had a soldier climbing up the side of the mountain, and then he fell through the side of the mountain to inside it.  Maybe it's intentional to give it that Hobbit-like feel.  8)

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: ivandogovich on August 29, 2014, 05:51:42 am
Had something I thought was weird happen in the new desert/mountain map.  Had a soldier climbing up the side of the mountain, and then he fell through the side of the mountain to inside it.  Maybe it's intentional to give it that Hobbit-like feel.  8)

OMG... thats awesome! Brilliant!  and freaking devious... the snakeman spawnpoints in there... <shudders>
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 29, 2014, 06:01:54 am
Had something I thought was weird happen in the new desert/mountain map.  Had a soldier climbing up the side of the mountain, and then he fell through the side of the mountain to inside it.  Maybe it's intentional to give it that Hobbit-like feel.  8)

Unintentional behavior... the ground tiles were missing on that level, so that's why it fell. Fixed for next version. Thanks :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 29, 2014, 08:01:31 am
Hobbes, regarding the tileset: is there still some place for adding partially destroyed tiles? For some of them ruined versions already exist (like for example wardrobe), others can be done easily...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 29, 2014, 01:35:14 pm
Hobbes, regarding the tileset: is there still some place for adding partially destroyed tiles? For some of them ruined versions already exist (like for example wardrobe), others can be done easily...

Yes, there is still space for partially destroyed tiles.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 29, 2014, 03:29:36 pm
I've uploaded version 2.0, available here (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-missions-pack).

Change Log
* Split the ruleset into two, Terrain Pack and Missions Pack, to keep the terrains and missions separate, for easy updating and integration  with other mods. Also included the Alien Remix ruleset.
* Fixed bugs with the Industrial, Desert Mountain, Polar Mountain, Forest Mountain, Railyard and Dawn City terrains.
* Added Alien Hive and Alien Hunt to the Missions Pack.
* Added French and Russian translations, courtesy of Infini and VSx86, respectively.

I haven't added the Commercial terrain since it's still unfinished and there were a lot of important updates ready to go, plus I am also developing a new Jungle terrain, but those will be added as soon as possible.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 29, 2014, 03:32:24 pm
Yes, there is still space for partially destroyed tiles.

OK, I'll try to do them tomorrow (today is a no-no).

I've uploaded version 2.0

On the other hand, I may not have the time... :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 29, 2014, 03:34:18 pm
OK, I'll try to do them tomorrow (today is a no-no).

On the other hand, I may not have the time... :D

Version 2.1 is waiting for your destroyed tiles... ;)

Also, could you post a pic of what your maps are supposed to look? Since the tilesets were changed I have problems figuring out which tiles were replaced.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Vulgar Monkey on August 29, 2014, 04:32:58 pm
re that unintentional tile bug.....do you think it is possible to purposely reproduce this effect to create a 'cave system' map?

Might be interesting for some afghanistan/vietnam type tunnel-fighting affair.
I dont know about you lot, but I certainly find those little unlit cave sections of alien bases to be most intimidating. Especially with Chryssies.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 29, 2014, 05:17:11 pm
re that unintentional tile bug.....do you think it is possible to purposely reproduce this effect to create a 'cave system' map?

Might be interesting for some afghanistan/vietnam type tunnel-fighting affair.
I dont know about you lot, but I certainly find those little unlit cave sections of alien bases to be most intimidating. Especially with Chryssies.

That unexpected effect can be reproduced but do you really want to have to spend TUs to look for the entrances? Plus, you can get in but I don't think you can get out of those caves which could bring movement problems.

There are a couple of those hills though that have openings on the top that lead to the inside. Usually they will be slightly hidden though, like the map below.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: wsmithjr on August 29, 2014, 07:11:35 pm
EDIT:  My error.  Disregard the rest of this post.

Unintentional behavior... the ground tiles were missing on that level, so that's why it fell. Fixed for next version. Thanks :)

I've installed the new 2.0 version and my soldier still falls through the mountain in the exact same place.  It's definitely changed because the map itself looks different.  Now I see what you mean by "it fell" as before the whole hill just looked funny and didn't really have a top.  Now it has a proper top and looks better, but there's still a "hole".  And I'm not talking about the entryway into the tunnels ... it's a couple spaces over from that entryway.  I can give you a save.  Looking at the attached image, if you move the soldier 1 space directly forward, he'll fall into the tunnels.  And you can see the movement indicators show the lower floor.  Just thought I'd mention if this isn't the way it's supposed to be.

One caveat ... this is the original saved game from earlier but with the new terrain installed, so perhaps that is affecting it somehow?

Edit:
Now I know it's not intentional because you call fall into the tunnels at any point on the side of the mountain, even clear on the other side, if you step from the side of the mountain onto a space that has a tunnel location beneath it.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on August 29, 2014, 09:35:41 pm
@Hobbes: I had the same issue with some of my UFO maps. Make sure that there are "floor" tiles everywhere; if the hill slope is "content" it won't do. A floor tile is neccessary for the soldiers not to fall through.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 29, 2014, 09:58:48 pm
One caveat ... this is the original saved game from earlier but with the new terrain installed, so perhaps that is affecting it somehow?

Try a new tactical mission with version 2.0 since it shouldn't affect saves. The issue was the one Dioxine mentioned on the previous post: it is required to have floor tiles on the slopes otherwise the soldiers will fall.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: wsmithjr on August 29, 2014, 10:25:59 pm
Try a new tactical mission with version 2.0 since it shouldn't affect saves.

<sigh>  I suppose it's 2 late to delete my previous post?  Sure enough, it's fine now.  Sorry.  I thought to myself, I wish I could start a new battle to see if it still does it.  Completely forgot about the "New Battle" option from the main menu.

Nothing to see here...  :-[
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: wsmithjr on August 29, 2014, 11:18:50 pm
OK, in this case I don't think I'm doing something stupid.

Tried to activate your Alien_Remix.rul in 2.0 and it's asking for Resources/Sprites/mutcom and there is no such folder in your zip.

While I'm thinking about it, will Alien_Remix play nice with other alien mods?  So, will I still get say Waspites or Gazers and then sometimes get the remix groupings?  Or does it override any other alien loadouts?

Thanks.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 29, 2014, 11:52:34 pm
OK, in this case I don't think I'm doing something stupid.

Nope, the battlescape is being loaded from the save, and since the map was generated with the missing tiles, the save will always have those tiles missing.

Quote
Tried to activate your Alien_Remix.rul in 2.0 and it's asking for Resources/Sprites/mutcom and there is no such folder in your zip.
Thanks.

Ah, forgot to add those to the zip. Thanks for the heads up.

Just uploaded a new zip of 2.0 with the required files.

Quote
While I'm thinking about it, will Alien_Remix play nice with other alien mods?  So, will I still get say Waspites or Gazers and then sometimes get the remix groupings?  Or does it override any other alien loadouts?

The Alien Remix only creates mixed crews of vanilla aliens. If you have mods of new aliens they will appear by themselves but not as part of the mixed crews.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Argo on August 30, 2014, 10:42:34 am
I like your effort, a really outstanding work :)
These maps are a good addition to the original game

I have a little question...why i can not see some maps into battle mode? (port, dawn e rail maps).
It a simply a little bug? I dont see any error message into the game.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 30, 2014, 12:24:39 pm
I have a little question...why i can not see some maps into battle mode? (port, dawn e rail maps).
It a simply a little bug? I dont see any error message into the game.

It is not a bug, it just isn't possible to choose the terror site terrains in Battle mode. No one ever consider that it could be more than 1 terrain available when they designed Battle mode, so the game simply randomly chooses from the list of terror terrains.

If you want to play a specific terror map in Battle mode, one way is to open the ruleset file and comment all the terrains you don't want to play to deactivate them.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Argo on August 30, 2014, 01:50:48 pm
ok thanks for your explanations :) I'm happy that it is not a bug
and again thanks for your efforts.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 30, 2014, 03:11:13 pm
All right, so, a final couple of clothing props:

- Shirts_loose: Hanging directly in the wall. This is a practical application of the HangingShirts picture from days ago.
- ShirtsRackEmpty and ShirtsRackFull: Another for of clothing display, this is a plastic grate for hanging shirts and skirts. (And I really should've made more skirts.)
- CHANGING_destroyed: Destroyed changing room.
- Records_plates_destroyed: Destroyed record or plate stand.

Continued in the next post.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 30, 2014, 03:17:21 pm
Wardrobe_destroyed: a destroyed wardrobe.
Mannequin_destroyed: destroyed mannequin.
Hanger_grey_destroyed and Hanger_blue - destroyed: destroyed cloth hangers.

That's it.
And if there are still free slots, I would like to see DAWNFRNITURE-006 as well as the yellow warning triangle that can be found in the Railroad terrain near electric boxes.

The next post will show my maps, please bear with me.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: ivandogovich on August 30, 2014, 03:40:50 pm
Rofl!  I love the destroyed mannequin.  ;D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 30, 2014, 04:12:24 pm
Rofl!  I love the destroyed mannequin.  ;D

Thanks! I wasn't completely sure. :)

Now, the maps. There are five of them attached, with descriptions.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 30, 2014, 05:36:26 pm
Thanks! I wasn't completely sure. :)

Now, the maps. There are five of them attached, with descriptions.

Thanks. I'm going to see if I can finish everything either today or tomorrow. Meanwhile I started working in adapting TFTD's Atlantis and Mayan terrains as new Desert and Jungle terrains and I'm trying to get all 3 released at the same time.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 30, 2014, 05:47:25 pm
Thanks. I'm going to see if I can finish everything either today or tomorrow. Meanwhile I started working in adapting TFTD's Atlantis and Mayan terrains as new Desert and Jungle terrains and I'm trying to get all 3 released at the same time.

Awesome. Will play the hell out of these.

If there's still room, would it be possible to add the mirror as well?

BTW my personal opinion is that the grey metallic hanger looks better than the blue one, but I'm leading the final decision to you.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 30, 2014, 05:58:46 pm
If there's still room, would it be possible to add the mirror as well?

BTW my personal opinion is that the grey metallic hanger looks better than the blue one, but I'm leading the final decision to you.

The mirror has been already added on the last png I posted, facing both directions, but I guess just one is enough.

I thought the blue one was more colorful but I'm good with using the grey one instead. If there's room I'll try to keep both, although there could be a common destroyed tile for both hangers.

The maps look good but I'm not so sure about the COMRC04 map because I'm doing a major rework on the outer spaces, using the palm trees from TFTD's Island tileset and Dawn City's hedgerows.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 30, 2014, 06:04:05 pm
The mirror has been already added on the last png I posted, facing both directions, but I guess just one is enough.

Oops, my bad. Yeah, agreed completely. I think the west wall seems to have less objects, but I am not completely sure.

I thought the blue one was more colorful but I'm good with using the grey one instead. If there's room I'll try to keep both, although there could be a common destroyed tile for both hangers.

Yep, the destroyed grey one could work for both.

The maps look good but I'm not so sure about the COMRC04 map because I'm doing a major rework on the outer spaces, using the palm trees from TFTD's Island tileset and Dawn City's hedgerows.
[/quote]

Don't worry about it, it's small and nothing special. Although I wish it could be recreated in some way, since a small technical building seems to fit the terrain.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Infini on August 30, 2014, 07:36:07 pm
French translation v2.0:


New lines in:

1- Alien_Remix.rul

2- Missions_Pack.rul

 :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: wsmithjr on August 31, 2014, 03:34:19 am
Started new game on Experienced difficulty with the 2.0 Alien Missions ruleset activated.  (I've also got MiB activated, so maybe that's the cause of the following behavior.)  On February 1, the aliens got a sudden 1000 point spike on the graphs.  Is it an Alien Raid that caused that?  I never saw a UFO or got any kind of notice, just 1000 points suddenly appearing for the aliens.  The graph indicated it happened in the Artic and I send Interceptors there for 2 days to see if there was some kind of base or something, but never did find anything.  Also, nothing else happened in the Artic for the rest of the month.

I guess from the description I was expecting to need to defend something for the Alien Raid mission, but I never got the chance.  I was going to complain about such a huge point score for the aliens so early in the game, but capturing a V.Large ship (not sure what it is, but it's not a Battleship) helped get me 150 points in my favor at the end of the month, so I guess it wasn't so bad after all. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 31, 2014, 04:51:01 am
French translation v2.0:


New lines in:

1- Alien_Remix.rul

2- Missions_Pack.rul

 :)

Thanks :)

Started new game on Experienced difficulty with the 2.0 Alien Missions ruleset activated.  (I've also got MiB activated, so maybe that's the cause of the following behavior.)  On February 1, the aliens got a sudden 1000 point spike on the graphs.  Is it an Alien Raid that caused that?  I never saw a UFO or got any kind of notice, just 1000 points suddenly appearing for the aliens.  The graph indicated it happened in the Artic and I send Interceptors there for 2 days to see if there was some kind of base or something, but never did find anything.  Also, nothing else happened in the Artic for the rest of the month.

I guess from the description I was expecting to need to defend something for the Alien Raid mission, but I never got the chance.  I was going to complain about such a huge point score for the aliens so early in the game, but capturing a V.Large ship (not sure what it is, but it's not a Battleship) helped get me 150 points in my favor at the end of the month, so I guess it wasn't so bad after all. :)


The 1000 points spike in the Arctic most likely had to do with the MiB mod since 2.0 doesn't change any of the missionWeights on that region and Antarctica.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 31, 2014, 05:23:12 am
Here is the new Atlant Desert terrain. First, with the original sand tiles from TFTD (converted using MCDEdit).

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/thumb4_CTTUQNNW083020141021.png)

Now this is how it looks using the Desert tileset instead:

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/thumb4_LXPFOCCP083020141021.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: XCOMFan419 on August 31, 2014, 05:40:41 am
Here is the new Atlant Desert terrain. First, with the original sand tiles from TFTD (converted using MCDEdit).

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/thumb4_CTTUQNNW083020141021.png)

Now this is how it looks using the Desert tileset instead:

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/thumb4_LXPFOCCP083020141021.png)
hory shet

that looks sexy
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 31, 2014, 05:46:03 am
And this is the original Mu terrain, for the new version I want to add Jungle tiles.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: wsmithjr on August 31, 2014, 07:10:55 am
The 1000 points spike in the Arctic most likely had to do with the MiB mod since 2.0 doesn't change any of the missionWeights on that region and Antarctica.

Thanks.

BTW, those new terrains will just be way too cool.  Thanks.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 31, 2014, 10:29:39 am
I still felt something was missing from the clothing shop... Shelves! With jeans, t-shirts and towels...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on August 31, 2014, 11:03:44 am
I'm so gonna steal this terrain :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 31, 2014, 01:31:52 pm
I'm so gonna steal this terrain :)

Steal?! The precious?!?!?!? ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: smexyvami on August 31, 2014, 02:41:24 pm
Here is the new Atlant Desert terrain. First, with the original sand tiles from TFTD (converted using MCDEdit).

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/thumb4_CTTUQNNW083020141021.png)

Now this is how it looks using the Desert tileset instead:

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/thumb4_LXPFOCCP083020141021.png)

nice azteck
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 31, 2014, 02:55:14 pm
nice azteck

What I'm considering right now is if I should keep the old sand tiles instead of replacing them with the Desert tiles (the pink looks a bit strange but it might be a nice change of colors).

Solaris, here's the current new tileset with all the new additions. Do you want to design more tiles (I can still find room for a few) or can I start finishing it?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 31, 2014, 03:22:17 pm
Hmm, I have asked before for the tiles as attached.

Also, I would love to see an expensive car there... Perhaps the Civilian Car from Apocalypse (https://ufopedia.csignal.org/apocapedia/047.png)?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: ivandogovich on August 31, 2014, 03:26:41 pm
What I'm considering right now is if I should keep the old sand tiles instead of replacing them with the Desert tiles (the pink looks a bit strange but it might be a nice change of colors).

As much as I like the tiles as they converted, ( and they look amazing blued out in Tftd's Underwater shades), and as much as I'm not as fond of the yellow sands of the Sahara in Ufo Defense,   I still think the yellow fits more with the overall game.  Just my two cents.

Also, Mu is incredible.  In all my years of playing and watching TftD, I have never seen this terrain set, and thought it the Atlantis set was the only ancient underwater city terrrain.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on August 31, 2014, 03:46:37 pm
Why not keep BOTH + Jungle, for a total of 6 variations of ruins :)

Btw if you're making the Jungle versions, please put some trees/plants on top of the ruins too :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on August 31, 2014, 04:10:43 pm
Hmm, I have asked before for the tiles as attached.

Also, I would love to see an expensive car there... Perhaps the Civilian Car from Apocalypse (https://ufopedia.csignal.org/apocapedia/047.png)?

The bookstand tile has been added to the COMFRNT tileset. I've also added to the new tileset a toilet, and a couple other tiles.

The car would take some 7-8 tiles and there are no roads on this map.

As much as I like the tiles as they converted, ( and they look amazing blued out in Tftd's Underwater shades), and as much as I'm not as fond of the yellow sands of the Sahara in Ufo Defense,   I still think the yellow fits more with the overall game.  Just my two cents.

Also, Mu is incredible.  In all my years of playing and watching TftD, I have never seen this terrain set, and thought it the Atlantis set was the only ancient underwater city terrrain.

Both Atlantis/Mu are hard to get on regular missions on TFTD and you might as also have confused both terrains.

Why not keep BOTH + Jungle, for a total of 6 variations of ruins :)

Btw if you're making the Jungle versions, please put some trees/plants on top of the ruins too :)

I tend to agree with ivandogovich that the Desert version will fit the theme better. The color is simply too pink and it take a while to reconvert the colors to something more natural.

I thought about doing both Jungle and Desert versions of both maps but there are only two Geoscape textures that display Jungle, so the choice is to keep the original terrain + 1 new Mu Jungle, since to me Mu looks a lot like a Mayan temple. Atlantis fits better with desert but if I have time I might also make Mu with Desert, since there are 4 Geoscape textures for Desert and there are only two used.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on August 31, 2014, 04:24:30 pm
You're right about the lack of roads, but I meant a car for sale... But since I couldn't get any Apocalypse extractor, nevermind.

We could however add your white minivan, after all the shops must be supplied somehow.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: robin on August 31, 2014, 05:39:06 pm
Mu Jungle, since to me Mu looks a lot like a Mayan temple.
Mu definitely looks like Mayan/Aztec, coupling it with jungle is the right call IMO.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 01, 2014, 05:28:01 pm
You're right about the lack of roads, but I meant a car for sale... But since I couldn't get any Apocalypse extractor, nevermind.

We could however add your white minivan, after all the shops must be supplied somehow.

I'm a bit tired of the minivan since it appears so much on Dawn City and the issue would still be that there are no roads.

I'm trying to finish the Mu Jungle terrain before completing Commercial but it's taking me some time since I have to redo several of the Mu maps.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 01, 2014, 05:33:29 pm
I'm a bit tired of the minivan since it appears so much on Dawn City and the issue would still be that there are no roads.

Conclusion 1: we need more vehicles. I've been thinking about it for quite some time, but I'm not brave enough yet.
Conclusion 2: some of them need threads! :)

Good luck with the maps!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: moriarty on September 01, 2014, 05:38:27 pm
if you're thinking about new vehicles: I like the concept of using trucks as sniper positions in xcom2012. perhaps you could try making a truck that can be walked onto? (also, once you create a basic truck-with-trailer, you can easily add variety by putting different stuff onto the trailer ;) )
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 01, 2014, 05:45:56 pm
perhaps you could try making a truck that can be walked onto?

This shouldn't be a problem at all.

(also, once you create a basic truck-with-trailer, you can easily add variety by putting different stuff onto the trailer ;) )

Speaking of trailers: Trailer parks as terror missions! :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 01, 2014, 07:39:09 pm
Good luck with the maps!

The Mu maps really need attention because in some ways TFTD simplified map design but those don't work for UFO.

This shouldn't be a problem at all.

Speaking of trailers: Trailer parks as terror missions! :)

There's already two cars available on Dawn City and it would be really neat to have more cars and trucks to make terrains for trailer parks and highways.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: robin on September 02, 2014, 02:59:34 pm
You know Hobbes what ufo tiles have the "Big_Wall:33" thing set to "1"?
The dirt blocks of the x-com base (specifically tiles: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, of XBASE1.MCD).
The dirt block of the alien base instead has it set to 0.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 02, 2014, 03:12:52 pm
You know Hobbes what ufo tiles have the "Big_Wall:33" thing set to "1"?
The dirt blocks of the x-com base (specifically tiles: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, of XBASE1.MCD).
The dirt block of the alien base instead has it set to 0.

Quite a few have BigWall defined as 1:
* AVENGER - 12 tiles
* U_EXT02 - 10 tiles
* XBASE01 - 5 tiles
* MARS - 1 tile
* PLANE - 12 tiles
* MOUNT - 5 tiles
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 02, 2014, 06:01:11 pm
Almost there...

My question right now with the Mu terrain is if I should also put vegetation on top of the temples

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: ivandogovich on September 02, 2014, 06:11:00 pm
Almost there...

My question right now with the Mu terrain is if I should also put vegetation on top of the temples

This is looking wonderful!!
Vegetation on the temples would look terrific, but its awesome as it stands right now. :)
Cheers, Ivan
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 02, 2014, 06:17:54 pm
Yes, the buildings are way too pristine now. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 02, 2014, 07:01:36 pm
This is looking wonderful!!
Vegetation on the temples would look terrific, but its awesome as it stands right now. :)
Cheers, Ivan

Yes, the buildings are way too pristine now. :)

The jungle is about to start its erradication of human presence  ::)

Solaris, do you want the MCD files of the new tileset? They are unfinisheed since I still need to make adjustments to the values but since I won't change the images you can use the tileset to update your existing maps and create new ones.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 02, 2014, 10:45:20 pm
Solaris, do you want the MCD files of the new tileset? They are unfinisheed since I still need to make adjustments to the values but since I won't change the images you can use the tileset to update your existing maps and create new ones.

Oh yes, certainly. I'd love to have a head start.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 03, 2014, 03:53:21 pm
Oh yes, certainly. I'd love to have a head start.

Here are the Commercial tilesets. I've mostly finished them (finally) but please report any bugs you see.

EDIT: attached a preview of the Commercial terrain.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions packs (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 04, 2014, 05:54:27 pm
Mu Jungle is finished for now. Anyone wants to do an XCOM/Indiana Jones crossover? :)

Now I am going to finish Commercial and then release 2.1 with the 3 new terrains. Since there will be now alternate for Jungle, I'm also thinking of including another Terrain ruleset where all UFO and Terror missions will only take place on the new terrains and not in the old ones, the only exceptions would be XCom and Alien bases.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: ivandogovich on September 04, 2014, 06:10:00 pm
<drools> wow... just wow... that Mu Jungle is amazing!
Cheers, Ivan :D

Edit: and yeah, I kinda spammed that image around (Google+, Twitter, Reddit)...  ::)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 06, 2014, 04:08:29 am
I should have time to finish all this weekend. Mu and Atlantis are almost done but I still have to redesign a few maps of Commercial.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: eXalted on September 06, 2014, 11:29:36 pm
Maaan, that's some awesome work over there! Just WOW  :o I love those temples and jungles :o

I've been thinking of starting a new game of X-Com but for first time with mods. I'll wait for the new tilesets to be included and will be starting right away!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 07, 2014, 12:58:38 am
Ugh, I've been too busy recently to take care of the Commercial maps. I hope I'll manage to do something over the weekend...

EDIT: where's the entire bathroom stuff? All I can see is one toilet seat.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 07, 2014, 01:23:10 am
Ugh, I've been too busy recently to take care of the Commercial maps. I hope I'll manage to do something over the weekend...

EDIT: where's the entire bathroom stuff? All I can see is one toilet seat.

Each of the 2 Bathroom tilesets has 28 tiles each, and it was impossible to add so many additional tiles. When I looked at the maps you designed it seemed that only 1 toilet tile would be required so I only added that one for now. But it's possible to squeeze a few more extra tiles, although simply impossible to add 20 or 30 tiles without having to replace existing ones.

Anyways, meanwhile I'm going to upload version 2.1 soon and you can add your updated maps later.

Mu and Atlantis are going to need some testing of the AI since I've basically stuck to TFTD's settings since I'm curious to see how the AI handles then. 
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 07, 2014, 01:28:24 am
Each of the 2 Bathroom tilesets has 28 tiles each, and it was impossible to add so many additional tiles. When I looked at the maps you designed it seemed that only 1 toilet tile would be required so I only added that one for now. But it's possible to squeeze a few more extra tiles, although simply impossible to add 20 or 30 tiles without having to replace existing ones.

That's fine I guess, we don't need absolutely everything, but I'd like the urinals, the showers and the wall-to-piss-on, whatever it's called in English. If they're somewhere there, I'm happy!

Anyways, meanwhile I'm going to upload version 2.1 soon and you can add your updated maps later.

Sure I will!

Mu and Atlantis are going to need some testing of the AI since I've basically stuck to TFTD's settings since I'm curious to see how the AI handles then.

Publish the results, please :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 07, 2014, 01:37:43 am
That's fine I guess, we don't need absolutely everything, but I'd like the urinals, the showers and the wall-to-piss-on, whatever it's called in English. If they're somewhere there, I'm happy!

Can you please post which exact tiles you would be interested?

Quote
Sure I will!

Meanwhile I'll disable your maps until you update them and fix the doors on several of them. The issue is that you cannot place doors on locations where they will replace a wall tile when open. What will happen is that when you close the door, the wall will not reappear and there will be a hole. See the attached pic for an example.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 07, 2014, 01:54:51 am
Can you please post which exact tiles you would be interested?

Sure, here's what I personally consider important (red = essential, yellow = useful, no colour = not very useful for the Commercial set):

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/mcd1.jpg)

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/mcd2.jpg)

Meanwhile I'll disable your maps until you update them and fix the doors on several of them. The issue is that you cannot place doors on locations where they will replace a wall tile when open. What will happen is that when you close the door, the wall will not reappear and there will be a hole. See the attached pic for an example.

Oh, good to know, I haven't foreseen this.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 07, 2014, 02:14:42 am
Sure, here's what I personally consider important (red = essential, yellow = useful, no colour = not very useful for the Commercial set):

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/mcd1.jpg)

(https://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa43/SolariusScorch/Modding/mcd2.jpg)

Pick the orientation of the red ones that you prefer.

I'm going to upload 2.1 right now.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 07, 2014, 02:19:28 am
Pick the orientation of the red ones that you prefer.

I don't really care, as long as not everything is on the same wall orientation... Perhaps lavatories/urinals on the West wall, toilets on the North wall?

I'm going to upload 2.1 right now.

Yessss! :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 07, 2014, 02:31:44 am
Another spawning problem... Enemies spawning in a building which has no entrance (and is very, very hard to blow up):

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: VSx86 on September 07, 2014, 01:04:09 pm
Good day, Hobbes.
 
There's a bug in new Missions_Pack ruleset. Happened on version openxcom_git_master_2014_09_06_0652
 
(https://cdn.mediacru.sh/XgwlVPx3qHc3.png)
 
I fixed it. Correct file attached to this message.
 
 
Thanks for the interesting add-on!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 07, 2014, 02:21:55 pm
Another spawning problem... Enemies spawning in a building which has no entrance (and is very, very hard to blow up):

Fixed. Thanks!

Good day, Hobbes.
 
There's a bug in new Missions_Pack ruleset. Happened on version openxcom_git_master_2014_09_06_0652
 
I fixed it. Correct file attached to this message.
 
Thanks for the interesting add-on!

Fixed and updated version 2.1 of the pack. Thanks!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Infini on September 07, 2014, 05:56:23 pm
French translation; 3 new lines in v2.1 (Terrain_Pack.rul)

STR_ATLANTDESERT: L'Atlantide
STR_MUJUNGLE: Continent Perdu de Mu
STR_COMRCURBAN: Centre Commercial

Merci!
 :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: myk002 on September 07, 2014, 07:44:16 pm
Hey Hobbes,

Solarius Scorch directed me over here for an issue I found while running the Final Mod Pack (original post (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2163.msg31612#msg31612)).

I've run into a crash issue on one of the maps with the railyard tileset.  On alien turn one, I get a std::vector overrun.  It appears that the alien patrol nodes are corrupt. 

I opened a bug at https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/819 but Warboy closed it, saying (rightly) that he wasn't about to debug mod issues.  I've attached a savegame that shows the issue and written up some more technical details in the bug report, if that helps.  Is there any more info I can get from the debugger that could help track this down?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 07, 2014, 08:06:30 pm
French translation; 3 new lines in v2.1 (Terrain_Pack.rul)

STR_ATLANTDESERT: L'Atlantide
STR_MUJUNGLE: Continent Perdu de Mu
STR_COMRCURBAN: Centre Commercial

Merci!
 :)

Merci :)

Hey Hobbes,

Solarius Scorch directed me over here for an issue I found while running the Final Mod Pack (original post (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2163.msg31612#msg31612)).

I've run into a crash issue on one of the maps with the railyard tileset.  On alien turn one, I get a std::vector overrun.  It appears that the alien patrol nodes are corrupt. 

I opened a bug at https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/819 but Warboy closed it, saying (rightly) that he wasn't about to debug mod issues.  I've attached a savegame that shows the issue and written up some more technical details in the bug report, if that helps.  Is there any more info I can get from the debugger that could help track this down?

Can you post a pic of the specific map block that is causing issues?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: myk002 on September 07, 2014, 08:14:29 pm
sure thing:
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 07, 2014, 09:05:51 pm
I don't know if it's the cause of the bug, but the screenshot shows that the Railyard seems to miss a dedicated Landing Zone as well...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 07, 2014, 11:27:53 pm
sure thing:

I'm afraid this picture doesn't help much since I mean the individual map block (either 10x10 or 20x20). Also, what behavior provokes the bug?

I don't know if it's the cause of the bug, but the screenshot shows that the Railyard seems to miss a dedicated Landing Zone as well...

The dedicated LZ is attached. The terrain will never load if you don't have a specific map block assigned as LZ.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: myk002 on September 08, 2014, 02:13:10 am
Ah, I haven't really dealt much with the maps before.  How do I find out which block is causing trouble?

I know the nodeLinks vector contains the following values (from the bug report (https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/819):
(gdb) print *fromNode->getNodeLinks()
$10 = std::vector of length 5, capacity 5 = {239, 230, -1, 257, 245}

and then 257 is used as index into a vector that only has 253 elements.  How do I find what block this relates to?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 08, 2014, 02:14:43 am
Isn't debug mode showing what is happening when the game crashes, and where?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: myk002 on September 08, 2014, 02:20:11 am
yeah -- the stack trace and some poking around with gdb is in the bug report (https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/819)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 08, 2014, 05:54:35 am
yeah -- the stack trace and some poking around with gdb is in the bug report (https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/819)

Can you check with Warboy if there is a limit to the number of route nodes in a battlescape?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: myk002 on September 08, 2014, 10:11:26 am
Warboy responds (https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/819#comment_3882):
Quote
RMP files store the data as unsigned 8-bit values, so yes, the limit is 255.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 08, 2014, 02:45:32 pm
Warboy responds (https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/819#comment_3882):

So the 256 limit not only applies to RMP files but to the total of nodes in a Battlescape as well? This is the issue I need to confirm since this doesn't happen with the MCD files - they also have a 256 limit but you can use more than 256 entries during a tactical fight.

Or, an even better question: hat wdoes Warboy think it is the cause of the error message?

Sorry for all these questions but I'm not really qualified to understand that bug report since I hardly know any coding.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 08, 2014, 09:13:36 pm
1. Small smoke dispersal issue (see attached screencap; small circle indicates the point of smoke grenade detonation); it doesn't seem right that such a low hedge blocks smoke dispersal...

2. Unsure: while these windows are transparent to bullets and LoS, they're as hard as the rest of the wall (it just withstood a heavy cannon near-miss). Maybe lower the armor a bit or make a broken window tile? It's not an issue with (inferior) vanilla glassless windows, but here this big-ass blue glass feels just wrong when shrugging off nearby HE detonations.

Sorry for incessantly bombarding you with these issues, but that's only because I love your terrains :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 08, 2014, 09:48:32 pm
1. Small smoke dispersal issue (see attached screencap; small circle indicates the point of smoke grenade detonation); it doesn't seem right that such a low hedge blocks smoke dispersal...

2. Unsure: while these windows are transparent to bullets and LoS, they're as hard as the rest of the wall (it just withstood a heavy cannon near-miss). Maybe lower the armor a bit or make a broken window tile? It's not an issue with (inferior) vanilla glassless windows, but here this big-ass blue glass feels just wrong when shrugging off nearby HE detonations.

Sorry for incessantly bombarding you with these issues, but that's only because I love your terrains :)

I'll reduce both the smoke blockage of the hedge rows and the armor of the windows. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 08, 2014, 10:57:15 pm
Hobbes, I've reworked the maps, all I need to finish them are the bathroom bits.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 08, 2014, 11:08:34 pm
Oh, and another one: stairs. Can go up, can't go down. Might be true for multiple stairs on this map.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 09, 2014, 12:21:10 am
Oh, and another one: stairs. Can go up, can't go down. Might be true for multiple stairs on this map.

I thought I had those fixed. I need to look better into this issue. Question: there are 2 sets of stairs on that area, 1 on each level. The issue is moving from one set to the other, right? Or is the unit being blocked elsewhere?

Hobbes, I've reworked the maps, all I need to finish them are the bathroom bits.

The terrain files are attached. Let me know if you prefer a different orientation to the bathroom furniture or more tiles.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 09, 2014, 12:36:51 am
Thanks Hobbes.

The only I would really like is another orientation of the handbasin, since it's hard to always put it on the same wall as the toilet.

And maybe we can have the towels, if it's still possible.

EDIT: the hanging coat (COMDECOR number 52) is positioned a bit too low/right; attaching a hopefully better version.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 09, 2014, 01:09:27 am
And maybe we can have the towels, if it's still possible.

You mean the pair of towels? Because the single towel is already added to COMDECOR.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 09, 2014, 02:13:25 am
I thought I had those fixed. I need to look better into this issue. Question: there are 2 sets of stairs on that area, 1 on each level. The issue is moving from one set to the other, right? Or is the unit being blocked elsewhere?

The problem happens in between these 2 sets of stairs (gosh, these 4-tile stairs are serious stamina-burners :) Oh and a curious thing, I'm using an old version of your terrain pack, and still the house in question is 5- or 6- levels tall... I though your missions had a height of 4 back then? Just an observation, I like it being that tall. But while the Dawn City is sometimes more convoluted than the Port/Industrial, at least the buildings aren't so heavily reinforced. I really need to start bringing mortars into Terror missions :) Overall I'm really impressed how diverse the Dawn City is, fought several terrors in this terrain and it almost never looks alike.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 09, 2014, 02:37:36 am
The problem happens in between these 2 sets of stairs (gosh, these 4-tile stairs are serious stamina-burners :) Oh and a curious thing, I'm using an old version of your terrain pack

Have you had the stairs bug with the latest version? Because it might already be fixed.

Quote
and still the house in question is 5- or 6- levels tall... I though your missions had a height of 4 back then? Just an observation, I like it being that tall. But while the Dawn City is sometimes more convoluted than the Port/Industrial, at least the buildings aren't so heavily reinforced. I really need to start bringing mortars into Terror missions :) Overall I'm really impressed how diverse the Dawn City is, fought several terrors in this terrain and it almost never looks alike.

I changed the height to 6 when I redesigned Dawn City. Dawn City is actually 2 terrains, one with automatic road generation, the other without, so that might explain why the battlescape is so diverse.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 09, 2014, 02:41:00 am
Have you had the stairs bug with the latest version? Because it might already be fixed.

Sadly, no and the chances of finding these stars again on a mission aren't that big. I'm waiting for the final version of the Commercial terrain before installing the new version of the Terrain Pack.

Btw how is this stairs bug generated? It was recurring in my maps as well.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 09, 2014, 02:51:03 am
Sadly, no and the chances of finding these stars again on a mission aren't that big. I'm waiting for the final version of the Commercial terrain before installing the new version of the Terrain Pack.

Btw how is this stairs bug generated? It was recurring in my maps as well.

Well, in that case let me know if you encounter the bug with the latest version, otherwise it might already have been fixed.

From what I remember the bug was caused by a wall on a different level that prevented the soldier from moving up/down the stairs.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 09, 2014, 08:03:59 am
You mean the pair of towels? Because the single towel is already added to COMDECOR.

Oh yeah, I can see it now, but... it's a ground object? Why? I expected a content object.

(Same for the shower, but it's a bit more understandable here.)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: myk002 on September 09, 2014, 09:43:49 am
SupSuper responded regarding the crashing map:

Quote
You can have infinite nodes on the Battlescape, but only 255 per RMP (and id=255 means none).

Anyways we've fixed a bug that might've caused these buggy node IDs by making nodes wrap around at 128. However there's no easy way to fix this save, the mission has to be aborted/cheated/etc.

see: https://github.com/SupSuper/OpenXcom/commit/235f2b40dbb4bd870953c20cb5d1fc455091e0e4

I'm not sure what the implications of this are for maps with more than 128 nodes, though.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 09, 2014, 11:17:57 am
Oh yeah, I can see it now, but... it's a ground object? Why? I expected a content object.

(Same for the shower, but it's a bit more understandable here.)

Just use both as a content object, I'll fix them later.

SupSuper responded regarding the crashing map:

see: https://github.com/SupSuper/OpenXcom/commit/235f2b40dbb4bd870953c20cb5d1fc455091e0e4

I'm not sure what the implications of this are for maps with more than 128 nodes, though.

I was discussing this issue yesterday with SupSuper and Warboy on the irc channel. Whatever the bug is, it is not confirmed to be related with the rmp files.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 09, 2014, 03:21:09 pm
1. Small smoke dispersal issue (see attached screencap; small circle indicates the point of smoke grenade detonation); it doesn't seem right that such a low hedge blocks smoke dispersal...

2. Unsure: while these windows are transparent to bullets and LoS, they're as hard as the rest of the wall (it just withstood a heavy cannon near-miss). Maybe lower the armor a bit or make a broken window tile? It's not an issue with (inferior) vanilla glassless windows, but here this big-ass blue glass feels just wrong when shrugging off nearby HE detonations.

Sorry for incessantly bombarding you with these issues, but that's only because I love your terrains :)

I've lowered the armor of all those windows.

I've just checked and the hedge row Smoke Blockage setting is 0... whatever is happening with the smoke in that game is related to how the game processes smoke and not the terrain definitions.

Oh yeah, I can see it now, but... it's a ground object? Why? I expected a content object.

(Same for the shower, but it's a bit more understandable here.)

There's a fixed version in attachment that fixes both objects, also with the new orientation for the washbasin and the new coat hanger image.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hadan on September 09, 2014, 07:51:03 pm
There's a fixed version in attachment that fixes both objects, also with the new orientation for the washbasin and the new coat hanger image.
Is this file to be applied to the current version or is this just for Solarius?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 09, 2014, 08:04:19 pm
Finally I'm attaching the maps. I'm not 100% sure they're flawless, mostly because of the recent updates, so please treat them as a beta. (It's better to submit them now than keep polishing them for eternity.) Of course, I'll fix any errors.

I think I'll make some more Commercial maps in the future (small office? boutique?) but we'll see how it goes.

Is this file to be applied to the current version or is this just for Solarius?

I think just for me, unless you have/use other Commerce tilesets.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 09, 2014, 08:20:59 pm
Is this file to be applied to the current version or is this just for Solarius?

Just for Solarius, don't apply it to the current version or you might have issues when playing on that terrain :)

Finally I'm attaching the maps. I'm not 100% sure they're flawless, mostly because of the recent updates, so please treat them as a beta. (It's better to submit them now than keep polishing them for eternity.) Of course, I'll fix any errors.

I think I'll make some more Commercial maps in the future (small office? boutique?) but we'll see how it goes.

I'll add them later today after checking them out and publish a new version.

Meanwhile, there might be a problem with the Railyard routes, if you haven't read my previous posts. It's still unclear what causes the bug but one possible reason is the extensive number of nodes defined in the map blocks. I may have to redo the RMP files and redo most of the nodes.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 09, 2014, 08:26:33 pm
Meanwhile, there might be a problem with the Railyard routes, if you haven't read my previous posts. It's still unclear what causes the bug but one possible reason is the extensive number of nodes defined in the map blocks. I may have to redo the RMP files and redo most of the nodes.

Yeah, I saw. If it proves to be correct, naturally I'll offer my help.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 09, 2014, 08:30:40 pm
Yeah, I saw. If it proves to be correct, naturally I'll offer my help.

I'm currently more inclined to think that the issue is related with the nightly versions but I'm keeping an eye first for more reports of this bug. Thanks for the offer of help :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: pkrcel on September 10, 2014, 02:54:02 pm
Sic! All clues indicate that the terrain pack causes crashes  :'( due to aforementioned "buggy RMP".....hope there's a better solution than having you manually fix the files...


EDIT:
I edited the savegame to xform it in a Geoscape savegme (right befre the mission I was doing, so), and if I try again the mission I get the message:

[10-09-2014 14:07:29]   [FATAL]   MAPS/COMRCURBAN19.MAP not found

but I'm baffled, all I've done is compile the lateest git hoping it would allow to recover from the crash (but as SupSuper said, the being-played missions are unrecoverable :( )

I also re-installed the Terrain Pack 2.1 but the error persists?

EDIT: By the way also openxcom 1.0 show the same error....

EDIT2: well of course, the said set is NOT in the terrain pack.


Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 10, 2014, 07:08:45 pm
Version 2.2 uploaded!

Changes:
* Added Solarius maps and updated tilesets
* Dawn City tiles rebalanced as asked by Dioxine

EDIT:
I edited the savegame to xform it in a Geoscape savegme (right befre the mission I was doing, so), and if I try again the mission I get the message:

[10-09-2014 14:07:29]   [FATAL]   MAPS/COMRCURBAN19.MAP not found

Yes. The COMRCURBAN19.MAP isn't present on 2.1 because I made a mistake. Sorry about that. S... happens sometimes (check attached pic)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on September 10, 2014, 07:53:31 pm
Good !!!!
I need this for my car too !!!!!! ;D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: pkrcel on September 10, 2014, 09:29:13 pm


Yes. The COMRCURBAN19.MAP isn't present on 2.1 because I made a mistake. Sorry about that. S... happens sometimes (check attached pic)


LOL it took me a fair amount if time to get was wrong in the pic!!!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 10, 2014, 09:32:46 pm
It looks like a GTA situational screenshot. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: VSx86 on September 11, 2014, 12:12:38 am
Updated Russian translations for Terrain+Missions Pack inside attached file.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: eXalted on September 11, 2014, 01:22:36 am
Some fast work here!

So version 2.2. includes the commercial and jungle temples tilesets?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 11, 2014, 01:27:13 am
Some fast work here!

So version 2.2. includes the commercial and jungle temples tilesets?

Yes, it includes the Commercial, Mu/Jungle and Atlantis/Desert terrains (and the necessary tilesets).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: eXalted on September 11, 2014, 01:44:48 am
Oh! Then it's time to try playing X-Com for first time with mods!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XOps on September 11, 2014, 03:40:21 am
Are all the other terror terrains supposed to be commented out? Only the commercial terror map is going to load.
Edit: attached code
Code: [Select]
#      - MADURBAN
#      - DAWNURBANA
#      - DAWNURBANB
#      - PORTURBAN
#      - INDUSTRIALURBAN
#      - URBAN
#      - RAILYARDURBAN
#      - NATIVEURBAN
      - COMRCURBAN
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 11, 2014, 04:02:41 am
Are all the other terror terrains supposed to be commented out? Only the commercial terror map is going to load.
Edit: attached code
Code: [Select]
#      - MADURBAN
#      - DAWNURBANA
#      - DAWNURBANB
#      - PORTURBAN
#      - INDUSTRIALURBAN
#      - URBAN
#      - RAILYARDURBAN
#      - NATIVEURBAN
      - COMRCURBAN

Crap, forgot about that. I've reuploaded 2.2 with that fixed. Thanks.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XOps on September 11, 2014, 06:24:52 am
Crap, forgot about that. I've reuploaded 2.2 with that fixed. Thanks.

No problem. I loaded up the new Terrain Pack and used the skirmish mode to check out the new map (very nice by the way :) ) and the commercial map came up first. I knew something was up because I am never that lucky. I usually have to exit and go back in several times to finally get to a new map.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: pkrcel on September 11, 2014, 09:44:33 am
On that note, I've had the terror missiom myself and the COmm Tileset is NEAT!

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 11, 2014, 02:21:52 pm
No problem. I loaded up the new Terrain Pack and used the skirmish mode to check out the new map (very nice by the way :) ) and the commercial map came up first. I knew something was up because I am never that lucky. I usually have to exit and go back in several times to finally get to a new map.

Well, now you know how to get the terrain you want: save the game before sending a craft to a terror site, edit the ruleset file (adding the # on the terrains you don't want) and reload the game or start skirmish mode. :)

On that note, I've had the terror missiom myself and the COmm Tileset is NEAT!

Many thanks to Solarius, Dioxine, and the others for the new tiles :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 11, 2014, 03:47:02 pm
Many thanks to Solarius, Dioxine, and the others for the new tiles :)

...Which reminded me of the credits I was supposed to provide. I'll do it today or tomorrow.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on September 12, 2014, 10:52:11 am
Hi,

first I want thanks you and friends, for the beautiful innovations!

after that I have a question

I look at UFO2000 map depot and I notice that AirField map data set depends by TFTD Port1 and Port2 tile sets.

Is it possible recover those maps with the PCKs of PortUrban ?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 12, 2014, 03:58:32 pm
Is it possible recover those maps with the PCKs of PortUrban ?

Yes, you can use the tilesets PortRoads and PortUrbits, since they are essentially Port01 and Port02 but with the palettes converted to UFO.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 12, 2014, 07:21:41 pm
Hey Hobbes, another small issue with your map (at least I THINK it is yours as most maps ever created for OXCom are :) ) This section of a barn lacks any entrances except from the roof:

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 12, 2014, 08:38:21 pm
OK, so here's the promised COMDECOR list of credits, by tile. I'm skipping your own, as well as Tentacular's bathroom bits.

17 (futuristic chair): converted by me from some old The Sims mod.
18, 19 and 20(changing room): made by me.
21 (wardrobe): made by me.
22 (destroyed wardrobe): slightly modified by me, comes from 111 in COMMERCE.
23 and 24 (standing hangers): made by me.
26 (round objects stand): made by Dioxine as a variant of 27.
27 and 28 (record stand): made by me, based on the original supermarket tile.
29 (mirror): made by me.
51 (hanging jacket): made by me.
52, 53 and 54 (hanging clothes on a rack, empty rack): made by me.
58 and 59 (cloth shelves): made by me.
60 and 61 (posters): made by Dioxine.
66 and 67 (mannequin): made by me, based on Civilian sprite.
68 (blue dress): made by me, based on some random pic on the internet.
69 (potted plant): ripped from Xenonauts.

By the way, I also ripped withered/destroyed stages of the potted plant - use them if you like.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 12, 2014, 10:00:47 pm
Hey Hobbes, another small issue with your map (at least I THINK it is yours as most maps ever created for OXCom are :) ) This section of a barn lacks any entrances except from the roof:

It's a surprise room, you need to find the secret door ;)

OK, that's fixed for the next version.

OK, so here's the promised COMDECOR list of credits, by tile. I'm skipping your own, as well as Tentacular's bathroom bits.

17 (futuristic chair): converted by me from some old The Sims mod.
18, 19 and 20(changing room): made by me.
21 (wardrobe): made by me.
22 (destroyed wardrobe): slightly modified by me, comes from 111 in COMMERCE.
23 and 24 (standing hangers): made by me.
26 (round objects stand): made by Dioxine as a variant of 27.
27 and 28 (record stand): made by me, based on the original supermarket tile.
29 (mirror): made by me.
51 (hanging jacket): made by me.
52, 53 and 54 (hanging clothes on a rack, empty rack): made by me.
58 and 59 (cloth shelves): made by me.
60 and 61 (posters): made by Dioxine.
66 and 67 (mannequin): made by me, based on Civilian sprite.
68 (blue dress): made by me, based on some random pic on the internet.
69 (potted plant): ripped from Xenonauts.

By the way, I also ripped withered/destroyed stages of the potted plant - use them if you like.

Well do you feel necessary to get into that detail, or should we credit you, Dioxine and Tentaculat for the new tiles?

Also, I'm a bit uncomfortable with using content from Xenonauts since it is copyrighted.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: myk002 on September 12, 2014, 10:10:32 pm
It's a surprise room, you need to find the secret door ;)

OK, that's fixed for the next version.
I always thought the lack of a door was intentional.  I thought it was a briliant move, actually - having sections that have to be blasted through to be explored...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 12, 2014, 10:28:30 pm
Well do you feel necessary to get into that detail, or should we credit you, Dioxine and Tentaculat for the new tiles?

Up to you, I'm totally cool with short credits.

Also, I'm a bit uncomfortable with using content from Xenonauts since it is copyrighted.

I've been using stuff ripped from other games for my mods for a decade. I never thought about it as an issue, after all making a mod implies using copyrighted material.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: pkrcel on September 12, 2014, 11:31:07 pm
Quote
making a mod implies using copyrighted material.

well...it's not really a given, you know.


Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 12, 2014, 11:40:02 pm
well...it's not really a given, you know.

Well, modifying copyrighted material (which is a mod's central function) is also prohibited. As far as I know anyway, since not even lawyers understand it and I don't really care. (I remember the popular culture being of much better quality before the introduction of copyright laws in 1994. :P )

Anyway, I never thought it'd be an issue. Meh, whatever.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: pkrcel on September 12, 2014, 11:54:15 pm
Quote
Well, modifying copyrighted material (which is a mod's central function) is also prohibited

I don't understand what you mean, modifing copyrighted material may not infringe copyright per se, particularly a game with modding support .....and that surely does not imply that doing so you are entitled to use copyrighted material from another source (which was Hobbes complaint in this case I reckon).

I'd anyway like to say that I generally agree with you, and I do not really care, nor I am particularly fond of Copyright (oh god no!)....which generated an homougus volume of the worst b*shit in human history.

But it's still a delicate issue, nevertheless.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 13, 2014, 12:11:53 am
It's a surprise room, you need to find the secret door ;)

I've found one. A secret key was needed... a secret HE key :)

Considering copyrights: I'm not sure if you're aware of that, Hobbes, but here's a Red Pill for you: you're already freely distributing copyrighted TFTD material (and, zounds! CHANGING it) :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XOps on September 13, 2014, 07:36:09 am
What! A copyright discussion on the internet?! That never happens! ;D

Hobbes, I was playing around with tiles for the Artifact Site from TFTD and converted them to UFO format by recoloring (see pics below). I always liked that level for some reason. Unfortunately, they are rather worthless at the moment given that the game cant connect these maps together automatically. Well that and right now all of the custom mission stuff is hardcoded. Regardless I wondered if you could use the .PCKs  since I'm just going to sit on them until we get more control of mission terrain types (hadn't really messed with the MCDs that much). Also I was playing around with colors and redid the ATLANTDESERT with a yellow color and was rather pleased with the result. Regardless just tell me if you would be interested in either one. If you don't need them then that's cool too. I am just trying to make it a habit to start sharing my work more. I have a bad habit of hording pretty much all of my projects to myself.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 13, 2014, 10:05:15 am
Hard to tell through that BioWare blur, but Atlantean terrain recolor seems to look really sweet. Great job! ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on September 13, 2014, 10:12:11 am
XOps, please how do you recolor the tile set ?

Do you manually change the tiles of PCK or other way ?

Thanks
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 13, 2014, 04:54:27 pm
I don't understand what you mean, modifing copyrighted material may not infringe copyright per se, particularly a game with modding support .....and that surely does not imply that doing so you are entitled to use copyrighted material from another source (which was Hobbes complaint in this case I reckon).

Considering copyrights: I'm not sure if you're aware of that, Hobbes, but here's a Red Pill for you: you're already freely distributing copyrighted TFTD material (and, zounds! CHANGING it) :D

pkrcel stated the main aspect of my point here, that Xenonauts is a completely different game (although inspired by XCom), made by a different producer. Using TFTD, Apocalypse or even the new Enemy Unknown images would be OK since it's all XCom and owned by 2K/Firaxis.

To be practical let's move on from this discussion and keep the potted plant for now.

Hobbes, I was playing around with tiles for the Artifact Site from TFTD and converted them to UFO format by recoloring (see pics below). I always liked that level for some reason. Unfortunately, they are rather worthless at the moment given that the game cant connect these maps together automatically. Well that and right now all of the custom mission stuff is hardcoded. Regardless I wondered if you could use the .PCKs  since I'm just going to sit on them until we get more control of mission terrain types (hadn't really messed with the MCDs that much). Also I was playing around with colors and redid the ATLANTDESERT with a yellow color and was rather pleased with the result. Regardless just tell me if you would be interested in either one. If you don't need them then that's cool too. I am just trying to make it a habit to start sharing my work more. I have a bad habit of hording pretty much all of my projects to myself.

The 2nd level of the Artifact site looks as if it could be used as an alternate alien base. The recoloring of the ATLANTDESERT looks weird - the color marble columns are supposed to be white on my playbook and having a landscape almost all in the same color gets tiring to the eye.

XOps, please how do you recolor the tile set ?

Do you manually change the tiles of PCK or other way ?

Thanks

The easiest way to convert tilesets from TFTD to UFO is to make a copy of the TFTD tileset you're interested and put it on the /ufo folder of MCEdit. Then open the original TFTD tileset using MCEdit, export the pck as png, open the copy of the tileset and import the png as pck.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 13, 2014, 05:15:43 pm
Maybe these colums are made from sandstone, by the sand people :) I'd help to change these greek statues to pharaohs, though - Poseidon indeed looks really weird here...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XOps on September 13, 2014, 05:23:48 pm
XOps, please how do you recolor the tile set ?

Do you manually change the tiles of PCK or other way ?

What Hobbes said will work though I used PCKview and photoshop. Recoloring in photshop is easy. Getting PCK view to work right is a bit more challenging.

The 2nd level of the Artifact site looks as if it could be used as an alternate alien base. The recoloring of the ATLANTDESERT looks weird - the color marble columns are supposed to be white on my playbook and having a landscape almost all in the same color gets tiring to the eye.
I tried using the artifact site as an alien base replacement already. Crashed out with an M_range_check error. I suspect it is because the game is trying to find the U_BASE or U_WALL02 tileset and use them as connectors between sections. Though this is just a guess.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 13, 2014, 05:33:41 pm
Maybe these colums are made from sandstone, by the sand people :) I'd help to change these greek statues to pharaohs, though - Poseidon indeed looks really weird here...

The best way to edit the columns would be to keep the grey/white color but give it a slight brown/yellow tint, so that the marble blends better than the current version. I'd love to see pharaoh statues as well :)

I tried using the artifact site as an alien base replacement already. Crashed out with an M_range_check error. I suspect it is because the game is trying to find the U_BASE or U_WALL02 tileset and use them as connectors between sections. Though this is just a guess.

I never heard that the game used those tilesets for the connections since it merely removes the unnecessary tiles on map blocks. It would be interesting to figure out what is causing the M_range_check error on your version since that issue seems to be affecting only maps with TFTD tilesets.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XOps on September 13, 2014, 06:56:06 pm
The best way to edit the columns would be to keep the grey/white color but give it a slight brown/yellow tint, so that the marble blends better than the current version. I'd love to see pharaoh statues as well :)

I can do a shading lineup if you wish then you can just pick the one you like most or pick one that's close and I can see if I can improve it any. Otherwise I won't bug you anymore about this. It is your mod after all. I'm just some punk packing a copy of photoshop.  :)

I never heard that the game used those tilesets for the connections since it merely removes the unnecessary tiles on map blocks. It would be interesting to figure out what is causing the M_range_check error on your version since that issue seems to be affecting only maps with TFTD tilesets.
Then I wonder if it is an MCD problem or an issue with imported nodes? Or both? I was using the latest nightly. It's just strange that I got the map to work after replacing the farm terrain and making a flat map for a landing zone. I did note that it had a hard time placing aliens. I may tinker with this later and see if i can get it work.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 13, 2014, 07:37:16 pm
I can do a shading lineup if you wish then you can just pick the one you like most or pick one that's close and I can see if I can improve it any. Otherwise I won't bug you anymore about this. It is your mod after all. I'm just some punk packing a copy of photoshop.  :)

The shading lineup sounds great - I had already noticed that the marble on both Atlantis and Mu terrains is a bit too bright and pristine in contrast with the surrounding terrain, so this sort of improvement would be most welcome :)

Quote
Then I wonder if it is an MCD problem or an issue with imported nodes? Or both? I was using the latest nightly. It's just strange that I got the map to work after replacing the farm terrain and making a flat map for a landing zone. I did note that it had a hard time placing aliens. I may tinker with this later and see if i can get it work.

It isn't about imported nodes, since it has been reported on Railyard, which is a completely new terrain originally created for UFO2000 that uses both UFO and TFTD tilesets. Using the maps to replace the Farm ones is normal. But the best use of Artifact Level 2 would be for Alien Base, although it's very likely that you'd have to do major edits to the MCD settings.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 13, 2014, 07:42:09 pm
Updated Russian translations for Terrain+Missions Pack inside attached file.

This is the content of the Alien Remix file:

Code: [Select]
  - type: ru
    strings:
      STR_SECTOID_FLOATER: "?????"
      STR_SECTOID_SNAKEMAN: "???????"
      STR_SECTOID_MUTON: "???????"
      STR_SECTOID_ETHEREAL: "???????"
      STR_FLOATER_SNAKEMAN: "????????????"
      STR_FLOATER_MUTON: "?????"
      STR_FLOATER_ETHEREAL: "???????"
      STR_SNAKEMAN_MUTON: "????????????"
      STR_SNAKEMAN_ETHEREAL: "????????????"
      STR_MUTON_ETHEREAL: "???????"
      STR_SECTOID_REAPER: "???????"
      STR_SECTOID_CHRYSSALID: "???????"
      STR_SECTOID_SIL_CEL: "???????"
      STR_SECTOID_SECTOPOD: "???????"
      STR_FLOATER_CYBERDISC: "?????"
      STR_FLOATER_CHRYSSALID: "?????"
      STR_FLOATER_SIL_CEL: "?????"
      STR_FLOATER_SECTOPOD: "?????"
      STR_SNAKEMAN_CYBERDISC: "????????????"
      STR_SNAKEMAN_REAPER: "????????????"
      STR_SNAKEMAN_SIL_CEL: "????????????"
      STR_SNAKEMAN_SECTOPOD: "????????????"
      STR_MUTON_CYBERDISC: "?????"
      STR_MUTON_REAPER: "?????"
      STR_MUTON_CHRYSSALID: "?????"
      STR_MUTON_SECTOPOD: "?????"
      STR_ETHEREAL_CYBERDISC: "???????"
      STR_ETHEREAL_REAPER: "???????"
      STR_ETHEREAL_CHRYSSALID: "???????"
      STR_ETHEREAL_SIL_CEL: "???????"
      STR_MIXED_ALL: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_1_1: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_1_2: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_1_3: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_2_1: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_2_2: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_2_3: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_3_1: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_3_2: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_3_3: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_5_1: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_5_2: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_5_3: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_7_1: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_7_2: "?????????"
      STR_MIXED_7_3: "?????????"
      STR_MUTON_LEADER: "?????-?????"
      STR_MUTON_COMMANDER: "?????-???????????"
      STR_MUTONCOM_CORPSE: "???? ??????-????????????"
      STR_MUTON_UFOPEDIA: "??? ???????????????? ???????? ????????? ? ????????? ????? ???????. ? ??? ?????? ??????????? ? ???????????? ? ???? ?????? ????, ??????? ?? ?????, ??? ? ?????? ????????. ?????? ?? ??, ??? ??? ????????????? ????????? ????????????? ????, ?????????? '??????????'. ??? ?????? ?????????????? ????? ???????????, ?? ??????? ??????? ??????????? ? ??? ???????. ????? ? ??? ???????????? ??????????????? ????????, ??????? ????????? ?? ?????? ????????. ???? ??? ????? ?????????? ??? ????????????? ????? ???????, ??? ????? ?????? ??????? ??? ??????-?? ??????? ??????."
      STR_CELATID_UFOPEDIA: "??? ????? ????? ???????? ?????????? ????????? ???????????? ?????? ? ???????. ??? ???????? ???????????? ?????????? ????????????? ????? ? ????????? ? ??????? ????????, ???? ???? ??? ?? ?????. ????? ??????????? ???? ??????? ???????????? ? ???????? ?????????? ?????????, ??????????? ??????????? ????? ??. ??? ???????? ????? ??????????? ???? ? ????????????? ?????????. ??? ???????????? ???? ??????? ? ?? ???????????."
      STR_SILACOID_UFOPEDIA: "??? ??????? ?????????? ?????? ????? ????? ???????? ???????? ?????????? ?????. ??? ????? ???? ??? ?????????? ??????, ??????? ????? ????? ???? ????????? ??????? ?????. ??? ???????? ????? ??????????? ????????? ? ????? ???????????????? ????? ???????? ??? ??????????, ???????? ?????????????? ???????????. ??? ????????? ????????? ? ???????????? ????? ???????."
      STR_CHRYSSALID_UFOPEDIA: "????????????? ?????? ????? ???????? ???????? ?????? ??????? ? ??????? ???. ??????? ?????????? ? ???? ????? ???????? ??????? ??? ??????? ???????? ? ????????. ?????? ????, ????? ??????? ????? ?????, ??? ??????????? ? ??? ???? ? ??????????? ??, ???????????? ?????? ? ???????? ?????. ??????? ????????? ??????????? ?? ?????? ?????? ????? ???????? ????. ?????????? ????????? ????????? ? ????? ?????????????."
      STR_REAPER_UFOPEDIA: "??? ???????? ?????????? ???????? ????? ?????? ??????? ? ?????? ??????????. ??? ????? ??? ???????? ?????????, ??????? ???????????? ??? ???????? ?? ??? ?????????????. ??????????? ?????? ????????? ????? ???????? ???? ?? ??????? ??? ????-????, ????? ??????? ? ??????????. ??????????? ?????? ????????????? ? ????????."
      STR_SECTOPOD_UFOPEDIA: "????????? - ??? ??????, ?????????? ?????? ???????? ???????. ??? ???????????? ??????? ??????????? ????? ?????????????? ????? ?? ?????????, ?????? - ??????????. ????????? ???????? ???????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ??????????."
      STR_CYBERDISC_UFOPEDIA: "??? ??????????? ?????? ???????? ??????? ???????? ?????????????????? ??????? ??????? ? ???????? ?????? ?????????? ???????????. ?????????????????? ????????? ???? ?? ??????? ???????????? ?? ???????????? ?????????. ???????? ??????????? ???????? ?????? ? ?????? ??? ??????????? ?????? ??? ??????????, ???????? ?????????."

Is this intended?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Infini on September 13, 2014, 09:25:09 pm
Code: [Select]
  - type: ru
    strings:
      STR_SECTOID_FLOATER: "Летун"
      STR_SECTOID_SNAKEMAN: "Сектоид"
      STR_SECTOID_MUTON: "Сектоид"
      STR_SECTOID_ETHEREAL: "Сектоид"
      STR_FLOATER_SNAKEMAN: "Человекозмей"
      STR_FLOATER_MUTON: "Мутон"
      STR_FLOATER_ETHEREAL: "Эфириал"
      STR_SNAKEMAN_MUTON: "Человекозмей"
      STR_SNAKEMAN_ETHEREAL: "Человекозмей"
      STR_MUTON_ETHEREAL: "Эфириал"
      STR_SECTOID_REAPER: "Сектоид"
      STR_SECTOID_CHRYSSALID: "Сектоид"
      STR_SECTOID_SIL_CEL: "Сектоид"
      STR_SECTOID_SECTOPOD: "Сектоид"
      STR_FLOATER_CYBERDISC: "Летун"
      STR_FLOATER_CHRYSSALID: "Летун"
      STR_FLOATER_SIL_CEL: "Летун"
      STR_FLOATER_SECTOPOD: "Летун"
      STR_SNAKEMAN_CYBERDISC: "Человекозмей"
      STR_SNAKEMAN_REAPER: "Человекозмей"
      STR_SNAKEMAN_SIL_CEL: "Человекозмей"
      STR_SNAKEMAN_SECTOPOD: "Человекозмей"
      STR_MUTON_CYBERDISC: "Мутон"
      STR_MUTON_REAPER: "Мутон"
      STR_MUTON_CHRYSSALID: "Мутон"
      STR_MUTON_SECTOPOD: "Мутон"
      STR_ETHEREAL_CYBERDISC: "Эфириал"
      STR_ETHEREAL_REAPER: "Эфириал"
      STR_ETHEREAL_CHRYSSALID: "Эфириал"
      STR_ETHEREAL_SIL_CEL: "Эфириал"
      STR_MIXED_ALL: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_1_1: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_1_2: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_1_3: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_2_1: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_2_2: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_2_3: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_3_1: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_3_2: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_3_3: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_5_1: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_5_2: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_5_3: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_7_1: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_7_2: "Смешанная"
      STR_MIXED_7_3: "Смешанная"
      STR_MUTON_LEADER: "Мутон-лидер"
      STR_MUTON_COMMANDER: "Мутон-командующий"
      STR_MUTONCOM_CORPSE: "Труп мутона-командующего"
      STR_MUTON_UFOPEDIA: "Эти человекоподобные существа физически и умственно очень развиты. У них особое пристрастие к употреблению в пищу сырого мяса, которое им нужно, как и земным хищникам. Похоже на то, что ими телепатически командуют представители расы, называемой 'эфириалами'. Как только телепатическая связь прерывается, их нервная система разрушается и они умирают. Также у них присутствуют кибернетические импланты, которые усиливают их боевые качества. Пока они будут находиться под командованием своих лидеров, они будут боевой пехотой для какого-то высшего разума."
      STR_CELATID_UFOPEDIA: "Эта форма жизни обладает загадочной природной способностью парить в воздухе. Она способна обнаруживать активность человеческого мозга и двигаться в сторону человека, даже если его не видно. После обнаружения цели целатид приземляется и стреляет маленькими капсулами, содержащими чрезвычайно едкий яд. Эти существа могут клонировать себя с поразительной скоростью. Они сопровождают расу мутонов в их странствиях."
      STR_SILACOID_UFOPEDIA: "Эта имеющая кремниевую основу форма жизни выделяет огромное количество тепла. Она имеет силу для разрушения камней, которые потом могут быть поглощены горячим ядром. Эти существа имеют примитивный интеллект и могут контролироваться через импланты или существами, имеющими телепатические способности. Они действуют совместно с инопланетной расой мутонов."
      STR_CHRYSSALID_UFOPEDIA: "Крабоподобные клешни этого существа являются мощным оружием в ближнем бою. Быстрый метаболизм и сила этого существа придают ему высокую скорость и ловкость. Вместо того, чтобы убивать своих жертв, оно откладывает в них яйца и впрыскивает яд, превращающий жертву в ходячего зомби. Молодой криссалид вылупляется из жертвы вскоре после введения яйца. Криссалиды действуют совместно с расой человекозмеев."
      STR_REAPER_UFOPEDIA: "Это двуногое плотоядное животное имеет мощные челюсти и крайне прожорливо. Оно имеет ряд мозговых имплантов, которые используются для контроля за его деятельностью. Примитивные хищные инстинкты этого существа едва ли годятся для чего-либо, кроме террора и разрушения. Потрошители обычно ассоциируются с летунами."
      STR_SECTOPOD_UFOPEDIA: "Сектоподы - это роботы, оснащённые мощным лазерным оружием. Эти механические монстры управляются через телепатический канал их хозяевами, обычно - эфириалами. Сектоподы являются наиболее мощным орудием террора пришельцев."
      STR_CYBERDISC_UFOPEDIA: "Эта миниатюрная версия летающей тарелки является автоматизированным оружием террора и оснащена мощным плазменным излучателем. Антигравитационный двигатель дает ей большое преимущество на пересечённой местности. Основным назначением является погром и террор под управлением боевых сил пришельцев, особенно сектоидов."

Not my translation, but maybe I can help.
The content is OK, maybe you didn't save as UTF-8
Check if the french translation is correct too.  Special character like "é" for example won't appear as it is supposed to.
 :)

Edit: I use Notepad++ Portable Edition, free and perfect for the job.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 13, 2014, 10:03:54 pm
The content is OK, maybe you didn't save as UTF-8
Check if the french translation is correct too.  Special character like "é" for example won't appear as it is supposed to.
 :)

Edit: I use Notepad++ Portable Edition, free and perfect for the job.

Yup, I also use Notepad ++ but I must have forgotten to set the ruleset file for UTF-8. The French ones are also messed up as well, could you resend those for me? Thanks.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Infini on September 13, 2014, 11:14:00 pm
I resend for sure.
It's not my intention to disappoint the French community (338 million total).

 :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 13, 2014, 11:28:38 pm
I resend for sure.
It's not my intention to disappoint the French community (338 million total).

 :)

Merci :)

I've updated version 2.2 with the door to the hidden farm building and the french and russian corrections.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XOps on September 14, 2014, 01:37:08 am
Here are some possibilities. The original is on the top left and the rest are numbered for reference. Also they are pasted over the original sand texture for reference. Keep in mind that you can mix and match tiles as well and that this is more of a rough version. I can clean up tiles a little since photoshop doesn't always convert things correctly (see 10). Let me know if something matches or hits close to the mark.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 14, 2014, 01:53:10 am
Here are some possibilities. The original is on the top left and the rest are numbered for reference. Also they are pasted over the original sand texture for reference. Keep in mind that you can mix and match tiles as well and that this is more of a rough version. I can clean up tiles a little since photoshop doesn't always convert things correctly (see 10). Let me know if something matches or hits close to the mark.

These look great! 1, 2 and 4 are the ones I like the most. You pick the final color out of those 3 :)

There are also a few tiles with small pieces of columns that the sand around them doesn't match the desert sand tone, if you got the time to fix those.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XOps on September 14, 2014, 02:45:11 am
Narrowed it down to two. Did them both because it's not that much trouble to do recolors. Try them both pick one that suits you. ATLANTDESERT1 I like a little more. I think it provides variety without clashing too much. Also I replaced the wavy TFTD sand with the basic UFO sand just as you asked so you can use those other pillar chunks now as well as some of the transition tiles. Also included are the png files in case you need to tweak things yourself.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: ivandogovich on September 14, 2014, 04:23:00 am
Just an interested observer's observation, I like the first one in the package best ALTDS1.  I think the brown tones work to breakup the yellowness of the desert better.
Cheers, Ivan :D
(this was my first pick too, from the overall sheet) ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 14, 2014, 04:42:14 am
Narrowed it down to two. Did them both because it's not that much trouble to do recolors. Try them both pick one that suits you. ATLANTDESERT1 I like a little more. I think it provides variety without clashing too much. Also I replaced the wavy TFTD sand with the basic UFO sand just as you asked so you can use those other pillar chunks now as well as some of the transition tiles. Also included are the png files in case you need to tweak things yourself.

I've redesigned the maps to use the transition tiles and tested both PCKs. The results are attached, I still think I prefer the 1st one rather than having the marble and status all yellow. Is there anything else that you think it needs to be changed?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: pkrcel on September 14, 2014, 10:50:39 am
+1 to hobbes.


Xops great works all around.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 14, 2014, 08:23:18 pm
Hi,
another issue: Commercial terrain. Pictured roof tiles were subjected to a couple of Power 140 detonations. First they change to damaged roof tiles, but then instead of perhaps disappearing, they change to some sort of indestructible broken concrete.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 14, 2014, 09:49:01 pm
I also have a bug to report. After opening these doors, they changed to vinyl record stands. (Now I can't get out.)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 14, 2014, 10:17:15 pm
Hi,
another issue: Commercial terrain. Pictured roof tiles were subjected to a couple of Power 140 detonations. First they change to damaged roof tiles, but then instead of perhaps disappearing, they change to some sort of indestructible broken concrete.

Fixed for version 2.3. Those damaged roof tiles are supposed to be indestructible btw.

I also have a bug to report. After opening these doors, they changed to vinyl record stands. (Now I can't get out.)

Fixed.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 15, 2014, 03:33:22 am
I can't seem to open your new terrains with the Mapview... (MUJUNGLE, SANDS)... any idea what the problem could be? Or perhaps I'm using an outdated program?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 15, 2014, 07:30:57 am
I can't seem to open your new terrains with the Mapview... (MUJUNGLE, SANDS)... any idea what the problem could be? Or perhaps I'm using an outdated program?

Have you added the new tilesets to the IMAGES.DAT file on the settings subfolder?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 15, 2014, 05:29:06 pm
Dammit, forgot about that. Thanks! Now it works.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 15, 2014, 06:05:00 pm
Dammit, forgot about that. Thanks! Now it works.

No problemo, it is my most common mistake with MapView :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: pkrcel on September 16, 2014, 10:13:57 pm
Hobbes, I am doing a Terror mission in the Railyard...I can't for the lif of me throw ANY object to an enemy that's on the rails.

Look at the screen, the girl with the arrow is unable to throw a grenade to the reaper position....I see no obstacles on the ballistic trajectory and also OTHER troopers cannot throw there.

Another soldier threw an incendiary grenade to the base of the fence (visible) and did quite fine, but he also could not throw at the reapers position (he did move but ended up in the same spot after the turn.

Also, it seems that most materials in Railyard are nigh indestructible....is this the expected behaviour?

EDIT: I should point out that after getting rid of the fence in ANOTHER problematic spot (with a grenade) I could then throw another grenate on the rails.

I suspect this has to do with the parabolic trajectory calculations and whatnot....nothing really in the terrain itself most prolly.


Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: ivandogovich on September 17, 2014, 12:04:05 am
The fence is blocking the trajectory to the reaper.  Blow up the fence first, then you can toss under the reaper.  Its impossible to toss items under the rear two squares of a 2x2 unit as the forward squares of the unit block the trajectory there too.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: pkrcel on September 17, 2014, 12:20:42 am
The fence is blocking the trajectory to the reaper.  Blow up the fence first, then you can toss under the reaper.

Well, of course it is but....it's counterintuitive, at least to me...being there two fences I couldn't even throw on ANY rail tile (not only the ones with the reaper...this was what baffled me.

Its impossible to toss items under the rear two squares of a 2x2 unit as the forward squares of the unit block the trajectory there too.

THIS is something that bothers me also in confined spaces....it's perfectly possible but not in openXcom  ;D

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: ivandogovich on September 17, 2014, 01:24:05 am
Of course the alternative is to "Air Burst" it.  If you have grenades set to blow up on contact and you have explosives damage more than one leve., you can trow it to the tile above the Reaper and blow it up from above. ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: pkrcel on September 17, 2014, 12:20:10 pm
Nothing that complicated, I was only thinking that the arcinshot property fo the grenade is a bit off when you're (i.e.) in a low corridor....in that case you simply throw the grenade in a mostly straight trajectory having it "roll on the floor" (not literally!).

The distances involved are of at most of some meters...no need for a "classic" ballistic trajectory, no?

Same applies to launching a grenade unde the belly of a Cyberdisk or similar....

Anyway I can live with that, it was only a matter of taking the right measures  ;D in my first Railyard mission.

I still stand on the indestructible part thou, In the end mission I unloaded several autocannon HE rounds and a couple rockes on a wall and it went unscathed.... :o



Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 17, 2014, 05:54:39 pm
I still stand on the indestructible part thou, In the end mission I unloaded several autocannon HE rounds and a couple rockes on a wall and it went unscathed.... :o

The main culprit is that Railyard uses Port (TFTD terrain) tilesets and they have the same armor settings as in TFTD. Personally this limits the use of explosives and using gunfire to clear terrain and blocks LoF, forcing you to use other tactics, which is a nice change included on the pack, although I do understand that people who never played TFTD will have to adjust :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: pkrcel on September 17, 2014, 06:01:22 pm
Well, okay...it was blast nontheless (even more actually) but since I HAD to slalom through a lot of things to get those floaters it felt a bit 'unnatural', if I may say so  :P

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 19, 2014, 12:12:12 am
Autocannon is feather weight, use Heavy Rockets and High Explosive and you'll see that this terrain is quite destructible with a proper approach :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 19, 2014, 03:21:31 am
Autocannon is feather weight, use Heavy Rockets and High Explosive and you'll see that this terrain is quite destructible with a proper approach :)

"Any problem on Earth can be solved with the careful application of high explosives" :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: pkrcel on September 19, 2014, 07:18:11 am
Right, but I used an HE auto cannon burst, TWO rockets and a satchel charge. I hoped to open at least a tiny hole .....

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 19, 2014, 05:07:37 pm
Right, but I used an HE auto cannon burst, TWO rockets and a satchel charge. I hoped to open at least a tiny hole .....

Hmmm, the thing is that on TFTD you can't bring the Hydro Jet Cannon and the Torpedo Launcher (the equivalents for the cannon and rocket) to Port missions since those weapons won't work on land, and the terrain is really designed to negate the use of explosives to demolish buildings.

This brings (again) the question of whether to scale down the armor on those Port tiles. IMHO I'd rather keep it as it is since missions in those terrains are different than the old chore of blasting all cover and use scout/snipers to pick the aliens.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 19, 2014, 06:25:49 pm
Magna Pack & Sonic Pulsers are still a fair game, tho... not even mentioning exploding biodrones or the fact that sonic blasta & cannon punch through those walls with ease :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: pkrcel on September 19, 2014, 07:14:36 pm
I certainly don't need those to be  destructible,  it only *feels* weird that explosive blasts fail to damage the walls.....
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 20, 2014, 09:30:48 am
I just think Port bricks shouldn't be stronger than non-Port bricks. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 20, 2014, 09:50:29 am
They're hardened pink industrial bricks, man :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: mercy on September 20, 2014, 11:06:07 am
Awesome work. Please continue.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on September 20, 2014, 11:28:35 am
I like differences on play different scenarious  8)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 20, 2014, 11:32:50 am
I like differences on play different scenarious  8)

Me too, and?

This doesn't justify inexplicable properties of the game world.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on September 20, 2014, 01:29:10 pm
Bricks are actually fine, if a bit tough. My issue with these maps are tiles that are *really* and inexplicably indestructible, like striped barriers (?!?), some wooden/glass roofs and corrugated sheet huts... :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 20, 2014, 01:55:57 pm
I have another one-way stairs bug to report:
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 20, 2014, 04:01:12 pm
I have another one-way stairs bug to report:

Does it become completely impossible to move down the stairs on all 3 sides?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 21, 2014, 12:04:48 am
Does it become completely impossible to move down the stairs on all 3 sides?

I think so. Clicking anywhere beyond the pyramid gives the "Not enough time units!" message, and the soldier doesn't go anywhere.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 21, 2014, 01:13:48 am
I think so. Clicking anywhere beyond the pyramid gives the "Not enough time units!" message, and the soldier doesn't go anywhere.

If you wait a couple of turns you'll see Aztec warriors coming out of the pyramid, grabbing your soldier and sacrifice him on the top of the pyramid by cutting his heart and offering it to the alien gods while your soldier is still alive ... ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: ivandogovich on September 21, 2014, 01:15:16 am
Yeah, that map is just beautiful!  <drools>
Cheers, Ivan :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on September 21, 2014, 02:20:17 am
If you wait a couple of turns you'll see Aztec warriors coming out of the pyramid, grabbing your soldier and sacrifice him on the top of the pyramid by cutting his heart and offering it to the alien gods while your soldier is still alive ... ;)

She didn't wait, she shot her way out of the trap. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 21, 2014, 04:32:40 am
She didn't wait, she shot her way out of the trap. :)

Good for her ;)

From what I've seen it is the same previous issue with Dawn's stairs. I'll need to edit those maps.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on September 28, 2014, 03:13:46 am
Tanks can't climb my stairs, do you know what causes this?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 28, 2014, 04:54:00 pm
Tanks can't climb my stairs, do you know what causes this?

I need more info. What terrain/tileset? Can you post pics?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on September 28, 2014, 07:54:44 pm
I need more info. What terrain/tileset? Can you post pics?
I'm talking about my tiles, I hoped you could hint me to a cause.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on September 28, 2014, 08:29:14 pm
I'm talking about my tiles, I hoped you could hint me to a cause.

Can you post the tileset? Does it only happen to large units?
Title: UFO may land on water
Post by: VSx86 on October 03, 2014, 12:11:22 am
Someone was found this recently, but I'm encoutnered this event today during playing while multiple mods enabled at same time:
 
YetMoreUFOs
 
Terrain_Pack  \
Missions_Pack |> all from Terrain/Missions Pack mod
Alien_Remix   /
 
Expanded_UBase
AlienInventory
men_in_black
MoriartyArmor
 
There's saved game where you may see the UFO landing on water near west African coast (but don't forget to install those mods first).
I suspect this gameplay glitch happens because of Terrain/Missions Pack.

2nd screenshot below shows which terrain used for the ground mission.
Title: Atlantis Desert recoloring needed
Post by: Hobbes on October 03, 2014, 05:19:20 am
Someone was found this recently, but I'm encoutnered this event today during playing while multiple mods enabled at same time:
 
YetMoreUFOs
 
Terrain_Pack  \
Missions_Pack |> all from Terrain/Missions Pack mod
Alien_Remix   /
 
Expanded_UBase
AlienInventory
men_in_black
MoriartyArmor
 
There's saved game where you may see the UFO landing on water near west African coast (but don't forget to install those mods first).
I suspect this gameplay glitch happens because of Terrain/Missions Pack.

2nd screenshot below shows which terrain used for the ground mission.

I think I got this fixed (after finally understanding how missionZones work), so I'll be posting a fix soon.

I've also figured out the issue with the stairs on Mu Jungle, and the solution isn't as bad (complicated) as I initially thought.

But the bad news is that it is currently impossible to use the stairs on Atlantis Desert because the OXC engine doesn't allow for stairs composed of 3 tiles (as some are on TFTD), only 2 tiles. The possible solution is to replace the stairs with those used on Mu Jungle but for that I will need someone to recolor the Mu Jungle tiles below with the current color of the Atlantis Desert stairs.
Title: Re: Atlantis Desert recoloring needed
Post by: Falko on October 03, 2014, 06:06:27 am
The possible solution is to replace the stairs with those used on Mu Jungle but for that I will need someone to recolor the Mu Jungle tiles below with the current color of the Atlantis Desert stairs.
done
i think i only found MU.PCK in my tftd terrain folder and assumed thats is mu-jungle
so here a transformation into dessert style
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XOps on October 03, 2014, 06:42:12 am
It was either the color Falko made, or I think one of the cool brown colors. Sadly I can't remember which was decided on. I've spent all my time working on mods rather than actually enjoying them. I attached the other brown. Let me know if the shade or brightness is off or discard if it was the other color used.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 03, 2014, 02:25:11 pm
done
i think i only found MU.PCK in my tftd terrain folder and assumed thats is mu-jungle
so here a transformation into dessert style

It was either the color Falko made, or I think one of the cool brown colors. Sadly I can't remember which was decided on. I've spent all my time working on mods rather than actually enjoying them. I attached the other brown. Let me know if the shade or brightness is off or discard if it was the other color used.

Thank you both for your work.

Your (XOps) tiles are of the correct color, so I used those. I've finished the fixes to both Atlantis Desert and Mu Jungle and from the looks of what works/not regarding tiles, someone is going to have some work implementing those terrains on TFTD, since the currently engine is particularly demanding concerning stairs.

I also spend more time right now developing mods than actually playing them. ;)

Now I only need to fix the Mission_Pack ruleset to prevent more UFOs being generated at the sea but that will need some testing before I can publish the fix.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XOps on October 03, 2014, 09:15:09 pm
Hobbes, I know this might delay the release a bit, but would be interested in a another shading lineup for the MU tileset like we did with DesertAtlantis? It will be a little more involved than the desert set, but I think I have some ideas that would allow the set to blend better with the jungle tileset.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 03, 2014, 09:18:26 pm
Hobbes, I know this might delay the release a bit, but would be interested in a another shading lineup for the MU tileset like we did with DesertAtlantis? It will be a little more involved than the desert set, but I think I have some ideas that would allow the set to blend better with the jungle tileset.

I can wait - I'm only going to fix the missionZones now and I had already thought before that the Mu stone tiles could probably need a little rework to fit better with the Jungle terrain. Do your best :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XOps on October 04, 2014, 03:36:18 am
As I said this one is a bit more involved. The MU tileset has very little texture and a simple recolor is unlikely to make it match with the very grainy jungle terrain. As such I have included other options such as patchy stains and vine growth. All samples are pasted over the basic jungle ground tile.  Recommendations: C8, C9, C10, C11, C12 (though C11 and 12 may be a bit too green), F5, F6, F8, and F9.

A few other things to keep in mind.
Some of the areas that are super bright green i can clean up in the final version
I can mix and match these as needed.
Also If it won't mess with the map order I could also include a vine and non vine version so you could have clear sections of the temple like near the top.
I also will fix those transition tiles and replace the sea weeds with something useful like rubble or some hanging vines or something.

Let me know if something hits the mark or gets close.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 04, 2014, 04:50:16 am
As I said this one is a bit more involved. The MU tileset has very little texture and a simple recolor is unlikely to make it match with the very grainy jungle terrain. As such I have included other options such as patchy stains and vine growth. All samples are pasted over the basic jungle ground tile.  Recommendations: C8, C9, C10, C11, C12 (though C11 and 12 may be a bit too green), F5, F6, F8, and F9.

A few other things to keep in mind.
Some of the areas that are super bright green i can clean up in the final version
I can mix and match these as needed.
Also If it won't mess with the map order I could also include a vine and non vine version so you could have clear sections of the temple like near the top.
I also will fix those transition tiles and replace the sea weeds with something useful like rubble or some hanging vines or something.

Let me know if something hits the mark or gets close.

Those look great. I'd say we try a few of your suggestions (C8, C9, C10, F5, F8, F9) to see how they look in game. :)

One thing is that the 4 initial ground tiles are used a lot on the pyramid inner chambers so it might be better to keep those clean of vines so I don't have to replace all those tiles. But you can replace the sea weeds and sand tiles for vine versions, hanging vines, rubble, etc. as you want as they currently aren't used at all.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Falko on October 04, 2014, 05:06:47 am
wow you put a lot of thought and work into that
my little experiment consisted only of clicking through my tools for a minute so kudos to you :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: new_civilian on October 04, 2014, 02:34:19 pm
Hello, just dropping in quickly! This mod has to be one of the best single map mods outthere. Your new terrain add so much to the game, it is incredible, it's a new game now. Thanks for all!  :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on October 04, 2014, 09:03:32 pm
Can you post the tileset? Does it only happen to large units?
Sorry for the super-late answer.  :-[

Yes, it happens only with large units.

I've attached the map and the terrains.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 04, 2014, 10:13:33 pm
Hello, just dropping in quickly! This mod has to be one of the best single map mods outthere. Your new terrain add so much to the game, it is incredible, it's a new game now. Thanks for all!  :)

Thanks. Glad you're enjoying it :)

Sorry for the super-late answer.  :-[

Yes, it happens only with large units.

I've attached the map and the terrains.

First, impressive work. The issue seems to be that you cannot have a wall on the same tile as the stair or the unit (small or large) won't be able to climb the stairs. I had the same issue on the Mu Jungle terrain. 
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on October 04, 2014, 10:38:49 pm
Thanks.
Small units do climb it though.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 04, 2014, 10:56:38 pm
Thanks.
Small units do climb it though.

OK, just tested with removing the walls and this is a bug. This is most likely caused because stairs on the original UFO were always supposed to only be used by small units, although they could also be used by large ones and on OXC no one considered large units going up stairs.

This also is making me wonder if the stairs issues I had with Dawn City and Mu Jungle weren't caused by this same bug.

EDIT: I'm having this issue with Mu Jungle (Large Units cannot go up stairs) but not with Desert Atlantis. This is very weird.

EDIT2: And now the bug that prevented units from going down stairs is back on Mu Jungle where before it was gone. I wonder if this is happening as well on the regular terrains.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on October 04, 2014, 11:37:25 pm
Guess tanks just can't into stairs.  :P
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 04, 2014, 11:38:55 pm
Guess tanks just can't into stairs.  :P

I think there are 2 bugs involved: one regarding TU calculation that prevents units from getting downwards since I get a 'Not Enough TUs available', it affects Mu Jungle and possibly yours (could you check?); the second prevents large units from getting to the second level and I suspect it may be something to do with OXC preventing situations on the original game where HWPs could climb single stairs but then would be stuck and unable to get down. I'll report these situations on the bug tracker and see if we get some word from the developers.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on October 04, 2014, 11:45:21 pm
Just checked: my small units can climb down those stairs.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 05, 2014, 12:08:17 am
Just checked: my small units can climb down those stairs.

Good, but the crazy thing is that on the same map my small units can go down some stairs but cannot go down in others, depending on the orientation, which is completing baffling to me  :o

Your bug is also happening on the Mu Jungle 2x2 stairs.

Let's see if we hear anything from the bug report I posted here (https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/836)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on October 05, 2014, 04:59:12 pm
I just had to share this... Hobbes' quality unit spawning in action :)

I'd call it a bit sloppish if it wasn't pure, distilled EVIL, sir :)

(for those who don't know Piratez, everyone but our favorite black guy is a civilian... some of them, former ones. Also, this is start of Turn 2)

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 05, 2014, 06:27:19 pm
I just had to share this... Hobbes' quality unit spawning in action :)

I'd call it a bit sloppish if it wasn't pure, distilled EVIL, sir :)

(for those who don't know Piratez, everyone but our favorite black guy is a civilian... some of them, former ones. Also, this is start of Turn 2)

How many aliens/civilians do you have set to spawn and what's the map size?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on October 05, 2014, 08:40:39 pm
50x50 size, 16 civilians (although only 10 were actually spawned - 9 here, the tenth one somewhere else and thankfully he got mercifully shot by a Cultist of Sirius with a lowest-possible-callibre round on Turn 1 so he was spared witnessing this horror :) )

About the aliens, it's an almost unmodified Superhuman terror spawn - about 30 creatures total, give or take.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 05, 2014, 11:28:00 pm
About the aliens, it's an almost unmodified Superhuman terror spawn - about 30 creatures total, give or take.

IIRC that's about twice the number of aliens on terror sites on the original game.

I guess the authorities should stop their warnings for the civilian population to 'gather on designated areas for evacuation'  during attacks ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XOps on October 07, 2014, 12:43:04 am
Here are some early samples. I am using up all the transition tiles to do non vine versions of a lot of the tiles. The Vines look good, but when they are all together they tend to look like a pattern which is rather strange for random vegetation. I haven' tried all of the variants yet, but these are the strongest contenders so far. I am leaning a bit towards the dark gray, but the lighter gray looks really good too. Medium and heavy grain differences are very slight (you may have to zoom in really close to see the difference). I will give the heavy brown stained set a try to before I start trying to tidy these up and move towards a final version.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 07, 2014, 01:05:01 am
Here are some early samples. I am using up all the transition tiles to do non vine versions of a lot of the tiles. The Vines look good, but when they are all together they tend to look like a pattern which is rather strange for random vegetation. I haven' tried all of the variants yet, but these are the strongest contenders so far. I am leaning a bit towards the dark gray, but the lighter gray looks really good too. Medium and heavy grain differences are very slight (you may have to zoom in really close to see the difference). I will give the heavy brown stained set a try to before I start trying to tidy these up and move towards a final version.

Those look really good! I can't really tell which one I like the most :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: ivandogovich on October 07, 2014, 01:12:15 am
Light Gray!  It will let units stand out more, both Sectoids, Paper Suit Soldiers, and Power & Flying Armor troops too.  Nice work!
Medium grain is best imo, too.

Cheers, Ivan :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Arthanor on October 07, 2014, 02:33:46 am
Dark Grey Med Grain for me! The repeating pattern is more visible in the light grey version and it fits better with being old/dirty.

Just need a few more people now and we'll have one vote for every kind ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on October 07, 2014, 03:39:01 am
OMG each one of these tilesets is so awesome. Pixel art at its best, you've beaten graphic limitations of the engine! I like dark grey/blue the best I think :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on October 07, 2014, 10:38:22 am
Those look really good! I can't really tell which one I like the most :)

Me too ...

What do you think about that ?

Code: [Select]
  - name: MUJUNGLE
    mapDataSets:
      - BLANKS
      - SANDS
      - MUJUNGLE
      - JUNGLE
    alternativeDataSets:
      - [JUNGLE, JUNGLE_1]
      - [MUJUNGLE, MUJUNGLE_1, MUJUNGLE_2]

Hypotetically the terrain generation algorithm could randomize the tilesets
(them have to be perfectly compatible)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 07, 2014, 03:24:04 pm
Code: [Select]
  - name: MUJUNGLE
    mapDataSets:
      - BLANKS
      - SANDS
      - MUJUNGLE
      - JUNGLE
    alternativeDataSets:
      - [JUNGLE, JUNGLE_1]
      - [MUJUNGLE, MUJUNGLE_1, MUJUNGLE_2]

Hypotetically the terrain generation algorithm could randomize the tilesets
(them have to be perfectly compatible)

This could be useful in this case, or any future tilesets designed to take advantage of it, but in general I think the existing tilesets don't allow for this type of simple color variation. The issue is that Mu and Atlantis tilesets are designed around a single color but for the other terrains you'd have to make a complete reskin (like someone did for the Urban tilesets on civilian's map pack).

Reskins are OK but for me it would be better if someone took the time instead to design a completely different terrain since that adds more variety than a recoloring. I think it's also more rewarding for a graphics artist to create something new like XOps is doing here by combining both Mu and Jungle graphics to fit together and make something new (based on existing terrains but still something new).

In short, I'm not against this in general, I just question if it will be worth the effort.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on October 07, 2014, 08:46:12 pm
I respect your influential opinion.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 07, 2014, 09:31:22 pm
I respect your influential opinion.

 ::)

(https://mountainrepublic.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/question-authority.jpg)

I'm more being practical since I prefer to see the Terrain Pack available to everyone using version 1.0 of OpenXCom, rather than having a mod that depends on beta builds.

Have you seen Volutar's proposal for Map Generation? Maybe your idea could be integrated there to be used later in the future.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: davide on October 07, 2014, 10:31:51 pm
Yes I agree

I spooke some weeks ago with Volutar but after that I have some poblems at my home
(a tube in mine bathroom had a leak .. :'(. )

I cannot did anything after that ...

Today I resynch night source code build with mine mod but I have  a regression with my previous result
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on October 09, 2014, 04:37:24 am
IIRC that's about twice the number of aliens on terror sites on the original game.

Not really. While the max number of deployed aliens is 16 as you say, there are also up to 10 terror units with them, which gives a total of 26, already very close to 30 :P Now I see that I've increased the max number of rank and file enemies by about 5 or so, but 26 to 31 seems like a rather small difference. Also I've never seen this strange civilian behaviour on Luke's maps, original maps, or Railyard :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XOps on October 10, 2014, 06:03:27 pm
Not really. While the max number of deployed aliens is 16 as you say, there are also up to 10 terror units with them, which gives a total of 26, already very close to 30 :P Now I see that I've increased the max number of rank and file enemies by about 5 or so, but 26 to 31 seems like a rather small difference. Also I've never seen this strange civilian behavior on Luke's maps, original maps, or Railyard :)

I did an experiment not too far back where I upped the number of civilians to 50 on the default terror map. I noticed similar spawning behavior where it would put them in clumps around nodes. I think when too many units are on the map, the game starts placing civilians around nodes if most other nodes are taken up as I theorize that the game gives priority to the aliens for spawning. That's just a guess though.

At any rate I have finished the recolors. The heavy stained brown tileset was a bust, but at least it was easily eliminated. I have included the three best looking sets.
Dark Blue Gray with medium grain.
Dark Gray with medium grain.
Light Gray with medium grain.
MUJUNGLE.MCD The MCD file that has the extra data for the replaced tiles. Note that I did not add any tiles, only replace old unused tiles so the tile order wouldn't be messed up.

A few extra notes
The extra tiles have the vines on them where as the default tiles have only the green stains. This means that the current maps will mostly have to have their exteriors reworked. The full vine versions can be placed onto the current maps to vary up the appearance without looking like a repeating pattern. Regardless the maps will likely benefit from being reworked.
Also I did include the three versions that looked the best. I really can't say which one I like best. As far as I am concerned, it is Hobbes's mod so he gets final say. More than likely we will have to wait for Hobbes to touch up the maps to see how they will look.

Just let me know if there are any bugs or tiles that need to be touched up. Transparency can be an issue for darker tiles and I have tried to make sure I got all of the holes, but I sometimes miss these during conversions.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 10, 2014, 07:38:12 pm
OK, just redid a couple of the pyramids using the recolored tilesets. Then I tested all of the colors to see which ones fit better the new pyramids. The pictures of the 3 different colors are in attachment. I think Light Grey can be discarded since it the green vines over the white masonry doesn't look that good. In comparison Dark Grey looks a lot better, but I still think there's too much contrast between the vines and masonry, so my favorite one at the moment, and perhaps not surprisingly since it was the one I chose to redo those 2 pyramids is Blue Grey.

I added all of those additional tiles you redesign, plus I had to remove a lot of vegetation to the top of the pyramids because of stair bug issues.

What do you guys think of the color and pyramid redesign? I'll also post pics of the whole battlescape using the 3 colors.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 10, 2014, 07:38:56 pm
And here are the battlescape pics.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Arthanor on October 10, 2014, 08:01:22 pm
I agree with you about the light grey having too much contrast. I prefer the dark grey, because of the brown giving it a kind of dirty feel. The blue grey is not bad at all, but it is very uniform under the vines, making it look like clean dark stones instead of something old.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: ivandogovich on October 10, 2014, 09:15:31 pm
Of the three: Blue Grey is best!  - its distinctive enough that sectoids and soldiers wont blend in. :)
Cheers, Ivan :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 10, 2014, 10:05:39 pm
Hmmm. Looking better at the pics, one thing needed is to remove the green 'squares' underneath the vegetation. That would help the plants to mix with the masonry underneath. I'll try doing that later on and then editing a few more pyramids to check how it would look.

Edit: redid the Jungle tileset to remove all of the green 'ground' squares and renamed it JungleBits. Redid all the the maps with the reworked tilesets. Here are the 3 different versions.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: new_civilian on October 11, 2014, 11:31:29 am
Wow, you are a real X-Com graphics artist!  :o

Just an idea: What about an Polar Ice-Station terrain, you know, like in "The Thing from another World"?  :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on October 13, 2014, 02:26:53 pm
I did an experiment not too far back where I upped the number of civilians to 50 on the default terror map. I noticed similar spawning behavior where it would put them in clumps around nodes. I think when too many units are on the map, the game starts placing civilians around nodes if most other nodes are taken up as I theorize that the game gives priority to the aliens for spawning. That's just a guess though.

Indeed, this is correct observation. A map has only a limited number of civilian/alien units it can safely place. For Dawn City, Industrial & Port, the limit seems to be around vanilla Veteran level (abnormal behaviour has been spotted on these maps with vanilla Superhuman), or, 25 or so units total.

Another observations is that after playing these maps many times, the deployment and movement patterns for aliens seem to be much more predictable than in vanilla maps, Luke's Terror, or Railyard.

So my final diagnosis is: these maps contain too few nodes, including spawning nodes.

While it is obvious that maps cannot cover for unnaturally high deployments, I think the error margins taken here are simply too narrow (since the number of spawn points seems insufficient even for vanilla Superhuman deployments, and goes haywire with as little as 20% larger spawn). I'd advise doubling the number of nodes for every map block, as I see no reason for not doing it - the 128 limit per map block is very, very high, and it'd allow both to avoid errors, and make enemy spawning/movements much less predictable.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 13, 2014, 06:05:00 pm
Wow, you are a real X-Com graphics artist!  :o

Just an idea: What about an Polar Ice-Station terrain, you know, like in "The Thing from another World"?  :)

Hey there. Thanks for the idea, it has already been suggested before. Who knows in the future?

Indeed, this is correct observation. A map has only a limited number of civilian/alien units it can safely place. For Dawn City, Industrial & Port, the limit seems to be around vanilla Veteran level (abnormal behaviour has been spotted on these maps with vanilla Superhuman), or, 25 or so units total.

Another observations is that after playing these maps many times, the deployment and movement patterns for aliens seem to be much more predictable than in vanilla maps, Luke's Terror, or Railyard.

So my final diagnosis is: these maps contain too few nodes, including spawning nodes.

While it is obvious that maps cannot cover for unnaturally high deployments, I think the error margins taken here are simply too narrow (since the number of spawn points seems insufficient even for vanilla Superhuman deployments, and goes haywire with as little as 20% larger spawn). I'd advise doubling the number of nodes for every map block, as I see no reason for not doing it - the 128 limit per map block is very, very high, and it'd allow both to avoid errors, and make enemy spawning/movements much less predictable.

Just ran a few tests on Superhuman difficulty level. This issue is very dependent on a few conditions:
* The number of civilians deployed. The numbers of civilians observed varied between 6 and 12. It was only when there was more than 10 civilians that I saw this happening.
* The number of aliens, for the same reasons above, but I didn't check particularly for those. But in Superhuman the max number of aliens present is 18 and the average would be around 12. So, in a few cases you'd get the max numbers of 30 aliens and civilians per battlescape but the average will less than 20.
* The type of maps present. Not surprisingly the only time I saw 6 civilians packed into the same spawn node was in a map with roads and a lot of open spaces. As a general rule (and used on the vanilla road maps) there is no spawing of units in those open map blocks.

One additional thing about nodes is that they are used by the aliens for patrolling, which means that the alien uses them when it doesn't know the location of any XCom units. If it is already engaged it will not use the nodes. So, if you set the nodes to use all possible approaches, then your maps are good, you don't need to define more movement patterns. The best example for this is TFTD, were the nodes are limited to the barest possible.

And this is my approach since extra nodes won't really change anything (other than giving me too much work for minimal gains) - a couple more can be added or switched for spawning on the unusual situations where vanilla generates a lot of aliens - but how the aliens move when engaged is dependent on the AI, not the nodes or their connections.

Edit: OK, I'll look into remaking the nodes on the Dawn City, Industrial or Port to fit more numbers of aliens/civilians. But this can have other side effects for the vanilla alien deployments, like having a lot of aliens/civilians starting out in the open, making them easy pickings.

This issue of mod compatibility is simply tricky because there are certain ratios on vanilla that I would rather follow.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on October 14, 2014, 03:22:01 pm
I'd advise to simply add more spawn nodes inside buildings - note how a vanilla barn has 5-6 spawn points, while Industrial/Port buildings seem to have 1 to 3.

While this is true that the AI overtakes unit movement when they're no longer in Patrol mode, their positions become unpredictable only if you linger too long around your LZ - my tactics however dictate an ideal of killing as much as half of the enemies before Turn 3 ends, to capitalize on Warboy's "AI don't use grenades before turn 3" rule and cause mass panic, helping to fight isolated and well-hidden enemies who would be a real pain (as in, inevitable losses) to hunt down otherise.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 14, 2014, 07:38:57 pm
While this is true that the AI overtakes unit movement when they're no longer in Patrol mode, their positions become unpredictable only if you linger too long around your LZ - my tactics however dictate an ideal of killing as much as half of the enemies before Turn 3 ends, to capitalize on Warboy's "AI don't use grenades before turn 3" rule and cause mass panic, helping to fight isolated and well-hidden enemies who would be a real pain (as in, inevitable losses) to hunt down otherise.

I play almost the same way as you do: I use the first turns to expand the perimeter and kill as many aliens as quickly as possible, using a ton of high explosives and scout and snipe. That way you avoid getting hit by several aliens at the same time. However, this sort of tactics also advises against spawning too many aliens on the same location. A simple High Explosive or rocket is enough to kill all of them.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: VSx86 on October 15, 2014, 01:14:10 am
Are most latest version of this T/M Pack is compatible with PirateZ!, Final Mod Pack, and Xeno Operations mods?
In PirateZ! i seen
Quote
Version optimized for Piratez mod. Hobbes Terrain version 1.9.8.

(this written in Piratez_Compatible_Terrain_Pack.rul)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on October 15, 2014, 12:57:28 pm
I think it is compatible.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 15, 2014, 04:10:17 pm
Are most latest version of this T/M Pack is compatible with PirateZ!, Final Mod Pack, and Xeno Operations mods?
In PirateZ! i seen
(this written in Piratez_Compatible_Terrain_Pack.rul)

The FMP already includes the Terrain Pack but you should ask on the relevant thread whether the latest version is compatible or not. I have no idea about the Xeno Operations mod.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on October 15, 2014, 04:16:23 pm
The FMP already includes the Terrain Pack but you should ask on the relevant thread whether the latest version is compatible or not. I have no idea about the Xeno Operations mod.

In FMP it is, and always will be. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: XOps on October 15, 2014, 04:21:13 pm
Are most latest version of this T/M Pack is compatible with PirateZ!, Final Mod Pack, and Xeno Operations mods?

It is compatible with Xeno Ops. The Mission Pack part is not (messes with deployment) and the Alien Remix would cause some issues, but the Terrain Pack part works fine. There were a few hangups, but those were on Xeno Ops side and they should be fixed now.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: new_civilian on October 15, 2014, 04:25:34 pm
It is also compatible with the Piratez mod, Dioxine added a compatibility rulset.  :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on October 15, 2014, 08:52:57 pm
It is also compatible with the Piratez mod, Dioxine added a compatibility rulset.  :)

It is compatible even without it, a player just won't be getting extra civilian types OR Luke's Expanded Terror city maps OR your improved farm terrain without it :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 16, 2014, 12:21:10 am
Version 2.4 almost finished. List of changes:
* Added more spawn points to Dawn City, Industrial and Port terrains
* Added new Mu Jungle tilesets, with the contribution of XOps for the recoloring of the MUJUNGLE tileset.
* Fixed issue with Alien Raid UFO appearing over the sea
* Removed Alien Hive and Hunt missions from the Missions Pack
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: VSx86 on October 16, 2014, 03:27:33 am
* Removed Alien Hive and Hunt missions from the Missions Pack
Where are they now? Is they removed forever, or they will be imported to some other mod?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 16, 2014, 08:22:59 am
Where are they now? Is they removed forever, or they will be imported to some other mod?

I removed them because I ended up disliking the ruleset solution and currently it's only possible to add them as UFO missions, which doesn't work that well. Maybe I'll add them later in the future.

The mod site seems to be down, so here's a link to download version 2.4 (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/18824603/Terrain%20Pack%20v2.4.zip)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on October 16, 2014, 03:24:05 pm
Nice :)

One request: this plant here cannot be stepped upon, which is a bit weird. How about changing it?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 16, 2014, 05:37:57 pm
Nice :)

One request: this plant here cannot be stepped upon, which is a bit weird. How about changing it?

That's how the plant is configured in the original tileset.

The .zip file didn't contain the updated Mu Jungle, that's why your pic has all that sand. I've replaced the .zip file with the correct one.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on October 16, 2014, 06:14:04 pm
That's how the plant is configured in the original tileset.

I fail to understand why it's of any importance. All the more reason to mod the game if it's imperfect. :)

Of course I don't really care about this particular object too much, but there are more things to fix, despite them being in the original tileset. Like that blue roof in the Port terrain, which you can fly through; it's been like then in RFTD, but it didn't matter, as you couldn't fly in that game.

The .zip file didn't contain the updated Mu Jungle, that's why your pic has all that sand. I've replaced the .zip file with the correct one.

Ah good, I'll do it now.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: robin on October 16, 2014, 06:48:35 pm
I removed them because I ended up disliking the ruleset solution and currently it's only possible to add them as UFO missions, which doesn't work that well. Maybe I'll add them later in the future.
Yeah. The solution of using UFOs to create non-UFO missions is not ideal. It's an "emergency solution" while we wait for the ability to add customizable terror-like missions. I suspect (hope) that with TFTD and all its mission types, this will be possible.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 16, 2014, 08:45:18 pm
I fail to understand why it's of any importance. All the more reason to mod the game if it's imperfect. :)

I have one philosophy: stick to the original as much as possible. Changing something because of not liking how the game mechanic worked on the original game is a no-no for me.

Yeah. The solution of using UFOs to create non-UFO missions is not ideal. It's an "emergency solution" while we wait for the ability to add customizable terror-like missions. I suspect (hope) that with TFTD and all its mission types, this will be possible.

My conclusions exactly, although I'm not sure if the developers will allow to edit on the ruleset how missions are generated.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on October 16, 2014, 11:32:58 pm
I have one philosophy: stick to the original as much as possible. Changing something because of not liking how the game mechanic worked on the original game is a no-no for me.

Funny enough, I claim to having the same philosophy. :) I do recognize some minor details of the game is less-than-perfect though, and I believe in making an actual progress here; but of course I respect your decision.

Thanks for updating the maps, they look much better now!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 17, 2014, 12:21:45 am
Funny enough, I claim to having the same philosophy. :) I do recognize some minor details of the game is less-than-perfect though, and I believe in making an actual progress here; but of course I respect your decision.

To me it's also the less-than-perfect thingies that make the game perfect. For instance, OpenXCom calculates the paths of craft for them to fly the curvature of the Earth in a more efficient way but I still miss the old ritual of the vanilla game of having to do it manually when you really wanted to make sure that your Skyranger would reach that landed UFO in time.

I've had a discussion about the change made that aliens can't use explosive weapons during the first 2 turns and how it has removed from OXC that rare classic moment when half your squad gets blasted by an alien grenade or stunned while departing the Skyranger. It is a completely f..... up moment for the player, but so is getting a base defense mission on the first month.

You start making too much of those changes in the name of efficiency but you're also removing part of each one's personal memories by doing so. Anyways, I'll always remember that time on vanilla when a Skyranger got hit by a blaster bomb in turn 2 but it exploded on the outside instead of killing all my troops. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on October 17, 2014, 01:21:39 am
I've had a discussion about the change made that aliens can't use explosive weapons during the first 2 turns and how it has removed from OXC that rare classic moment when half your squad gets blasted by an alien grenade or stunned while departing the Skyranger. It is a completely f..... up moment for the player, but so is getting a base defense mission on the first month.

You start making too much of those changes in the name of efficiency but you're also removing part of each one's personal memories by doing so. Anyways, I'll always remember that time on vanilla when a Skyranger got hit by a blaster bomb in turn 2 but it exploded on the outside instead of killing all my troops. :)

That particular change was just a bad case of pissed off Warboy who doesn't like to lose his squads, I can only hope it'll become optional/limited to lower difficulties (Can I Play, Daddy?) someday :) Although the blue domed roof could use some improvement none the less - it's obviously bugged, unlike that plant which is a matter of opinion (it ain't supposed to be made of concrete, is it?), so sticking to the original in that last case seems the best solution.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on October 17, 2014, 03:24:20 am
Yeah, can't agree more, Dioxine.

Anyway Hobbes, I was browsing your Alien Remix and I think it's a bug: the STR_SNAKEMAN_SECTOPOD race contains no Sectopods, but Chryssalids. I suppose it's wrong?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 17, 2014, 06:45:41 pm
Anyway Hobbes, I was browsing your Alien Remix and I think it's a bug: the STR_SNAKEMAN_SECTOPOD race contains no Sectopods, but Chryssalids. I suppose it's wrong?

Yup, bug there. Nice catch, thanks!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on October 17, 2014, 06:59:30 pm
Yup, bug there. Nice catch, thanks!

No probs. :)

By the way, I've noticed that the Port terrain is somewhat damaged from turn one - like for example the metal stairs in the picture attached, but also holes in the walls etc. Is this intentional? If it is, it's not a bad initiative, though iot's a pity it can't be randomized.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 17, 2014, 07:01:01 pm
No probs. :)

By the way, I've noticed that the Port terrain is somewhat damaged from turn one - like for example the metal stairs in the picture attached, but also holes in the walls etc. Is this intentional? If it is, it's not a bad initiative, though iot's a pity it can't be randomized.

That's not Port terrain but Industrial, and yeah the buildings were designed to look rather abandoned or worn down.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on October 17, 2014, 07:03:04 pm
That's not Port terrain but Industrial

Right, sorry, I still have a bit of a fever. :P

Anyway, I'll suggest random terrain damage to the Open X-Com Extended. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Dioxine on October 17, 2014, 07:29:56 pm
I have to say I love postapocalyptic feel to this terrain, although the building Solar pictured is somewhat faulty - there are no means of entering it, but there's a spawn point upstairs (or at least I think there is?) :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 17, 2014, 07:46:19 pm
Anyway, I'll suggest random terrain damage to the Open X-Com Extended. :)

IMHO, that sort of feature sounds a lot better than it actually would do if it was implemented and it is doubtful that the work involved gives enough return to compensate for it. Usually when people play they are busy with other things to do than to pay attention to those little details. 

I have to say I love postapocalyptic feel to this terrain, although the building Solar pictured is somewhat faulty - there are no means of entering it, but there's a spawn point upstairs (or at least I think there is?) :)

Yup, there's a node with possible spawning on the 1st level inside the structure.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: BBHood217 on October 19, 2014, 07:48:53 pm
I was browsing your Alien Remix and I think it's a bug: the STR_SNAKEMAN_SECTOPOD race contains no Sectopods, but Chryssalids. I suppose it's wrong?

Argh, and I was about to download it too.  Now I'll have to wait some more.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (WIP)
Post by: Hobbes on October 19, 2014, 09:15:28 pm
Argh, and I was about to download it too.  Now I'll have to wait some more.

It's a really minor thing. I've attached the fixed version below.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: BBHood217 on October 27, 2014, 11:56:40 am
Though the Alien Hive mission is no longer there, apparently the Hive crew still is because a Battleship with a Hive crew attacked one of my bases.  Is that normal?

Incidentally, a Hive crew is apparently composed of Sectoids and Chryssalids.  Makes for a "fun" base defense :P
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on October 28, 2014, 01:17:31 am
Though the Alien Hive mission is no longer there, apparently the Hive crew still is because a Battleship with a Hive crew attacked one of my bases.  Is that normal?

Incidentally, a Hive crew is apparently composed of Sectoids and Chryssalids.  Makes for a "fun" base defense :P

The Hive Crew can still be encountered in Alien Raid missions. You must have shot down a Raider Ship carrying a Hive crew which caused the retaliation mission.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: BBHood217 on October 28, 2014, 09:57:46 am
Actually, I haven't seen any raider ships in my current game.  That particular retaliation just came out of nowhere; there were no scouts, a battleship just showed up and made a beeline to my base.

The Hive crew was actually from a reload attempt; the original was Floaters and my base was completely undefended, so I reloaded and prepared.  And when the battleship showed up again, it was now a Hive crew.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on October 28, 2014, 03:48:24 pm
Actually, I haven't seen any raider ships in my current game.  That particular retaliation just came out of nowhere; there were no scouts, a battleship just showed up and made a beeline to my base.

The Hive crew was actually from a reload attempt; the original was Floaters and my base was completely undefended, so I reloaded and prepared.  And when the battleship showed up again, it was now a Hive crew.

The saved game got messed up then.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: jackstraw2323 on October 30, 2014, 04:18:12 pm
Great work, these look amazing. Can't wait to try a few of them out.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: BBHood217 on October 30, 2014, 04:48:13 pm
Okay, now I've seen a couple of raider ships in my game; but now there's a new problem.  When I tried to ground assault one, I got an "invalid vector<T> subscript" error.  On a whim, I attempted to New Battle a raider ship on Farm terrain.  Same error message almost every time, only working once out of around 10 attempts.

At first I thought the fault was with the Skywarden and Skyguardian from the Expanded X-Com Armory mod, but I still got the error even with a Skyranger.  So, something might be wrong with the raider ship...?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on October 30, 2014, 09:55:19 pm
Okay, now I've seen a couple of raider ships in my game; but now there's a new problem.  When I tried to ground assault one, I got an "invalid vector<T> subscript" error.  On a whim, I attempted to New Battle a raider ship on Farm terrain.  Same error message almost every time, only working once out of around 10 attempts.

At first I thought the fault was with the Skywarden and Skyguardian from the Expanded X-Com Armory mod, but I still got the error even with a Skyranger.  So, something might be wrong with the raider ship...?

Just tried it on New Battle without any problems. Disable all other mods and try again to see if you still the error.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: davide on October 31, 2014, 06:01:33 pm
Hello,

Does your Terrain Pack contains maps
from this UFO2000 pack ?

The Burbs - downsuburbs-beta15
https://www.xcomufo.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=242027963&page=2 (https://www.xcomufo.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=242027963&page=2)

Here there is a zip wit 90 maps described only by .LUA files ...

bye


Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on November 01, 2014, 02:44:11 am
Hello,

Does your Terrain Pack contains maps
from this UFO2000 pack ?

The Burbs - downsuburbs-beta15
https://www.xcomufo.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=242027963&page=2 (https://www.xcomufo.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=242027963&page=2)

Here there is a zip wit 90 maps described only by .LUA files ...

bye

No, it does not. At a certain point the UFO2000 developers decided to use a new file format in .LUA to replace all the old ones (.MAP, .MCD, etc.) and get rid of the limitations of those formats. The Burbs terrain was created completely in .LUA.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: davide on November 01, 2014, 11:37:02 am
I think that convert the format of 91 maps from .lua to .map  is simple (it is very near to a CSV file format)

for the tilesets the task is more complex

Code: [Select]
AddTileset {
    Name = "dawn",
    Author = "",
    Tiles = {
        [1] = {
            EditorName = "Grey pavement 1",
            IsometricImage = png_image("$(extension)/dawnmasterimagelist/32x40-001.png"),
            Shape = [[
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,
            ]],
            MinimapImage = [[
                888888,888888,888888,888888,
                888888,888888,888888,888888,
                888888,888888,888888,888888,
                888888,888888,888888,888888,
            ]],
            Tile_Type = 0,
            Armour = 20,
            TU_Walk = 4,
            TU_Fly = 4,
            TU_Slide = 4,
            Die_MCD = 15,
        },

IsometricImage = png_image("$(extension)/dawnmasterimagelist/32x40-001.png"),
I think that is it the offset into the unique big picture multi-tiles dawnmasterimagelist.png

It could be used to produte .PCK and .TAB files too.

For the MCD file it is more complex.

What is your opinion ?

thanks


Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on November 02, 2014, 12:23:18 am
I think that convert the format of 91 maps from .lua to .map  is simple (it is very near to a CSV file format)

for the tilesets the task is more complex

Code: [Select]
AddTileset {
    Name = "dawn",
    Author = "",
    Tiles = {
        [1] = {
            EditorName = "Grey pavement 1",
            IsometricImage = png_image("$(extension)/dawnmasterimagelist/32x40-001.png"),
            Shape = [[
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,0000,
                FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,FFFF,
            ]],
            MinimapImage = [[
                888888,888888,888888,888888,
                888888,888888,888888,888888,
                888888,888888,888888,888888,
                888888,888888,888888,888888,
            ]],
            Tile_Type = 0,
            Armour = 20,
            TU_Walk = 4,
            TU_Fly = 4,
            TU_Slide = 4,
            Die_MCD = 15,
        },

IsometricImage = png_image("$(extension)/dawnmasterimagelist/32x40-001.png"),
I think that is it the offset into the unique big picture multi-tiles dawnmasterimagelist.png

It could be used to produte .PCK and .TAB files too.

For the MCD file it is more complex.

What is your opinion ?

thanks

I didn't design this terrain and I don't remember how it looks like. The maps may contain references to more than 256 different tiles being used on them, which would make them impossible to use without adaptations. Regarding the MCD files, the LOFT and Scang definitions are completely different from the original game, since it was possible to costumize them and not being limited to the shapes and overhead images of the vanilla files.

TLDR: I'm not interested in adapting this terrain due to all the work required. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: davide on November 02, 2014, 01:26:18 am
Sigh

 :'(

Do you working on other xcom project ?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on November 02, 2014, 05:47:28 am
Sigh

 :'(

Do you working on other xcom project ?

Some UFO2000 terrains are either not good or it would take more work to convert them than to create new terrains. I prefer quality rather than quantity.

Why don't you convert the terrains yourself if you're so interested on them?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on November 02, 2014, 11:44:07 am
Why don't you convert the terrains yourself if you're so interested on them?

Yes, yes! :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: davide on November 03, 2014, 01:53:44 am
You are right ... :-[

i cannot found free time to begin and complete something at the moment. :-\

Sometimes I write a post with a hint about some ideas that I have but I cannot make.

If you remember some time a go I suggested to recover Railyard Terrain ...

and you with the help of Solarious did it ...

After that you collaborate with him  for Commercial terrain ....

a double success ! ;D




Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on November 03, 2014, 03:12:24 am
You are right ... :-[

i cannot found free time to begin and complete something at the moment. :-\

Sometimes I write a post with a hint about some ideas that I have but I cannot make.

If you remember some time a go I suggested to recover Railyard Terrain ...

and you with the help of Solarious did it ...

After that you collaborate with him  for Commercial terrain ....

a double success ! ;D

Well I'm done with the Terrain Pack other than to fix bugs to the existing terrains. It would be interesting to design new missions but 1.0 is very limited on that matter.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: new_civilian on November 03, 2014, 12:12:58 pm
A major problem is the fact that there are only so many (~12?) globe terrain types to attach new terrains to. Hobbes mod uses about every posssible combination without replacing anything (good work there) but now there's virtually nothing left.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: mercy on November 03, 2014, 01:48:29 pm
Great work!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on November 03, 2014, 01:49:25 pm
A major problem is the fact that there are only so many (~12?) globe terrain types to attach new terrains to. Hobbes mod uses about every posssible combination without replacing anything (good work there) but now there's virtually nothing left.

You can still add Terror Site terrains, plus you've got Alien Base and XCOM Base terrains, which I deliberately didn't touch due to the code used to dig tunnels between map blocks, plus any changes to XCOM Base may conflict with any base facility mods.

When TFTD is implemented it will be possible to have a random list of terrains assigned to every texture, since that's how it works: for each texture there are 3 possible terrains: Coral, Seabed and a specific one assigned to the globe texture.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Falko on November 03, 2014, 02:17:47 pm
but now there's virtually nothing left.
you can add more terrains
see the images here:
https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2835.msg30054#msg30054
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: davide on November 03, 2014, 04:18:24 pm
Diuring lunch break time
I tried to landing over Storm Mountain and Siberia terror sites
 (I am working on terrain generation ... one source line at month)

The XCom craft land on top of maps but it is empty,
the XCom units appears on first level at coordinate (x=*, y=0),  the top-right side.

Any suggestion about this issue ?

Luke URBAN2 terror terrain is same them but I did not read issue in the forum about empty craft

thanks
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on November 03, 2014, 04:29:11 pm
Any suggestion about this issue ?

No idea, sorry.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: new_civilian on November 05, 2014, 01:35:33 pm
You can still add Terror Site terrains, plus you've got Alien Base and XCOM Base terrains, which I deliberately didn't touch due to the code used to dig tunnels between map blocks, plus any changes to XCOM Base may conflict with any base facility mods.

When TFTD is implemented it will be possible to have a random list of terrains assigned to every texture, since that's how it works: for each texture there are 3 possible terrains: Coral, Seabed and a specific one assigned to the globe texture.
you can add more terrains
see the images here:
https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2835.msg30054#msg30054

Hobbes: That (and the reasons I pm`ed you about) is why I stick to making edited default terror terrains only. Those are easy to apply and rather foolproof and stable.

Falko: That`s cool, I didn`t know that. However, it is rather difficult to turn this into a working mod without having conflicts with other mods. Take the AlienArmoury mod for example, it adds ufo missions in certain areas, a mod that changes that area will most likely lead to problems. A better solution would be to simply make all terrains work like the Terror Mission Terrain, all you have to do there is to add a line (and the terrain of course) to the alien deployment entries. What would be optimal is basically what Hobbes said the TFTD changes will bring.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: davide on November 05, 2014, 02:27:15 pm
When TFTD is implemented it will be possible to have a random list of terrains assigned to every texture, since that's how it works: for each texture there are 3 possible terrains: Coral, Seabed and a specific one assigned to the globe texture.

About this request, in mine build I made a little change to improve this behavoiur

I changed this methods from

(It returrns always the first terrain that match texture and lat)
Code: [Select]
/**
 * Gets battlescape terrain using globe texture and latitude.
 * @param tex Globe texture.
 * @param lat Latitude.
 * @return Pointer to ruleterrain.
 */
RuleTerrain *BattlescapeGenerator::getTerrain(int tex, double lat)
{
RuleTerrain *t =  0;
const std::vector<std::string> &terrains = _game->getRuleset()->getTerrainList();
for (std::vector<std::string>::const_iterator i = terrains.begin(); i != terrains.end(); ++i)
{
t =  _game->getRuleset()->getTerrain(*i);
for (std::vector<int>::iterator j = t->getTextures()->begin(); j != t->getTextures()->end(); ++j )
{
if (*j == tex && (t->getHemisphere() == 0 || (t->getHemisphere() < 0 && lat < 0) || (t->getHemisphere() > 0 && lat >= 0)))
{
return t;
}
}
}

assert(0 && "No matching terrain for globe texture");
return t;
}

to

(It returns randomized terrain from those that match texture and lat)
Code: [Select]
/**
 * Gets battlescape terrain using globe texture and latitude.
 * @param tex Globe texture.
 * @param lat Latitude.
 * @return Pointer to ruleterrain.
 */
RuleTerrain *BattlescapeGenerator::getTerrain(int tex, double lat)
{
RuleTerrain *t =  0;
const std::vector<std::string> &terrains = _game->getRuleset()->getTerrainList();
std::vector<RuleTerrain*> compliantTerrain;
for (std::vector<std::string>::const_iterator i = terrains.begin(); i != terrains.end(); ++i)
{
t =  _game->getRuleset()->getTerrain(*i);
for (std::vector<int>::iterator j = t->getTextures()->begin(); j != t->getTextures()->end(); ++j )
{
if (*j == tex && (t->getHemisphere() == 0 || (t->getHemisphere() < 0 && lat < 0) || (t->getHemisphere() > 0 && lat >= 0)))
{
compliantTerrain.push_back(t);
}
}
}
if (compliantTerrain.size())
{
size_t n = RNG::generate(0, compliantTerrain.size() - 1);
return compliantTerrain[n];
}
assert(0 && "No matching terrain for globe texture");
return t;
}
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: new_civilian on November 07, 2014, 04:58:03 pm
Just something that caused me a real headache and even some CTDs: Make sure that this map-pack is loaded last in your mod list, otherwise essential settings can be overwritten and cause problems.  :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on November 07, 2014, 07:47:54 pm
Just something that caused me a real headache and even some CTDs: Make sure that this map-pack is loaded last in your mod list, otherwise essential settings can be overwritten and cause problems.  :)

Even then there can be problems, if the Terrain Pack changes settings required for the previous mods to work.

Rule of thumb is that there may be issues running the Terrain Pack with any other mods that change the terrain settings, unless the author of the other mods has specifically made them compatible, like Solaris Scorch was doing for the FMP.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: TaxxiDriver on November 14, 2014, 05:34:43 am
Can I ask you a question about the compatibility? I couldn't just read every replies in this thread... too many... :'(

(1) Can I use it with any mods that add new UFOs in general? I don't know what exactly the 'terrain' is comprised of, but I guess just adding the UFOs wouldn't be a problem? If not, specifically can I use it with the mod Yet more UFOs by grzegorj or Luke's Extra UFOs?

(2) How can one recognize there is an incompatibility between one mod and the other regarding the terrain? The only cases I can think of is sharing the same 'name' of the terrain or indexing the same number for the 'mapBlocks' or something like that. Are there any other possible cases for confliction? For example, some mods alter the 'terrain' of the facilities of X-COM base, and those wouldn't conflict with your mods, I guess?

I REALLY REALLY REALLY want to use this mod but just worried if it will cause trouble with other mods ??? Hope it works with Yet More UFOs especially.


Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on November 14, 2014, 10:26:35 am
(1) Can I use it with any mods that add new UFOs in general? I don't know what exactly the 'terrain' is comprised of, but I guess just adding the UFOs wouldn't be a problem? If not, specifically can I use it with the mod Yet more UFOs by grzegorj or Luke's Extra UFOs?

Mods that only add new UFOs are OK to use since Terrains and UFOs are different aspects of the game. In a short explanation, terrains are the general environment where battles take place and are made of different tiles (ground, walls, objects). UFOs are craft and also use tiles to be 'physically' created but they are added and generated separately to the terrains.

Quote
(2) How can one recognize there is an incompatibility between one mod and the other regarding the terrain? The only cases I can think of is sharing the same 'name' of the terrain or indexing the same number for the 'mapBlocks' or something like that. Are there any other possible cases for confliction? For example, some mods alter the 'terrain' of the facilities of X-COM base, and those wouldn't conflict with your mods, I guess?

There are 2 ways for incompatibilities to happen:
1) If the original terrain files have been changed but the original filenames have been kept and a mod includes those files, then installing that mod will replace the original files and the changes will apply to all terrains that use those files (original terrains and other mods). This can lead to unexpected issues when playing such as walls that suddenly are replaced by objects or even more disastrous or even potentially game crashing effects. The Terrain Pack only uses unique filenames different from the original ones to prevent this from happening (but a couple other mod creators haven't bothered renaming the original files after altering them)
2) If you have two mods that change the definitions of what terrains should be used in specific situations (Terror Sites, Alien & XCOM bases, and the definitions of where the Desert/Forest/Farm/Etc. terrains should be used in UFO missions), then the mods will be loaded consecutively according to the names of the .rul files, which means that only the changes on the last file loaded will apply.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: TaxxiDriver on November 14, 2014, 01:14:01 pm
Thank you for your kind answer! I'm now relieved to use other mods that just add new UFOs. This means that I'm going to use your mod for my next playthrough...

*downloading*

 ;D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on November 15, 2014, 07:13:46 am
Thank you for your kind answer! I'm now relieved to use other mods that just add new UFOs. This means that I'm going to use your mod for my next playthrough...

*downloading*

 ;D

Enjoy :)
Title: Terrain Pack Version 3.0 discussion
Post by: Hobbes on November 29, 2014, 11:19:42 pm
I'm starting to plan version 3.0 of the Terrain Pack.

This version should be ready by the time OpenTFTD and/or a new stable version are released and I have the following goals, based on what the nightlies/OpenTFTD should have available:
* Updating the terrain generation rules (roads, etc.) on the existing terrains to the new format of the nightlies.
* Reassigning terrains to Geoscape textures, due to the future possibility that each globe texture can have several terrains assigned to be chosen randomly for each mission. As an example, this will mean that missions in the Desert textures will use either the original Desert, Desert Mountain or Atlantis Desert terrains. This will also remove the current limits on the number of terrains that can be used on the UFO missions.
* There has been some discussion on this thread (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=3159.0) regarding an slight overhaul of the UFO globe and its polygons to both improve its realism and diversity of Earth's biomes (Forest, Desert, etc.), which I would like to include on version 3.0. This would mean adding at least 3 new Geoscape textures: Grasslands (Savannah/Steppe), Tundra and Taiga, with corresponding new terrains.

A few additional ideas:
* Another improvement would be to increase the number of cities present on the map (although keeping the original countries) and do slight updates to the MissionZones, in the line of MKSheppard's Improved Nations Mod (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=1513.0).
* Finally, according to Warboy, it will be possible to assign specific terrains to cities to be used during terror sites. This means it would be possible to create regional/country/city specific terrains (Oriental cities, New York, etc.) for those missions.
* Adding different civilian versions to terror sites according to the city/region.

A tentative texture list and the corresponding terrains for version 3.0 would then be the following:
* Desert texture - Original Desert, Desert Mountain and Atlantis Desert terrains
* Polar - Original Polar, Polar Mountain
* Jungle - Original Jungle, Mu Jungle, Jungle Farm and Jungle Mountain
* Forest - Original Forest, Forest Mountain and Forest Farm
* Mountain - Original Mountain
* Savannah - Original Farm, Expanded Farm, Savannah (lots of tall grass and vegetation)
* Tundra (no trees)
* Taiga (w/ trees)

Other additional textures were considered but been discarded at the moment due to the amount of work required to redrew the Geoscape:
* Coastal - Port, Island, Swamp (for use in UFO/Terror Site missions at the coast)
* Urban (area around the current cities) - Original Urban (northern hemisphere), Mad City, Native

The bold terrains would be new terrains that would require new graphics. Any comments, ideas that you'd like to see included?
 
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: BlackLibrary on December 01, 2014, 11:51:25 pm
A nice companion to this would be adding civilians and (bold suggestion) types of civilians.  If we are going to add map diversity, demographic diversity would also be interesting.  Each terrain, whatever, could include an ethnicity or civilian type.

Then a mission in Africa could feel more like Africa, while a mission in South America. 

Too difficult to mod and add?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 02, 2014, 01:41:33 am
A nice companion to this would be adding civilians and (bold suggestion) types of civilians.  If we are going to add map diversity, demographic diversity would also be interesting.  Each terrain, whatever, could include an ethnicity or civilian type.

Then a mission in Africa could feel more like Africa, while a mission in South America. 

Too difficult to mod and add?

Quite easy actually. Either Dioxine or robin already made a few different civilian sprites and offered them a while ago but I had forgotten about that.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 03, 2014, 04:52:00 am
OK, this is an adaptation I made of a map showing Earth's biomes, to have an idea of how the textures would be distributed. It uses the colors of the Geoscape palette, but in appearance it will look differently since it will use textures rather than single colors and there won't be this much detail regarding the polygons. The Mountain special areas will depend on the area nearby, since they'll use the Forest/Polar/etc. versions of the Mountain terrain.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: bladum on December 03, 2014, 10:40:15 am
Hobbes,

Map is great from gameplay perspective, nice balance of terrains. But is quite not real ... what is your main focus ?

Tom
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 03, 2014, 02:48:53 pm
Hobbes,

Map is great from gameplay perspective, nice balance of terrains. But is quite not real ... what is your main focus ?

Tom

Could you please specify why the map isn't quite real? It was based on the map present on Wikipedia's Biome (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biome) page.

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7b/Vegetation-no-legend.PNG/800px-Vegetation-no-legend.PNG)

I had to combine several biomes together since it would be impossible to have differentiated terrains for all of them and it doesn't include all topography (mountains) yet. Plus, weather is also a factor on the appearance of Earth from space but I've decided that it is better to assume it's summer. Finally the colors don't quite match reality, specially with the Grassland areas which will be a mixture of green/brown rather than the simple green above but with the Geoscape palette it is nearly impossible even after adjustments are made. 

There are also some areas which are quite troublesome to represent in real colors like Tibet (the grey on the middle of Asia). On Google Earth it appears with a yellowish tone but in other photos (representing different time of the year) it appears as a browish red:
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6b/Asia_terrain.jpg)

Finally, I've considered biomes first rather than topography since vegetation affects more the appearance than the elevation. If I'd made a map based first on topography then it would look something like this:
(https://www.ngdc.noaa.gov/mgg/image/mggd.gif)

Now this has a number of issues, the foremost being that elevation doesn't equal the presence of mountains. Southern Africa, Iberian Peninsula, Turkey or Iran have large elevated areas but they are mainly plateaus, not mountains. Greenland and Antarctica elevation is due to the permanent ice cap, etc. But this will also be taken into consideration when designing the polygons and assigning textures, so there will actually be more 'pink' areas than on the map I originally posted.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: bladum on December 03, 2014, 03:46:44 pm
Your proposition of map is great. It does really matter for most players if turkey is grassland or mountains. What is more important can we fight on different terrains including mountain forest etc and does during single game different terrains can be spotted.

In vanilla most of fights were on cultivate terrain then some desert or forest / jungle, urban only during terror and polar / mountains were actually quite rare. Your combination of forest + mountains or desert + mountains is great for this purpose. It all about making game more fun longer by bigger variety and still keep the "this is better x-com game" feeling.

It works great for vanilla but also could be used in mods.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 20, 2014, 03:15:36 am
I've integrated the new cities and mission zones from MKSheppard's Improved Nations mod, did some adjustments to the missions zones and added  a lot more cities. Here are some results at half zoom (when city names start being displayed):

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/BKUPHJTF121920140811.png)
(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/WPUBVQTN121920140819.png)
(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/SYKZHCOE121920140813.png)
(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/STTNXHVE121920140812.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: volutar on December 20, 2014, 08:20:34 am
Now it's obviously  WHY Gollops didn't make so much cities.
Not because of "low memory" or "slow text rendering".
But because of MESS it cause. And it's a good enough reason not to do that.

P.S. Hobbes, could you make screenshots not more than 800 pixels width? They simply won't fit forum and making scrollers.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 20, 2014, 08:38:43 am
I agree with your points, first I thought the Improved Nations mod had too many cities.

But I decided to add even more - but I'll remove quite a few cities from the more crowded regions by commenting them in the ruleset. And people  can remove those they won't want or simply switching zoom/press Tab while playing to remove city display.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Yankes on December 20, 2014, 02:25:18 pm
One way to fix it is allow OXC show some cities names only on max zoom. This will allow lot more cities without causing mess on screen.

[ps]

I made fast test, adding this to code is trivial.
Added some screen shot showing it working with default data rules.
Look on Vancouver and Dallas.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on December 20, 2014, 03:43:40 pm
Can this be somehow automated, so that city names disappear whenever they overlap? I mean on non-maximum zoom.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Yankes on December 20, 2014, 04:05:36 pm
It would be hard, even simplest and fastest solution will require lot of code.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: bladum on December 20, 2014, 04:09:57 pm
why not define citySize per city ? this will define level of zoom when city name is displayed
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Yankes on December 20, 2014, 04:25:50 pm
it's working exactly like that, per city. Look on example screen shots.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 20, 2014, 05:16:15 pm
One way to fix it is allow OXC show some cities names only on max zoom. This will allow lot more cities without causing mess on screen.

[ps]

I made fast test, adding this to code is trivial.
Added some screen shot showing it working with default data rules.
Look on Vancouver and Dallas.

Does this involve changing the source code? Or is the citySize option already working?

For the time being I'll simply remove cities that overlap at the zoom level where they start being displayed, by commenting their lines. The overlap happens mainly on Europe, Asia and North America, which I suspect is also due to cultural bias (more familiarity with those areas).

The other regions hardly have this issue, and removing a few cities will also address the current unbalance between city concentrations when comparing the different regions.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 20, 2014, 07:11:48 pm
N America, Europe and SE Asia after removing overlapping cities and adjusting labels.

A few curiosities I've noticed is that adding cities to the Pacific, Arctic and Antarctic automatically triggers the appearance of Terror missions over those regions. Also although the North Atlantic now has 2 cities (Nuuk and St John) they don't trigger terror sites since there are no mission zones defined.

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/OUWVQBHB122020141208.png)
(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/IVXIRCTA122020141208.png)
(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/VEPAZMXO122020141208.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Yankes on December 20, 2014, 09:20:50 pm
Does this involve changing the source code? Or is the citySize option already working?

For the time being I'll simply remove cities that overlap at the zoom level where they start being displayed, by commenting their lines. The overlap happens mainly on Europe, Asia and North America, which I suspect is also due to cultural bias (more familiarity with those areas).

The other regions hardly have this issue, and removing a few cities will also address the current unbalance between city concentrations when comparing the different regions.
It require code change, I made patch and send it to Warboy for inclusion to nightly. If Warboy will like it, it will be in official build, if not I will include it to my extended version.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Falko on December 21, 2014, 12:33:09 am
2 cities (Nuuk and St John) they don't trigger terror sites since there are no mission zones defined.
there is some "magic" in the existing oxc code that adds terror-missionzones for all cities
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 21, 2014, 03:16:02 am
It require code change, I made patch and send it to Warboy for inclusion to nightly. If Warboy will like it, it will be in official build, if not I will include it to my extended version.

I've been working on 1.0 so the current solution (comment unnecessary cities) works, later when I release a terrain pack version for nightly i can see how this works.

there is some "magic" in the existing oxc code that adds terror-missionzones for all cities

I haven't checked the code but the 'magic' seems similar to: add terror mission, roll for random zone, check if region has required MissionZones for terror mission. I'm betting on this because I haven't seen yet terror missions being generated in the north atlantic and they should require other MissionZones than cities to take place.

The interesting bit now is how to use the terror sites on these areas since it should be possible in the future to assign specific terrains to cities, so terror missions in could be in Antarctica research stations, Pacific ones using Port terrain. And if MissionZones are added to the North Atlantic then cities on that area would also become terror targets. 
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Falko on December 21, 2014, 08:30:19 am
i talk about this
https://github.com/SupSuper/OpenXcom/blob/9c4820c4631db467677d1d6f29a5f17a67536b45/src/Ruleset/RuleRegion.cpp#L71
Code: [Select]
https:// if a city has been added, make sure that it has a zone 3 associated with it, if not, create one for it.so not having a missionzone in the rul file for a city does not prevent terrormissions for this city
i also would love to have a set of terrains per city or (perhaps as a default) per region

also +1 for the zoom(/citysize?) factor
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 21, 2014, 05:01:36 pm
i talk about this
https://github.com/SupSuper/OpenXcom/blob/9c4820c4631db467677d1d6f29a5f17a67536b45/src/Ruleset/RuleRegion.cpp#L71
Code: [Select]
https:// if a city has been added, make sure that it has a zone 3 associated with it, if not, create one for it.so not having a missionzone in the rul file for a city does not prevent terrormissions for this city
i also would love to have a set of terrains per city or (perhaps as a default) per region

also +1 for the zoom(/citysize?) factor

I've come to like that piece of code since it reduces the necessary work for adding cities. With TFTD it will be possible to assign specific terrains to cities, since it is necessary to differentiate ports from islands.

I've added also TFTD's cities and islands so that later it is possible to use this mechanic on the Terrain Pack. But now I need to decide what will be the standard display, i.e. which cities will appear/be hidden. I can think of 3 possible options, 1st being all cities appearing, 2nd only UFO & TFTD cities, 3rd the current selection of cities (used for the images above).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Arthanor on December 22, 2014, 06:23:17 am
That looks pretty cool! And maybe some of us will learn geography through playing OCX :)

One thing I already learned: There is such a place as Fort Severn in Canada, and I'm Canadian. Having looked it up, the wiki says 90 families..? How did that make it there? Maybe some minimum population size (100k? few 100ks?) would make more sense than adding tiny aboriginal villages.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 22, 2014, 01:44:33 pm
One thing I already learned: There is such a place as Fort Severn in Canada, and I'm Canadian. Having looked it up, the wiki says 90 families..? How did that make it there? Maybe some minimum population size (100k? few 100ks?) would make more sense than adding tiny aboriginal villages.

It is one of the cities in TFTD. Maybe by 2040 it has become Canada's largest city :)

Since adding the TFTD cities had the result of Terror Sites being activated for the Pacific, I wondered how it would be possible to have alien missions on the other oceans. So I've added MissionZones for the Atlantic and Indian Oceans to allow for UFOs to land and I assigned Alien Research missions to these 3 regions, plus Alien Base for the North Atlantic, plus the automatic Terror mission each month. The chance for any mission being generated is low, the same as in the Pacific.

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/QTHMUDMH122220140857.png)

One interesting bit is that this will later allow to add and assign TFTD's Port and Island terrains to these cities. And, on the case of the islands perhaps even an adaptation of Cruise/Cargo ship maps.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 26, 2014, 06:17:23 pm
Version 2.5 has been released here (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack).

This should be the last major release for the milestone version 1.0 of OpenXcom. Afterwards all releases of the Terrain Pack will be oriented towards compatibility with the nightly versions, in order to include additional new features regarding the Geoscape that are being developed.

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/DXYVQCPK122620141050.png)
(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/DBHVIMFR122620141049.png)

* Several new cities were added from MKSheppard's Improved Nations (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,1513.0.html) mod, TFTD, and additional others. Each city has been categorized on its entry as UFO/TFTD, Standard or Full View, making it possible to select the amount of cities displayed by editing the ruleset.
* Terror missions can happen now in the Pacific, North and South Atlantic and Indian oceans. It is also possible now to get Alien Research missions on the Atlantic and Indian oceans since Mission Zones were added to those areas.
* The Country and Region Zones have been redesigned, using the Improved Nations mod and additional work. I haven't included any of that mod's new countries because of the major strategic changes they should imply.

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/BFALKODF122620141053.png)

Since the cities from TFTD were added and it is now possible to have UFO missions over all the oceans, it is now possible to almost recreate TFTD's terror attacks, with the adapted Port terrain available on the Terrain Pack. Later, with the planned future features for the nightlies, it will be possible for terror attacks on any coastal or island city to use only the original Port, Island or even an adapted Cruise/Cargo ship terrains.

MKSheppard's mod also includes Antarctic bases, and although they are disabled on 2.5, and later on the nightly versions, the objective is to create an antarctic research base (like The Thing's Outpost 31) terrain, to be used only in terror attacks on the Antarctic.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: XCOMFan419 on December 26, 2014, 07:24:34 pm
I like to use the Improved Nations mod. Because of the changes you made to your mod, would they be compatible anymore? These two mods are staples of most of my playthroughs, and it'd be terrible to have to make sacrifices for either of these mods to work.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 26, 2014, 08:15:15 pm
I like to use the Improved Nations mod. Because of the changes you made to your mod, would they be compatible anymore? These two mods are staples of most of my playthroughs, and it'd be terrible to have to make sacrifices for either of these mods to work.

If you activate both, then you'll get most of the settings for the Improved Nations mod regarding the Geoscape. You sbould still get the additional UFO missions on the oceans.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: MKSheppard on December 27, 2014, 05:04:16 pm
Hobbes, it's a great honor to see my admittedly incomplete work being used in another mod!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 27, 2014, 06:40:38 pm
Hobbes, it's a great honor to see my admittedly incomplete work being used in another mod!

Thanks for the work you placed into it. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 30, 2014, 04:28:14 am
Today I've finished converting the ruleset to the latest nightly and I've also done a couple of corrections to the milestone ruleset in the process.

With this step completed, I have now started working on the Geoscape redesign - for the moment I've decided not to change the shape of the continents or add islands but simply to design new textures and integrate them. Here's an example below:

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on December 30, 2014, 04:04:26 pm
More texture testing. Most of these textures will not be used extensively since they are for mountain terrain and all of them still need a few graphic tweaks. I'm going now to start working on the polygons now that I have new textures to use.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Infini on January 02, 2015, 10:07:59 pm
I really like what you're doing.
Congratulations!

 :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Yankes on January 04, 2015, 01:32:24 am
btw my patch pass, from today nightly you can set "zoom" value that define minimum zoom level to show city name.
Default value is 3.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on January 04, 2015, 04:30:12 am
I really like what you're doing.
Congratulations!

 :D

Thanks. Glad you guys are enjoying it. :)

btw my patch pass, from today nightly you can set "zoom" value that define minimum zoom level to show city name.
Default value is 3.

Thanks. I've already tried it and I'd make one suggestion: the zoom level should affect the display of both the city name and the red dot that marks the city location. Otherwise, you get the result I've attached below.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Yankes on January 04, 2015, 01:52:26 pm
Right, but if labels always draw over the red dot would be fine? I personally think that showing all cities position is good think, o maybe I'm wrong?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on January 04, 2015, 05:03:43 pm
Right, but if labels always draw over the red dot would be fine? I personally think that showing all cities position is good think, o maybe I'm wrong?

Personal choices :)

Other than to make the globe prettier, the only reason to have cities on the map is due to terror sites and that info isn't that relevant to the player.  If you detect the Terror Ship you can eventually figure out which city will get attacked, after the UFO finishes turning around. But by then you'll already have a Skyranger on the air towards that region and it's a matter of correcting its flight path.

By only showing the position of certain cities according to the zoom level you can still figure out which city will get attacked by zooming in the region. And the display won't be overwhelmed with info (the cities' position) that is only relevant during terror attacks.

I've made images to graphically show the difference between displaying all cities positions regardless of the zoom level and only displaying the cities' position according to the zoom level. First image displays all cities positions (as it currently works) at level 3 zoom. 2nd image is at level 3 also but only displays UFO/TFTD cities. 3rd image is at level 4 zoom and adds more cities to the display and the last image is level 5 with all the cities displayed.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: BlackLibrary on January 06, 2015, 06:55:22 pm
In this case, would a base be able to be created on, say, Jamaica or Bermuda, even though their are no landmass defined there in the set?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on January 06, 2015, 07:00:46 pm
In this case, would a base be able to be created on, say, Jamaica or Bermuda, even though their are no landmass defined there in the set?

No. It would required to add land masses for alien bases to be created in those locations but I'm not really interested into that kind of globe editing (which islands should be added or not?) since I rather prefer the simplicity of the original globe.

TFTD also had cities in the middle of the ocean without any landmasses. I basically took the idea of adding those cities from it.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: robin on January 06, 2015, 10:02:45 pm
No. It would required to add land masses for alien bases to be created in those locations but I'm not really interested into that kind of globe editing (which islands should be added or not?) since I rather prefer the simplicity of the original globe.

TFTD also had cities in the middle of the ocean without any landmasses. I basically took the idea of adding those cities from it.
I browsed through the mod and I saw you didn't make a terrain for the area 51, there's mcds but no map blocks: do you plan to do them in the future?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (check 1st post for download link)
Post by: Hobbes on January 06, 2015, 10:29:08 pm
I browsed through the mod and I saw you didn't make a terrain for the area 51, there's mcds but no map blocks: do you plan to do them in the future?

It is still being used in the Missions Pack as the terrain for the map block used in the Alien Raid missions. I haven't decided what to do with both Area51 and the Mission Pack in the future, or even if it makes sense to have new missions when they really are the same as UFO or Terror Sites.

In any case, I might reuse the HWP Factory 50x50 map block (which uses Area51) and adapt it so that it has XCOM spawn points and exit areas (so that the Skyranger isn't necessary), making the deployment on those maps more akin to Apocalypse. I'll probably do this as well with the Polis 50x50 maps that were used by the Alien Hunt/Hive missions (now removed from the Mission Pack).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Warboy1982 on January 07, 2015, 06:03:54 pm
before i delete the thread, Hobbes, could you please respond to my PMs? I don't mind if you let me have it with both barrels, I just want to know what's going on.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Hobbes on January 07, 2015, 08:36:07 pm
I've requested the moderators to close this thread. But don't worry, the Terrain Pack will still be available (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack) at the mod site. Feel free to message me about anything related to the Terrain Pack.

I've just decided that I need to do alone some rethinking about this whole project before I continue developing any more mods and the best way for me is to do a restart. As Pablo Picasso would say: "Every act of creation is first an act of destruction."

See ya all later and thank you for the fun and interesting discussions so far :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: ivandogovich on January 07, 2015, 08:58:03 pm
I've requested the moderators to close this thread. But don't worry, the Terrain Pack will still be available (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack) at the mod site. Feel free to message me about anything related to the Terrain Pack.

I've just decided that I need to do alone some rethinking about this whole project before I continue developing any more mods and the best way for me is to do a restart. As Pablo Picasso would say: "Every act of creation is first an act of destruction."

See ya all later and thank you for the fun and interesting discussions so far :)

I have to say, that I really appreciate all of the awesome work that I have seen here!  Nice work, Hobbes!!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: robin on January 07, 2015, 09:03:32 pm
Damn.
Well at least you're still around in case I stumble upon some new MapView mystery :P
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: XOps on January 07, 2015, 09:15:10 pm
Well I can certainly understand. The scope of what you are trying to do is pretty massive. I sympathize since I started planning something similar, but had to stop due to the scale of work involved. Take some time and rethink, replan, and maybe redo. I'll always be on call if you need tiles reworked. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Infini on January 08, 2015, 03:28:16 am
I did the French translation for v2.5 (all the cities) TXT file is included.

There's an invalid string (STR_LILONGE).

STR_LILONGUE  is the correct one.

Many thanks for your hard work and enjoy a good rest.

 ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Hobbes on January 09, 2015, 06:50:21 pm
Just taking care of some loose ends here.

I've uploaded version 3.0 of the Terrain Pack to the mod site. This version makes the Terrain Pack fully compatible with OpenXcom's Nightly version 2015-01-09 01:09. However, it won't solve the current compatibility issues resulting from using the Final Mod Pack with the latest nightlies, since the FMP ruleset will have to be updated with the new ruleset of the Terrain Pack version 3.0.

And I've also updated the Milestone version to 2.5.1, adding the French translation that Infini provided above.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: shadics on January 17, 2015, 11:06:35 am
I still have the problem with the farm map (Map failed to fully generate.)  :-\
my game version 1.0 git 2015-01-12 00:41
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Hobbes on January 17, 2015, 03:10:00 pm
I still have the problem with the farm map (Map failed to fully generate.)  :-\
my game version 1.0 git 2015-01-12 00:41

You need to upgrade the Terrain Pack to version 3.0.1. I found and fixed the bug with the Farm building 2 days ago.

For a quick fix, simply download the file below and replace the Terrain_Pack_Nightly.rul file on the Rulesets folder of OpenXcom.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: shadics on January 17, 2015, 10:41:20 pm
You need to upgrade the Terrain Pack to version 3.0.1. I found and fixed the bug with the Farm building 2 days ago.

For a quick fix, simply download the file below and replace the Terrain_Pack_Nightly.rul file on the Rulesets folder of OpenXcom.

The file below is not ''terrain pack nightly'' its ''missions pack nightly'' you are saying  change the name of the file for terrain pack and replace?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Hobbes on January 17, 2015, 11:11:54 pm
The file below is not ''terrain pack nightly'' its ''missions pack nightly'' you are saying  change the name of the file for terrain pack and replace?

My mistake. Fixed.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: shadics on January 17, 2015, 11:59:19 pm
I still have the problem, i dont know why  :-\
i tested the map ''farm'' in ''new battle''
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Hobbes on January 18, 2015, 01:16:10 am
I still have the problem, i dont know why  :-\
i tested the map ''farm'' in ''new battle''

Something got changed on the latest nightly because this issue with Farm never happened with the previous versions. Basically, you can't simply edit existing lines or add new lines on the code for each individual terrain, now it is required to have all the lines. Try the version below, I've tested Farm and it opens without a problem.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: shadics on January 18, 2015, 03:36:11 am
i dont know what to do, i tryed to reinstall all the game with only that mod... but didn't worked
 :-\ what could be the problem?
i have the latest nightlies and the latest mod
i dont know if this help
but this is the log
[17-01-2015 22:31:13]   [INFO]   Data folder is:
[17-01-2015 22:31:13]   [INFO]   Data search is:
[17-01-2015 22:31:13]   [INFO]   - C:\Users\Victor\Documents\OpenXcom\data\
[17-01-2015 22:31:13]   [INFO]   - C:\Users\Victor\Desktop\Victor\XCOM\data\
[17-01-2015 22:31:13]   [INFO]   - C:\Users\Victor\Desktop\Victor\XCOM\data\
[17-01-2015 22:31:13]   [INFO]   User folder is: C:\Users\Victor\Documents\OpenXcom\
[17-01-2015 22:31:13]   [INFO]   Config folder is: C:\Users\Victor\Documents\OpenXcom\
[17-01-2015 22:31:13]   [INFO]   Options loaded successfully.
[17-01-2015 22:31:14]   [INFO]   SDL initialized successfully.
[17-01-2015 22:31:14]   [INFO]   SDL_mixer initialized successfully.
[17-01-2015 22:31:14]   [INFO]   Attempting to set display to 640x400x8...
[17-01-2015 22:31:14]   [INFO]   Display set to 640x400x8.
[17-01-2015 22:31:14]   [INFO]   Loading ruleset...
[17-01-2015 22:31:15]   [WARN]   yaml-cpp: error at line 0, column 0: invalid node; this may result from using a map iterator as a sequence iterator, or vice-versa
[17-01-2015 22:31:15]   [INFO]   Ruleset loaded successfully.
[17-01-2015 22:31:15]   [INFO]   Loading resources...
[17-01-2015 22:31:16]   [INFO]   Loading extra resources from ruleset...
[17-01-2015 22:31:16]   [INFO]   Resources loaded successfully.
[17-01-2015 22:31:16]   [INFO]   Loading language...
[17-01-2015 22:31:16]   [INFO]   Language loaded successfully.
[17-01-2015 22:31:16]   [INFO]   OpenXcom started successfully!
[17-01-2015 22:31:16]   [INFO]   Playing flx, 320x200, 890 frames
[17-01-2015 22:31:16]   [INFO]   Using software scaling routine. For best results, try an OpenGL filter.
[17-01-2015 22:31:16]   [INFO]   SDL_mixer initialized successfully.
[17-01-2015 22:31:37]   [WARN]   STR_1_5X not found in es
[17-01-2015 22:31:37]   [WARN]   STR_1_5X not found in es
[17-01-2015 22:31:43]   [INFO]   Attempting to set display to 640x400x8...
[17-01-2015 22:31:43]   [INFO]   Display set to 640x400x8.
[17-01-2015 22:31:43]   [INFO]   SDL_mixer initialized successfully.
[17-01-2015 22:31:43]   [INFO]   Loading ruleset...
[17-01-2015 22:31:44]   [INFO]   Ruleset loaded successfully.
[17-01-2015 22:31:44]   [INFO]   Loading resources...
[17-01-2015 22:31:45]   [INFO]   Loading extra resources from ruleset...
[17-01-2015 22:31:45]   [INFO]   Resources loaded successfully.
[17-01-2015 22:31:45]   [INFO]   Loading language...
[17-01-2015 22:31:45]   [INFO]   Language loaded successfully.
[17-01-2015 22:31:45]   [INFO]   OpenXcom started successfully!
[17-01-2015 22:31:50]   [FATAL]   Map failed to fully generate.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Hobbes on January 18, 2015, 04:21:49 am
i dont know what to do, i tryed to reinstall all the game with only that mod... but didn't worked
 :-\ what could be the problem?
i have the latest nightlies and the latest mod

The problem is the latest nightly. Sometimes I need to try to load the Terrain Pack several times before it finally accepts it. And then it crashes when Farm is selected for whatever reason. Either try with a previous nightly from 2 weeks ago since it was working fine back then or wait until a new nightly is released that fixes this issue.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: shadics on January 18, 2015, 04:41:28 am
 :) ok thanks, i'll be waiting
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Warboy1982 on January 18, 2015, 06:39:18 am
posted it on the bug tracker but i may as well reiterate here:

the farm mapscript calls for blocks up to 25, but the farm terrain itself only has 19 blocks defined. removing the numbers 20->25 from the fillArea command fixed it for me.

explanation of why this happens:

when filling an area, it randomly selects a block from the array, depending on the weights you've defined. if the getBlock() command tries to get a block that doesn't exist, or if the array has been emptied (by maxUses) it will return null, and the fillArea command interprets this as "i ran out of blocks to fill with" and considers the command "completed".

technically speaking, it IS possible that the script could complete the map generation without issue, providing blocks 20 to 25 are never selected, which may go towards explaining why it worked two weeks ago but not today.

as to the reason for the yaml errors in the terrain pack ruleset... there are TABS on the end of lines 990, 1002, 1173 and 1192, and you've added a # on line 371 that will absolutely break things, you can't simply comment out the name in this case, you'll have to comment out the data, too (line 372 at the VERY least).

if you simply comment out a name, but leave the data, yaml-cpp has no way of knowing the data belongs to separate node, or that it should be ignored, it simply treats it as additional data for the previous entry. this technically also goes for the cities, but i guess you can get away with that, as it evidently uses the first matching nodes (in this case, lon and lat) rather than the last (i could actually be completely wrong about that last part - it bears further investigation).

i've attached a version with the above issues addressed.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Hobbes on January 18, 2015, 04:37:50 pm
That was stupid on my part. I copy/pasted the Farm lines from the Xcom1 ruleset on the terrain section to try to fix the issue but I should have done the same with the scripts. Sorry for bothering you and thanks for the explanation about the comments and tabs.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on January 18, 2015, 05:25:00 pm
Everything seems to go smoothly for me, except for the MADURBAN set, which closes the game in the New Battle. I have no idea why.

I'll investigate further, but for now I am sure that the MADURBAN section in the terrains section as well as the MADURBAN in the MapScripts are exactly like yours.

EDIT: OK, it runs fine when I use it separately. It is somehow my fault, not yours. Though I still have no idea what could be wrong...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Hobbes on January 18, 2015, 05:36:37 pm
EDIT: OK, it runs fine when I use it separately. It is somehow my fault, not yours. Though I still have no idea what could be wrong...

I'm rechecking at the moment the block numbers on the MadUrban script, in case I made a slipup there. Are you working to integrate the Terrain Pack on the FMP?

EDIT: The block numbers seem fine. Can you post the FMP ruleset that you're currently working on? A pair of extra eyes might help.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Solarius Scorch on January 18, 2015, 07:25:54 pm
EDIT: The block numbers seem fine. Can you post the FMP ruleset that you're currently working on? A pair of extra eyes might help.

Sure, there you go. I wouldn't dare to ask you myself, but since you asked, I'm certainly not going to refuse. :)

I still haven't finished with the maps, I haven't made the alien base work yet, but all standard terrain should work.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack (Mod Closed)
Post by: Hobbes on January 18, 2015, 10:16:52 pm
Sure, there you go. I wouldn't dare to ask you myself, but since you asked, I'm certainly not going to refuse. :)

I still haven't finished with the maps, I haven't made the alien base work yet, but all standard terrain should work.

This is what's causing the issue with Farm on the FMP:
Code: [Select]
  - type: FARM
    commands:
    - type: addUFO
    - type: addCraft
    - type: fillArea
      blocks: [1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37]
      maxUses: [3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3]

It's the same issue that I had and that Warboy fixed. You can either replace the last two lines with this:

Code: [Select]
      blocks: [1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18]
      maxUses: [3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3]

Or simply remove the FARM script all together since it's already included on the XCom1ruleset
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on January 19, 2015, 12:30:09 am
Uh, but I used Warboy's fixed version. I only added some new blocks (made by Civilian).

Anyway, Farm seems to be working fine to me. It's the Madurban that gives me trouble.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on January 19, 2015, 02:54:41 am
Uh, but I used Warboy's fixed version. I only added some new blocks (made by Civilian).

Anyway, Farm seems to be working fine to me. It's the Madurban that gives me trouble.

Ah ok about Farm then.

OK, what's causing the bug with MadUrban is the addUFO command being used in the script to generate a Terror mission, which previously was possible when there was no mapScripts. Industrial and Native also have this problem since they has a addUFO command, but when I remove it, the Terror Site gets generated without a problem. This should be an easy fix.

I think I got it fixed. Try the version below.

Btw, you can simply remove the Terrain Pack comments on the FMP to clean up the code a bit.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on January 20, 2015, 12:21:40 am
Indeed, this seems to be helpful. Thank you!

Though I still don't know why it worked yesterday. :P
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on January 20, 2015, 12:37:08 am
Though I still don't know why it worked yesterday. :P

Before the recent nightlies, when there were no separated mapScripts section, it was possible to use Terror Site terrains on missions that involved UFOs. The engine would add the UFO and then run the rest of the script (adding the Skyranger and roads). I thought that it was still possible to do that with the recent nightlies, so the script for some terror sites had an 'addUFO' command, since they are also used in those missions, and those UFO missions actually worked fine. What I didn't know is that the game crashes if it is running a script for a Terror Site and that script includes an addUFO command.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Warboy1982 on January 21, 2015, 09:30:25 am
i'll take care of that
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on January 21, 2015, 12:32:09 pm
Wouldn't it be easier to define a general script which creates the terrain/map?
And then have a second script which selects the types of terrain used and hands them over to the map generating script?
All terrain types are defined as terrains, without extra instances (like can only be used on terror-sites). And these could then be used as you please? So you could even mix terrain types.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: volutar on January 21, 2015, 12:41:25 pm
Terrain generation rules should be located in single rule file. No need to tear it into 2-4 parts.

Building scripts over scripts is awful idea. The less mess, the more it sorted/focused in the related areas (or files), the better.

There was one extreme - everything in one file. And it turn out into another extreme - everything is torn apart and put into dozens of files. As usual, there should be medial approach. Rules grouped by the logic and relations. To make everything clear, less messy, and logical.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on January 21, 2015, 05:28:16 pm
Wouldn't it be easier to define a general script which creates the terrain/map?
And then have a second script which selects the types of terrain used and hands them over to the map generating script?
All terrain types are defined as terrains, without extra instances (like can only be used on terror-sites). And these could then be used as you please?

If I'm understanding you correctly, then I think the current system already replicates this description (or most of it)

Each Geoscape texture is assigned 1 terrain (for UFO missions), and special missions (Terror Sites, bases) can be assigned multiple terrains, chosen randomly. You can assign terrains used in UFO missions for Terror Sites and vice-versa, although the former is unlikely (deserts are not ideal targets for terrorizing the local populace). As it is, the system is very flexible, and even allows you to assign specific terrains to specific UFOs, regardless of the Geoscape texture where the UFO landed/crashed. The improvements that can be made are basically to allow multiple terrains to be assigned to a Geoscape texture (which TFTD implementation should bring).

Quote
So you could even mix terrain types.

To mix terrain types you'd need to have terrains with sprites that are visually compatible (which very few of the current ones are), otherwise you end up with the visual equivalent of a chess board. As an extreme, try to picture Desert mixed with Polar: it would look very unrealistic.

Then you need to design the individual mapblocks for each terrain so that they can fit on other terrains. Taking an example of 2 terrains that are graphically very similar, Farm and Forest, the Forest's hills and trees could appear in the middle of a Farm. But if you took Forest's map blocks and mixed them together with Urban, then it would look weird to see all the grey concrete used in the ground of a city being suddenly replaced by the green ground of Forest (and the chess board visual effect would be noticed). The solution would be to have 1 Forest terrain adapted to be used with Farm, another adapted to be used with Urban.

This is already what I've been doing with the Mountain versions of Polar/Desert/Forest terrains. I simply redesign those terrains by adding them the Mountain mapblocks and adjust the ground tiles, and other elements, so that they fit with the rest of the map blocks. But redesigning each map block (and each terrain can have up to 20 of them or more) is time consuming. When I made the Mountain versions I could simply copy/paste the old Mountain map blocks and adapt them visually, but had to manually reproduce the old Forest/Polar/Desert map blocks, because of how the file system works.

So, it is already possible to mix terrains, but it does take some work to do it properly, since it is always better to create a new terrain rather than simply mixing them together.

Terrain generation rules should be located in single rule file. No need to tear it into 2-4 parts.

Building scripts over scripts is awful idea. The less mess, the more it sorted/focused in the related areas (or files), the better.

There was one extreme - everything in one file. And it turn out into another extreme - everything is torn apart and put into dozens of files. As usual, there should be medial approach. Rules grouped by the logic and relations. To make everything clear, less messy, and logical.

From my point of view, the most important is to have a system that allows as many options as possible. As for the actual structuring of the rules that's up for the code wizards to decide, sometimes I feel I would have done things with a different logic but once I learn the rules, it doesn't really matter :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Goldy on February 06, 2015, 10:36:16 pm
Hi,

I am trying to make this mod working, but I keep getting errors when activating Terrain_pack.rul in mod setup. The "Yaml-cpp: error at line 3938, column 17: illegal map value" error, to be specific. I am using  OpenXcom 1.0 and Terrain pack v2.5.1, as per instructions.

I was trying to tinker with the ruleset, but as I am still a newbie to this, it probably exceeds my abilities. Is there any way someone can help me? Thanks in advance.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 06, 2015, 11:02:49 pm
Hi,

I am trying to make this mod working, but I keep getting errors when activating Terrain_pack.rul in mod setup. The "Yaml-cpp: error at line 3938, column 17: illegal map value" error, to be specific. I am using  OpenXcom 1.0 and Terrain pack v2.5.1, as per instructions.

I was trying to tinker with the ruleset, but as I am still a newbie to this, it probably exceeds my abilities. Is there any way someone can help me? Thanks in advance.

The problem is in the french language settings. The ruleset attached should fix the issue.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Goldy on February 07, 2015, 11:09:18 pm
The problem is in the french language settings. The ruleset attached should fix the issue.

Thanks. I thought so too, but my own feeble attempts to overcome the problem were resisted. I downloaded your ruleset and everything seems to work. I've already visited some of the improved terrains and I am looking forward to see the new ones. Thank you again :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Iacopo378383 on February 08, 2015, 04:47:04 pm
HI Guys,
i really much appreciate your work here.
I have a little problem at running your mode, i'm using version 2.5 since i'am not using nightly version, running on linux mint 17 (same as ubuntu).
When i start the mod  i got some parsing error.

Actually trying, i solved it my own way. i will leave couple lines here, if someone run the same problem.
Yaml cpp line 0 column 0 some node problem, i deleted the first few line of comments #, and worked.
Had to change few i special character line 3928 or so.
and there were missing a black space somewhere.
Ok ty guys i hope it works now..
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 08, 2015, 05:15:06 pm
Had to change few i special character line 3928 or so.

This is the French language setting issue described before - the problem is not the character but the lack of space in (it should be : Dubaï not :Dubaï

I'm not getting of the other issues you mentioned - they must be related to Linux.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 13, 2015, 01:02:35 am
Getting closer to completion... here's version 3.0.4 (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack) (nightly openxcom_git_master_2015_01_21_0537 or more recent).

It includes several new features:
* 19 new UFO terrains, with all the terrains now organized in 'biomes', which include the original 5 UFO terrains plus Grassland, Savanna, Steppe, Taiga and Tundra. Each biome has 1-5 different terrains, each with different maps and they can have plains, hilly, mountain, swamp and temple map configuration.
* Port terrain (TFTD) has now been restored to the original version with the waterfront map blocks, with the adapted version also available for Terror Sites.
* An improved Geoscape with more landform detail, using volutar's previous work, and added with a new Geoscape texture.
* 6 new civilian types, taken from Dioxine's work on his Piratez mod.
* The Alien Remix and the Mission Pack mods have been removed from the zip file.
* Due to only 26 terrains being possible on the Geoscape, not all new terrains are possible to be added at this point and a few original ones have been completely removed (Farm, Forest, Mountain) to make room for the new ones. However, it is possible to select which ones you want to play by editing the ruleset since all necessary files are included in the zip.

The list of Geoscape textures and the terrains they are assigned to is:
0   Taiga Forest/Jungle Polar
1   Steppe Forest Mountain/Jungle Temple     
2   Improved Farm/Native
3   Savanna Forest/Steppe Desert   
4   Grassland Desert/Grassland Forest
5   Tundra Mountain/Tundra Desert Mountain
6   Forest Mountain/Jungle Original
7   Desert Mountain/Desert Original
8   Savanna Desert/Desert Temple
9   Polar Desert/Polar Mountain
10   Forest Polar/Jungle Mountain
11   Tundra Desert/Taiga Forest Mountain
12   Polar Original/Polar Original

I still want to add some more biome terrains in the future, make a few improvements to the maps, and possibly some more terrains I'm creating for my UFO Redux mod but at this point the pack is getting closer to completion. At this point the major item still to do is to adapt the pack to the new TFTD rules, which will allow for no limits in terrains assigned to Geoscape textures.

And to finish, here's a preview pic of the new Jungle Polar terrain. Enjoy :)

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/thumb_QQNJFYDZ021220150518.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Infini on February 13, 2015, 04:29:07 am
Impressive work.
Many thanks!

I did the French translation.

 :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 13, 2015, 06:39:06 am
Impressive work.
Many thanks!

I did the French translation.

 :)

Thanks. I've fixed a few bugs and attached your French translation to version 3.0.5
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Infini on February 13, 2015, 07:54:17 am
The Build "openxcom_git_master_2015_01_18_0417" is supposed to work well I presume.
I keep a copy on my hard drive, and another backup elsewhere.

Why you don't include it in your MOD if it's possible (in a separate folder)?
Just a suggestion, because it will be more and more difficult to find.

 :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on February 13, 2015, 04:13:34 pm
Hi Hobbes :)

Your Ruleset has an error, which makes it unable to load the IMPROVEDGLOBE.DAT. At least for me under Linux.

I got it running with the IMPROVEDGLOBE.DAT by changing the following line in your Ruleset:

Code: [Select]
globe:
  data: data/Resources/TerrainPack/Geoscape/IMPROVEDGLOBE.DAT

into the following:

Code: [Select]
globe:
  data: Resources/TerrainPack/Geoscape/IMPROVEDGLOBE.DAT

Now the Mod loads without Problems :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 13, 2015, 05:00:27 pm
The Build "openxcom_git_master_2015_01_18_0417" is supposed to work well I presume.
I keep a copy on my hard drive, and another backup elsewhere.

Why you don't include it in your MOD if it's possible (in a separate folder)?
Just a suggestion, because it will be more and more difficult to find.

 :D

I've noticed it and I'm going to update my nightly soon to a more recent version.

Hi Hobbes :)

Your Ruleset has an error, which makes it unable to load the IMPROVEDGLOBE.DAT. At least for me under Linux.

I got it running with the IMPROVEDGLOBE.DAT by changing the following line in your Ruleset:

Code: [Select]
globe:
  data: data/Resources/TerrainPack/Geoscape/IMPROVEDGLOBE.DAT

into the following:

Code: [Select]
globe:
  data: Resources/TerrainPack/Geoscape/IMPROVEDGLOBE.DAT

Now the Mod loads without Problems :)

And that was also the issue with the UFO Redux mod. Thanks for the info, I'll correct it for the next version.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 13, 2015, 09:10:51 pm
The Build "openxcom_git_master_2015_01_18_0417" is supposed to work well I presume.
I keep a copy on my hard drive, and another backup elsewhere.

Why you don't include it in your MOD if it's possible (in a separate folder)?
Just a suggestion, because it will be more and more difficult to find.

 :D

I've just downloaded openxcom_git_master_2015_02_12_2025 and updated the pack.

There is always a link for the nightly I'm using on the first post of this thread.

Hi Hobbes :)

Your Ruleset has an error, which makes it unable to load the IMPROVEDGLOBE.DAT. At least for me under Linux.

I got it running with the IMPROVEDGLOBE.DAT by changing the following line in your Ruleset:

Code: [Select]
globe:
  data: data/Resources/TerrainPack/Geoscape/IMPROVEDGLOBE.DAT

into the following:

Code: [Select]
globe:
  data: Resources/TerrainPack/Geoscape/IMPROVEDGLOBE.DAT

Now the Mod loads without Problems :)

Thanks. I've included this also on the upgrade to the latest nightly.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on February 15, 2015, 09:19:14 am
Dear Hobbes,

great maker and maintainer of the almighty Terrain Pack which provides us with wonderful joy and gameplay pleasure all along.
My fellow troops where just going to ride to this Terrormission:

Code: [Select]
missionSites:
  - lon: 5.530512067257032
    lat: 0.3992440663937029
    type: STR_ALIEN_TERROR
    id: 1
    race: STR_FLOATER
graphRegionToggles: 0001100000000001
globeLon: 5.530512067257032

When all of a sudden the alnighty terrainpack decided to fail on us! What shame, what regret...

I looks like some Route files for PORTFTD are missing.

Code: [Select]
From Openxcom Logfile:
[15-02-2015 07:28:54]   [INFO]  OpenXcom started successfully!
[15-02-2015 08:03:44]   [FATAL] ROUTES/PORTUFO13.RMP not found

Version was 3.0.5.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on February 15, 2015, 10:40:04 am
hm.. ok just saw the new version. Works now :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on February 15, 2015, 03:57:59 pm
Fantastic initiative, Hobbes! It's a shame we can't have more Geoscape textures at the moment, but hopefully it'll happen soon. Right? Right?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 15, 2015, 04:25:27 pm
Fantastic initiative, Hobbes! It's a shame we can't have more Geoscape textures at the moment, but hopefully it'll happen soon. Right? Right?

I'm not going to add more textures at the moment. It is very difficult to get textures that fit with the existing ones plus TFTD's terrain/texture system will remove any limitations to the number of terrains that can assigned to textures.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on February 15, 2015, 04:34:12 pm
I'm not going to add more textures at the moment. It is very difficult to get textures that fit with the existing ones plus TFTD's terrain/texture system will remove any limitations to the number of terrains that can assigned to textures.

Fair enough.

So there's yet another reason to wait for TFTD... :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 15, 2015, 05:05:06 pm
Fair enough.

So there's yet another reason to wait for TFTD... :)

Or to wait for TFTD's system to be fully implemented. :)

I've discovered that there's an issue between Nightly build 02_12 and the Terrain Pack: the game reverts to the original terrains on the northern hemisphere. This is most likely due to TFTD's system not being fully implemented.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on February 15, 2015, 10:15:07 pm
[15-02-2015 20:53:28]   [INFO]  OpenXcom started successfully!
[15-02-2015 21:09:48]   [FATAL] ROUTES/PORTUFO10.RMP not found

I guess you miss a few route files...
Second Terrormission in my testplay...

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 15, 2015, 10:53:12 pm
[15-02-2015 20:53:28]   [INFO]  OpenXcom started successfully!
[15-02-2015 21:09:48]   [FATAL] ROUTES/PORTUFO10.RMP not found

I guess you miss a few route files...
Second Terrormission in my testplay...

Sorry about that. The .zip below contains the missing RMP files.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Mr. Quiet on February 15, 2015, 11:56:49 pm
A great reason to wait for TFTD! Tell Warboy to speed it up!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on February 17, 2015, 12:49:30 am
Hobbes is there a way to reduce (to vanilla level) the hp the walls on some of the terrormission maps have?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 17, 2015, 07:27:11 am
Hobbes is there a way to reduce (to vanilla level) the hp the walls on some of the terrormission maps have?

Which terrains are you talking about?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on February 17, 2015, 09:58:47 am
Which terrains are you talking about?

I will search out the Terrains i mean, just don't have the time right now.
Btw is there a way to set the HP of walls cars etc..?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Mr. Quiet on February 17, 2015, 09:59:31 am
Thanks for giving us this mod Hobbes. I love it!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 17, 2015, 01:46:09 pm
I will search out the Terrains i mean, just don't have the time right now.
Btw is there a way to set the HP of walls cars etc..?

Yes, you need to use MCDEdit by volutar
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on February 17, 2015, 10:52:02 pm
Hi! Just was downloading 3.1.1 after I updated the nightly (I can't think of playing without this anymore!). Great work!

After seeing the "Antarctica has nothing to terrorize" bug in the FMP, I was wondering if it came from here, so I checked. There are some names defined but I couldn't find anything else for Antarctica. No "cities" to apply the names to, no changes to alien missions. Am I guessing right that you deemed Antarctica too small to terrorize? But then why the 3 strings under "Antartic Base/Outpost"?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 18, 2015, 12:31:41 am
Hi! Just was downloading 3.1.1 after I updated the nightly (I can't think of playing without this anymore!). Great work!

After seeing the "Antarctica has nothing to terrorize" bug in the FMP, I was wondering if it came from here, so I checked. There are some names defined but I couldn't find anything else for Antarctica. No "cities" to apply the names to, no changes to alien missions. Am I guessing right that you deemed Antarctica too small to terrorize? But then why the 3 strings under "Antartic Base/Outpost"?

Those names were initially from the Improved Nations mod. It had disabled Antarctic Outposts but I had to remove that code to prevent issues. I kept the strings because they will eventually be reintroduced as Terror Sites later on.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on February 18, 2015, 12:37:37 am
Yeah, it was me who screw up due to reasons.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on February 18, 2015, 12:41:32 am
No worries, just checking to keep the mods healthy :)

Looking forward to more content! :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 18, 2015, 12:48:07 am
Looking forward to more content! :D

Debugging the current content is my priority atm ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on February 18, 2015, 12:55:25 am
Oh, hum..

Looking forward to bug free content!  ;D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on February 19, 2015, 06:43:13 am
Well, speaking of debugging.. I've had bad luck with mission in the arctic causing my game to crash. First time was on Greenland (I think, otherwise on the Svalbard achipelago) that caught me unawares and crashed to desktop.

Second try is on Ellesmere/Axel Heiburg Island (see screenshot below). It runs fine most of the time, which leads me to believe that it's not the UFO or the floaters.

Whenever it works, the map I get is "Desert Polar". At first I thought maybe an alternate terrain was coming up and causing the crashes. However, I launched a few "New Battle" with "Desert Polar" but varying the UFO and got crashes as well.

Another thing from the New Battles: There is no
Code: [Select]
  - type: ru
    strings:
between the en-US strings and the french ones. So the french strings overwrite the en-US ones. That one's easy to fix at least :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on February 19, 2015, 08:38:38 am
Well well.. Those floaters are definitely up to no good. They went on to terrorize Kaujuitoq (the places in Canada are really weird, just found out that's what I know as Resolute.. But no Whitehorse, Yellowknife?)

Those floaters must have known that Kaujuitoq is the entrance to Hollow Earth, because when my troops landed there, it turned out they didn't need their winter coats! I'm not sure what the terrain is (I'm really not OXC map litterate) so I joined screenshots of the endeavour.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 19, 2015, 02:59:35 pm
Well, speaking of debugging.. I've had bad luck with mission in the arctic causing my game to crash. First time was on Greenland (I think, otherwise on the Svalbard achipelago) that caught me unawares and crashed to desktop.

Second try is on Ellesmere/Axel Heiburg Island (see screenshot below). It runs fine most of the time, which leads me to believe that it's not the UFO or the floaters.

Whenever it works, the map I get is "Desert Polar". At first I thought maybe an alternate terrain was coming up and causing the crashes. However, I launched a few "New Battle" with "Desert Polar" but varying the UFO and got crashes as well.

Another thing from the New Battles: There is no
Code: [Select]
  - type: ru
    strings:
between the en-US strings and the french ones. So the french strings overwrite the en-US ones. That one's easy to fix at least :)

Are you only using the Terrain Pack? If so, a saved game might make it easier to figure out the reason for the crash.

I've just tested Polar Desert on New Battle with all the vanilla UFOs and it ran without problems. Whatever the issue is, it doesn't seem to be related to the terrains (I might be wrong of course), since Polar Desert uses both the vanilla Desert map files and script, and the new stuff is basically the MCD files (unlikely since it's a mere reskin of the Desert MCD file) and the ruleset (which looks OK to me).

However, the current nightly build I'm using has issues with terrains since quite a few new terrains don't load and are instead replaced with the vanilla ones, so the issue might be with the nightly itself.

Well well.. Those floaters are definitely up to no good. They went on to terrorize Kaujuitoq (the places in Canada are really weird, just found out that's what I know as Resolute.. But no Whitehorse, Yellowknife?)

Those floaters must have known that Kaujuitoq is the entrance to Hollow Earth, because when my troops landed there, it turned out they didn't need their winter coats! I'm not sure what the terrain is (I'm really not OXC map litterate) so I joined screenshots of the endeavour.

The terrain is Commercial and I've already had 1 player complaining of palm trees in the Arctic, lol. That will get fixed once TFTD is implemented since it will be possible to determine terrains for individual cities during terror attacks.

As for the obscure Canadian cities, they appear on TFTD, so my guess is that in 30 years (TFTD takes place in 2040) those cities will have developed into megapolises due to climate change or something ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on February 19, 2015, 06:19:16 pm
Are you only using the Terrain Pack? If so, a saved game might make it easier to figure out the reason for the crash.
No, I was using YetMoreUFOs as well and it looks like the new types introduced from the Alien Armoury Expanded are the issue.. sometimes(?!) and other times the battlemap gets generated fine. My apologies for blaming your mod! (edit: Found it! Thanks for pointing me in the right direction: Away from your mod ;))
Quote
The terrain is Commercial and I've already had 1 player complaining of palm trees in the Arctic, lol. That will get fixed once TFTD is implemented since it will be possible to determine terrains for individual cities during terror attacks.
Looking forward to it! For now my operatives will enjoy the unexpected palm tree holiday :)

Quote
As for the obscure Canadian cities, they appear on TFTD, so my guess is that in 30 years (TFTD takes place in 2040) those cities will have developed into megapolises due to climate change or something ;)
Is the terrain pack supposed to be for an hybrid game set at a different time? It feels weird to have tiny places on the map instead of relevant ones for 1999.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 19, 2015, 06:51:56 pm
No, I was using YetMoreUFOs as well and it looks like the new types introduced from the Alien Armoury Expanded are the issue.. sometimes(?!) and other times the battlemap gets generated fine. My apologies for blaming your mod! (edit: Found it! Thanks for pointing me in the right direction: Away from your mod ;))

Yeah, I'm getting used to crashes and your description didn't fit the usual pattern of a terrain issue. Glad to help :)

Is the terrain pack supposed to be for an hybrid game set at a different time? It feels weird to have tiny places on the map instead of relevant ones for 1999.

Well, I guess that feeling applies mostly to canadians since the rest of us has no idea of what those places are really like.

Those cities were added so that the Arctic region can now have terror attacks scheduled (and eventually unique terrains, like a snow covered city). And a few already exist in TFTD, I guessed it made more sense to include those, since I'm also planning to split the Terror Site terrains so that terrains like Port will only appear on coastal/island cities and so on.

The intention is not really to have a hybrid terrain, but to adapt TFTD content to UFO. For instance, I'm planning to actually add the Ship missions from TFTD once it is possible to specialize the terror terrains and have mission sites, although I want to make them 1 stage unlike TFTD's 2 stages.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on February 19, 2015, 07:07:23 pm
That bug was unexpected. Been using that mod for a while.. I knew it was something "random" for which I could only think of maps (blocks/placement, maybe even terrain), but it turned out to be undefined item levels. Oh well..

Regarding cities, I can only really speak about Canada, being Canadian. I wouldn't know if "small city A" were in another country instead of "medium city B".

I would be happy to provide alternate, 2000s appropriate Canadian cities (with French/English names, lat/lon and anything else needed) if you are interested.

Those new missions sound good! No cleaning up the hull though? Or do you intend to make it an 8 level single map mayhem (call me crazy, I would totally go for that) ?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 19, 2015, 07:25:22 pm
That bug was unexpected. Been using that mod for a while.. I knew it was something "random" for which I could only think of maps (blocks/placement, maybe even terrain), but it turned out to be undefined item levels. Oh well..

It's how those bugs shown themselves.:)

Quote
Regarding cities, I can only really speak about Canada, being Canadian. I wouldn't know if "small city A" were in another country instead of "medium city B".

I would be happy to provide alternate, 2000s appropriate Canadian cities (with French/English names, lat/lon and anything else needed) if you are interested.

Any large city not present?

Quote
Those new missions sound good! No cleaning up the hull though? Or do you intend to make it an 8 level single map mayhem (call me crazy, I would totally go for that) ?

The hull part was the one I disliked the most. Plus that would require a lot of modifications since both maps don't fit with one another.

My idea is simply to have the top part - another possibly is to create a new port terrain where the ship is docked.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on February 19, 2015, 08:25:42 pm
In the Canadian North, I would have:
- Alert: 82°30′05″N 62°20′20″W (Tiny but geopolitically significant and it's almost at the pole)
- Whitehorse: 60°43′N 135°03′W (Territory capital)
- Yellowknife: 62°26′32″N 114°23′51″W (Territory capital)
- Iqaluit: 63°44′55″N 068°31′11″W (Territory capital)
- Churchill: 58°46′09″N 094°10′09″W (Industrial: Should replace Fort Severn which really stands out for being irrelevant)
- Cambridge Bay: 69°07′02″N 105°03′11″W (Industrial)
- Inuvik: 68°21′42″N 133°43′50″W (Industrial)

For the rest of Canada, a few cities to fill up some blank spaces:
- Thunder Bay: 48°22′56″N 89°14′46″W
- Quebec City (fr: Québec): 46°49′N 71°13′W
- Goose Bay: 53°18′07″N 60°25′00″W (Largest NE airbase)

It's a bit of a long list, but Canada is big and a map looks better with the "largest cities of the region" rather than empty because of population lower limits.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 19, 2015, 09:27:03 pm
Thanks. I need now to check their exact locations on a map and see how they would fit with the already existing ones.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on February 19, 2015, 10:14:35 pm
My pleasure! I tried to pick places scattered over the North and in empty spots for the South. Hopefully most work!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 20, 2015, 06:12:41 pm
My pleasure! I tried to pick places scattered over the North and in empty spots for the South. Hopefully most work!

I'll add a few more Canadian cities on the next update, as well as the fix for the US strings. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: SIMON on February 21, 2015, 05:23:51 pm
I'm sort of confused to know which to use atm. My current game was initially running off nightly 2015-02-17 but having put on commendations nightly with an exe of 2015-02-08 will the terrain pack v3.1.1 for nightlies run ok or shud I use the milestone version 2.5.2 on my current game as since putting on commendations the main menu screen is as the pic shows.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 21, 2015, 09:29:36 pm
I'm sort of confused to know which to use atm. My current game was initially running off nightly 2015-02-17 but having put on commendations nightly with an exe of 2015-02-08 will the terrain pack v3.1.1 for nightlies run ok or shud I use the milestone version 2.5.2 on my current game as since putting on commendations the main menu screen is as the pic shows.

If your nightly version (2015-02-08) has already the changes included to the Terror Missions, then the Terrain Pack for the milestone will crash on Terror Sites. The easier way for you to check is to open the XCom1Ruleset.rul file and do a search for this: specialUfo. If you find it, then you should try the Terrain Pack's v.3.1.1
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: SIMON on February 21, 2015, 11:11:27 pm
Took me a while to find that "specialUfo":

   - type: STR_ALIEN_TERROR
    points: 10
    specialUfo: STR_TERROR_SHIP
    deployment: STR_TERROR_MISSION
    markerName: STR_TERROR_SITE

as with the Xcom1 rul file being split up I found it in the alien missions rul file so I put v3.1.1 on and I was able via debug mode to test a terror mission and test another mission that was in south atlantic in a place called Trindade so I'm assuming that it's working ok, v3.1.1 loads second last to be on the safe side, only my item list order rul file loads after. Really looking forward to some of the different terrains. Will let u know if I've any probs but it looks like it shud be hokey doke. Just on another minor point the rul file I'm doing atm to reorder the ufopedia sections is via notepad++ and then checking my progress thru "https://falkooxc2.pythonanywhere.com/rulcheck#" but talk about labouriosly long and picky as a wrong space or tab anywhere messes up the whole thing. Is there anything better/faster way as to do just the top section (craft,armament & hwps) took me all afternoon?
Once again thanks for ur quick reply.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: ivandogovich on February 21, 2015, 11:22:01 pm
Just on another minor point the rul file I'm doing atm to reorder the ufopedia sections is via notepad++ and then checking my progress thru "https://falkooxc2.pythonanywhere.com/rulcheck#" but talk about labouriosly long and picky as a wrong space or tab anywhere messes up the whole thing. Is there anything better/faster way as to do just the top section (craft,armament & hwps) took me all afternoon?

The quickest way to check just your YAML is this:  https://yaml-online-parser.appspot.com/

just copy and paste from notepad++ and if it converts without errors, the code is fine. Otherwise, it often tells you where the error is, to help narrow it down.  And its a lot faster than uploading a whole zipped mod especially if you are including graphics, etc.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: SIMON on February 22, 2015, 12:08:26 am
Cheers, nothing has popped up in red so I must be doing it right enough.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 22, 2015, 02:53:01 am
as with the Xcom1 rul file being split up I found it in the alien missions rul file so I put v3.1.1 on and I was able via debug mode to test a terror mission and test another mission that was in south atlantic in a place called Trindade so I'm assuming that it's working ok, v3.1.1 loads second last to be on the safe side, only my item list order rul file loads after. Really looking forward to some of the different terrains. Will let u know if I've any probs but it looks like it shud be hokey doke.

If the Terror mission is being generated then you shouldn't have that issue.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on February 22, 2015, 12:35:17 pm
Regarding the ship attack mission, I think I personally would prefer merging both stages into one eight-storey high map. Cutting the ship into separate parts feels really unjustified, except to overcome system limitations (which are no longer relevant).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on February 22, 2015, 04:30:18 pm
Hi Hobbes, how come that all missions on North half of the globe use normal terrain and skip new ones,
and the south half is done correctly O_o? (has the new terrain types)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 22, 2015, 04:50:49 pm
Hi Hobbes, how come that all missions on North half of the globe use normal terrain and skip new ones,
and the south half is done correctly O_o? (has the new terrain types)

Good question. I had already noticed it and posted a bug report (https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/884) about it. This bug only applies to the Farm/Forest replacements though, since Mountain and Desert on the northern hemisphere will use the new terrains.

My guess is that it is related to TFTD implementation but I'm still waiting for the devs to look into it when they have time.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on February 22, 2015, 07:37:03 pm
Good question. I had already noticed it and posted a bug report (https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/884) about it. This bug only applies to the Farm/Forest replacements though, since Mountain and Desert on the northern hemisphere will use the new terrains.

My guess is that it is related to TFTD implementation but I'm still waiting for the devs to look into it when they have time.

Well i also have it for desert terrain. For in the northern hemisphere desert is polar/desert so ice in the sahara is the least what you expect, but playable :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on February 22, 2015, 07:41:48 pm
I was just going to report that! Maybe the sun is so bring that the sand looks white? ;)

Here's some supporting evidence:
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 22, 2015, 08:01:11 pm
Well i also have it for desert terrain. For in the northern hemisphere desert is polar/desert so ice in the sahara is the least what you expect, but playable :D

I was just going to report that! Maybe the sun is so bring that the sand looks white? ;)

Here's some supporting evidence:

LOL. I hadn't noticed that one. There's clearly some bug here at work since Polar Desert is assigned to the white polar texture.

I just noticed something weird: there's no script assigned to the Forest, Mountain and XBase terrains in the XCom1Ruleset, even though it is required, and yet those terrains keep getting generated.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on February 22, 2015, 08:05:58 pm
In the mean time, someone should design a sunglasses mod for our operatives :) That terrain is BRIGHT (which is should well be, sunny weather on snow is crazy).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on February 22, 2015, 08:56:34 pm
LOL. I hadn't noticed that one. There's clearly some bug here at work since Polar Desert is assigned to the white polar texture.

I just noticed something weird: there's no script assigned to the Forest, Mountain and XBase terrains in the XCom1Ruleset, even though it is required, and yet those terrains keep getting generated.

I just tried and played around a little bit with luke's expanded ubase, but i can't get those maps to get generated, i asume the mapscript stuff really broke those too.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on February 22, 2015, 10:08:47 pm
Hi Hobbes,

i got the terrains working correctly again. I changed the following values in Terrain_Pack_Nightly.rul
Code: [Select]
terrains:
  - delete: STR_CULTA
  - delete: STR_DESERT
  - delete: STR_FOREST
  - delete: STR_JUNGLE
  - delete: STR_MOUNT
  - delete: STR_POLAR
  - delete: STR_URBAN

into

Code: [Select]
terrains:
  - delete: CULTA
  - delete: DESERT
  - delete: FOREST
  - delete: JUNGLE
  - delete: MOUNT
  - delete: POLAR
  - delete: URBAN

Works now.
btw your Missing in extrstring - type: fr (for french)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on February 22, 2015, 10:22:29 pm
i also changed
the sections from CULTAFARMB to the following to make it appering again:

Code: [Select]
  - name: CULTAFARMB
    mapDataSets:
      - BLANKS
      - CULTIVAT
      - BARN
    script: DEFAULT
    textures: [2]
    hemisphere: -1

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 22, 2015, 10:40:17 pm
Hi Hobbes,

i got the terrains working correctly again. I changed the following values in Terrain_Pack_Nightly.rul

Ah. I see my mistake now. Thanks, I've already uploaded a new version with this fix.
i also changed
the sections from CULTAFARMB to the following to make it appering again:

CULTAFARMB has been deactivated on propose and with this settings it will override CULTAFARMA as the terrain assigned to that texture. CULTAFARMB only uses the new Farm buildings, while CULTAFARMA has all the old and new Farm maps.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on February 22, 2015, 11:04:17 pm
CULTAFARMB has been deactivated on propose and with this settings it will override CULTAFARMA as the terrain assigned to that texture. CULTAFARMB only uses the new Farm buildings, while CULTAFARMA has all the old and new Farm maps.

Uhh i didn't know that, but thanks :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: SIMON on February 23, 2015, 12:31:26 am
Re:previous posts, I was wondering why I hadn't seen any of the new terrains in my current game but the vast majority of my missions have been in Africa north of the equator and none in the southern hemisphere so I updated to v3.1.2, great work as 1 of the crash sites I haven't done yet in NW africa now looks like the pic attached.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on February 23, 2015, 04:53:09 am
Thanks for the prompt upgrade!

Unfortunately, I have some other bugs to report. The mission was up in the Himalayas. I'm not sure what the terrain is, but you'll recognize it from the screenshot below.

- Damaging the floor tiles, grows dead trees as seen at the bottom of the screen with the dead anthropods.
- Destroying the types of logs I identified on the screenshot causes the game to CTD. (Tested it by sniping each kind of object I found after a rocket caused the first crash).

Luckily, neither are too bad as long as you don't blow everything up :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 23, 2015, 05:43:59 am
Thanks for the prompt upgrade!

Unfortunately, I have some other bugs to report. The mission was up in the Himalayas. I'm not sure what the terrain is, but you'll recognize it from the screenshot below.

Got the bug. I'll post a fix either later or tomorrow.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 23, 2015, 06:18:26 pm
Just updated the nightly version to 3.1.3, with the bug fixes to the Tundra terrain plus additional Canadian cities.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on February 23, 2015, 07:05:24 pm
Hi Hobbes,

just downloaded the new Version and started playing around bit.
And btw:

Code: [Select]
[23-02-2015 17:58:23] [INFO] OpenXcom started successfully!
[23-02-2015 18:01:05] [FATAL] vector::_M_range_check

It's the removal stage of this logs here which crashes the game.
When shooting the rest of the Log (Screenshot 57) the game crashes and the message apers in Openxcom.log

And btw please change the number of Civilians back to 16 (vanilla default) 12 is to low!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on February 23, 2015, 08:53:49 pm
It's the removal stage of this logs here which crashes the game.
When shooting the rest of the Log (Screenshot 57) the game crashes and the message apers in Openxcom.log

And btw please change the number of Civilians back to 16 (vanilla default) 12 is to low!

Fixed both on 3.1.4
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: tollworkout on March 02, 2015, 05:49:24 am
is the dreaded missing LOF template that TFTD has and UFO doesn't
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: tollworkout on March 02, 2015, 05:56:02 am
seems mod site is offline ..would you mind putting the file on the forum as i am unable to download it anymore :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 02, 2015, 05:05:13 pm
is the dreaded missing LOF template that TFTD has and UFO doesn't

What do you mean?

seems mod site is offline ..would you mind putting the file on the forum as i am unable to download it anymore :)

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/18824603/UFO%20REDUX%20v0.3.2.zip (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/18824603/UFO%20REDUX%20v0.3.2.zip)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: tollworkout on March 02, 2015, 05:48:14 pm
vector::_M_range_check error comes from using LOFs higher than 11 . TFTD maps use LOF 12 or 13 unavailable in UFO so you get vector::_M_range_check when an unit is looking at the object with those LOFs :)
Thank you.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 02, 2015, 06:15:36 pm
vector::_M_range_check error comes from using LOFs higher than 11 . TFTD maps use LOF 12 or 13 unavailable in UFO so you get vector::_M_range_check when an unit is looking at the object with those LOFs :)
Thank you.

It's LOFs 112 and 113 actually that cause crashes since they don't exist on UFO but the bug above was not related with this but with the DieMCD settings.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 03, 2015, 12:57:15 pm
Need new Version  ;D ;D.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 04, 2015, 12:59:39 am
I've finished updating the Terrain Pack to the latest Nightly version published today, but I won't upload it until a bug that is causing terror site crashes gets fixed.

Meanwhile, here's a list of changes:
* Terror missions can now be Port Attacks (TFTD style), which only take place in coastal cities.
* Textures/Terrains have been completely upgraded, now for each texture there are a list of possible terrains and weights for them. This add a ton of terrain variety when playing since for each texture there are at least 4 possible terrains to choose (and in some cases can go to 10).
* A few more terrains have been added, for a current total of 39 terrains.

With this upgrade to OXC, I'm almost finished adding new stuff to the Terrain Pack, although there are a few things still on my mind:
* Add a modified version of Island (from TFTD) for Terror attacks on islands. This mod version won't have the Polynesian statues of the original but if you get a terror mission on Easter Island, you get the original terrain with the statues.
* Add Cargo and Liner (TFTD but without the 2nd stage) for Terror attacks on ships. Possibly also use them to make port missions with ships docked.
* Design more swamp (Polar) versions of the existing terrains and a Mountain Temple terrain.
* Design Arctic/Antarctic base terrains for terror missions on those continents. 
* I'm also halfway in the process of finally completing my Area51 terrain, which will add a military base setting, although I haven't thought about how to integrate it on the Pack since I'm designing it mainly for my other mod, UFO Redux.

Meanwhile, I've started a terrain design contest, with the winners being added to the terrain pack. More details about it can be read here: https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,3403.0.html (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,3403.0.html)

EDIT: bug fixed, got everything apparently working but I want to do some more testing before I publish this update.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 04, 2015, 03:04:14 pm
Version 3.2 has been uploaded to the site (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack), requires Nightly 2015_03_04_0147 or more recent.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 04, 2015, 04:13:38 pm
OMG!!! Praise to. Hobbes master of the terrainmod.  ;D ;D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on March 04, 2015, 05:45:52 pm
OMG!!! Praise to. Hobbes master of the terrainmod.  ;D ;D

AVE!!!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 04, 2015, 07:13:48 pm
AVE!!!

Solaris, I've just spotted the issue with your Railyard route nodes that has been causing crashes since the beginning. You must resized or copied .RMP files since the bug appears on maps very identical, namely RAILYARDURBAN19, 21 and 24. If you check the pic below it shows the issue: the highlighted connection is supposed to link to node 8, which stands a level underneath it, but instead the display shows it heading off map and this is causing crashes during the alien turn.

To fix these kind of issues it's better to delete the .RMP and start from scratch if MapView is displaying the link connections with that kind of graphic deviations, because they mean that there's an invisible off screen node (to where the line is heading off) that can't be edited.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 04, 2015, 11:50:04 pm
Hi Hobbes, do you think it would be possible, that if a UFO lands on a city directly e.g. a Battleship on a infiltration mission,
that you would get a City Terrain type instead of the normal one which is assigned to the current texture/ missionzone?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 05, 2015, 01:09:42 am
Hi Hobbes, do you think it would be possible, that if a UFO lands on a city directly e.g. a Battleship on a infiltration mission,
that you would get a City Terrain type instead of the normal one which is assigned to the current texture/ missionzone?

Might be possible by defining the locations of the city markers with a new texture, then assigning urban terrains for that texture. Too much work though since you'd need to create polygons for all the city locations.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: tollworkout on March 05, 2015, 02:15:52 am
i wish there was a lite version of this only with extra terror+terrain , extra cities and extra countries
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 05, 2015, 03:09:44 am
i wish there was a lite version of this only with extra terror+terrain , extra cities and extra countries

And deny you all the opportunity of editing the ruleset yourselves and removing what you personally don't like? Nah, I wouldn't do this to you guys ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: tollworkout on March 05, 2015, 04:18:39 am
And deny you all the opportunity of editing the ruleset yourselves and removing what you personally don't like? Nah, I wouldn't do this to you guys ;)

I like ALL terrains . I just wanted to do 1 playtrough more close to vanilla experience but have the TFTD cities as well :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on March 05, 2015, 04:35:04 am
What is there on top of that that you would want to get rid of? The port attack mission? It's basically just a terror mission on a coastline, isn't it?

Speaking of the port attack: Hobbes, could you define a 4th itemSet for the aliens? That way it would be compatible with mods with more item levels (ie the Alien Armoury Expanded). You don't need to use the last one, just for it to be there so if the AAE references it the game won't crash.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 05, 2015, 10:10:47 am
What is there on top of that that you would want to get rid of? The port attack mission? It's basically just a terror mission on a coastline, isn't it?

Speaking of the port attack: Hobbes, could you define a 4th itemSet for the aliens? That way it would be compatible with mods with more item levels (ie the Alien Armoury Expanded). You don't need to use the last one, just for it to be there so if the AAE references it the game won't crash.

It would be better to use the normal Terrormission deployment on those missions. I am also wrapping my head on how to do this, with my mod ( since i have also custom Loadouts and more aliend defined). I could define an extra loadout in my Mod but then it comes down two which Mod is loaded last by OpenXcom, those settings would be the ones who would get used.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 05, 2015, 10:14:46 am
Might be possible by defining the locations of the city markers with a new texture, then assigning urban terrains for that texture. Too much work though since you'd need to create polygons for all the city locations.

Hmm... ok so it might be possible. I will see if i can get a proof of concept on this.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 05, 2015, 02:59:41 pm
I like ALL terrains . I just wanted to do 1 playtrough more close to vanilla experience but have the TFTD cities as well :)

You mentioned you'd like to play with the new terrains + terror, extra cities and countries (I suppose you mean the extra regions, since there are no additional countries on this mod). Besides those, the only features added are the extra civilian types, and Port Attacks, but they don't change anything from the vanilla gameplay. Port Attacks are simply Terror Sites with a different warning message and briefing, since they use the same number and type of UFOs and aliens. When an Alien Terror mission is launched the game chooses between a Port Attack and a Terror Site, depending on the targeted city.

Speaking of the port attack: Hobbes, could you define a 4th itemSet for the aliens? That way it would be compatible with mods with more item levels (ie the Alien Armoury Expanded). You don't need to use the last one, just for it to be there so if the AAE references it the game won't crash.

I could define an extra loadout in my Mod but then it comes down two which Mod is loaded last by OpenXcom, those settings would be the ones who would get used.

Arthanor, it all comes down the issue hellrazor mentions. If I add a 4th item level to the Port Attack alienDeployment (which is the issue, since I don't define any of the itemLevels for vanilla Terror Attacks) and since the last mod overrides all previous settings, that means the Terrain Pack's 4th level settings will most likely override those of any weapon mods.

There are two possible solutions for this: I either remove the Port Attack alienDeployment and use the vanilla Terror Mission alienDeployment for the Port (and the future Island, Ship and Arctic/Antarctic terror sites), but that means no differentiated warning messages and briefing. Or modders simply adapt the Terrain Pack ruleset (and customize it as you see fit) and include it on their own mods.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on March 05, 2015, 09:31:17 pm
I am well aware that whichever mod defines item levels last is the one that gets picked, this gives 3 options:

1- The terrain pack defines 3 levels: Terrain mod has a 50% chance of being loaded last and overwriting other item lists. 100% chance of crashing with an unprepared 4 level mod (game will crash regardless of load order).

2- 4 levels mod defines a 4 level item list for Port Attack: Terrain mod has a 50% chance of being loaded last and overwriting 4 level item lists. That causes a crash in 4 level mods. (= 50% of crashing)

3- The terrain pack defines 4 levels: Terrain mod has a 50% chance of being loaded last and overwriting 4 level item lists with its own 4 level item list. No matter which one is loaded last, at least there is always 4 levels to access (= 0% crash).

I am merely suggesting we use the option with the least chance of crashing the game to desktop. This way you help make a game with your mod crash free even if the designer of the 4 level mod was unaware of the port attack mission. Even if they are aware, they can only warn to load their mod later to try to beat the crash, unless you define 4 levels (ie paste the 3rd level into a 4th).

Having to play a port attack where aliens don't have plasma shotguns and sniper rifles because you loaded your mods in the wrong order is not nearly as bad as having to reload your last save after the game crashed and then diagnose the issue. The diagnostic of "aliens did not have plasma shotguns" is also much easier than "my game crashes on port attacks".
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 05, 2015, 09:52:48 pm
There are two possible solutions for this: I either remove the Port Attack alienDeployment and use the vanilla Terror Mission alienDeployment for the Port (and the future Island, Ship and Arctic/Antarctic terror sites), but that means no differentiated warning messages and briefing. Or modders simply adapt the Terrain Pack ruleset (and customize it as you see fit) and include it on their own mods.

Couldn't you link it simply as Terrormission? You would get the different terrain but you didn't had the Loadout trouble. It's Terrain Pack. Mission deployment do interfer to much with other Mods.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 05, 2015, 11:36:52 pm
I am well aware that whichever mod defines item levels last is the one that gets picked, this gives 3 options:

1- The terrain pack defines 3 levels: Terrain mod has a 50% chance of being loaded last and overwriting other item lists. 100% chance of crashing with an unprepared 4 level mod (game will crash regardless of load order).

2- 4 levels mod defines a 4 level item list for Port Attack: Terrain mod has a 50% chance of being loaded last and overwriting 4 level item lists. That causes a crash in 4 level mods. (= 50% of crashing)

3- The terrain pack defines 4 levels: Terrain mod has a 50% chance of being loaded last and overwriting 4 level item lists with its own 4 level item list. No matter which one is loaded last, at least there is always 4 levels to access (= 0% crash).

I am merely suggesting we use the option with the least chance of crashing the game to desktop. This way you help make a game with your mod crash free even if the designer of the 4 level mod was unaware of the port attack mission. Even if they are aware, they can only warn to load their mod later to try to beat the crash, unless you define 4 levels (ie paste the 3rd level into a 4th).

Having to play a port attack where aliens don't have plasma shotguns and sniper rifles because you loaded your mods in the wrong order is not nearly as bad as having to reload your last save after the game crashed and then diagnose the issue. The diagnostic of "aliens did not have plasma shotguns" is also much easier than "my game crashes on port attacks".

None of those options completely solves the issue, and with the last one, the Terrain Pack will override all the item sets assigned to a Terror Mission if it is loaded last, so the weapons replaced with vanilla ones can be a lot more than just a plasma shotgun, depending on the other mod.

Plus, if I adapt the Terrain Pack to make it more compatible with 1 mod, what about all the requirements for all the other mods?

The option that completely solves this issue is 4 - People adapt the Terrain Pack as they need.

Like Dioxine did with the latest version of Piratez where he included a specific ruleset on his mod to integrate the Terrain Pack, which avoids 100% any loading/overwriting issues, and also allows to choose which terrains/civilians/etc. you want.

Couldn't you link it simply as Terrormission? You would get the different terrain but you didn't had the Loadout trouble. It's Terrain Pack. Mission deployment do interfer to much with other Mods.

If I only use the vanilla alienDeployment for Terror Missions to avoid conflicts with other mods that change it, then it will be simply impossible to add the ships from TFTD because they require a 50x80 battlescape and the only way I know to determine battlescape size is through alienDeployments. Also, have I said that I've been waiting for years to see TFTD ship missions on UFO? :)

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on March 06, 2015, 12:10:56 am
None of those options completely solves the issue, and with the last one, the Terrain Pack will override all the item sets assigned to a Terror Mission if it is loaded last, so the weapons replaced with vanilla ones can be a lot more than just a plasma shotgun, depending on the other mod.

But.. isn't a Port Attack an entirely different mission? Why would it overwrite a standard terror? I am certainly not suggesting you make port attacks into terror attacks (and am very much looking forward to cleaning up a docked boat along with the port!).

The only thing it should overwrite is other definition of Port Attack item levels, which it does now any ways (and in a way that makes the game crash if using 4 levels instead of being safe.)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 06, 2015, 12:58:09 am
But.. isn't a Port Attack an entirely different mission? Why would it overwrite a standard terror? I am certainly not suggesting you make port attacks into terror attacks (and am very much looking forward to cleaning up a docked boat along with the port!).

My mistake, I was considering what would happen if I included also the ItemLevels on AlienDeployment for a Terror Attack, which will never happen.

As for the first question, Port Attack isn't an entirely different mission, but I understand your confusion since it is listed like that on the current ruleset (although that will be removed on the next version because it is unnecessary) and also the terms are confusing. On UFO Terror Missions were simply Terror Sites. On the original TFTD, Terror Missions would be chosen randomly from either Port, Island and Ship Attacks, plus Artifact Site.

You may ask: what's the difference then, and the answer is that Terror Missions, or alienMissions, define the number & type of UFOs that appear, the consequences of the aliens succeeding (terror site activating, country withdrawal, base established, etc.) and the types of alienDeployments to be used during tactical combat. On its turn, alienDeployments determine the battlescape size and terrains used, along with numbers of aliens and their itemLevels, and the warning messages/icons displayed on Geoscape. So now instead of each alienMission (Terror Mission) only having one alienDeployment (Terror Site) assigned, you can have each alienMission with multiple alienDeployments assigned (Terror Site, Port Attack, etc.)

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The only thing it should overwrite is other definition of Port Attack item levels, which it does now any ways (and in a way that makes the game crash if using 4 levels instead of being safe.)

Terrain Pack has 4 itemlevels for Port Attack, other mod with 4 itemlevels is loaded at same time, you get 0 crashes but also a 50% chance that the itemLevels of the Terrain Pack override those of the other mod.

To me 50% is not acceptable odds when finding solutions for ruleset issues: it either works fully as intended or it is a temporary fix, since it can lead into unexpected and avoidable bugs, and players will notice when things aren't going the way they're supposed to.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on March 06, 2015, 01:11:04 am
I guess it's a philosophical issue. I prefer 50% chance of wrong items to 100% chance of crash.

I'll add a fix to my personal patch mod.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 06, 2015, 01:20:10 am
I guess it's a philosophical issue. I prefer 50% chance of wrong items to 100% chance of crash.

I'll add a fix to my personal patch mod.

I prefer 0% of wrong items and crashes, but I agree to disagree :)

There's at least two ways to change the ruleset, if you need any help.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Dioxine on March 06, 2015, 01:28:25 am
Testing the terrains... quite awesome. But NOT bug-free, no sir! Here's the first one - grass growing inside of a UFO :)

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 06, 2015, 02:30:27 am
Testing the terrains... quite awesome. But NOT bug-free, no sir! Here's the first one - grass growing inside of a UFO :)

Not just grass... I had a tree stump inside a vanilla Battleship.

I think I got a solution, I'll post it tomorrow.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 06, 2015, 07:26:26 am
The option that completely solves this issue is 4 - People adapt the Terrain Pack as they need.
In which way? You would still have the problem of overwriting settings if someone used both. Or integrate roughly 7000 lines of uncommented ruleset?

Like Dioxine did with the latest version of Piratez where he included a specific ruleset on his mod to integrate the Terrain Pack, which avoids 100% any loading/overwriting issues, and also allows to choose which terrains/civilians/etc. you want.

And how would he be able to do that? If your terrain pack gets loaded after his Pirats mod specific settings which both have would be overwritten by the last loaded mod.
That's how yaml works.

If I only use the vanilla alienDeployment for Terror Missions to avoid conflicts with other mods that change it, then it will be simply impossible to add the ships from TFTD because they require a 50x80 battlescape and the only way I know to determine battlescape size is through alienDeployments. Also, have I said that I've been waiting for years to see TFTD ship missions on UFO? :)

Changing the Mapsize over alienDeployments isn't issue here. You included a complete new Missiontype with it's own complete alienDeployment. Which makes your awesome mod somewhat incompatible with a lot of other mods. 50x80 sounds like a ugly Mapsize btw. (it's not a similar rectangle ohh geometric inconsistency :D).

So what you wanna do / suggest?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 06, 2015, 07:31:08 am
If I only use the vanilla alienDeployment for Terror Missions to avoid conflicts with other mods that change it, then it will be simply impossible to add the ships from TFTD because they require a 50x80 battlescape and the only way I know to determine battlescape size is through alienDeployments. Also, have I said that I've been waiting for years to see TFTD ship missions on UFO? :)

This is not TFTD, at the moment this is still OpenXcom UFO Defense. But i can under stand your desires.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: tollworkout on March 06, 2015, 07:33:23 am
we need compatibility patches and standardization for STR_.... i said it before. we make another ruleset called aaaCompatbilityRuleset.....in it we put all STR_ from all mods without anything specific..like generic items. then in mods you enable those..that way people can use stuff from other mods IF mod is installed.


__aaa thing is loaded first

- type: STR_ITEM
 cost: 0
 sell: 0
..... and any other possible string especially ammo stuff

that's it.

then in the actual mod you give it magic stuff. that way people don't use same strings or similar weapons use same ammo etc

SORRY for offtopic
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 06, 2015, 07:41:11 am
we need compatibility patches and standardization for STR_.... i said it before. we make another ruleset called aaaCompatbilityRuleset.....in it we put all STR_ from all mods without anything specific..like generic items. then in mods you enable those..that way people can use stuff from other mods IF mod is installed.


__aaa thing is loaded first

- type: STR_ITEM
 cost: 0
 sell: 0
..... and any other possible string especially ammo stuff

that's it.

then in the actual mod you give it magic stuff. that way people don't use same strings or similar weapons use same ammo etc

SORRY for offtopic

And what would that actually to god? Mods are so flexible. Some Mods only contain 1 Weapon or Tank or some new graphics.
Other Mods change the complete game, convert it into something else. Others focus on enhancing the vanilla playstyle to make it harder more challenging.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Dioxine on March 06, 2015, 07:51:55 am
In which way? You would still have the problem of overwriting settings if someone used both. Or integrate roughly 7000 lines of uncommented ruleset?

That's pretty much what I did because Piratez are incompatible with pretty much anything else (except for very minor add-on mods). It's called total conversion. Hobbes' mod is different - sure it could cause a conflict with mods that overwrite missions/deployments/cities/regions... but these are more conversions than mods, just like Piratez... most mods add variety to the vanilla and these will be compatible with the terrain pack... I guess any mod becomes incompatible with something once it reaches a certain size... Truth is you can't expect mod's author to provide compatibility with every other mod made and not yet made.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on March 06, 2015, 12:26:40 pm
I've also integrated Hobbes' work into the Final Mod Pack. There's just no other way to keep a mod compatible not only with all other mods, but also with different version of the same mod - for example, the next release of the FMP will have not 4, but 5 item levels, if not 6. On the upside, less rulesets makes a mod more compact and comfortable to use.

Oh, and thanks for pointing the problem with the RMP file Hobbes, I'll take care of it ASAP.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 06, 2015, 01:35:02 pm
I've also integrated Hobbes' work into the Final Mod Pack. There's just no other way to keep a mod compatible not only with all other mods, but also with different version of the same mod - for example, the next release of the FMP will have not 4, but 5 item levels, if not 6. On the upside, less rulesets makes a mod more compact and comfortable to use.

Oh, and thanks for pointing the problem with the RMP file Hobbes, I'll take care of it ASAP.

Which parts of it?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Dioxine on March 06, 2015, 01:40:42 pm
Oh, and thanks for pointing the problem with the RMP file Hobbes, I'll take care of it ASAP.

You'd better, I'm getting m_range vector check crashes on the Railyard here :P
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 06, 2015, 01:44:46 pm
There are two possible solutions for this: I either remove the Port Attack alienDeployment and use the vanilla Terror Mission alienDeployment for the Port (and the future Island, Ship and Arctic/Antarctic terror sites), but that means no differentiated warning messages and briefing. Or modders simply adapt the Terrain Pack ruleset (and customize it as you see fit) and include it on their own mods.

Integrating what excactly? The complete Terrainpack? And then check everytime for a new Version and integrate it once again? That's not feasible.
I could define Loadouts  and Missionstone etc.. for the new Mission type, but in the end the issue about which mod is loaded first will still exist.

Also does it really require a new Mission for having different Terrains?
I personally would stick with only the original mission types and just have different terrains.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 06, 2015, 04:35:12 pm
Truth is you can't expect mod's author to provide compatibility with every other mod made and not yet made.

+1

Oh, and thanks for pointing the problem with the RMP file Hobbes, I'll take care of it ASAP.

Thanks. I could do it but I figured that since it was your work it would be better to ask you first.


Integrating what excactly? The complete Terrainpack? And then check everytime for a new Version and integrate it once again? That's not feasible.

Solaris is doing it with the Final Mod Pack and I'm doing it as well: I have the entire Terrain Pack included on the ruleset of my UFO Redux mod, so that I can choose/change what I need for Redux and I have to update UFO Redux's ruleset everytime I make changes to the Terrain Pack.

If I instead started changing the contents of the Terrain Pack to fit Redux's needs (which would be easier) you can bet your ass that a lot of modders would be very pissed off at me, and that's why I didn't follow this route. Which is exactly the one what you and Arthanor are asking me to do: to change the Terrain Pack's content because of a particular mod's needs.

Quote
I could define Loadouts  and Missionstone etc.. for the new Mission type, but in the end the issue about which mod is loaded first will still exist.

Or you could simply rename change the ruleset of the Terrain Pack, remove the alienDeployment that is causing the issue and include the ruleset on your .zip file, so it doesn't matter which ruleset gets loaded. And if you ask me I can even do that for you, if you don't know what to change.

Quote
Also does it really require a new Mission for having different Terrains?

As I explained above to Arthanor, you don't need a new alienMission (the Port_Attack mission on the current ruleset will be removed on the next update) but you need alienDeployment to change the battlefield size to make room for huge map blocks such as Port's ships.

Quote
I personally would stick with only the original mission types and just have different terrains.

How would you feel if I told you: I really like to use your mod but it is conflicting with my mod, and I want you to solve it by limiting your creativity and not use any of the new features, so that I don't need to adapt/update my mod?

Because that's how I feel with this kind of requests - the new features I've added are derived from OXC's development process and they enhance terrain design. They also conflict with other mods that change alienDeployments, since that subsection deals with itemLevels as well as terrain but no one gets to decide how other people should use alienDeployments (and other sections). If you don't like my changes to alienDeployment, you either adapt to them or stop using the Terrain Pack.

That being said, my offer to help anyone to adapt the Terrain Pack ruleset his/her your personal use still stands.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 06, 2015, 07:04:22 pm
Solaris is doing it with the Final Mod Pack and I'm doing it as well: I have the entire Terrain Pack included on the ruleset of my UFO Redux mod, so that I can choose/change
what I need for Redux and I have to update UFO Redux's ruleset everytime I make changes to the Terrain Pack.

So i could theoretically do the same, and try to do define terrains for UFO Landingsites on or near Cities (which would make total sense to fight there in Urban terrain then in in some Farm or Forest).

If I instead started changing the contents of the Terrain Pack to fit Redux's needs (which would be easier) you can bet your ass that a lot of modders would be very pissed off at me, and that's why I didn't follow this route. Which is exactly the one what you and Arthanor are asking me to do: to change the Terrain Pack's content because of a particular mod's needs.

I see. It makes sense but i just fell uncomfortable with because the ruleset gets really big (i wish we could split them into seperate files and also have a directory for each Mod). Including the terrainpack would also require to integrate the MAP, RMP and MCD files right?

Or you could simply rename change the ruleset of the Terrain Pack, remove the alienDeployment that is causing the issue and include the ruleset on your .zip file, so it doesn't matter which ruleset gets loaded. And if you ask me I can even do that for you, if you don't know what to change.

Removing it wouldn't help since the order of loading defines what is read last will be used.

As I explained above to Arthanor, you don't need a new alienMission (the Port_Attack mission on the current ruleset will be removed on the next update) but you need alienDeployment to change the battlefield size to make room for huge map blocks such as Port's ships.

Ok so we will still need the deployment after all, well thats not a problem because this easily adapted / integrated.

How would you feel if I told you: I really like to use your mod but it is conflicting with my mod, and I want you to solve it by limiting your creativity and not use any of the new features, so that I don't need to adapt/update my mod?

Because that's how I feel with this kind of requests - the new features I've added are derived from OXC's development process and they enhance terrain design. They also conflict with other mods that change alienDeployments, since that subsection deals with itemLevels as well as terrain but no one gets to decide how other people should use alienDeployments (and other sections). If you don't like my changes to alienDeployment, you either adapt to them or stop using the Terrain Pack.

That being said, my offer to help anyone to adapt the Terrain Pack ruleset his/her your personal use still stands.

I didn't wanted to piss you off. It was just kinda weird when i was looking through the ruleset, what you excactly did there and then i saw the Alienmission etc.. (which will not exists next Version as you stated). If i get it right due to all the changes, actually everymod which has own alienDeployment rules would need to integrate the Terrainpack (if people would wish to use it, which they obviously do because its a amazing piece of work).

So this change is not enforced by you, rather by the decision our programmers here did so we can Mod more (and have part of TFTD support i guess).

How could i define textures for the cities to have UFO's landing there use a URBAN terrain? (because you mentioned this)

And btw i have gone through a few of the MCD files of the terrainpack to adjust the HP values of mapitems, especially those which seemed to be designed with the aspect of multiplayer in mind. Would you care to take a look or use them?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 06, 2015, 08:06:22 pm
So i could theoretically do the same, and try to do define terrains for UFO Landingsites on or near Cities (which would make total sense to fight there in Urban terrain then in in some Farm or Forest).

Yes. You can tweak the ruleset so that all UFO landings on a particular Geoscape polygon happen on urbanized terrains. Or, even easier, add those terrains to the texture definitions, but then the changes will apply to all polygons that used that texture.

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I see. It makes sense but i just fell uncomfortable with because the ruleset gets really big (i wish we could split them into seperate files and also have a directory for each Mod). Including the terrainpack would also require to integrate the MAP, RMP and MCD files right?

No. You don't need to include any of the Terrain Pack's .MAP/RMP/MCD/Resources files in your mod and be constantly updating them, only your own modified Terrain Pack ruleset. You just need to warn players that if they want to use your mod with the Terrain Pack they'll need to have the Terrain Pack already installed.

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Removing it wouldn't help since the order of loading defines what is read last will be used.

If you remove the conflicting alienDeployment entries from your modified Terrain Pack ruleset, then the alienDeployments from your mod will be the only ones used.

Quote
I didn't wanted to piss you off. It was just kinda weird when i was looking through the ruleset, what you excactly did there and then i saw the Alienmission etc.. (which will not exists next Version as you stated). If i get it right due to all the changes, actually everymod which has own alienDeployment rules would need to integrate the Terrainpack (if people would wish to use it, which they obviously do because its a amazing piece of work).

So this change is not enforced by you, rather by the decision our programmers here did so we can Mod more (and have part of TFTD support i guess).

The alienMission code is a leftover from my testing that I forgot to remove. At this stage people will need to be updating their mods due to the changes brought by TFTD implementation, specially if people keep adding new features.

I've just checked the Change Log for the Terrain Pack and this is simply the latest one of a series of conflicts in alienDeployments with other mods due to changes I've made. Until here, they have been solved by me sticking to vanilla definitions and removing adding anything (new weapons, missions, alien races) to the Pack that isn't terrain related. And I've been keeping to this policy essentially to help other modders use the Terrain Pack without conflicts.

And trust me, if the TFTD Ship missions end up being a bust, first thing I'll do will be to remove them and any non-vanilla alienDeployment entries like Port_Attack, since they won't be needed anymore to use the Port terrains and they are causing issues with other mods. I've done this before and removed the alienMissions of Alien Hunt and Alien Raid exactly for those reasons.

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How could i define textures for the cities to have UFO's landing there use a URBAN terrain? (because you mentioned this)

Actually, I think I figured out a way to do it on the Terrain Pack through the ruleset. I'll need to test this first.

Quote
And btw i have gone through a few of the MCD files of the terrainpack to adjust the HP values of mapitems, especially those which seemed to be designed with the aspect of multiplayer in mind. Would you care to take a look or use them?

Which ones did you change? Btw, those values were not specifically developed for multiplayer but rather inspired by the ones used in TFTD Port's terrain because of how they limit the old standard tactics scout and snipe from a long distance and to use explosions to level the entire map.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on March 06, 2015, 08:36:46 pm
Which parts of it?

All of it, really. It's just not released yet. It'll be in 1.0 (tests are underway).

You'd better, I'm getting m_range vector check crashes on the Railyard here :P

Oops. :P Attaching fixed maps (I haven't made them from scratch, but removing the faulty connections should be enough).

How would you feel if I told you:

Off-topic but this is how I portray Hobbes now:

(https://mrwgifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/How-About-No-Says-King-Sloth-In-a-Chair.gif)

;D

It makes sense but i just fell uncomfortable with because the ruleset gets really big

Yep. I totally relate, man. But there's no other way. Modding is SRS BUSINESS, even if you mostly steal and integrate (like me).

(i wish we could split them into seperate files and also have a directory for each Mod).

My mystical powers tell me that this is quite likely to happen at some point. If the stars are right. :)

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 07, 2015, 07:57:28 pm
Oops. :P Attaching fixed maps (I haven't made them from scratch, but removing the faulty connections should be enough).

Thanks. I've uploaded version 3.3 to the mod site (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack) containing this fix for the Railyard maps and the fix for the 'grass inside UFO' problem.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Infini on March 08, 2015, 02:00:04 am
Up-to-date French translation for 3.3
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 08, 2015, 09:49:11 pm
Which ones did you change? Btw, those values were not specifically developed for multiplayer but rather inspired by the ones used in TFTD Port's terrain because of how they limit the old standard tactics scout and snipe from a long distance and to use explosions to level the entire map.

I modified heavily:
PORTURBITS
PORTROADS

and slightly:
COMBITS
DAWNDECOR
DAWNFRNITURE

With the settings i changed you can actually level the complete map again.
Maybe you consider putting this in.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 09, 2015, 12:47:52 am
I modified heavily:
PORTURBITS
PORTROADS

and slightly:
COMBITS
DAWNDECOR
DAWNFRNITURE

With the settings i changed you can actually level the complete map again.

PORTROADS and PORTURBITS replicate the exact values used on the original PORT01 and PORT02 TFTD terrains. And, as I said before, I used the values of Port terrain while designing the new MCD files with the intention of preventing the whole map from being leveled with explosives.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 09, 2015, 12:51:30 am
PORTROADS and PORTURBITS replicate the exact values used on the original PORT01 and PORT02 TFTD terrains. And, as I said before, I used the values of Port terrain while designing the new MCD files with the intention of preventing the whole map from being leveled with explosives.

Well, we are not playing TFTD here right now. But do as you as you please. I just find it unlogical that i can not blow away stair tiles and steel beams with Blaster bombs on those maps which use these MCD files.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 09, 2015, 01:00:40 am
Well, we are not playing TFTD here right now. But do as you as you please. I just find it unlogical that i can not blow away stair tiles and steel beams with Blaster bombs on those maps which use these MCD files.

Logic (or realism) has nothing to do with this decision.

In UFO you can level nearly every one of the original UFO terrains. Here you can't level some of the Terror mission terrains, which adds some variety when playing since level bombing tactics are not as effective. 

And player use of explosives is overpowered on the original game, specially Blaster Bombs. Having a terrain more resistant to explosions reduces the player's advantage over the AI on explosives. 
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on March 09, 2015, 02:14:26 am
These maps are mostly used for terror missions, where wide use of explosives is inadvisable anyway. I certainly don't use the "level everything" strategy, because it kills civilians and besides is overall lame.

I personally would prefer to keep tiles consistent with other tiles of similar materials, otherwise an inexperienced player won't get what they expect (a brick wall is a brick wall, its durability shouldn't vary much between colours).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 09, 2015, 03:21:39 am
These maps are mostly used for terror missions, where wide use of explosives is inadvisable anyway. I certainly don't use the "level everything" strategy, because it kills civilians and besides is overall lame.

I personally would prefer to keep tiles consistent with other tiles of similar materials, otherwise an inexperienced player won't get what they expect (a brick wall is a brick wall, its durability shouldn't vary much between colours).

I wouldn't be so bothered about the Armor values of those MCD files. But what really set my of was that certain tiles simply could not be removed whatsoever because there DieMCD was pointing at themselves and this sucks! If i wanna remove a specific piece of wall, expect the game to behave the way and remove it. And if it has enough armor and i need to shoot it with a Heavy  Plasma or Heavy Laser ok so i do even that.

But having Tiles which can not be removed at all is just dumb!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 09, 2015, 03:54:31 am
btw Hobbes found a bug:

Railyardterrain (used your orginal MCD files from Version 3.3)
You can remove the Avenger ramp and it's landing gear see screenshot.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 09, 2015, 04:09:57 am
btw Hobbes found a bug:

Railyardterrain (used your orginal MCD files from Version 3.3)
You can remove the Avenger ramp and it's landing gear see screenshot.

It's Mountain Madness (https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Explosions#Mile-High_Madness) 2.0. Fixed and thanks.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 09, 2015, 04:20:36 am
Actually one or better two more things i found odd is the amount of TU it takes to cross these Tiles here:

See screenshots



Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 09, 2015, 04:23:06 am
And before i forget it Polarmountains seems kinda weird that you cannot dig, since other mountins actually allow that

See Screenshots
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 09, 2015, 04:54:42 am
Actually one or better two more things i found odd is the amount of TU it takes to cross these Tiles here:

Fixed

And before i forget it Polarmountains seems kinda weird that you cannot dig, since other mountins actually allow that

Those blocks have armor value of 30. The equivalent blocks in the vanilla Mountain terrain have a value of 50.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Dioxine on March 09, 2015, 05:26:28 am
I've actually liked that the high grass on this terrain costs 2x TU's to cross, it forced me to adjust tactics instead of the same old, same old :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 09, 2015, 07:11:14 am
Fixed

Those blocks have armor value of 30. The equivalent blocks in the vanilla Mountain terrain have a value of 50.

Well the blocks are ok. It's the tile appearing on top of them. If a unit walks over them it will not fall into the, digted hole beneath.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 09, 2015, 06:30:44 pm
Well the blocks are ok. It's the tile appearing on top of them. If a unit walks over them it will not fall into the, digted hole beneath.

That one doesn't have any easy fix - I'd need to redo several tiles and change the all maps that use them. All of the recent new terrains could use a similar rework though to get rid of redundant tiles and a better redesign, so I'm going to wait until I get time for all of this since changing the tilesets in one of the recent terrains can have effects on other terrains.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on March 09, 2015, 06:44:13 pm
I've actually liked that the high grass on this terrain costs 2x TU's to cross, it forced me to adjust tactics instead of the same old, same old :)

Hey, I second this! Felt very natural, being slowed down by the grass, forced to shoot at long ranges.

Pity we can't hide in it. :P
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 09, 2015, 06:47:41 pm
I've actually liked that the high grass on this terrain costs 2x TU's to cross, it forced me to adjust tactics instead of the same old, same old :)

Hey, I second this! Felt very natural, being slowed down by the grass, forced to shoot at long ranges.

Pity we can't hide in it. :P

It wasn't all the high grass, just a couple of tiles that had the wrong MCD settings. But if people would like it I might make the Grassland/Savanna MCDs so that all the grass tiles cost 6 TUs to cross rather than 4 and add some LOF cover to the tiles, like the brown grass fields on farm. I had considered this before but I thought it would annoy a lot of people.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on March 10, 2015, 12:30:49 pm
It wasn't all the high grass, just a couple of tiles that had the wrong MCD settings. But if people would like it I might make the Grassland/Savanna MCDs so that all the grass tiles cost 6 TUs to cross rather than 4 and add some LOF cover to the tiles, like the brown grass fields on farm. I had considered this before but I thought it would annoy a lot of people.

I guess high grass is similar enough to wheat, which does slow down people. So why not.

And yeah, some people won't like this. But you can't please everyone, etc. etc. And it's in my opinion way less controversial than indestructible walls. ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 10, 2015, 12:36:31 pm
That one doesn't have any easy fix - I'd need to redo several tiles and change the all maps that use them. All of the recent new terrains could use a similar rework though to get rid of redundant tiles and a better redesign, so I'm going to wait until I get time for all of this since changing the tilesets in one of the recent terrains can have effects on other terrains.

I see. I just wanted to let you know. I will search for further bugs by useing your mod and playing :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 10, 2015, 12:39:50 pm
It wasn't all the high grass, just a couple of tiles that had the wrong MCD settings. But if people would like it I might make the Grassland/Savanna MCDs so that all the grass tiles cost 6 TUs to cross rather than 4 and add some LOF cover to the tiles, like the brown grass fields on farm. I had considered this before but I thought it would annoy a lot of people.

Well the increase in TU usage would be ok, since grass can slow you down if it is high enough, if you are a soldier with loads of equipment.

The LOF would really annoy people i guess, as you mentioned. But it would be logical if the grass was covering the complete tile (so it is 2m high or so) then LOF sight limitation would make sense for units on the same level.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 10, 2015, 04:25:42 pm
Well the increase in TU usage would be ok, since grass can slow you down if it is high enough, if you are a soldier with loads of equipment.

The LOF would really annoy people i guess, as you mentioned. But it would be logical if the grass was covering the complete tile (so it is 2m high or so) then LOF sight limitation would make sense for units on the same level.

I might just change one of the Grassland/Savanna terrains into a 'tall grass' like the wheat fields on Farm since both terrains are too much look alike at the moment.

But meanwhile, I wanna focus to finish the Area51 terrain, which I'm developing for UFO Redux but it will also be added to the Terrain Pack once it is finished.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Dioxine on March 11, 2015, 05:21:09 pm
Well I'm quite surprised nobody noticed it since ancient times (since Mu Jungle appeared first, btw - this greenish look is simply great), but, there you have it, an RMP bug. Units get spawned in a place witout a way out (marked on the screenshot below):
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 11, 2015, 05:56:58 pm
Theres an issue with my map testing with the Ruined City terrain. :(

I can't guess what the issue is by that picture. You need to describe the error or the error message you're getting or post the relevant part of the ruleset that is causing the issue.

Well I'm quite surprised nobody noticed it since ancient times (since Mu Jungle appeared first, btw - this greenish look is simply great), but, there you have it, an RMP bug. Units get spawned in a place witout a way out (marked on the screenshot below):

Thanks. Fixed for the new version.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 11, 2015, 06:11:49 pm
Heres a zip attachment for the ruined city.

I hope you'll like it or not. I have a mess on the forums to clean up today.

I wonder if everything is a-ok for today.

I asked for the ruleset or the error message - I don't have time to go through all your maps trying to figure out what the issue is.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 11, 2015, 06:53:55 pm
Heres the stuff.

  - name: EXILERUINEDCITY
    textures: [2, 3]
    mapDataSets:
      - BLANKS
      - ROADS
      - URBITS
      - URBAN
      - FRNITURE
    largeBlockLimit: 5
    hemisphere: 0
    mapBlocks:
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY00
        width: 10
        length: 10
        type: 2
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY01
        width: 10
        length: 10
        type: 3
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY02
        width: 10
        length: 10
        type: 4
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY03
        width: 10
        length: 10
        type: 1
        subType: 0
        frequency: 3
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY04
        width: 10
        length: 10
        type: 1
        subType: 0
        frequency: 3
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY05
        width: 20
        length: 20
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY06
        width: 20
        length: 20
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY07
        width: 20
        length: 20
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY08
        width: 20
        length: 20
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY09
        width: 20
        length: 20
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY14
        width: 10
        length: 10
        frequency: 2
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY15
        width: 10
        length: 10
        frequency: 2
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY16
        width: 10
        length: 10
        frequency: 2
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY17
        width: 10
        length: 10
        frequency: 2
      - name: EXILERUINEDCITY18
        width: 10
        length: 10
        frequency: 2

I hope you fix it for me or else no one will have interest with my mod.

Download the attachment to fix my mod.
Good luck. :)


The ruleset looks fine to me. And I can't fix a problem unless I know what the problem is.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 11, 2015, 07:28:46 pm
View any of my messages first.

Then look at more of my ruined city.

I'm done two maps at once.

Take a look and see. Enjoy :)

You need to add this to your ruleset to see your terrain in Battle Mode:
Code: [Select]
terrains:
  - name: CULTA
    textures: [1, 4]

Your maps are merely the vanilla ones with a couple of tiles replaced. There isn't anything really interesting about them.

And this thread is about the Terrain Pack, so please don't use it to post about your terrains.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 13, 2015, 12:04:36 am
Ascension Island has a weird choice of Portattack Map (see Screenshot).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 13, 2015, 02:14:30 am
Ascension Island has a weird choice of Portattack Map (see Screenshot).

I've just replicated several Port Attacks on Ascension Island, both with the vanilla Terrain Pack and the version you have included in your Research Live Aliens mod and they all had the correct terrain. I've checked both the vanilla ruleset and yours and I can't explain what is happening since everything seems right.

A save game might help figuring this out. What Nightly version are you using? Meanwhile please keep an eye to see if that situation repeats itself... my suspicion at the moment is that the bug is located with the new missions implementation.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 13, 2015, 02:42:36 am
I am useing Nightly code from github from 08.03.2015.

And i shall provide you with a savegame (see attachement).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 13, 2015, 02:49:50 am
I am useing Nightly code from github from 08.03.2015.

And i shall provide you with a savegame (see attachement).

Hmmm... are you sure you're running this with a Nightly?

Code: [Select]
version: 1.0
build: ""
name: terraintest

I think it usually indicates the Nightly build, unless you're using Milestone 1.0

Code: [Select]
name: 001
build: " git 2015-03-04 01:47"
version: 1.0
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 13, 2015, 02:53:04 am
Hmmm... are you sure you're running this with a Niohtly?

Code: [Select]
version: 1.0
build: ""
name: terraintest

Yep! I always pull the code from github and compile it myself, so my version number is always 1.0, becaue it is stated as this in version.h
That's also why built is empty.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 13, 2015, 03:21:37 am
Yep! I always pull the code from github and compile it myself, so my version number is always 1.0, becaue it is stated as this in version.h
That's also why built is empty.

Gotcha. Well I've just downloaded openxcom_git_master_2015_03_08_1940 and everything seems to be in order with port attacks on Ascension Island. Let's see if this bug reappears because it's pretty strange that texture 4 was picked instead of -2 (the one assigned to Ascension Island) for a terror mission but I can't seem to be able to replicate this bug.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 13, 2015, 03:33:49 am
Gotcha. Well I've just downloaded openxcom_git_master_2015_03_08_1940 and everything seems to be in order with port attacks on Ascension Island. Let's see if this bug reappears because it's pretty strange that texture 4 was picked instead of -2 (the one assigned to Ascension Island) for a terror mission.

Did you test it with the savegame?
Because i just did a fresh git clone & compiled again and i can still reproduce the error with the savegame.
Did you get the correct terrains?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 13, 2015, 03:45:29 am
Did you test it with the savegame?
Because i just did a fresh git clone & compiled again and i can still reproduce the error with the savegame.
Did you get the correct terrains?

I can get your saved game to replicate the wrong terrain being displayed on the Battlescape, but the issue is not when the Battlescape is generated, but when the Mission Site is generated on Geoscape:

Code: [Select]
missionSites:
  - lon: 6.021385919380437
    lat: 0.1396263401595464
    type: STR_ALIEN_TERROR
    deployment: STR_PORT_ATTACK
    id: 4
    texture: 4
    race: STR_SNAKEMAN

For some reason it assigned texture 4 to the Mission Site, when it should be this:

Code: [Select]
  - race: STR_FLOATER
    texture: -2
    lon: 5.759586531581287
    lat: 0.3577924966588375
    id: 1
    type: STR_ALIEN_TERROR
    deployment: STR_PORT_ATTACK
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 13, 2015, 10:14:07 am
Hi hobbes is there some way to see which textures are asigned in which region (missionzone). (Does debug Mode offer this in some way?)
I know it is described in the ruleset, but some kind of map would be more helpful.

Because checking coordinates everytime i encounter terrain: 4 is a little bit troublesome.
I will later take a look in which reagions it is defined and will tell you how often i encounter it outside of this.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 13, 2015, 03:42:16 pm
Try this: https://falkooxc2.pythonanywhere.com/worldeditor (https://falkooxc2.pythonanywhere.com/worldeditor)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 13, 2015, 04:24:03 pm
Try this: https://falkooxc2.pythonanywhere.com/worldeditor (https://falkooxc2.pythonanywhere.com/worldeditor)

Well tanks that would work if it was compatible with the newest changes but it isn't...i will just check every mission manually.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 13, 2015, 04:33:31 pm
You can also try Volutar's world.dat editor: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=User:Volutar (https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=User:Volutar)

What is the issue with texture #4?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 13, 2015, 04:44:30 pm
You can also try Volutar's world.dat editor: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=User:Volutar (https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=User:Volutar)

What is the issue with texture #4?

I get it were often thats all.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 13, 2015, 07:54:31 pm
I get it were often thats all.

Well, it is one of the most used textures (see attached pic). Or do you mean you're getting it wrongly often?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 17, 2015, 05:05:08 am
Nothing new to announce yet, since I'm completing the Area51 terrain for UFO Redux, which eventually will end up here in some fashion. But I've been also thinking about what's next for the terrain and here's what's on the table at the moment:

1) Design specific Grassland, Savanna, Taiga, Tundra and Steppe maps. All of those terrains basically use the existing Desert, Forest, Desert Mountain, Forest Mountain Polar and Polar Mountain maps but with different sprites. This saved a lot of time in designing these terrains but there might still be issues of tiles being used wrongly due to this. This isn't a major issue but it's better to fix things.
2) Redesign the sprites of either Savanna or Grassland, since they are almost a copy of one another, making one of them with taller grass.
3) Design several new ideas for terrains: Mountain Temple, Desert & Polar Crashed Plane (from TFTD - davide's idea), Tundra Forest and finally more swamp versions of Grassland, Savanna, Taiga, Tundra, Mountain and Steppe.
4) Add Island and Ship (reduced to 1 stage) terrains from TFTD for terror missions.
5) Slight map redesign of Dawn City since the map blocks sometimes don't connect too well.
6) Design Arctic/Antarctic outpost terrain.

This is going to have to wait until I complete the new upgrades to Redux, but eventually I will come to this.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on March 17, 2015, 08:09:23 am
I may have asked this already, but would it be sensible to make an 8-level map for the ship by combining both terror stages?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 17, 2015, 04:32:20 pm
I may have asked this already, but would it be sensible to make an 8-level map for the ship by combining both terror stages?

You have asked already. :)

(https://mrwgifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/How-About-No-Says-King-Sloth-In-a-Chair.gif)

I like this meme :D

On the Terrain Pack I want to avoid battles that take forever and it would be required to edit both maps to fit together.

I've just remembered an idea I had to include the Area 51 terrain here - add a military bases/outposts as 'cities' on the globe (including the real Area 51's location), then launch Terror Site missions where the base has been overrun by the aliens and needs to be retaken.

I also didn't add to that list the Arctic/Antarctic outposts, which will also require some specialized terrain.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on March 17, 2015, 06:28:09 pm
Yeah, it fits you. :D

I don't think this combined ship would take so tremendously longer, with more entry points to the lower deck (including the ones you make yourself). But indeed it would require some painstaking edits to make them fit together. Maybe I'll try my hand at this at some point.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 17, 2015, 08:31:04 pm
Yeah, it fits you. :D

I don't think this combined ship would take so tremendously longer, with more entry points to the lower deck (including the ones you make yourself). But indeed it would require some painstaking edits to make them fit together. Maybe I'll try my hand at this at some point.

A map of 80x50x8 with all those small rooms of the ships sounds to me like a nightmare to clear out. You could set the routes so that the aliens will favor moving upwards but still...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 17, 2015, 10:19:50 pm
Hi hobbes, i think i found a pattern.

github code from 13 March 2015

I will provide you with two savegames.
First one is with an active Terrorship going to create a terrormission/portattack. (terraintest.sav)
If you let it run, let it create a missionsite, directly fly there and do the mission everything works fine.
-> Correct texture gets assigned and correct terrain gets selected.

The second savegame (terraintest2.sav) is done after the Missionsite is created, the error with the wrong assigned texture appears again.

To reproduce:
- Load savegame terraintest.sav
- Wait until the Terrorship creates a Missionsite
- Save the game after the Missionsite is generated (but name it otherwise)
- reload the new saved game
- send one craft towards the missionsite
- enjoy wrong texture assigment.

I have a couple of mods on but will now turn them all off and will only use the terrainpack and see if i can reproduce once again.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 17, 2015, 10:24:08 pm
I turned off all my mods and only enabled the terrainpack ruleset.

I can reproduce the bug once again.

See savegame.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 17, 2015, 10:35:42 pm
I decided to turn off also the terrain pack ruleset.

And i can still reproduce the bug.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 17, 2015, 11:07:02 pm
hobbes i guess we are going to file a bug report.

i am useing github code from 13.03.2015 gitclone self compiled.

Started a new modless game. Forwardee until 20th of january and saved.
Then waited for terrorsite to occur.

Saved the game.
Same pattern, if i fly directly there WITHOUT reloading the game (i can save, this doesn't influence as long as the save doesn't get loaded).
After reloading the game wrong texture gets asigned.

Sry for the spam...

Edit: Just downloaded https://openxcom.org/git_builds/openxcom_git_master_2015_03_17_2139.zip
And run it on windows 7 in virtualbox, same pattern and reproduceable. This is definitly a bug!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 17, 2015, 11:38:41 pm
hobbes i guess we are going to file a bug report.

i am useing github code from 13.03.2015 gitclone self compiled.

Started a new modless game. Forwardee until 20th of january and saved.
Then waited for terrorsite to occur.

Saved the game.
Same pattern, if i fly directly there WITHOUT reloading the game (i can save, this doesn't influence as long as the save doesn't get loaded).
After reloading the game wrong texture gets asigned.

Sry for the spam...

Edit: Just downloaded https://openxcom.org/git_builds/openxcom_git_master_2015_03_17_2139.zip
And run it on windows 7 in virtualbox, same pattern and reproduceable. This is definitly a bug!

Good job. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 17, 2015, 11:43:29 pm
I filed Bug report: https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/894 (https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/894)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 18, 2015, 02:08:58 am
I filed Bug report: https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/894 (https://openxcom.org/bugs/openxcom/issues/894)

So the bug occurs because the game is saved incorrectly?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 18, 2015, 09:11:15 am
So the bug occurs because the game is saved incorrectly?

hm... try it out for yourself. But to me the game looks saved correctly.
I am not sure.

Code: [Select]
missionSites:
  - lat: -0.73085662427262543
    type: STR_ALIEN_TERROR
    deployment: STR_TERROR_MISSION
    id: 5
    lon: 4.7538405501195546
    texture: -1
    secondsRemaining: 14400
    race: STR_MUTON

This looks correct to me. It's also the right texture. But the Error still occurs.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Ridаn on March 18, 2015, 04:18:37 pm
I get a CTD when those stumps get destroyed, those are the same as ones reported by Arthanor here https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,2358.msg39266.html#msg39266
but terrain looks different.

Piratez integrated latest terrain pack, so the problem is probably still there.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 18, 2015, 04:39:13 pm
I get a CTD when those stumps get destroyed, those are the same as ones reported by Arthanor here https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,2358.msg39266.html#msg39266
but terrain looks different.

Piratez integrated latest terrain pack, so the problem is probably still there.

That's Taiga, forgot to fix those. Thanks!

EDIT: Updated the download version with the fixes to Taiga, Tundra and Mu Jungle previously reported on the thread.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Dioxine on March 18, 2015, 06:24:35 pm
Thanks for that, it really simplifies fixing the problem on my side :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Dioxine on March 19, 2015, 07:03:01 pm
Hmm... Indestructible roofs warning! :) Map: Commercial. Most roofs go through 1-2 stages of destruction then end up with these gray-brown tiles to end all tiles. I don't know if it's intended, but, in case it's not, I'm posting a screenshot:
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 19, 2015, 07:24:52 pm
Hmm... Indestructible roofs warning! :) Map: Commercial. Most roofs go through 1-2 stages of destruction then end up with these gray-brown tiles to end all tiles. I don't know if it's intended, but, in case it's not, I'm posting a screenshot:

1 tile to rule them all!

I might change this later.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Dioxine on March 20, 2015, 02:28:55 am
I might try doing something for your map competition, my idea is Arctic Lab (basically rebuilt & recolored Undersea Lab from TFTD). Depends how well I'll fare with taming the MCDEdit :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: davide on March 20, 2015, 10:50:27 am
I might try doing something for your map competition, my idea is Arctic Lab (basically rebuilt & recolored Undersea Lab from TFTD). Depends how well I'll fare with taming the MCDEdit :)

+5

It is a very good idea !  :P
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 20, 2015, 02:47:36 pm
I might try doing something for your map competition, my idea is Arctic Lab (basically rebuilt & recolored Undersea Lab from TFTD). Depends how well I'll fare with taming the MCDEdit :)

@DIoxine

Nice. I had already considered how to reuse that Lab but no ideas so far :)

I'm most likely going to add a snow version of the Area51Base terrain but I also like the idea of the recolored Lab for locations on Arctic/Antarctic ice, since most of the Area51 buildings look too complex for a remove facility.

@all

As implied above, I'm going to add soon the new Area51Base terrain as a new alienDeployment for terror missions. It's going to be called 'Facility Attack' or something and the description will say that the aliens have attacked an overran a secret research facility and that you need to recover control of it by removing the aliens, etc., etc.

The base layout will have a outer perimeter encircling a 50x50 area. I'm still considering whether to land the Skyranger inside or outside the facility, although I'm more inclined to the former due to size issues. I'm also still deciding upon adding city markers on Geoscape for the facilities. I know I'd really like to add a marker for Area 51 but adding 2-3 new markers for most regions can make the Geoscape starting to look crowded. The alternative is not to have any markers for the base locations so you won't really know where the UFO is headed.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on March 23, 2015, 02:45:47 am
Having military bases come under attack would be cool, especially if you could represent some sort of fighting having happened. I know civilians can't have guns, so you can't have soldier npcs, but maybe corpses wearing the basic body armor or something? A few alien corpses could make it look like it was a firefight, but it is probably impossible to put down the proper corpses..

Also, sort of a bug report: There are windows in this map which allow you to see terrain through but not aliens. Would it be possible to make them visible? Kinda weird to have aliens hiding behind glass doors ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 23, 2015, 07:02:35 am
Having military bases come under attack would be cool, especially if you could represent some sort of fighting having happened. I know civilians can't have guns, so you can't have soldier npcs, but maybe corpses wearing the basic body armor or something? A few alien corpses could make it look like it was a firefight, but it is probably impossible to put down the proper corpses..

I was thinking of adding a few civilians in soldier uniforms as the remaining panicked troops about to be wiped out by the aliens. Adding a corpse tile at this design stage would require a lot of changes to maps and different map versions.   

Quote
Also, sort of a bug report: There are windows in this map which allow you to see terrain through but not aliens. Would it be possible to make them visible? Kinda weird to have aliens hiding behind glass doors ;)

Ah. I think I know why that is happening. I'll fix it later, but the fix may also lead to shots flying through glass without breaking it.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Arthanor on March 23, 2015, 03:11:51 pm
Panicked soldiers for "civilians" works :)

Weird about the windows. There is no "solid but 100% see through" combination? I think shots through (most likely not bulletproof) glass makes more sense than aliens being invisible when behind a window any way. Most weapons in XCom should be able to punch through a window.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 23, 2015, 03:54:40 pm
Paniced Civilians in Soldiers sprites would be cool. Maybe you also could some standard weapons and ammo laying around.
And maybe a few destroyed HWP's (as a fixed Maptile not as corpse).

Items can be placed on the map via the mapscript, you even can give them a explicit position, but i guess you are already aware of that.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 23, 2015, 05:05:47 pm
Weird about the windows. There is no "solid but 100% see through" combination? I think shots through (most likely not bulletproof) glass makes more sense than aliens being invisible when behind a window any way. Most weapons in XCom should be able to punch through a window.

XCom Physics :)

Or the difference between Line of Fire (LoF) and Line of Sight (LoS). LoS is used to reveal terrain while LoF is used to see and fire at enemy units. If LoS is clear but LoF is blocked then you can see terrain but can't see enemies. This issue comes precisely from not having 'solid but 100% see through combinations' in the original UFO or TFTD.

Paniced Civilians in Soldiers sprites would be cool. Maybe you also could some standard weapons and ammo laying around.
And maybe a few destroyed HWP's (as a fixed Maptile not as corpse).

Items can be placed on the map via the mapscript, you even can give them a explicit position, but i guess you are already aware of that.

Yeah, a few weapons could be distributed around the map. Fixed map tiles would require a lot of work since I'd have to replace existing tiles with the new ones and then edit all the maps that used the old tiles, or make nearly perfect duplicates. But I think would be also possible to have a non-recoverable "body" item placed on maps, as long as it isn't associated with any unit.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Dioxine on March 23, 2015, 05:26:33 pm
I'm using placed non-recoverable items as scenery and lighting, it works perfectly. Sometimes it's just easier that way than tileset midifications.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 23, 2015, 05:40:24 pm
But I think would be also possible to have a non-recoverable "body" item placed on maps, as long as it isn't associated with any unit.

That's exactly what i meant!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Ridаn on March 23, 2015, 09:15:44 pm
Found another undestructable roof.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on March 24, 2015, 02:17:46 pm
Hobbes, this came up in the FMP thread:

https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,2027.msg41568.html#msg41568 (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,2027.msg41568.html#msg41568)

Do you think it's an error with the Terrain Pack, or simply I messed up (like always)?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 24, 2015, 06:20:02 pm
Found another undestructable roof.

That's how it is supposed to act. TFTD tilesets have a habit of making it hard to remove terrain.

Hobbes, this came up in the FMP thread:

https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,2027.msg41568.html#msg41568 (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,2027.msg41568.html#msg41568)

Do you think it's an error with the Terrain Pack, or simply I messed up (like always)?

Just tested Industrial terrain 4 times and everything seems OK. I'd also like to know if he was using the fixed map blocks for Railyard or the old buggy ones.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Buscher on March 24, 2015, 10:19:38 pm
I took the liberty to create MD5 checksums with WinMD5Free. I just wish it had a batch function.
Code: [Select]
RAILYARDURBAN00.MAP - ae3dda81e5260d81fd8b41632adbd98b
RAILYARDURBAN01.MAP - 47486a7f83d3c487abeeee6754048794
RAILYARDURBAN02.MAP - 29950786b9370bfa9a280ee00fd1162f
RAILYARDURBAN03.MAP - 9c30a2e5daf36f1a98e18cfc0f9920ad
RAILYARDURBAN04.MAP - 9443199399f3c268184a896e9b4ce6c2
RAILYARDURBAN05.MAP - 22697077583cc71796ae2aec140b625e
RAILYARDURBAN06.MAP - 6aee5b18f839cb7efeb42ece64c4009c
RAILYARDURBAN07.MAP - e00b9200827db9176d98f2eac35045b1
RAILYARDURBAN08.MAP - 87264e587dfc9934e53e57eebc92ce1f
RAILYARDURBAN09.MAP - 34057164e9e422efe93471b38c180e4d
RAILYARDURBAN10.MAP - ffffff8018bc5bae73a22bcb39fe23a8
RAILYARDURBAN11.MAP - 4e234f34a4c24ebfdb26f34c001e6c38
RAILYARDURBAN12.MAP - 51763fd8764ea171e4e856a5011b1a0c
RAILYARDURBAN13.MAP - 858b0ec1a80bb1c4fa2d166ddee55a7b
RAILYARDURBAN14.MAP - f5d006e5408a900fc1cf6a2dd5416228
RAILYARDURBAN15.MAP - effe03b93cb7f6cb9f58a3b0e621e722
RAILYARDURBAN16.MAP - b14ef17c3859366ac4f4a8a7a27d5517
RAILYARDURBAN17.MAP - 422a47dbca7c2621eb93ffcb84f9671a
RAILYARDURBAN18.MAP - 221ed3ae7f79d728115d83eab23d1d87
RAILYARDURBAN19.MAP - 6ae2584876ef76c52b621864040d2940
RAILYARDURBAN20.MAP - 543d331bb00f10f671bee51e90540028
RAILYARDURBAN21.MAP - 5c6ea7568c243127932e8b0f955e2b54
RAILYARDURBAN22.MAP - f244a7ae23051a56881b185c293d0951
RAILYARDURBAN23.MAP - af0d0d8cd8c4198a32dd65611657c3d4
RAILYARDURBAN24.MAP - 54b5a05ac88e9c768b94d64328a4476c
RAILYARDURBAN25.MAP - 6093ffe46d779897181ef73a2ecdd2b4
RAILYARDURBAN26.MAP - 94418b943aef2ce34f7d1882fe161988
RAILYARDURBAN27.MAP - 6b7c2bf767b86ac75365f8fc1b818ffe
and the four industrial ones for good measure:
Code: [Select]
INDUSTRIALURBAN04.MAP - f3bd38ba3003c046449f683d443b1e3c
INDUSTRIALURBAN05.MAP - d7d8410bf63157f11737c0fa980ca019
INDUSTRIALURBAN06.MAP - 2ed3864a97d86dd13707cfb11ffbd709
INDUSTRIALURBAN07.MAP - 2d7c7d5977039c292f049e84103d582e

Hopefully it helps.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on March 24, 2015, 11:24:23 pm
Yep, it checks. Thanks Buscher.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 24, 2015, 11:43:53 pm
I took the liberty to create MD5 checksums with WinMD5Free. I just wish it had a batch function.
Code: [Select]
RAILYARDURBAN00.MAP - ae3dda81e5260d81fd8b41632adbd98b
RAILYARDURBAN01.MAP - 47486a7f83d3c487abeeee6754048794
RAILYARDURBAN02.MAP - 29950786b9370bfa9a280ee00fd1162f
RAILYARDURBAN03.MAP - 9c30a2e5daf36f1a98e18cfc0f9920ad
RAILYARDURBAN04.MAP - 9443199399f3c268184a896e9b4ce6c2
RAILYARDURBAN05.MAP - 22697077583cc71796ae2aec140b625e
RAILYARDURBAN06.MAP - 6aee5b18f839cb7efeb42ece64c4009c
RAILYARDURBAN07.MAP - e00b9200827db9176d98f2eac35045b1
RAILYARDURBAN08.MAP - 87264e587dfc9934e53e57eebc92ce1f
RAILYARDURBAN09.MAP - 34057164e9e422efe93471b38c180e4d
RAILYARDURBAN10.MAP - ffffff8018bc5bae73a22bcb39fe23a8
RAILYARDURBAN11.MAP - 4e234f34a4c24ebfdb26f34c001e6c38
RAILYARDURBAN12.MAP - 51763fd8764ea171e4e856a5011b1a0c
RAILYARDURBAN13.MAP - 858b0ec1a80bb1c4fa2d166ddee55a7b
RAILYARDURBAN14.MAP - f5d006e5408a900fc1cf6a2dd5416228
RAILYARDURBAN15.MAP - effe03b93cb7f6cb9f58a3b0e621e722
RAILYARDURBAN16.MAP - b14ef17c3859366ac4f4a8a7a27d5517
RAILYARDURBAN17.MAP - 422a47dbca7c2621eb93ffcb84f9671a
RAILYARDURBAN18.MAP - 221ed3ae7f79d728115d83eab23d1d87
RAILYARDURBAN19.MAP - 6ae2584876ef76c52b621864040d2940
RAILYARDURBAN20.MAP - 543d331bb00f10f671bee51e90540028
RAILYARDURBAN21.MAP - 5c6ea7568c243127932e8b0f955e2b54
RAILYARDURBAN22.MAP - f244a7ae23051a56881b185c293d0951
RAILYARDURBAN23.MAP - af0d0d8cd8c4198a32dd65611657c3d4
RAILYARDURBAN24.MAP - 54b5a05ac88e9c768b94d64328a4476c
RAILYARDURBAN25.MAP - 6093ffe46d779897181ef73a2ecdd2b4
RAILYARDURBAN26.MAP - 94418b943aef2ce34f7d1882fe161988
RAILYARDURBAN27.MAP - 6b7c2bf767b86ac75365f8fc1b818ffe
and the four industrial ones for good measure:
Code: [Select]
INDUSTRIALURBAN04.MAP - f3bd38ba3003c046449f683d443b1e3c
INDUSTRIALURBAN05.MAP - d7d8410bf63157f11737c0fa980ca019
INDUSTRIALURBAN06.MAP - 2ed3864a97d86dd13707cfb11ffbd709
INDUSTRIALURBAN07.MAP - 2d7c7d5977039c292f049e84103d582e

Hopefully it helps.

What's the use of this?

It would be more useful if you could post a save during tactical when the vector m range error appears. It will show there any bugs with the route nodes.

Solaris, also check to see if you have the latest PORTURBITS and PORTROADS tileset files added to the FMP. There was an issue with those
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Buscher on March 25, 2015, 12:40:24 am
What's the use of this?

It answered the question of yours being:
Quote
I'd also like to know if he was using the fixed map blocks for Railyard or the old buggy ones.

---

Quote
It would be more useful if you could post a save during tactical when the vector m range error appears. It will show there any bugs with the route nodes.

It's kind of hard to create such a save if it crashes on generation of the tactical map.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 25, 2015, 03:42:46 am
It answered the question of yours being:

I have no idea of how to use or read what you posted, so it didn't answer me anything. I needed plain dates for the last file modification would have been more useful.

It's kind of hard to create such a save if it crashes on generation of the tactical map.

If it crashes during the generation of the tactical map then I'd suspect that it isn't related to the Terrain Pack but rather to alienDeployments. Where there are bugs with the .RMP files the game usually crashes during tactical.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 25, 2015, 07:38:52 am
I have no idea of how to use or read what you posted, so it didn't answer me anything. I needed plain dates for the last file modification would have been more useful.

If it crashes during the generation of the tactical map then I'd suspect that it isn't related to the Terrain Pack but rather to alienDeployments. Where there are bugs with the .RMP files the game usually crashes during tactical.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Md5sum (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Md5sum)

Those are the "fingerprints" of the files he has on his machine. md5sums are better to check if the file is a specific one or if it is corrupted or not, then a simple date.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 25, 2015, 08:14:25 am
btw i found it rather hard to destroy this ground/floor tiles, even thou every wall near them was obliterated by large rockets.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 25, 2015, 04:40:02 pm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Md5sum (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Md5sum)

Those are the "fingerprints" of the files he has on his machine. md5sums are better to check if the file is a specific one or if it is corrupted or not, then a simple date.

Always learning something new.

btw i found it rather hard to destroy this ground/floor tiles, even thou every wall near them was obliterated by large rockets.

That terrain uses the original BARN tileset and I haven't changed anything about it. Check to see the tileset hasn't been changed by another mod.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Dioxine on March 25, 2015, 05:25:25 pm
Speaking with a 9/11 debunker tone: I don't see any evidence of a large enough explosion to destroy these tiles. Most wooden walls, which are much weaker, are still standing, and the stone tiles on the ground (which are identical to those on the 2nd floor) were indeed obliterated, by an explosion on the ground level. The vertical force wasn't simply large enough. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 25, 2015, 08:25:34 pm
Speaking with a 9/11 debunker tone: I don't see any evidence of a large enough explosion to destroy these tiles. Most wooden walls, which are much weaker, are still standing, and the stone tiles on the ground (which are identical to those on the 2nd floor) were indeed obliterated, by an explosion on the ground level. The vertical force wasn't simply large enough. :)

I shoot a Large Missile from the frist level into the roof from downstairs that should have been enough.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Ridаn on March 25, 2015, 08:39:47 pm
And I used a Fusion explosives with a damage rating of 220. Its 20 more than a vanilla Blaster Launcher. A direct hit in the middle.
And this wooden looking roof is just floating there, mocking me.  :'(

That's how it is supposed to act. TFTD tilesets have a habit of making it hard to remove terrain.

So its WAD? I felt it wasnt just hard to remove, but impossible to. This stuff is harder than UFO hull.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 25, 2015, 09:05:16 pm
I shoot a Large Missile from the frist level into the roof from downstairs that should have been enough.

Just tried it and it's simply how the Barn tileset is designed and explosions work. Most of the blast is absorbed by the walls, so there's not enough to destroy the ground after them. One thing is that the specific ground tile is only used on ground level on vanilla Farm terrain and it has a strength of 30 while the usual ground tiles for upper levels have around 6-8 strength.

So its WAD? I felt it wasnt just hard to remove, but impossible to. This stuff is harder than UFO hull.

It is impossible to destroy/remove it. If it takes a hit that overcomes its armor, the tile is simply replaced by itself. TFTD's terrain is notorious for being designed to be very hard to remove/destroy.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 25, 2015, 09:08:55 pm
Just tried it and it's simply how the tileset/explosions work. Most of the blast is absorbed by the walls, so there's not enough to destroy the ground after them.

Well actually it was the second missile, the frist one removed everything on the first and second level and then i fired the second missile directly onto this tiles from downstairs i even used some HE packs and Heavy Canon shots...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 25, 2015, 09:14:27 pm
Well actually it was the second missile, the frist one removed everything on the first and second level and then i fired the second missile directly onto this tiles from downstairs i even used some HE packs and Heavy Canon shots...

The explosion mechanism most likely isn't the same as the original. Because all the tileset values are vanilla, the only different thing is that the specific tile is only used on level 0 on vanilla Farm, while it is used on levels 1 and 2 on Expanded Farm.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 25, 2015, 09:17:43 pm
The explosion mechanism most likely isn't the same as the original. Because all the tileset values are vanilla, the only different thing is that the specific tile is only used on level 0 on vanilla Farm, while it is used on levels 1 and 2 on Expanded Farm.

hm..kay as a groundtile it makes sense but in this case it is just midair floating.... so maybe replace it with anothertile from barn, theone which is used in normal farm barn for bottom on the second level?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Ridаn on March 25, 2015, 09:45:20 pm
Something is wrong with doors on this terrain, looks like a wrong LOF template.
Attachement 1: I have a Line of sight through closed door, and I`m able to shoot.
Attachement 2: fps look of Attachement 1
Attachement 3: Door is open. No Line of Sight and no Line of Fire.
Attachement 4: fps look of Attachement 3, door is open
Attachement 5: Terrain screenshot, coursor is in the middle of mapblock where I tested stuff.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 25, 2015, 10:48:56 pm
hm..kay as a groundtile it makes sense but in this case it is just midair floating.... so maybe replace it with anothertile from barn, theone which is used in normal farm barn for bottom on the second level?

Done. Replaced it with the ground tile used for level 1 on vanilla maps.

Something is wrong with doors on this terrain, looks like a wrong LOF template.

Yup, that's it. The LOF settings were completely wrong. Thanks. :)

For some different, I've already got Area51 added as a Terror Site for the Terrain Pack, although I'll create a new alienDeployment for it and will only set it to appear on mid-game. The alienDeployment will be called 'facility raid' or similar, and it will not take place on city markers.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 26, 2015, 09:59:55 am
Done. Replaced it with the ground tile used for level 1 on vanilla maps.
Your the best ;)

For some different, I've already got Area51 added as a Terror Site for the Terrain Pack, although I'll create a new alienDeployment for it and will only set it to appear on mid-game. The alienDeployment will be called 'facility raid' or similar, and it will not take place on city markers.

It will not be taken place on city markers? Ok so you will define extra markers?
Hm.. i am just thinking a lot of what to do with my mod, so i guess i will try too put this new terrain to some good use.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 26, 2015, 10:06:27 pm
It will not be taken place on city markers? Ok so you will define extra markers?
Hm.. i am just thinking a lot of what to do with my mod, so i guess i will try too put this new terrain to some good use.

There will be specific MissionZone 3 areas but there won't be any markers, to avoid overcrowding the Geoscape with more markers and since those attacks take place on military bases, no cities.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack - Area 51 terrain published!
Post by: Hobbes on March 27, 2015, 05:25:00 am
Today I'm finally implementing an idea that I had about 10 years ago when I started modding maps for XCom: I wanted to create a military base terrain (a.k.a. Area 51) to use in Terror Sites, with military personnel instead of civilians. I released several versions of Area 51, one for the original game that reused the original sprites in new maps, and another for UFO2000 that didn't look that good.

So when I came to OXC I still had this goal on the back of my head, of finishing this mythical Area 51 terrain. And I can say now that it is almost finished :)

I didn't had time to implement everything yet since there were a lot of bug fixes for other terrains that I wanted to release due to reported bugs. Later installments will include the mission sites not to happening in cities but in countryside locations, I hadn't added the uniformed civilians yet and I also want this terrain only to appear on the middle-late game, since it is a very unforgiving terrain.

This terrain contains 100 maps and they has been designed as a 'Build-Your-Own-Secret-Base' kit. There are perimeter maps, road maps, buildings and clear areas. To have an idea about the possibilities, check my other mod, UFO Redux, where it is used to create a 100x100 mercenary base.

As for bug fixes, this release fixes the following ones:
* Fixes for Madurban & Railyard (bad .RMP files causing vector::_range_check crashes)
* Farm (wrong tile use)
* Commercial (glass walls LOF/LOS issues)
* Dawn City (LOF issues)

Important - Bug Reporting
If there are future crashes with a "vector::_range_check" error message, please report the terrain and a save file of the game during tactical combat would greatly help. Please do no attach games saved during Geoscape since they are useless to determine the reason for this sort of crashes.

If you are playing the terrain part as part of another mod, make sure you have the latest files on the /MAPS, /ROUTES and /TERRAIN folders, since the other mod's author might not have updated those to the latest version.

And to finish, welcome to Area 51 (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack) :)

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/CAIDJTPQ032620151124.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Jstank on March 27, 2015, 06:19:03 am
Im no longer getting a range check error with the latest nightly, I am getting terror missions in open wild lands, no buildings. It works, you can play it but Im pretty sure the aliens don't care about random campers...(https://imgur.com/share/i/5fqU9IM)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Ridаn on March 27, 2015, 02:25:02 pm
Got another guy stuck behind vegetation on Mu jungle, map block looks like the same as one reported by Dioxine, so if it is the same (and got fixed already) I do apologize in advance.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 27, 2015, 04:12:23 pm
Im no longer getting a range check error with the latest nightly, I am getting terror missions in open wild lands, no buildings. It works, you can play it but Im pretty sure the aliens don't care about random campers...(https://imgur.com/share/i/5fqU9IM)

This is an OXC isssue, upgrade to the latest nightly to fix it.

Got another guy stuck behind vegetation on Mu jungle, map block looks like the same as one reported by Dioxine, so if it is the same (and got fixed already) I do apologize in advance.

Already reported and fixed :)

Version 3.4.1 updated with a fix to the Area51 terrain where a specific map was causing crashes.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Dioxine on March 27, 2015, 08:52:56 pm
Great that the new version came out! I had to merge with my Piratez version, and I've noticed some discrepancies... namely, I have a bunch of maps jury-rigged to the Terrain Pack, that aren't present in the terrain pack itself. My question is, what's their status?
Namely
- CULT_NEW maps (in Farms);
- SOLBAN maps (in Madurban).

Question 2, are the xxURBAN_UFO terrains ever used? I think the idea itself is great, but I haven't seem to stumble upon them...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 27, 2015, 09:01:18 pm
Great that the new version came out! I had to merge with my Piratez version, and I've noticed some discrepancies... namely, I have a bunch of maps jury-rigged to the Terrain Pack, that aren't present in the terrain pack itself. My question is, what's their status?
Namely
- CULT_NEW maps (in Farms);
- SOLBAN maps (in Madurban).

Neither are present on the Terrain Pack. SOLBAN are used on the improved XCom Base facilities, IIRC. CULT_NEW is from a Farm mod someone posted a while ago.

Quote
Question 2, are the xxURBAN_UFO terrains ever used? I think the idea itself is great, but I haven't seem to stumble upon them...

Yes, they were assigned to Geoscape textures before the new texture system was implemented, so it was possible to get then on UFO missions.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Ridаn on March 27, 2015, 09:24:03 pm
CULT_NEW maps are from Civilian, as far as I know.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on March 28, 2015, 11:32:25 am
Actually, CULT_NEW and SOLBAN blocks were added to Piratez by me, when I was integrating Terrain Pack for DIoxine. CULT_NEW is indeed by Civilian, like Ridan said, and SOLBAN are my own additions to the URBAN.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: hellrazor on March 30, 2015, 10:42:47 pm
Uhh i am just wondering.

Do Sectoid Leaders also posses teleporting powers?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on March 30, 2015, 11:02:10 pm
Uhh i am just wondering.

Do Sectoid Leaders also posses teleporting powers?

They have a magic pocket where they can fit everything :)

Fixed for next version. Thanks. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Ridаn on April 01, 2015, 01:52:28 pm
Those 3x3 tiles under a radar dish blend with tiles from a lower level, doesnt look good.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 01, 2015, 11:14:16 pm
Those 3x3 tiles under a radar dish blend with tiles from a lower level, doesnt look good.

I'd wish all bug reports were like this... ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: chaosshade on April 03, 2015, 10:19:31 pm
Because I don't understand exactly what's going on and what the fix for it is, I'll hand over my mod so you can look at it and meanwhile I'll just have to deal w/ vanilla stuff.

Dropbox Link (https://www.dropbox.com/s/zk6a6ox1gjhkzh1/Weapon%20Rework%20Beta%200.4.zip?dl=0)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 04, 2015, 07:38:18 am
Version 3.5 has been uploaded to the mod site (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack).

It contains fixes to the Cyberdisk issue and for a map bug that caused crashes with the Area 51 terrain. I've also removed Commercial and Railyard from the list of terrains for Terror missions since I've come to the conclusion that those two terrains are too buggy and need a complete overhaul of their files (and in case of Commercial, of making it less TFTD with too many small rooms).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on April 04, 2015, 11:10:56 am
(and in case of Commercial, of making it less TFTD with too many small rooms).

Please no. I like it. :(
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: davide on April 04, 2015, 03:37:46 pm
-10

 :'(
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 04, 2015, 04:18:54 pm
Please no. I like it. :(

The maps you designed for Commercial are good, the ones I want to redesign are the 10x10s that were my first atttempts at map design a long time ago. I've read and heard several complaints about this terrain being too TFTD like, so I'll clear a bit the inside of those 3 level buildings.

Plus, I'll redo all the .RMP files and redesign the old tiles (again, not the recent ones that you and others designed). Right now this terrain looks to me like Frankenstein's monster with bits and pieces from everywhere.

And I haven't removed those terrains from the package, merely deactivated them by not assigning them to any missions. So you can still play with them or add to your mod by editing the ruleset. Just don't come to me with bug reports - right now I want to focus on the MJ12 missions for Redux before I get back to fixing those terrains.

And since you like TFTD so much, try Area 51 on the Terrain Pack. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: ivandogovich on April 04, 2015, 04:34:56 pm
Hmm... getting Vector_M_ crashes when trying to load tactical battles.  one is a farm and the other is Rail. 
Using latest nightly, Piratez 9b, and latest terrain pack on top.

I'm going to rebuild and see if I messed something up.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 04, 2015, 05:04:59 pm
Hmm... getting Vector_M_ crashes when trying to load tactical battles.  one is a farm and the other is Rail. 
Using latest nightly, Piratez 9b, and latest terrain pack on top.

I'm going to rebuild and see if I messed something up.

As stated above, I've deactivated Railyard on the Terrain Pack due to bugs, so play that terrain at your own risk. As for Mod Farm, I've got it working without issues just with the Terrain Pack.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: ivandogovich on April 04, 2015, 05:12:57 pm
OK. I recompiled and it looks like its working fine.  ::)  Sorry for the false alarm. 
and I finally built a script to do it... its not really recompliling, just copying the files around to make a new setup of the mod. XD
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on April 04, 2015, 05:19:51 pm
Oh, I didn't mean "protecting" the ones I made, I was referring to the possible removal of tight closets. I like them, to a certain degree, they're refreshing and make the game less boring. (As long as they're occasional.)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 04, 2015, 05:28:36 pm
Sorry for the false alarm.

I just had this wonderful idea of charging people a beer whenever it is a false alarm  ::)

Oh, I didn't mean "protecting" the ones I made, I was referring to the possible removal of tight closets. I like them, to a certain degree, they're refreshing and make the game less boring. (As long as they're occasional.)

I agree with this.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: ivandogovich on April 04, 2015, 06:43:06 pm
Just got a CTD from the Geoscape when approaching the end of the first month.  I'm not sure is this was the same bug that was occurring earlier with the terror missions in Antarctica or not.

latest nightly, piratez mod, terrainpack (MAPS, ROUTES, TERRAINS) is what I'm using.

I'll post in PirateZ thread too.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 05, 2015, 03:26:21 pm
Just got a CTD from the Geoscape when approaching the end of the first month.  I'm not sure is this was the same bug that was occurring earlier with the terror missions in Antarctica or not.

latest nightly, piratez mod, terrainpack (MAPS, ROUTES, TERRAINS) is what I'm using.

I'll post in PirateZ thread too.

I just replied to this on the Piratez thread but I wanted to clarify something about crashes while using the Terrain Pack with other mods.

Right now there are 2 main types of bugs that are the usual ones with the Terrain Pack:
1) Design bugs - this means wrong graphics (like grass inside UFOs), bad MCD settings (like objects being replaced with the wrong ones when destroyed) and aesthetics (that ground is easily confused with the one on the 2nd level on that building). Those bugs usually don't cause CTD (but they might during a mission)
2) "vector::_range_check" error messages - these are due to bad .RMP files that got either wrongly saved or badly designed. Those happen during missions when the AI tries to use route nodes that don't exist or are wrongly placed.

Most other current bugs, specially those with "invalid vector<T> subscript" error messages are usually from bad integration of the Terrain Pack with other mods, specially the alienDeployments section, since the Terrain Pack now requires a PORT_ATTACK entry. Another usual source of conflict are mods that define more than the vanilla 3 itemLevels.

In short, CTDs or error messages before the mission starts usually don't involve the Terrain Pack but other mods. CTDs/messages/funky terrain behavior during the mission usually involve the Terrain Pack. And, as with everything, there are exceptions :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Ridаn on April 05, 2015, 03:39:24 pm
Some of the destroyed ground tiles in Port terrain (or is it Industrial too? I have no idea) cost zero TU to traverse.
Sadly, I`m unable to present you pictures of non-destroyed mapblocks - I tried New Battle to look whats that terrain is called and my battlescape autosave was replaced with one from New Battle.

edit: nevermind, its all of them :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Dioxine on April 05, 2015, 03:50:47 pm
Is this a hovering armor trying to walk on these tiles? TU cost for foot and hovering units are defined separately.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Ridаn on April 05, 2015, 03:52:50 pm
No, its a Brute suit, a normal walking one.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Dioxine on April 05, 2015, 05:40:17 pm
I'm getting consistent crashes trying to land on Desert. Version used: 3.4.1. Has this been fixed for 3.5? Or maybe it was never broken and I've likely haven't copied stuff well enough?

EDIT: nvmd, fixed after updating to terrain pack 3.5
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain/Missions Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 05, 2015, 07:37:47 pm
Some of the destroyed ground tiles in Port terrain (or is it Industrial too? I have no idea) cost zero TU to traverse.
Sadly, I`m unable to present you pictures of non-destroyed mapblocks - I tried New Battle to look whats that terrain is called and my battlescape autosave was replaced with one from New Battle.

edit: nevermind, its all of them :)

That's interesting because that's how the values on the original TFTD files are actually set. I wonder if this affects the original Port terrain. Fixed and thanks.

I'm getting consistent crashes trying to land on Desert. Version used: 3.4.1. Has this been fixed for 3.5? Or maybe it was never broken and I've likely haven't copied stuff well enough?

EDIT: nvmd, fixed after updating to terrain pack 3.5

As I described above, crashes when the engine tries to generate a battlescape are usually due to other mods (or wrongly copying the pack ruleset). It's possible that I screwed up and didn't test enough before publishing, but unlikely. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Ridаn on April 12, 2015, 07:05:12 pm
Looks like wrong LOF template is used for windows on Dawn City B, I cant see interior from outside and cant look outside either. Spotting enemies and shooting at them works fine though.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Dioxine on April 12, 2015, 07:08:32 pm
That building... is EVIL. Laws of men and nature do not apply to it :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Ridаn on April 13, 2015, 01:27:35 am
That building... is EVIL. Laws of men and nature do not apply to it :)

I think that LOFT might be used for stuff like bunkers or embrasures.
Or for supernatural-ish stuff like your Mansion of Madness "UFO". Might be an intersting twist.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 13, 2015, 02:34:06 am
Looks like wrong LOF template is used for windows on Dawn City B, I cant see interior from outside and cant look outside either. Spotting enemies and shooting at them works fine though.

Fixed, thanks. I've also fixed a few bugs with Port terrain (thanks for clownagent for his help) and uploaded (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack) version 3.5.1. No ruleset changes, only terrain, maps and routes changes.

The cause of the EVIL mansion was not due to the LOFT but because those were previously walls and I had forgotten to switch the stop LOS setting on them from true to false.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Dioxine on April 13, 2015, 06:54:11 am
I've lost dozens of soldiers in that building :) Gotta see how it looks now :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 15, 2015, 06:36:33 pm
I've lost dozens of soldiers in that building :) Gotta see how it looks now :)

The amazing thing to me is that I've never had this terrain while playtesting during a campaign and that's why I missed this obvious bug.

As everyone may have noticed, there aren't much updates lately to the Terrain Pack other than bug fixing. That is not because of a lack of ideas but since I'm focusing on debugging and finishing my other mod, UFO Redux. Here's my task list after I'm done with Redux:
1) Redesign Commercial and Railyard terrains
2) Add Slums, Complex, Polis & Downtown terrains from UFO2000
3) Add Island and Cargo/Liner Ships from TFTD
4) Redesign Dawn City's maps
5) Redesign Savanna/Grassland sprites to differentiate them
6) Redesign the maps and MCD files used on the new UFO terrains (Tundra, Steppe, etc.) to fix graphics issues.
7) Add new variations of UFO terrains: Mountain Temple, Desert & Polar Crashed Plane (from TFTD), Tundra Forest, swamp versions of Grassland, Taiga, etc.
8) Design Arctic/Antarctic outpost terrain
9) Add colored variations of the vanilla Urban terrain (like the different 'UFO' terrains) - this is the first step into creating specific regional terrains for terror sites.
10) Add Area51 as a separate alienDeployment for Terror Sites, simulating an attack on a military facility, rather than a city.

I'm also waiting to see if there are any entries from the Terrain Pack contest that fulfill some of those future additions, which would save me some time, like the Polar outposts.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Dioxine on April 21, 2015, 08:53:06 pm
Hey,
How about maybe replacing those gray indestructible blocks from Dawn City with some actual rooms? This doesn't look any good once explosives expose it...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 21, 2015, 10:45:41 pm
Hey,
How about maybe replacing those gray indestructible blocks from Dawn City with some actual rooms? This doesn't look any good once explosives expose it...

They're supposed to be concrete blocks. I placed them there to prevent blowing up the entire ground level.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Dioxine on April 22, 2015, 12:41:41 am
They're supposed to be concrete blocks. I placed them there to prevent blowing up the entire ground level.

And that'd be bad... how? :) No matter, it's your mod and your call :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on April 24, 2015, 04:58:17 pm
Hi Hobbes,

i took the freedom and added " " to all your string in extraString section.
Ruleset attached.

Plz put "" into you file string defintions :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on April 25, 2015, 06:22:11 pm
You wanna look at this Hobbes (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,1898.msg43517.html#msg43517)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 25, 2015, 07:10:08 pm
You wanna look at this Hobbes (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,1898.msg43517.html#msg43517)

Dioxine needs to update his ruleset. Thanks
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on April 25, 2015, 07:12:50 pm
Dioxine needs to update his ruleset. Thanks

Is the map now 10x10 or 20x20?
Because i integrated the newest Version of the Terrainpack ruleset Yesterday and the maps is specified in the ruleset as 20x20.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 25, 2015, 07:13:37 pm
Is the map now 10x10 or 20x20?
Because i integrated the newest Version of the Terrainpack ruleset Yesterday and the maps is specified in the ruleset as 20x20.

Map is 20x20, Dioxine simply had an earlier version defined in the ruleset.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on April 25, 2015, 07:14:35 pm
Map is 20x20, Dioxine simply had an earlier version defined in the ruleset.

Ok good to know. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on April 27, 2015, 03:24:31 pm
Hobbes, you wanna take a look at this (https://github.com/SupSuper/OpenXcom/commit/66326fe6df68dfcb4a4d4388c60ae60689e6090d).

Guys we have to change everything around again :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 27, 2015, 03:36:13 pm
Hobbes, you wanna take a look at this (https://github.com/SupSuper/OpenXcom/commit/66326fe6df68dfcb4a4d4388c60ae60689e6090d).

Guys we have to change everything around again :D

Thanks.

Well, those changes look like they are TFTD related to implement the Shipping Lane Attacks/Artifact Sites (game will pick between one when launching the alien mission).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on April 27, 2015, 03:40:21 pm
Thanks.

Well, those changes look like they are TFTD related to implement the Shipping Lane Attacks/Artifact Sites (game will pick between one when launching the alien mission).

Well this maybe the case, and more changes are good. But since this changes the YAML code structure all mods with terrain definitions will fail to load (i guess) until they change this also.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 27, 2015, 04:04:14 pm
Well this maybe the case, and more changes are good. But since this changes the YAML code structure all mods with terrain definitions will fail to load (i guess) until they change this also.

Well, let's just wait until Warboy implements his mission scripting to see what comes out :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on April 27, 2015, 04:10:51 pm
Well, let's just wait until Warboy implements his mission scripting to see what comes out :)

Well i just tested, with the new code everything loades fine, the question is what will happen ingame.

And yes the mission scripting stuff will be really good.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 30, 2015, 01:34:50 am
Version 0.5.2 uploaded (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack) to the mod site.

Only changes to ruleset - contains fixes to the Australasia MissionZones, where it would be possible for a UFO to land on water (and provoke a CTD when trying to assault it).

It also contains a fix to the city location of Sevastopol (Europe) which was also placed over water and causing crashes when trying to assault a UFO landed on this city during an Alien Infiltration mission. I've already fixed quite a few of these city placements but everyone please keep an eye since they can be hard to detect.

hellrazor, I haven't included yet the strings with "" since that would involve me changing the Redux ruleset and I haven't had time yet.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on April 30, 2015, 10:58:16 am
Version 0.5.2 uploaded (https://www.openxcom.com/mod/terrain-pack) to the mod site.

Only changes to ruleset - contains fixes to the Australasia MissionZones, where it would be possible for a UFO to land on water (and provoke a CTD when trying to assault it).

It also contains a fix to the city location of Sevastopol (Europe) which was also placed over water and causing crashes when trying to assault a UFO landed on this city during an Alien Infiltration mission. I've already fixed quite a few of these city placements but everyone please keep an eye since they can be hard to detect.

hellrazor, I haven't included yet the strings with "" since that would involve me changing the Redux ruleset and I haven't had time yet.

I could add "" to the extraString Section of your Redux Ruleset, if you like.
It is not a big hassle, only some regular expression magic in vim :)


Code: [Select]
s/: \(.*\)$/: "\1"/
The magic ^^
Adds "" for a marked line on the correct places.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Arthanor on April 30, 2015, 06:23:26 pm
That looks crazy!

I used to have double quotes around every strings in my mod, because the mod I was using as a reference was doing that, but then found out that it would work without too, so now my mods are a mess..

Beyond uniformity, is there a reason to use the double quotes?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on April 30, 2015, 06:26:55 pm
Beyond uniformity, is there a reason to use the double quotes?

Yeah, you need them if you want to use characters like colons in the text string. 
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Dioxine on April 30, 2015, 06:46:52 pm
No need to worry about it too much, the OXCom will kindly inform you of any missing quotes with a ".rul file failed to load, error on line xxx" message :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on April 30, 2015, 11:40:31 pm
No need to worry about it too much, the OXCom will kindly inform you of any missing quotes with a ".rul file failed to load, error on line xxx" message :)

Well have fun searching for the right file if you do not use a single file ruleset.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on April 30, 2015, 11:44:41 pm
Also added "" to newest Terrain Pack :)

So no more not to use :P
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Dioxine on May 01, 2015, 12:37:57 am
Well have fun searching for the right file if you do not use a single file ruleset.

I happen to, and it says which one it is, dude :P
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on May 01, 2015, 12:43:56 pm
I happen to, and it says which one it is, dude :P

Not if your loading from a folder.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Arthanor on May 01, 2015, 11:35:10 pm
Oh well.. thanks for the info!

Hobbes, is it normal that the map displays things weird in some terrain? I got a swamp (jungle + water from arctic) that looked like straight arctic on the map (everything was white). That was using Piratez, but I assume it has something to do with the terrain pack.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on May 01, 2015, 11:41:37 pm
Hobbes, is it normal that the map displays things weird in some terrain? I got a swamp (jungle + water from arctic) that looked like straight arctic on the map (everything was white). That was using Piratez, but I assume it has something to do with the terrain pack.

Hmmm, so you got a jungle swamp in the battlescape, although the UFO had landed/crashed on a Polar (white) texture?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Arthanor on May 02, 2015, 04:46:06 am
No, I got a swamp for something that landed... somewhere in Europe or North Africa.. I can't remember but those are the only two places where I have radar coverage. I think the terrain was appropriate. The issue is that on the map (the minimap thing when you press m), all the grassy areas showed up as white like if it were arctic terrain.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on May 02, 2015, 05:32:07 am
No, I got a swamp for something that landed... somewhere in Europe or North Africa.. I can't remember but those are the only two places where I have radar coverage. I think the terrain was appropriate. The issue is that on the map (the minimap thing when you press m), all the grassy areas showed up as white like if it were arctic terrain.

That happens because it is currently impossible to edit the Scang.dat file, so it is only possible to the vanilla minimap graphics.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on May 02, 2015, 11:55:23 am
uhhh Hobbes, my man are kinda not on the gardening trip here.

So would you mind reduce the level of plants here:
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 02, 2015, 01:24:02 pm
uhhh Hobbes, my man are kinda not on the gardening trip here.

So would you mind reduce the level of plants here:

> Jungle.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on May 02, 2015, 01:53:46 pm
> Jungle.

Vanilla Jungle landing site looks like this:
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Dioxine on May 02, 2015, 01:57:52 pm
I love Jungle #1 (Hobbesian Jungle? :) ) with all that vegetation.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on May 02, 2015, 02:08:13 pm
I love Jungle #1 (Hobbesian Jungle? :) ) with all that vegetation.

I do like the vegetation.
But it is a little bit too much especially around the landing zone, were my men wanna depart and secure a perimeter.
And i depart in all directions.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Dioxine on May 02, 2015, 02:11:15 pm
Well, use a HE pack or 2 to clear the LZ. Who said mother nature should give a f**k about your tactical needs.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on May 02, 2015, 02:16:10 pm
Well, use a HE pack or 2 to clear the LZ. Who said mother nature should give a f**k about your tactical needs.

I had situations were my tank could not move down the ramp completly. And throwing a HE Pack and destroying my own tank kinda defeats the purpose of bringing one.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on May 02, 2015, 02:23:57 pm
> Jungle.

Jungle Swamp or Jungle Mountain, a.k.a. Hobbesian Jungle ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on May 02, 2015, 02:25:49 pm
> Jungle.

Jungle Swamp or Jungle Mountain, a.k.a. Hobbesian Jungle ;)

I had situations were my tank could not move down the ramp completly. And throwing a HE Pack and destroying my own tank kinda defeats the purpose of bringing one.

"The condition of man... is a condition of war of everyone against everyone." - Thomas Hobbes
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on May 02, 2015, 02:34:15 pm
Anyway, is there a way influence the occurance rate of this vegetation? Because it is really getting on my nerves.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Dioxine on May 02, 2015, 02:38:37 pm
Here, a 101 on LZ clearing for those commanders who really won't accept the simple truth that mechanized units don't work too well in the jungle. With this distance & elevation, the tank is undamaged:
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on May 02, 2015, 02:46:59 pm
Anyway, is there a way influence the occurance rate of this vegetation? Because it is really getting on my nerves.

The mapBlocks used underneath the craft/UFOs are all assigned to group 1. Remove the group setting and they won't appear on the LZ.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on May 02, 2015, 02:58:12 pm
The mapBlocks used underneath the craft/UFOs are all assigned to group 1. Remove the group setting and they won't appear on the LZ.

So no vegetation what so ever?
Hm.. this i also kinda dumb since the vegetation itself is nice (it is only the occurence rate of it on the LZ map part which bothersome).

Well i played around with this. Obviously there is no other way then to edit those 3 maps (JUNGLEPOLAR01, JUNGLEPOLAR02 and JUNGLEPOLAR03) and remove some of the vegetation.
And removing them from the LZ isn't such a good thing todo, because you can then spawn anywere else... (in the water)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on May 04, 2015, 11:37:24 pm
I am just wondering what pretty things can happen with polar water destribution sometimes.

I call this total denial :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on May 05, 2015, 07:14:25 pm
I am just wondering what pretty things can happen with polar water destribution sometimes.

I call this total denial :D

That's how the vanilla script works. Most times you won't get any issues but it is possible to get a lot of dead ends with Polar. The Jungle and Mountain Swamp terrains can also have these issues since they use the Polar script. 
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: hellrazor on May 06, 2015, 08:56:30 am
That's how the vanilla script works. Most times you won't get any issues but it is possible to get a lot of dead ends with Polar. The Jungle and Mountain Swamp terrains can also have these issues since they use the Polar script.

Well nevermind, the mission went well after all. It was just the first time ever since i play X-Com that i had this case.
Maybe there is a way to do some grouping on the polarscript to prevent stuff like this in the future or so?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on May 06, 2015, 02:48:21 pm
Well nevermind, the mission went well after all. It was just the first time ever since i play X-Com that i had this case.
Maybe there is a way to do some grouping on the polarscript to prevent stuff like this in the future or so?

This issue is more related to how the vanilla Polar maps are designed since some completely block movement east-west or north-south. You could change the script to not to use those maps, otherwise they'd need to be redesigned to allow for both movement directions.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Arthanor on May 06, 2015, 05:33:20 pm
Hi Hobbes,

I had a weird thing happen yesterday during a pogrom in what I think is this terrain:
(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/thumb_PKIGIIUK090620140722.png)

The glass doors that slide open (there is one in the south-east corner of the top building in the pic above), when blown up, become impassable. I resorted to smashing surrounding walls with hammers so I could get through.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on May 06, 2015, 06:42:16 pm
Hi Hobbes,

I had a weird thing happen yesterday during a pogrom in what I think is this terrain:

The glass doors that slide open (there is one in the south-east corner of the top building in the pic above), when blown up, become impassable. I resorted to smashing surrounding walls with hammers so I could get through.

This is Commercial terrain and it currently is disabled on the Terrain Pack. Thanks for the notice. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 07, 2015, 12:21:25 pm
This is Commercial terrain and it currently is disabled on the Terrain Pack. Thanks for the notice. :)

Are you working on it, or perhaps someone else could make some fixes? It shouldn't be hard.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on May 07, 2015, 03:06:07 pm
Are you working on it, or perhaps someone else could make some fixes? It shouldn't be hard.

I'm not working on it atm since I'm in the process of moving everything out of my house for some long due home improvement. I want to do this myself since a lot of changes are involved.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: Hobbes on May 08, 2015, 03:27:15 am
Version 3.6 uploaded to the mod site, updating the pack for use with the new mod system of the latest nightly.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack
Post by: davide on May 08, 2015, 09:03:28 am
I'm not working on it atm since I'm in the process of moving everything out of my house for some long due home improvement.

me too ... from a lot of months ...

now I am working on the fourth room ...

meanwhile the things that I moved into garage were invaded by sectoid ants ...sigh

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 09, 2015, 01:00:45 pm
hi hobbes,

found this today: Karachi under Water. With the newest integrated Terrainpack.

Vanilla it looks like this: Karachi_Vanilla
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 09, 2015, 02:42:46 pm
hi hobbes,

found this today: Karachi under Water. With the newest integrated Terrainpack.

Vanilla it looks like this: Karachi_Vanilla

Fixed. Thanks.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 09, 2015, 02:50:10 pm
Fixed. Thanks.

Would you mind sharing the lines you corrected?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 09, 2015, 03:24:50 pm
Would you mind sharing the lines you corrected?

This is the fixed coordinates

        - [67.39, 67.39, -24.9, -24.9, -1, STR_KARACHI]

You'll need to edit the location of the landed UFO on the saved game if you want to play that mission.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 09, 2015, 04:04:59 pm
This is the fixed coordinates

        - [67.39, 67.39, -24.9, -24.9, -1, STR_KARACHI]

You'll need to edit the location of the landed UFO on the saved game if you want to play that mission.

Thanks :) Jeah already did ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 10, 2015, 04:33:01 am
Thanks :) Jeah already did ;)

Thank you for reporting those city bugs. I've managed to found and fix another city with the same issue (Hiroshima) after I did a recheck but they can be hard to find.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 10, 2015, 09:20:36 am
Thank you for reporting those city bugs. I've managed to found and fix another city with the same issue (Hiroshima) after I did a recheck but they can be hard to find.

Would you mind sharing the line?
It is easier for me this way:D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 10, 2015, 09:40:53 am
I just did a Planetwide sweep, please take a Look at the Screenshots (Name of File indicates what could be wrong)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 10, 2015, 09:41:16 am
And one more :>
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Arthanor on May 10, 2015, 06:12:51 pm
Another weird issue: My gals can run super fast after blowing up the asphalt in this terrain. Very useful for melee!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 10, 2015, 06:49:13 pm
And one more :>

Thanks, I've fixed all the ones you mentioned on the previous posts for version 3.7 (uploaded already to the mod site), some I had already corrected but they can be deceiving.

Another weird issue: My gals can run super fast after blowing up the asphalt in this terrain. Very useful for melee!

This has been already fixed. Please update the files on the /TERRAIN folder and see if you still get the error when you start a new Port mission.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Arthanor on May 10, 2015, 08:14:03 pm
Oh.. Sorry! I'm using a slightly dated version of Piratez. Looks like I should update again soon.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 11, 2015, 06:07:11 pm
Hobbes, in case you haven't noticed yet: this blue postal box is completely passable.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 11, 2015, 07:36:23 pm
Hobbes, in case you haven't noticed yet: this blue postal box is completely passable.

Fixed, thanks. What is that plane I'm seeing on the pic?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 11, 2015, 08:15:42 pm
Fixed, thanks. What is that plane I'm seeing on the pic?

It is called Skymarshall, it is a improved Skyranger.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 11, 2015, 08:17:34 pm
It is called Skymarshall, it is a improved Skyranger.

Yes indeed,
WITH SLIDING SIDE DOORS!!!
:D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 11, 2015, 08:19:00 pm
Yes indeed, WITH SLIDING SIDE DOORS! :D

I would liked it better if it had a groundlevel like the original one.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 11, 2015, 08:36:10 pm
I would liked it better if it had a groundlevel like the original one.

I tried making it, but failed to force the soldiers to spawn, and never got around to finishing it. Maybe someday. :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 11, 2015, 09:11:31 pm
Yes indeed,
WITH SLIDING SIDE DOORS!!!
:D

Btw are they from an extra PCK File?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 11, 2015, 09:16:36 pm
Btw Hobbes could you please give all stuff on Portterrains some proper diemcd's?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 11, 2015, 10:31:38 pm
Btw are they from an extra PCK File?

Yeah, made them from the TFTD UFO doors.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 11, 2015, 11:58:38 pm
Btw Hobbes could you please give all stuff on Portterrains some proper diemcd's?

If I had my way, I'd change all the vanilla MCDs to act precisely like the ones in Port.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 12, 2015, 12:27:16 am
If I had my way, I'd change all the vanilla MCDs to act precisely like the ones in Port.

Oh well you rather not.
But maybe the fence?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 15, 2015, 01:33:01 pm
Did some more Blastertesting on Area 51 today.

Invincible Roof tiles ahoi!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 17, 2015, 02:05:38 am
Well, hoe should i say.

I have a Sectoid in my Cavern and noone knows about it :>

He is stuck inside, the bushes in his way are indestructable... so can not free him.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 17, 2015, 02:06:47 am
Also is this supposed to be burning this good?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 18, 2015, 12:16:06 am
Probably some wrong asigned Deathtiles?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 18, 2015, 12:24:15 am
Probably some wrong asigned Deathtiles?

I thought I had fixed those already but not. Thanks.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: SDEDEN on May 20, 2015, 04:42:05 am
I got a terror mission in Hammerfest that had the tropical pallet applied to it. You know, palm trees and everything. I don't have a save game, sadly. Forgot to set that aside. Though it's not like it's game-breaking, just a little bit odd is all.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 20, 2015, 01:52:00 pm
I got a terror mission in Hammerfest that had the tropical pallet applied to it. You know, palm trees and everything. I don't have a save game, sadly. Forgot to set that aside. Though it's not like it's game-breaking, just a little bit odd is all.

What do you mean by tropical pallet? The jungle UFO terrain? Or an urban terrain with palm trees in the streets?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: SDEDEN on May 21, 2015, 04:29:59 am
What do you mean by tropical pallet? The jungle UFO terrain? Or an urban terrain with palm trees in the streets?

I mean the urban terrain with palm trees.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 21, 2015, 11:28:58 am
I mean the urban terrain with palm trees.

Yeah, for the time being those cities located in the Arctic are using the general urban terrain but when I have more time I want to develop snowy terrains. Here's a list (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,2358.msg42984.html#msg42984) of what I want to add.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: SDEDEN on May 22, 2015, 04:56:39 am
Yeah, for the time being those cities located in the Arctic are using the general urban terrain but when I have more time I want to develop snowy terrains. Here's a list (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,2358.msg42984.html#msg42984) of what I want to add.

Well I look forward to it. I find your mod pretty essential now as it adds so much more variety, and it's not just cosmetic either. A lot of those maps are more complex than what was in the original game.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 22, 2015, 04:08:11 pm
Well I look forward to it. I find your mod pretty essential now as it adds so much more variety, and it's not just cosmetic either. A lot of those maps are more complex than what was in the original game.

Well I want to slightly simplify some terror site terrains and also have less chance of the hilly UFO terrains appearing since I've received some feedback complaining about those. But the next major upgrade will take some months since there's a lot going on in real life atm.

Thanks for the feedback :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Arthanor on May 22, 2015, 05:07:17 pm
Really? I quite like the hills. There isn't much flat terrain IRL.. Breaking LoS is nice to allow a bit more close up fights instead of always having the scout and snipe being the obvious best tactic. Maybe there's a few too many caves though, but those are kind of fun too.

Simplifying the terror terrains sounds good. Some of them are nasty until you get an avenger's worth of soldiers to sweep them. I've had a terror mission where the aliens didn't manage to find a single civilian. That was pretty funny. On the other hand, the one with buildings that are all in a row without connections on the upper stories is a bit tedious. Going up and down and up again to check them all takes ages. And obviously there's no aliens except in the one you skip ;) And you discover that when it takes a peak out the window and snipes one of your soldier!

Thankfully, Piratez has hammers that can make new "doors" between them. Sweeping was much improved by that. Maybe they could all have a door on the top floor that links to an emergency exit? Have those ladders that work like elevators, and metal balconies linking the buildings together so you can have a team sweeping the top by going through those, and another team entering by the main door to sweep the middle. That would speed things up a bit and make it much more manageable.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 22, 2015, 05:42:16 pm
I don't mind the hills, but I would like to see more flat forests. While hilly forests do exist, most forests are rather flat, and it doesn't really happen at all in X-Com.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Arthanor on May 22, 2015, 07:09:06 pm
Most forests are flat? And they don't have bushes right? You must be european! :P

Joking aside, variation is indeed good, and it does feel like we see a lot of hills. Maybe the terrains could be such that hilly forests also have some flat areas, while flat forests can also have a few hills? (put more spawn points on those for snipery nastiness?) Might work better than either all hills or all flat..
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: pilot00 on May 23, 2015, 06:48:06 pm
Most forests are flat? And they don't have bushes right? You must be european! :P

Joking aside, variation is indeed good, and it does feel like we see a lot of hills. Maybe the terrains could be such that hilly forests also have some flat areas, while flat forests can also have a few hills? (put more spawn points on those for snipery nastiness?) Might work better than either all hills or all flat..

Muh mortar cringes at this.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 23, 2015, 07:46:08 pm
Well the maps for UFO missions need an overhaul somewhere in the future to solve some small issues and I havent' really had time to think about it but it would be well possible to have flat, hilly, mountain and river versions of all the terrains to satisfy all tastes (or most anyways).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 23, 2015, 08:04:31 pm
Most forests are flat? And they don't have bushes right? You must be european! :P

Well, do forests in Canada grow on vertical walls or something? :)

Well the maps for UFO missions need an overhaul somewhere in the future to solve some small issues and I havent' really had time to think about it but it would be well possible to have flat, hilly, mountain and river versions of all the terrains to satisfy all tastes (or most anyways).

Yup, exactly what I thought.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Arthanor on May 23, 2015, 10:46:08 pm
Variations sound good to me too!
Well, do forests in Canada grow on vertical walls or something? :)
I don't know.. I'm sure I could find some! For having been "off-trail hiking" (I wasn't lost, no no!) a few times, I can say that even the hilliest, messiest jungle I've seen in XCom is a well tended park compared to what I experienced here.

Watching movie forest fights (ex.: in LotR where you can run and charge between trees) was very puzzling until I visited Germany and saw how different it is over there. XCom forests certainly look a lot more like european ones, which is fine when the UFO is in Europe, of course ;)

Not that I'm asking for wild forests to be reproduced. It would be a pain in the game. I just found the comment on hills being too much funny. I personally like how they break line of sight and force you to fight a little bit more up close. Not a fan of the cave with bushes in it though.. Wasting TUs and grenades to blow away bushes to walk through a cave that 90% of the time doesn't have enemies is not very entertaining.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: NuclearStudent on May 24, 2015, 02:59:47 am
Well, do forests in Canada grow on vertical walls or something? :)

You sound like you are joking, but that is actually the case. Forests grow out of mountains. I am not using a metaphor. Their roots are absolutely literally dug into mountains, and roadbuilding was very expensive because of that. Plenty of people died to blast open railways and highways through stone and trees.

It really depends on where you live. I live on the western part of canada, where there are plenty of temperate rainforests and mountains.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 24, 2015, 12:22:58 pm
Well I actually grew up close to mountainous forest too, being a semi-highlander. But I've always felt it's not very typical for a forest. :)

Anyway, yeah, I'd love more forest types (flat, swampy, all the jazz). Seems like a natural direction.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: pilot00 on May 24, 2015, 06:14:28 pm
Not that I'm asking for wild forests to be reproduced. It would be a pain in the game. I just found the comment on hills being too much funny. I personally like how they break line of sight and force you to fight a little bit more up close. Not a fan of the cave with bushes in it though.. Wasting TUs and grenades to blow away bushes to walk through a cave that 90% of the time doesn't have enemies is not very entertaining.

The times I found the last enemy in that cave though :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Arthanor on May 24, 2015, 06:33:18 pm
That 10% usually is "waste TUs to blow up bushes since 90% of the time there isn't anyone; end turn; enemy walks past blown up bushes to check out what's happening; gal face tanks a whole lot of hurt and passes out; other gal steps in and kill the bugger" for me..

Also.. some of those bushes can't be destroyed with a hammer, which makes it even more annoying! Maybe I'll have to try a chainsaw/auto-axe...
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 24, 2015, 06:37:55 pm
Also.. some of those bushes can't be destroyed with a hammer, which makes it even more annoying! Maybe I'll have to try a chainsaw/auto-axe...

This should be fixed in the next version since there were some incorrect LOFT values with those bushes which made them very hard to hit with bullets.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Arthanor on May 24, 2015, 07:01:34 pm
Ah! That's awesome! I was always hitting the ground a tile behind the tree before. Thanks :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: yrizoud on May 27, 2015, 01:22:21 am
Just wanted to report a minor issue : I got a HWP stuck in a one-way dead-end.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 27, 2015, 02:58:24 am
Just wanted to report a minor issue : I got a HWP stuck in a one-way dead-end.

The HWP can't move at all?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: SDEDEN on May 27, 2015, 04:35:23 am
I encountered a bug in a terror mission where I was able to look clear through the wall of a building and murder the floaters inside. I took a screenshot for you... but forgot to actually paste it into paint and save it as a jpg. Sorry.

So I'm sure this post isn't very helpful.

It was like a warehouse kind of building. nothing vanilla. Was in one of those terror maps with the tall, three or four story apartment buildings, if that helps.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Arthanor on May 27, 2015, 04:41:02 am
Maybe use the new battle generator, generate a bunch of terror missions until you find the right terrain and then the right building to take a screenshot of it?

It takes a bit more time, but Hobbes invests a lot of his time already, so saving some of his is worth it!
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 27, 2015, 04:47:01 am
I encountered a bug in a terror mission where I was able to look clear through the wall of a building and murder the floaters inside. I took a screenshot for you... but forgot to actually paste it into paint and save it as a jpg. Sorry.

So I'm sure this post isn't very helpful.

It was like a warehouse kind of building. nothing vanilla. Was in one of those terror maps with the tall, three or four story apartment buildings, if that helps.

Sounds like Dawn City terrain but I've just checked all the walls and they seem to be in order. Perhaps you confused a window with a wall?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 27, 2015, 06:23:03 am
Guess i need to send my pilot back to flight school...
otherwise i can not explain why he is so incompetent landing like this:
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: yrizoud on May 27, 2015, 11:27:31 am
HellRazor, your new camoflage troops are a success.
The HWP can't move at all?
Yes it's stuck. I was trying to peek in those caves, my last move was straight "up" (I mean, from bottom of screen).
From looking at how the HWP is "sunk", you can see that there are two slope tiles, and right behind them (up), the ground sinks back to minimum height.
The HWP climbed the two sloped tiles and fell on the other side of them.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 27, 2015, 12:16:20 pm
HellRazor, your new camoflage troops are a success.

Well first it is "hellrazor" not "HellRazor". (Why do people always add in big letters *sign*)
Second there are no camoflage troops there....

Yes it's stuck. I was trying to peek in those caves, my last move was straight "up" (I mean, from bottom of screen).
From looking at how the HWP is "sunk", you can see that there are two slope tiles, and right behind them (up), the ground sinks back to minimum height.
The HWP climbed the two sloped tiles and fell on the other side of them.

You can try freeing your HWP, Heavy Lasers will help you removing some of the tiles, which means Tank / Cannon is stuck on his own there indefinitly. I also noticed this once but didn't really pay attention to it since i was shooting my own tank in the back with a rocket to kill a alien inside :D
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 27, 2015, 02:56:19 pm
(Why do people always add in big letters *sign*)

Spelling. :P
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: SDEDEN on May 28, 2015, 05:22:20 am
Sounds like Dawn City terrain but I've just checked all the walls and they seem to be in order. Perhaps you confused a window with a wall?

It's possible. Next time I get a mission on one of those maps I'll be more careful to stash the save somewhere and a screenshot... assuming I wasn't just mistaken.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: the_third_curry on May 28, 2015, 07:21:54 am
Speaking of the vertical forests of Canada, the swamps here in the southeast United States would be pretty brutal as an X-com environment.

https://www.topturfsc.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/cypress-gardens-moncks-corner-south-carolina.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4076/4750277751_0cd9789d6a_b.jpg

(The forum won't let my upload pictures for some reason.)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Arthanor on May 28, 2015, 02:50:16 pm
It could be really interesting to have a swamp terrain (water recoloured brownish) in which you can cross water, but it costs you.. 8? 10? TUs per step instead of 4. And maybe weird tile elevations so that it is almost impossible to drive a HWP in there. A real nasty swamp!

Of course, the very first UFO you make crash would then systematically generate on the nasty swamp, at night, no matter where and when it happened, just because.. ;)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 28, 2015, 04:15:09 pm
The idea of a swamp requiring extra TUs to cross the water tiles has been discussed before and should be implemented in the future for the current swamp terrains and new ones.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: 7Saturn on May 28, 2015, 06:34:34 pm
I obviously didn't read the whole last 60+ pages, so if this has been addressed before, I'm sorry. I just had a battleship mission on a terrain, clearly from this mod. I found a problem with maneuverability on it. When you try to move a hwp into the cavern, shown below, there's nothing holding you back. So you get your hwp into that cavern. However, when trying to leave again, you simply can't. That means, once you have entered there, your hwp will stay there until the end of the battle.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on May 28, 2015, 08:02:20 pm
I obviously didn't read the whole last 60+ pages, so if this has been addressed before, I'm sorry. I just had a battleship mission on a terrain, clearly from this mod. I found a problem with maneuverability on it. When you try to move a hwp into the cavern, shown below, there's nothing holding you back. So you get your hwp into that cavern. However, when trying to leave again, you simply can't. That means, once you have entered there, your hwp will stay there until the end of the battle.

This has just been reported as well - it will be fixed on a later version, for the moment just try not to use HWPs on those caves :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on May 28, 2015, 09:41:22 pm
Ey Hobbes,

i did some work on Luke83 Expanded Terror Maps today, i resized and removed the groundlevel/cellars and placed approriate groundtiles were needed.
Are you interested in putting those in as a extra additional Terrorterrain?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on June 01, 2015, 01:28:18 am
Ey Hobbes,

i did some work on Luke83 Expanded Terror Maps today, i resized and removed the groundlevel/cellars and placed approriate groundtiles were needed.
Are you interested in putting those in as a extra additional Terrorterrain?

I'm completely interested on checking it out :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on June 01, 2015, 06:34:06 pm
I'm completely interested on checking it out :)

Well then you will :>
The attached zip file contains the resized maps and a adapted new mapscript.

I only resized the maps and filed groundholes with groundtiles, were needed also removed some unused banisters (due to no more undergroundlevels.

So fair have not experienced any errors with it.

The only really big problem is that, the terraindefinitions used by luke83 make it impossible for the moment to mix these maps with other, since he did used:

Code: [Select]
    mapDataSets:
      - BLANKS
      - ROADS
      - URBITS
      - URBAN
      - FRNL83

instead of:
Code: [Select]
    mapDataSets:
      - BLANKS
      - ROADS
      - URBITS
      - URBAN
      - FRNITURE
      - FRNL83

But it works fine as standalone so to say.
My general idea was to actually, rework the new Maps so that they can be mixed with vanilla ones or MADURBAN ones,
and with the CityAddTerrain MAps from Civilian.
At least this is my Idea.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 01, 2015, 08:49:11 pm
No problem with not being able to mix it with other terror terrains, since we can get a bit more urban terror stuff, percentage-wise.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on June 01, 2015, 09:53:00 pm
No problem with not being able to mix it with other terror terrains, since we can get a bit more urban terror stuff, percentage-wise.

Jeah its jsut i wanted to have one urban terrain were all new modules could be present that is why :>

And getting some more Urban modules is something i also wanna have.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on June 02, 2015, 05:28:28 am
The only really big problem is that, the terraindefinitions used by luke83 make it impossible for the moment to mix these maps with other, since he did used:

Code: [Select]
    mapDataSets:
      - BLANKS
      - ROADS
      - URBITS
      - URBAN
      - FRNL83

instead of:
Code: [Select]
    mapDataSets:
      - BLANKS
      - ROADS
      - URBITS
      - URBAN
      - FRNL83

I had a look at FRNL83 and I immediately gave up on checking the actual maps because a lot of the mcd entries on that file look terrible, specially the XCom base blue chairs.

If you're going to redesign it either change the FRNL83 images with something else or use the DECOR tileset in addition to the 4 used by the original Urban (to make it compatible with MADURBAN).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on June 02, 2015, 03:43:07 pm
Well you could at least take a look at the maps anyway.

Which MCD files are you refering to excactly, so i do know which ones i should include, for replacementtiles (were neccessary).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on June 02, 2015, 06:23:05 pm
Well you could at least take a look at the maps anyway.

Which MCD files are you refering to excactly, so i do know which ones i should include, for replacementtiles (were neccessary).

Just had a look at the maps:
* CF00, 01, 02, 03, 100-118 are the original Urban maps, so they are redundant
* CF09, 14, 20 need to have their inner walls replaced with proper ones (grey or yellow). CF23 has door issues (door opens and replaces wall, when door is closed it leaves a space instead of the original wall).

There are a lot of MCD entries on FRNL83 that aren't used at all. The ones that really need to be replaced are the 2 that use the blue circular chairs from XCom base terrain.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on June 03, 2015, 01:09:25 am
Just had a look at the maps:
* CF00, 01, 02, 03, 100-118 are the original Urban maps, so they are redundant
Jeah i noticed this already, so we can basically skip them.

* CF09, 14, 20 need to have their inner walls replaced with proper ones (grey or yellow). CF23 has door issues (door opens and replaces wall, when door is closed it leaves a space instead of the original wall).

Uhh so best thing would be to pull in vanilla terrain and rework those 4 Maps so they could be used with other ones.

There are a lot of MCD entries on FRNL83 that aren't used at all. The ones that really need to be replaced are the 2 that use the blue circular chairs from XCom base terrain.

Unfortunatly i do not have a copy of volutar mcdedit around. Do you know were to get it?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on June 03, 2015, 01:16:27 am
There are a lot of unused tiles on the FRNL83 file, my guess is that Luke83 designed them but never got to use them on maps.

The first 26 entries on FRNL83 are the ones from the original FRNITURE tileset, it would be better to use instead the original FRNITURE and then add new mcd entries on a new file (FRNL83 or something else).

You can get MCDEdit from volutar's user page on UFOPaedia.org
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on June 07, 2015, 09:26:35 pm
There are a lot of unused tiles on the FRNL83 file, my guess is that Luke83 designed them but never got to use them on maps.

The first 26 entries on FRNL83 are the ones from the original FRNITURE tileset, it would be better to use instead the original FRNITURE and then add new mcd entries on a new file (FRNL83 or something else).

You can get MCDEdit from volutar's user page on UFOPaedia.org

Well i remade the non vanilla maps with the standard FRNITURE. So they can be worked with in the future.
Unfortunatly i have no clue on how to remove those first 26 Entries from FRNL83, so i can put this on top and have all the beauty.
Could you help here? If it isn't to inconvinient.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on June 08, 2015, 02:01:08 am
Well i remade the non vanilla maps with the standard FRNITURE. So they can be worked with in the future.
Unfortunatly i have no clue on how to remove those first 26 Entries from FRNL83, so i can put this on top and have all the beauty.
Could you help here? If it isn't to inconvinient.

The remaining MCD entries from FRNL83, after removing the vanilla tiles, amount to around 33 entries, and you can still fit around an additional 37 tiles. 
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: davide on June 08, 2015, 02:47:05 pm
Well i remade the non vanilla maps with the standard FRNITURE. So they can be worked with in the future.
Unfortunatly i have no clue on how to remove those first 26 Entries from FRNL83, so i can put this on top and have all the beauty.
Could you help here? If it isn't to inconvinient.

Volutar's MCDEdit (117g) allows to delete a range of MCD Entry, after that you can press top right button "Edit PCK" and remove a range of PCK entry too.

Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: 7Saturn on June 08, 2015, 03:06:18 pm
As a map-modding noob there's one question for me: How ist the map-overview being created? Is it somehow saved in the map-files, or does (open)xcom generate it from the mapfiles? I'm asking, because I have maps here, that look really handsome, from battlescape-view, but when looking on the map, you can see, that the squares often don't match the map you can see in the battlescape-view. You then see, for example, a grey-white arctic map, but on overview, it's dust-desert.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: XOps on June 08, 2015, 04:02:07 pm
As a map-modding noob there's one question for me: How ist the map-overview being created? Is it somehow saved in the map-files, or does (open)xcom generate it from the mapfiles? I'm asking, because I have maps here, that look really handsome, from battlescape-view, but when looking on the map, you can see, that the squares often don't match the map you can see in the battlescape-view. You then see, for example, a grey-white arctic map, but on overview, it's dust-desert.

It's the SCANg setting. You can only pick from the vanilla tiles though.

(https://www.openxcom.com/content/modimages/IBRMSNEW060820150858.png)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: 7Saturn on June 08, 2015, 06:45:07 pm
You can only pick from the vanilla tiles though.
OK, that's probably the problem, as those new maps look rather different, so they can't be combined with the old overview-tiles, as they had nothing similar.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Dioxine on June 09, 2015, 12:22:54 am
@Xops: Is tile #9 a modified Dune2 Windtrap? :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: XOps on June 09, 2015, 03:25:50 am
@Xops: Is tile #9 a modified Dune2 Windtrap? :)

Oh man. Dune 2. Brings back memories. That was the first game that led me down the dark path of strategy games. I definitely used the windtrap as an inspiration. I'm using it as an alien life support item.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: davide on June 09, 2015, 12:08:05 pm
Oh man. Dune 2. Brings back memories. That was the first game that led me down the dark path of strategy games.

Me too!

The second game was XCOM  8)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: new_civilian on June 11, 2015, 01:19:19 pm
Now where is that docked cargo ship map you talked about in the UFO redux thread?  :P ;D


Btw, may I beg/offer something? I do not understand the new mapscript thingies, maybe you could add my city "skins" and maps to your package? https://www.openxcom.com/mod/big-addon-map-pack I would be very glad (and honored) if you did...  :-[
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on June 11, 2015, 01:51:58 pm
Now where is that docked cargo ship map you talked about in the UFO redux thread?  :P ;D


Btw, may I beg/offer something? I do not understand the new mapscript thingies, maybe you could add my city "skins" and maps to your package? https://www.openxcom.com/mod/big-addon-map-pack I would be very glad (and honored) if you did...  :-[

I am currently planning to rewrite the Mapscript for the CityAddOnTerain, from you. So i can add them towards into my Mod.
I like the maps, i have seen so far.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on June 11, 2015, 02:35:18 pm
Now where is that docked cargo ship map you talked about in the UFO redux thread?  :P ;D

At present time it is only possible to add the docked cargo ship as a special mission, so this map most likely will not be a part of the terrain pack.

Quote
Btw, may I beg/offer something? I do not understand the new mapscript thingies, maybe you could add my city "skins" and maps to your package? https://www.openxcom.com/mod/big-addon-map-pack I would be very glad (and honored) if you did...  :-[

From the pic you posted, your city terrain isn't exactly what I'm looking to the terrain pack. The walls you've chosen for the outside of buildings are 'inner' walls, and the desert skin for roads doesn't look that good.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on June 11, 2015, 10:11:53 pm
At present time it is only possible to add the docked cargo ship as a special mission, so this map most likely will not be a part of the terrain pack.

From the pic you posted, your city terrain isn't exactly what I'm looking to the terrain pack. The walls you've chosen for the outside of buildings are 'inner' walls, and the desert skin for roads doesn't look that good.

Actually he uses a recolored vanilla MCD file, so you can get a complete new colorcode on already exiting maps, including all vanilla URBAN map ones. Those outer walls are the same tileset items, i just checked.

Maybe someone could slightly recolor these outer walls in civilians MCD file, make them a little more dark, so they differentiate a little bit.
But i find not bad the way it is.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on June 12, 2015, 02:16:36 am
Actually he uses a recolored vanilla MCD file, so you can get a complete new colorcode on already exiting maps, including all vanilla URBAN map ones. Those outer walls are the same tileset items, i just checked.

Maybe someone could slightly recolor these outer walls in civilians MCD file, make them a little more dark, so they differentiate a little bit.
But i find not bad the way it is.

I only checked the pics at the site, which do not transmit a good image, since the ruleset hasn't been updated to the latest nightly and the .map file names make it a pain to add the terrain to Map View.

 I like the idea of recolored MCD files but it needs to be done properly to be added to the Terrain Pack, otherwise I do not have time at the moment to be working on somebody else's maps.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on June 12, 2015, 10:28:07 am
I only checked the pics at the site, which do not transmit a good image, since the ruleset hasn't been updated to the latest nightly and the .map file names make it a pain to add the terrain to Map View.

 I like the idea of recolored MCD files but it needs to be done properly to be added to the Terrain Pack, otherwise I do not have time at the moment to be working on somebody else's maps.

Well jeah the Map names he used are kinda ugly, but there are some good variations of vanilla content in there and some new stuff.
I will rename the files (to something like e.g. URBAN_09b.MAP)and convert the mapscript. I will give you copy and you can take a look, will probaly happen on the weekend.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 14, 2015, 03:53:41 pm
Hobbes, it's not much but I've made two mew forest maps.

The reason is, the "forest" in the game is not a forest at all, just some loose trees. So I've started making some real forest mapblocks - still loose for a forest, but at least with some trees. Here are the first two, I think they look and work okayish.

Perhaps we could have two different terrains, one "some loose trees and grass" (the vanilla forest) and one "forest" (a new terrain using the same mcds but with more trees).
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on June 15, 2015, 12:19:24 am
Hobbes, it's not much but I've made two mew forest maps.

The reason is, the "forest" in the game is not a forest at all, just some loose trees. So I've started making some real forest mapblocks - still loose for a forest, but at least with some trees. Here are the first two, I think they look and work okayish.

Perhaps we could have two different terrains, one "some loose trees and grass" (the vanilla forest) and one "forest" (a new terrain using the same mcds but with more trees).

I like them, although it would be better not to use the trees as bushes. Can you complete some more maps?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 15, 2015, 01:37:28 am
I like them, although it would be better not to use the trees as bushes. Can you complete some more maps?

Yeah, I can. I'll give it a try.

As for the trees as bushes, it was an experiment... I think it doesn't look bad, but it's a matter of choice.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on June 15, 2015, 04:54:58 am
I think it doesn't look bad, but it's a matter of choice.

A matter of opinion, agreed, I should have been a little more clear on my feedback regarding the trees as bushes: if you look at them from level 0, sure they look OK, but when switching to level 3 view it becomes confusing to distinguish between which trees are on the ground, and which ones are on the higher levels. Plus, there are already bushes with the Forest MCD file, plus a few color variations on the Steppe/Taiga MCD files, so it's simply a matter of adding a couple additional tiles, and you get bushes that don't look like the top of the tree :)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: 7Saturn on June 15, 2015, 10:08:13 am
For a noob like me: Is there some sort of tutorial or map-modding-guide?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 15, 2015, 10:49:29 am
A matter of opinion, agreed, I should have been a little more clear on my feedback regarding the trees as bushes: if you look at them from level 0, sure they look OK, but when switching to level 3 view it becomes confusing to distinguish between which trees are on the ground, and which ones are on the higher levels. Plus, there are already bushes with the Forest MCD file, plus a few color variations on the Steppe/Taiga MCD files, so it's simply a matter of adding a couple additional tiles, and you get bushes that don't look like the top of the tree :)

Ah, fair point. But I don't think we'll actually need to do more tiles at this point... We could, but I don't think it's absolutely necessary. The key is to place more trees.

For a noob like me: Is there some sort of tutorial or map-modding-guide?

Not to my knowledge, sadly.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: 7Saturn on June 15, 2015, 11:20:31 am
Then I will have to rely on veterans like Hobbes, to tell me, what to do with these *.map-files and if there's a possibility, to include maps with only new tiles into ufo2000 as »free« maps.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 15, 2015, 11:57:24 am
Then I will have to rely on veterans like Hobbes, to tell me, what to do with these *.map-files and if there's a possibility, to include maps with only new tiles into ufo2000 as »free« maps.

Sure, ask away, I'll try to help too.

Generally speaking, mapmaking consists of two completely separate processes: making the .mcds, which contain all tiles for a given set, and then using these .mcds to make actual mapblocks (which are modular parts of maps, usually 10x10 or 20x20 tiles). Since the first process is more advanced, I suggest you start with making new mapblocks for the already existing terrains, like I just did with forest, for example making a new house for the city terror or whatever.

To edit maps, you need MapView, a rather friendly editor currently developed by TheBigSot. After setting it up, in order to make a new mapblock I suggest you:
1) Make a copy of an already existing mapblock and give it a new name. Remember to do so with its .map file (in MAPS) and .rmp file (in ROUTES).
2) Open the MapView settings file, find your original mapblock entry and copy that entire line, then change the new line to reflect on the new mapblock's file name, but don't change anything else.
3) Open MapView; your new mapblock should appear under the relevant terrain. It looks the same as the original one, but you can now edit it with the tools provided.

Here's your (excuse of a) starting guide. If you have questions, please ask away.
(Also I know it's a bit hackish, but it's meant to allow a painless quick start.)
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: hellrazor on June 15, 2015, 12:03:19 pm
In general it is better to asign new maps a seperate directory in mapview and a seperate group.
I always copy the files first before i include those into mapview and modify them.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 15, 2015, 12:38:07 pm
In general it is better to asign new maps a seperate directory in mapview and a seperate group.
I always copy the files first before i include those into mapview and modify them.

Yeah, I also work on a separate directory, not live Openxcom tissue.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on June 15, 2015, 03:56:44 pm
Then I will have to rely on veterans like Hobbes, to tell me, what to do with these *.map-files and if there's a possibility, to include maps with only new tiles into ufo2000 as »free« maps.

If you're looking into adding new terrains into UFO2000 there's a guide I wrote a long time ago that I've attached. It's probably a bit outdated but the basics are there.

The main difficulty might be that UFO2000 has an alternate map system that replaces the .MAP/.MCD files with .LUA rulesets, but the old files should work too.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: 7Saturn on June 15, 2015, 09:35:40 pm
Generally speaking, mapmaking consists of two completely separate processes: making the .mcds, which contain all tiles for a given set, and then using these .mcds to make actual mapblocks (which are modular parts of maps, usually 10x10 or 20x20 tiles). Since the first process is more advanced, I suggest you start with making new mapblocks for the already existing terrains, like I just did with forest, for example making a new house for the city terror or whatever.
That part I already understood. I was thinking, when people do new maps, they mostly just use existing tiles, right? So, when there aren't any new bitmaps included, the map-file relies on existing vanilla-tiles? Atm I'm not really interested in creating a new map myself (taking to much time, I have to prioritize what to take on, first). But when somebody creates new tiles with map-files, it should in principle be possible, to port them to ufo2k relatively easy, i guess. ATM, ufo2k only has 2 maps without using vanilla files. Adding a few would be nice. However, I have no real overview, if there actually are completely new maps, not depending on vanilla files/tiles.
To edit maps, you need MapView, a rather friendly editor currently developed by TheBigSot.
Meaning, with this I can arrange existing tiles, whether they are newly created, or using vanilla graphics/tiles?
(Also I know it's a bit hackish, but it's meant to allow a painless quick start.)
Thanks anyway, as now, I have a little more of an impression of what you guys are doing. =) However, these forest-map-files then just rely on vanilla files, as there are no additional tiles coming with it?
If you're looking into adding new terrains into UFO2000 there's a guide I wrote a long time ago that I've attached. It's probably a bit outdated but the basics are there.
I had a first look at this Ufopaedia article (https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Custom_Maps_%28UFO2000%29#Basic_Terrain_Concepts), but it seems, that there are differences. For example, in you txt-file it says: »2) Always make the maps with 4 levels (but no more!).« Is this a design decision or a real requirement? In the Ufopaedia article I didn't find any mentioning of this.
The main difficulty might be that UFO2000 has an alternate map system that replaces the .MAP/.MCD files with .LUA rulesets, but the old files should work too.
I'm mainly interested in the combination of existing new tiles and maps using no vanilla-tiles at all. I believe, I could do that, once I have a map with this properties, to add it to UFO2000. Fuddling around a bit is less time consuming, than pixeling new tiles, creating new maps and then make them fit UFO2000 requirements, I think.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 15, 2015, 09:55:30 pm
That part I already understood. I was thinking, when people do new maps, they mostly just use existing tiles, right? So, when there aren't any new bitmaps included, the map-file relies on existing vanilla-tiles?

Yes. Tiles are stored in "collections" that are in fact mcd files. So each terrain addresses several mcd files - usually between 2 and 5 - and then pours all tiles from these files on the table and you just building form them! Yeah, MapView is a lot like Lego.

Meaning, with this I can arrange existing tiles, whether they are newly created, or using vanilla graphics/tiles?

Yeah, you can do the Lego stuff. :)

Thanks anyway, as now, I have a little more of an impression of what you guys are doing. =) However, these forest-map-files then just rely on vanilla files, as there are no additional tiles coming with it?

Yes, they use the same mcds as vanilla Forest maps. Otherwise we wouldn't be able to use it in the same mission as vanilla Forest maps.
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: 7Saturn on June 15, 2015, 10:22:47 pm
OK, that enlightens me a lot. =) So one question remains, right now: Do you know of any completely vanilla free maps?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: Hobbes on June 15, 2015, 10:55:54 pm
ATM, ufo2k only has 2 maps without using vanilla files. Adding a few would be nice. However, I have no real overview, if there actually are completely new maps, not depending on vanilla files/tiles.

UFO2000 Terrains with new MCD and MAP files:
* Dawn City
* Moonbase
* Area 51
UFO2000 Terrains with only new MAP files:
* Siberia
* Slum
* Native
* Industrial
* Downtown
* Airfield
* Etc, basically any non-vanilla terrain

Quote
I had a first look at this Ufopaedia article (https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Custom_Maps_%28UFO2000%29#Basic_Terrain_Concepts), but it seems, that there are differences. For example, in you txt-file it says: »2) Always make the maps with 4 levels (but no more!).« Is this a design decision or a real requirement? In the Ufopaedia article I didn't find any mentioning of this.

That txt file was probably written before it was possible to have more than 4 levels on UFO2000.

OK, that enlightens me a lot. =) So one question remains, right now: Do you know of any completely vanilla free maps?

The new OXC version of Area 51?
Title: Re: [MAPS] Terrain Pack - updated to new mod system
Post by: 7Saturn on June 15, 2015, 11:08:24 pm
UFO2000 Terrains with new MCD and MAP files:
* Dawn City
* Moonbase
But with a freshly compiled ufo2000, I only could choose those two maps. The others were not available. Maybe I'll have to double check that. But I'm quite certain, that I missed this:
* Area 51
UFO2000 Terrains with only new MAP files:
* Siberia
* Slum
* Native
* Industrial
* Downtown
* Airfield
Using vanilla files, therefore aren't available without installed vanilla files, OK.
* Etc, basically any non-vanilla terrain
If I still can contact the au