OpenXcom Forum

Modding => Work In Progress => Topic started by: Human Ktulu on April 22, 2014, 10:49:38 pm

Title: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Human Ktulu on April 22, 2014, 10:49:38 pm
Why not new facilities for human bases ?

- Simple crossing corridor open in 2 height level (like alien base)
Build for 25.000$
Time construction : 5 days
no small room
no maintenance

- Control Center (allow to launch vessel, only one per base, if destroyed entire base is lost with auto-destruction)
Build for 350.000$
Time construction : 15 days
Maintenance : 6000$

- Power Reactor (only one per base)
Build for 180.000$
Time construction : 10 days
Maintenance : 20.000$

- Hospital (if possible with OPX engine, for heal wounded soldier)
Build for 450.000$
Time construction : 20 days
Maintenance : 10.000$

Thanks
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on April 22, 2014, 11:42:09 pm
THE CORRIDOR OF DEATH!

But seriously, new map blocks are always welcome.
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: yrizoud on April 23, 2014, 12:27:26 am
This is a very nice idea.
- Better base defense
- A tradeoff between fast base expansion and final base capacity - or use corridors then destroy them.
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Shoes on April 23, 2014, 12:45:13 am
With sandbags or some other form of half-wall defense?
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on April 23, 2014, 03:28:14 am
Maybe even a simple security tower? Something like those fire points in alien bases, the ones with small windows.
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: moriarty on April 23, 2014, 03:13:33 pm
With sandbags or some other form of half-wall defense?

that sounds like a good idea... the corridor could be 3 squares wide, with windowed metal walls alternatingly projecting from the sides. 2x2-units could still pass but will have to move around the walls, 1x1-units can either run through the middle or take (partial) cover behind the windows:

                |        |
                |      _|
                |        |
                |_      |
                |        |
________|        |_________
 |                             |   

_____|___          ______|__
                |        |
                |      _|
                |        |
                |_      |
                |        |
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Camalex97 on April 24, 2014, 03:07:51 pm
that sounds like a good idea... the corridor could be 3 squares wide, with windowed metal walls alternatingly projecting from the sides. 2x2-units could still pass but will have to move around the walls, 1x1-units can either run through the middle or take (partial) cover behind the windows:

                |        |
                |      _|
                |        |
                |_      |
                |        |
________|        |_________
 |                             |   

_____|___          ______|__
                |        |
                |      _|
                |        |
                |_      |
                |        |

do you meen kinda like a pillbox? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pillbox_%28military%29 maybe even elevate the corridor and have windows on the walls that are at about foot/leg level? i think it sounds like a good idea
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: moriarty on April 24, 2014, 03:36:02 pm
yeah, almost, only I don't think of a complete box, just a simple wall-with-window. that kind of wall should exist already, so it would take next to no effort. the alien base has those windows in the outer wall of the command room complex. just put those into the corridor :)
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Camalex97 on April 24, 2014, 10:13:55 pm
yeah, almost, only I don't think of a complete box, just a simple wall-with-window. that kind of wall should exist already, so it would take next to no effort. the alien base has those windows in the outer wall of the command room complex. just put those into the corridor :)

ya, i think i get what your saying.  btw a empty room with 4 pillboxes sounds like a great idea come to think of it (2 high, takes up as much empty space as possible with the entrances to the pillboxes being near each corner of the room?)
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Human Ktulu on April 26, 2014, 12:06:50 am
It will be interesting to test several type of corridors, simple (base idea) or with defensive advantages :D
it will be especially useful for the small bases.
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Ran on April 26, 2014, 12:35:00 am
If we have corridors I request we make stores and hangars destructible.
I think it's unfair you can just blast the aliens out of your base without any consequences to your facilities.
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: moriarty on April 26, 2014, 01:20:36 am
I'd rather see specialized alien attack crews: mixed alien crews which always contain a few silacoids... why silacoids? because they can burrow, of course! I mean, think about it, they are rock creatures with a super-hot core. of course they can eat their way through rock. so while 70-80 percent of the aliens would go through the hangars and access lift, smaller squads would follow the silacoid tunnel-maker and attack any xcom facility next to solid earth by breaking through from the outside.

that would mean a complete change of base setup for defendability, and a real tactical challenge. imagine your troops all rushing towards the hangar/access lift which you so neatly arranged to create a choke point, waiting for the first alien to poke its ugly head around a corner, when suddenly five or six chryssalids attack them from behind. oh, the terror!
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Tarvis on April 27, 2014, 08:36:01 pm
If we have corridors I request we make stores and hangars destructible.
I think it's unfair you can just blast the aliens out of your base without any consequences to your facilities.
I don't think hangars should be. Reason is, this is where aliens spawn. Meaning, they can attack it from the very first turn before you are able to get there and do anything about it.
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Ran on April 27, 2014, 10:13:41 pm
I guess you have a point there. ;)
Of course aliens should not be able to destroy your hangar with a few plasma shots but detonating 10 blaster bombs without any consequences isn't quite realistic either
How's this - we don't need to make hangars and storage a target for aliens. They can be destroyed as collateral damage but aliens have more important targets to pay attention to.
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on April 27, 2014, 10:19:59 pm
I guess you have a point there. ;)
Of course aliens should not be able to destroy your hangar with a few plasma shots but detonating 10 blaster bombs without any consequences isn't quite realistic either
How's this - we don't need to make hangars and storage a target for aliens. They can be destroyed as collateral damage but aliens have more important targets to pay attention to.

Well, if adjacent facilities are destroyed, hangars and stores will be destroyed as well. :)
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: SupSuper on April 27, 2014, 11:33:53 pm
If we have corridors I request we make stores and hangars destructible.
I think it's unfair you can just blast the aliens out of your base without any consequences to your facilities.
This is all dependant on the map files. Facilities are "destructible" because they have special object tiles flagged as "important" for the aliens, and if they destroy them all, the associated facility is removed.
So you could theoretically achieve anything by modding the facility maps.
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Ran on April 28, 2014, 01:27:56 am
Yes, I know. The flags can be set in MCDEdit.
But that's not the point.
As I said I don't want aliens to attack stores and hangars but make them take damage if you blow them up with blaster bombs. They don't need to be completely destroyed but some sort of damage penalty between all and nothting would be fine.
I've always found it a bit harsh that facilities (and everything connected to them) were completely destroyed because the aliens blew up some minor stuff upstairs.
What about the approach that buildings can be damaged and lose their function until they are repaired - which may take a fraction of the original build time and some money of course?
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Camalex97 on April 28, 2014, 03:39:37 pm
Well, if adjacent facilities are destroyed, hangars and stores will be destroyed as well. :)

maybe you just have pay for damages and wait for them to be repaired?  could work nicely
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Human Ktulu on May 02, 2014, 08:41:38 pm
I updated first post for add new requests.

But for moment I'm very interested to try simple corridor.  :P
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 02, 2014, 11:40:18 pm
Why not new facilities for human bases ?

- Control Center (allow to launch vessel, only one per base, if destroyed entire base is lost with auto-destruction)
Build for 350.000$
Time construction : 15 days
Maintenance : 6000$

That would be interesting. But I wonder, what exactly can you accomplish with this (apart from saving the plane)? Can you load your soldiers, or equipment, on board? That would be complicated to design and code...

- Power Reactor (only one per base)
Build for 180.000$
Time construction : 10 days
Maintenance : 20.000$

I can see this in conjunction with the multi-level base idea from another thread. If we have more facilities, we may introduce power requirements to expand your base. That would be a nice touch. (And if it's destroyed, random buildings lose their functionality until power is sufficient, haha.)

- Hospital (if possible with OPX engine, for heal wounded soldier)
Build for 450.000$
Time construction : 20 days
Maintenance : 10.000$

Yeah, why not. It would probably need to be researched maybe (I can imagine soldiers have a hospital already - how else would they recover from third degree plasma burns, by staying in bed?).
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: yrizoud on May 03, 2014, 12:49:52 am
I think he means Control Center to be a prerequisite to Launch the Avenger on a mission to mars. On one hand I like how it would introduce a visible "countdown" (construction days)  instead of the randomness of "when will my research end". But it's also something that would be useful for a tiny amount of time : From the game's point of view, as soon as you can go to Mars, you should. It's not a facility you're supposed to keep long enough to pay a monthly fee, and it would be unlikely to have to defend it in "base assault".

One thing I like with the hospital idea is that you would use the "transfer" mechanism to send wounded to your only base which has the facility. Not sure how useful it would feel, however, because there are IMO mostly 2 ways to play :
- ironman, where the casualties are so high and random that you keep a large squad anyway - a 30-day wound does not cripple your strike force.
- nitpicker, where you reload when someone is wounded ot killed.
In both cases, quickened healing is not so useful.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on May 03, 2014, 02:35:29 am
I know i am away from Modding right now, but between study, i have been playing with the idea of remaking the base maps ( so they are not just boring corridor fights) but actually something fun and challenging..i am still experimenting with sizes and levels.

What i think would be the best solution would be to do away with the automatic linking between mapblocks that happens now and allow the use to Choose how they link up to the other blocks and what additional features they can have ( sentry guns, lockable blast door etc)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Camalex97 on May 05, 2014, 03:16:25 pm
Yeah, why not. It would probably need to be researched maybe (I can imagine soldiers have a hospital already - how else would they recover from third degree plasma burns, by staying in bed?).

no silly! they don't die! they just go to sleep forever when aliens hit them too much! they only need time to recover because they got their tonsils removed! and they aren't just in bed, they are in bed eating lots of icecream!
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 05, 2014, 08:11:30 pm
and they aren't just in bed, they are in bed eating lots of icecream!

Oh my, that's kinda bad for tonsils...
Now I'm uneasy.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Camalex97 on May 06, 2014, 02:40:21 pm
Oh my, that's kinda bad for tonsils...
Now I'm uneasy.

i think they secretly have masochistic desires and get injured though... you ever wander why they sometimes shoot at the sky when their target is 10 feet infront of them?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 06, 2014, 02:51:13 pm
i think they secretly have masochistic desires and get injured though... you ever wander why they sometimes shoot at the sky when their target is 10 feet infront of them?

But it's fun! And it's definitely an Orky thing to do.

As for the facilities... Did anyone mention showers and toilets as well as a kitchen? I don't think 200 people living in the base (not counting maintenance staff) eat TV dinners and need to take a lift to the surface whenever they want to relieve themselves.
I can see this as an additional building which limits maximum personnel. Or perhaps it would be easier to just sacrifice half the Living Quarters' space, and decrease Living Quarters capacity by half. (Or more, since they already seem to be far too efficient for what they look like anyway.) This would go great with another idea that is floating around the forum, a two-layer base (so you get 4 levels in Battlescape, etc).
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Camalex97 on May 06, 2014, 03:17:18 pm
As for the facilities... Did anyone mention showers and toilets as well as a kitchen? I don't think 200 people living in the base (not counting maintenance staff) eat TV dinners and need to take a lift to the surface whenever they want to relieve themselves.
I can see this as an additional building which limits maximum personnel. Or perhaps it would be easier to just sacrifice half the Living Quarters' space, and decrease Living Quarters capacity by half. (Or more, since they already seem to be far too efficient for what they look like anyway.) This would go great with another idea that is floating around the forum, a two-layer base (so you get 4 levels in Battlescape, etc).

I always assumed they ate mre's (if you don't know what that is, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MRE they taste suprisingly good for what they are) i mean its not like we are sending them on a 48 hour trip (round flight) without any food right?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 06, 2014, 03:33:36 pm
I always assumed they ate mre's (if you don't know what that is, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MRE they taste suprisingly good for what they are) i mean its not like we are sending them on a 48 hour trip (round flight) without any food right?

>Build a 20 million dollars underground base
>Tell everyone there to only eat MREs and piss in the bushes
>THAT'S X-COM, BABY!
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Camalex97 on May 06, 2014, 03:39:00 pm
>Build a 20 million dollars underground base
>Tell everyone there to only eat MREs and piss in the bushes
>THAT'S X-COM, BABY!

well... they get paid like 40k (or was It 10k?) a month and there might even be a really amazing pension when its all over (if they actually survive...)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 06, 2014, 03:46:17 pm
well... they get paid like 40k (or was It 10k?) a month and there might even be a really amazing pension when its all over (if they actually survive...)

One Chryssalid hiding in the bushes would terminate the project. Ouch.

Anyway, any opinion on the "decrease Living Quarters capacity to improve immersion" issue?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Camalex97 on May 06, 2014, 03:56:19 pm
One Chryssalid hiding in the bushes would terminate the project. Ouch.

Anyway, any opinion on the "decrease Living Quarters capacity to improve immersion" issue?

I always assumed they had bathrooms and food provided in the area under the barracks that isn't used for anything, so instead of getting rid of half the space in the barracks, maybe just use the area under it instead?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 06, 2014, 04:00:12 pm
I always assumed they had bathrooms and food provided in the area under the barracks that isn't used for anything, so instead of getting rid of half the space in the barracks, maybe just use the area under it instead?

Doable, but I'm not sure if it would be big enough. Some modding needed. :)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Camalex97 on May 06, 2014, 04:11:28 pm
Doable, but I'm not sure if it would be big enough. Some modding needed. :)

its not like they need a locker room or anything, all their stuff is just 1 floor above so that wouldn't need to take up room... would they need separate showers for male and female or would it be more efficient to just alternate between showers?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Falko on May 06, 2014, 06:03:00 pm
its not like they need a locker room or anything, all their stuff is just 1 floor above so that wouldn't need to take up room... would they need separate showers for male and female or would it be more efficient to just alternate between showers?
and in the next mod all xcom soldiers that spawn in the shower rooms running around without their assigned armor during base attack?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 06, 2014, 06:34:45 pm
its not like they need a locker room or anything, all their stuff is just 1 floor above so that wouldn't need to take up room... would they need separate showers for male and female or would it be more efficient to just alternate between showers?

Most X-Com operatives aren't Americans, so they don't really care. :P

and in the next mod all xcom soldiers that spawn in the shower rooms running around without their assigned armor during base attack?

OMG, we need a new sprite too...
Dioxine made nude females, so it's a start!
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Camalex97 on May 06, 2014, 07:54:11 pm
OMG, we need a new sprite too...
Dioxine made nude females, so it's a start!

i was originally going to say would men and women shower together since they already share the same barracks but i wasn't sure on your policy regarding those kinds of topics...
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 06, 2014, 08:03:39 pm
i was originally going to say would men and women shower together since they already share the same barracks but i wasn't sure on your policy regarding those kinds of topics...

.....what?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Warboy1982 on May 07, 2014, 03:49:08 am
this isn't the sims, people
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 07, 2014, 02:03:40 pm
this isn't the sims, people

Yeah, sadly. :P

Though some more layout accuracy would be desirable; because honestly, what's the harm in having bathrooms? They don't have to be to scale (pretty much nothing is), but they'd be a nice touch. Besides, Apocalypse had them.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Warboy1982 on May 07, 2014, 08:04:08 pm
...and what if apocalypse jumped off a bridge?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Angelus_EV on May 07, 2014, 08:19:27 pm
...and what if apocalypse jumped off a bridge?
hahahahaha!  :P
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Shoes on May 07, 2014, 08:37:44 pm
I skimmed the thread, so if this is out of place, then oops.

Talking about adding "useless" facilities; having a bathroom or chairs in the base or things like that could boost soldier morale, literally. +2 permanent morale per facility or something. Enter a battle with 120 morale, less chance of being panicked and whatnot.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 07, 2014, 08:42:53 pm
...and what if apocalypse jumped off a bridge?

OK, this was a stupid argument on my part, but... are you against this modification, Warboy? If so, why? It's just a little improvement which has no impact on anything, and would make the base a little prettier, in a functional sort of way.

Talking about adding "useless" facilities; having a bathroom or chairs in the base or things like that could boost soldier morale, literally. +2 permanent morale per facility or something. Enter a battle with 120 morale, less chance of being panicked and whatnot.

Uh... Silliness aside, do you mean that there could be bases with NO BATHROOMS? :P

Honestly people, I'm just talking about adding some pixels to the battlemap to make the room look more natural, stop making a new minigame out of it.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Human Ktulu on May 07, 2014, 10:10:14 pm
Hi all,

I misunderstand latest reactions, the first goal of this request is create little more facilities  to prevent that the whole of the researchs and manufactures can be concentrated in only two bases.

Please, no  kidding.
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Aldorn on May 09, 2014, 02:06:25 pm
1) Corridor

that sounds like a good idea... the corridor could be 3 squares wide, with windowed metal walls alternatingly projecting from the sides. 2x2-units could still pass but will have to move around the walls, 1x1-units can either run through the middle or take (partial) cover behind the windows:

                |        |
                |      _|
                |        |
                |_      |
                |        |
________|        |_________
 |                             |   

_____|___          ______|__
                |        |
                |      _|
                |        |
                |_      |
                |        |

I like this idea !

What about making 1st floor a storage place, to make it more "valuable" (with a restricted capacity compared to "General Store")

                |        |
                |      _|
                |        |
                |_      |
                |        |
________|        |_________
 |                             |   

____|___          ______|__
                |        |
                |      _|
                |         S|
                |_      |
             |S         |

* S = Staircase to 1st floor storage


2) New facilities

Hi all,

I misunderstand latest reactions, the first goal of this request is create little more facilities  to prevent that the whole of the researchs and manufactures can be concentrated in only two bases.

Please, no  kidding.

I agree your point of view

There is a way to prevent a single base to be sufficient : adapt capacity limitations. In my previous attempts to make a personal mod, I decided to reduce capacities, as for example :
- Live Quarters : 50 -> 10
- General Store : 50 -> 20
- Alien Containment : 10 -> 1
- ...

Anyway, I like the idea of proposing new facilities, and in particular your propositions (as Corridor, Hospital, ...)

I think if some people do not like it, it seems easy just to ignore such a mod ;-)


3) Garage

Another idea of facility (but I do not know if capacity limitation is possible to be modded) : a "Garage" = small 1x1 hangar for HWP (with a capacity of n HWP)


4) Control Center

I think my proposition below is not a really good idea, but anyway, just in case some people would like to brainstorm on it...

Rather than (or in addition to) making "Control Center" necessary to launch crafts, simply make it necessary to control entire base, and be also a "decisive" facility, I mean : protect it whatever happens, because losing it would mean losing entire base (do not know if possible to mod this)

Inconvenient of this proposition : as it would have to be placed as soon as you create any base (as access lift), this would mean you would not be able to place it far away from access lift, which could make base defense very difficult to organize, specially in upper difficulty levels... That's why it is not a so good idea :-((
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 09, 2014, 03:02:46 pm
What about making 1st floor a storage place, to make it more "valuable" (with a restricted capacity compared to "General Store")

Seconded!
Also do as the Piratez mod did, and add a little cargo capacity to the Hangar - it makes sense, as craft equipment should be stored in hangars, no?

There is a way to prevent a single base to be sufficient : adapt capacity limitations. In my previous attempts to make a personal mod, I decided to reduce capacities, as for example :
- Live Quarters : 50 -> 10
- General Store : 50 -> 20
- Alien Containment : 10 -> 1
- ...

That's kinda extreme, I mean the last one. :P
But I'd like to see the Living Quarters capacity decreased, as long as we can have two-layer bases.

3) Garage

Another idea of facility (but I do not know if capacity limitation is possible to be modded) : a "Garage" = small 1x1 hangar for HWP (with a capacity of n HWP)

I think them being in the stores is fine. It's just a robot...
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Human Ktulu on May 09, 2014, 03:16:43 pm
3) Garage

Another idea of facility (but I do not know if capacity limitation is possible to be modded) : a "Garage" = small 1x1 hangar for HWP (with a capacity of n HWP)
In vanilla game, HWP use only 6 space of store ! I dont know if it's possible technically.

4) Control Center

I think my proposition below is not a really good idea, but anyway, just in case some people would like to brainstorm on it...

Rather than (or in addition to) making "Control Center" necessary to launch crafts, simply make it necessary to control entire base, and be also a "decisive" facility, I mean : protect it whatever happens, because losing it would mean losing entire base (do not know if possible to mod this)

Inconvenient of this proposition : as it would have to be placed as soon as you create any base (as access lift), this would mean you would not be able to place it far away from access lift, which could make base defense very difficult to organize, specially in upper difficulty levels... That's why it is not a so good idea :-((
The solution it's to have only one command center for all the bases but with the possibility of building this installation on others bases for security. If all command center are destroyed = game over.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on May 09, 2014, 03:19:45 pm
Regarding Control Center, your idea is a nice work around !

It is always useful to share ideas with other for some brainstorming ;-)

Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: yrizoud on May 09, 2014, 03:44:35 pm
I've sometime wondered about a communication center, a facility giving <= 5% worldwide detection. Or much more, if it's manned by a new category of personal, "operators".
Though I have no idea how "long" the crafts uncovered in this manner should be visible.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on May 09, 2014, 03:53:45 pm
I've sometime wondered about a communication center, a facility giving <= 5% worldwide detection. Or much more, if it's manned by a new category of personal, "operators".
Though I have no idea how "long" the crafts uncovered in this manner should be visible.

You give me an idea : the Control Center could have a half "small radar" range in addition, and replace default small radar at start of the game
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 09, 2014, 04:47:17 pm
You give me an idea : the Control Center could have a half "small radar" range in addition, and replace default small radar at start of the game

OK, but that'd be in addition to the functionality proposed by Human Ktulu.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Camalex97 on May 09, 2014, 07:32:57 pm
it would be cool if we could have a tftd styled base defense (sorry if this is off topic) where you have aliens trying to get inside of your base where you have fortifications setup to stop them, and then you had your second layer of your base which is just whatever you have it setup as, what do you guys think?
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Aldorn on May 17, 2014, 03:14:53 pm
That's kinda extreme, I mean the last one. :P
But I'd like to see the Living Quarters capacity decreased, as long as we can have two-layer bases.

You are right...
I thought about it, and I will raise up to 5
But I will create an Alien Containment per Alien Race...

Sectoid Autopsy -> Sectoid Containment available to produce
Mutton Autopsy -> Mutton Containment available to produce
...

Thanks to have driven me on the right way   ;)

EDIT : I did not think about how to prevent a live mutton to be accepted in a sectoid containment... Too bad !
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: civilian on May 17, 2014, 03:17:40 pm
it would be cool if we could have a tftd styled base defense (sorry if this is off topic) where you have aliens trying to get inside of your base where you have fortifications setup to stop them, and then you had your second layer of your base which is just whatever you have it setup as, what do you guys think?

Excellent idea. And it should be technically possible, the last mission (Cydonia) uses a two-stage layout already.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Yankes on May 17, 2014, 03:41:43 pm
Two stage defense mission is bad idea. Who will defend in second part? You split your troops and lave half to death on surface?
Better idea would be that you choose where you fight, ground will dont give lot of protection (you are attacking them before they enter base) or underground where aliens can break you facilitates (new mechanic, every building that aliens enters is out of order for some time after battle).
This will give interesting decision depending on your strength, where you want made last stand :)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Human Ktulu on May 17, 2014, 08:24:02 pm
... and my request ?  :'(

If someone can simply make it, just an simple corridor for moment, I will be happiest !

 ;)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: civilian on May 18, 2014, 04:36:33 pm
I dont know where the facilitiy sprites are located, sry  :-[
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: davide on May 19, 2014, 09:12:07 pm
I remember an other game, UFO afterlight, ...

it has human traning facilities and other ...

Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: civilian on May 20, 2014, 12:09:01 pm
fwiw, I tried to make a simple corridor but could not get it to show up in the base defense missions, it worked in the base layout screens (using the Access lift icon) but not in the tactical game. Maybe it had to do wit the fact that I made it have only 1 level. Atm I am pretty much occupied by my work on another mod, so don't expect anything from me.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Human Ktulu on May 20, 2014, 09:32:53 pm
Don't worry civillian, "all things come to him who waits" (it is my future epitaph).
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: davide on May 23, 2014, 06:21:38 pm

But I will create an Alien Containment per Alien Race...

Sectoid Autopsy -> Sectoid Containment available to produce
Mutton Autopsy -> Mutton Containment available to produce
...

An other idea could be:

One Alien Containment,
 but it could contains live alies of a specific race only after its race autopsy was complete
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 24, 2014, 02:27:35 pm
An other idea could be:

One Alien Containment,
 but it could contains live alies of a specific race only after its race autopsy was complete

In my opinion, having separate facilities for each species is needlessly anal. And making it dependant on autopsy makes it even more anal.
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Aldorn on May 24, 2014, 09:25:23 pm
In my opinion, having separate facilities for each species is needlessly anal. And making it dependant on autopsy makes it even more anal.
Right
But aim is only to make game more difficult. In this case, it is to force player to build many bases, as one base will not be enough to build all needed facilities (as reducing capacity of living quarters, labs, ...)
Title: Re: [Request] Corridor for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on May 25, 2014, 08:18:24 am
Right
But aim is only to make game more difficult. In this case, it is to force player to build many bases, as one base will not be enough to build all needed facilities (as reducing capacity of living quarters, labs, ...)

What I wanted to say is that this idea is more tedious than difficult. Of course this is debatable, but I don't think it really adds much to the challenge, you just need to micro-manage more.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Jstank on June 06, 2014, 06:14:17 pm
Speaking of better base defenses what about an upgrade using a large quantity of alien alloys which will make the walls in your base defense not be made of cardboard.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on June 19, 2014, 10:25:07 am
Here after some other interesting discussion with Hobbes on creating new facilities (corridor, hangar 3X3)

https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2281.msg23141#msg23141 (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2281.msg23141#msg23141)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: niculinux on June 21, 2014, 01:20:12 pm
Nice, these would be some nice touches that may be even merged in next opdnxcom relase :P
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Human Ktulu on June 21, 2014, 07:59:15 pm
Wow, not bad !  8)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: AlienMuncher on June 22, 2014, 05:53:15 pm
Lot of great ideas here!

What do you guys feel about Ufo Detection Systems? For me Hyper Decoder felt little over the top in game. What I think it should do is only give details about ufo detected by the radar - size, mission details, etc. Since its development in game made radar systems obsolete, it would be nice if it was still necessary to keep some kind of detector along Hyper Decoder. I don't know about its detection ability though... Maybe lowered to 60-80% with ability of additional boost by some other technology/building?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 22, 2014, 07:47:59 pm
Lot of great ideas here!

What do you guys feel about Ufo Detection Systems? For me Hyper Decoder felt little over the top in game. What I think it should do is only give details about ufo detected by the radar - size, mission details, etc. Since its development in game made radar systems obsolete, it would be nice if it was still necessary to keep some kind of detector along Hyper Decoder. I don't know about its detection ability though... Maybe lowered to 60-80% with ability of additional boost by some other technology/building?

Fair point.
However, I would suggest a less drastic solution: the Hyper-Wave Decoder could give you only mission and alien race data, but no information on UFO size or speed. Therefore you'd need both installations to have a complete picture.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: AlienMuncher on June 23, 2014, 01:33:57 pm
Quote
Fair point.
However, I would suggest a less drastic solution: the Hyper-Wave Decoder could give you only mission and alien race data, but no information on UFO size or speed. Therefore you'd need both installations to have a complete picture.

True. Exact speed and size would come from Advanced Radar System which radius could be equal to oryginal Hyper-Wave Decoder and its UFO detecting ability - let's say 70%? Thus in the radius of Small radar system player would achieve 100% detection, in the radius of Large Radar 90% and beyond that - 70% (it is just a general idea how whole system could work). Large Radar system though should have smaller detection radius so to leave some area covered only by Advanced Radar with 70% detection probability (thus alien ships would have a fighting chance of not being detected all the time)

In this way even on later stages of the game player would have to rely on all 4 detection systems, which also by huge difference in maintenance (4 systems instead of just 1) would made bigger inpact on economy aspect of game.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: tnarg on June 23, 2014, 02:10:48 pm
FYI I'm working on a mod that limits base space.  The idea is to stop people just have one big base with every thing in and just having the other bases as intercepter base.

Living quarters: personnel set to 20, cost/upkeep lowwed by 50%
Lab,workshop,large radar,hyper decoder: size change to 2x2
Hanger:  size change to 3x3
General stores: strage incressed by 50%

This meen the player has to compomise in there main base for example if they want 2 hangers, Lab, workshop and large radar and alien containment then they cany only have 60 personnel.
Also was going to add impoved terren crafts after alien alloys inculding a fighter-intercepter carft reserchable, one gun point, 6 soldiers, a little slower then an interceptor incase they wanted to go with a one hanger option.

I've done the rule set but it's using the wrong graphics as I've not made my own yet.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: AlienMuncher on June 23, 2014, 08:19:24 pm
Quote
FYI I'm working on a mod that limits base space.  The idea is to stop people just have one big base with every thing in and just having the other bases as intercepter base.

The same goal basically can be achieved by modifying max. number of personel of Living Quarters, Workshops or Laboratory and by adding new buildings like for example Warboy1982 Training Centre. Seems to me it is better to put all effort and ingenuity in design of new buildings (function wise) than scaling up existing ones!
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on June 23, 2014, 11:08:01 pm
Great !

Did you find the way to create corresponding map for Base Defense ?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Falko on June 24, 2014, 08:25:38 am
Seems to me it is better to put all effort and ingenuity in design of new buildings (function wise) than scaling up existing ones!
Seems to me people should do what they want
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: tnarg on June 24, 2014, 11:25:30 am
The same goal basically can be achieved by modifying max. number of personel of Living Quarters, Workshops or Laboratory and by adding new buildings like for example Warboy1982 Training Centre. Seems to me it is better to put all effort and ingenuity in design of new buildings (function wise) than scaling up existing ones!

Just lowing the space in Workshops or Laboratory (as I did with Living Quarters) will not have the effect that I want.  I want people to have to think about the layout of there base for more then just defence.  Just because you have 4 spaces free dose not meen you can build a 2x2 building.  The building size where not pick a random they where balanced to give the player options.

I do like the idea of new buildings but the change to the base is only 1/4 of the mod and I'm not likey to finish it anyway so it dose not realy matter.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 24, 2014, 11:39:45 am
I want people to have to think about the layout of there base for more then just defence.  Just because you have 4 spaces free dose not meen you can build a 2x2 building.  The building size where not pick a random they where balanced to give the player options.

Let's dream: why not make it more sim-like and force the player to design power cables, water pipes and everything? With a system that penalizes long distances or something? :)

And now, for something completely different: we should add bathrooms, of course. And kitchens, and food stores!
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on June 24, 2014, 11:41:16 am
And now, for something completely different: we should add bathrooms, of course. And kitchens, and food stores!
Living Quarters  :o
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 24, 2014, 11:43:05 am
Living Quarters  :o

Have you seen these facilities there? :P

That's why I vote for making Living Quarters 2x2 to accommodate all this stuff!

Oh, and a mess hall. With tables and a TV and perhaps a snooker table! :)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on June 24, 2014, 11:50:17 am
Have you seen these facilities there? :P

That's why I vote for making Living Quarters 2x2 to accommodate all this stuff!

Oh, and a mess hall. With tables and a TV and perhaps a snooker table! :)
I like the idea of having 1X1 and 2X2 structures

For example :
1X1 LQ : capacity of 10
2X2 LQ : capacity of 50

Same for General Stores, Laboratory and Workshop
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 24, 2014, 12:05:24 pm
I like the idea of having 1X1 and 2X2 structures

For example :
1X1 LQ : capacity of 10
2X2 LQ : capacity of 50

Same for General Stores, Laboratory and Workshop

I think a, for example, mess hall can accommodate 80 people or so (after all they don't eat or play cards at the same time), so we could have full-feature 2x2 quarters and small 1x1 additional rooms, with just beds and a small bathroom maybe. :)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: yrizoud on June 24, 2014, 12:08:56 pm
It could be that when you build a 4th living quarter that completes a 2x2 square, the 4 blocks become a larger "giant living quarter".

edit: In fact it's possible to give a bonus for adjacent facility of same type, and build (little by little) a lab which is 3x1, or L-shaped, or Z-shaped etc. But then somebody has to map the 13 extra variants for each facility block. Huge work, but then we get more interesting maps with more 'large' rooms.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: shinr on June 24, 2014, 01:47:27 pm
Suggested simulating adjacency at the suggestions: https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2420.0, and then Solarious directed me here.

Adjacency bonus for Defense Facilities: Do they get extra shots or a better chance to hit? If it is the former, do they get extra shot for every adjacency, or for every X adjacency? (ex:2 Adjacent Defenses do not give you an extra shot, 3 Adjacent Defenses gives you an extra shot).

Adjacency bonus for Hangars: Since having an extra Craft will have a bigger impact on balance than some extra room for other facilities, I will repost what I suggested in my thread: Due to the size of the crafts and the necessary equipment to service them, you need a minimum of 3 Hangars stacked in a line(2x6/6x2) to get a enough room for the extra 4th craft, or a 4x4 to fit the 5th Craft in the Center.

EDIT: A question: Will the "Single Use Facilities" have bonuses, at least between the Small and Large Radars? (https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Base_Facilities_(EU)#Caveat_re:_Single_Use_Facilities)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Falko on June 24, 2014, 09:29:45 pm
i hope somebody get the 3x3 hangar finished
i put my current results soimewhere in the forum but the maps (base attack)did not get correct for this facility size
reason: no idea
hangar is a facility you cant scale easy "give 1 hanger 0.5 planes?" so making it 130% bigger (with 4 planes) scales fine
i would like to see a ruleset "hangarspace" (default =1) for crafts  that is bigger for bigger crafts so (if modded) a avenger can consume 2 hangarspaces
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Hobbes on June 24, 2014, 10:29:02 pm
I find it interesting to hear a lot of influence from Enemy Unknown 2012 on these ideas (adjacency bonus, single base, etc.). :)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: AlienMuncher on June 25, 2014, 01:43:27 am
Did you find the way to create corresponding map for Base Defense ?

I was only playing around with editor, so unfortunately no.


Have you seen these facilities there? :P

I have! Proof of concept attached with space for 10 or 15 inhabitants, but please don't shoot me since it is only quick draft... ;)


Quote
Let's dream: (...)

Also Command Centre, Reactor Room, Waste Treatment Facility!

Has anyone mentioned hospital / medical centre?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 25, 2014, 01:54:25 am
This looks great, I want this in already!

What about a power generator too?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: AlienMuncher on June 25, 2014, 03:41:34 am
Something like this maybe?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 25, 2014, 03:49:52 am
Yes... yes. This is awesome. Perfect.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Warboy1982 on June 25, 2014, 05:15:13 am
i know i've posted pics of these elsewhere, but i may as well include the maps/routes/mcds for archival purposes
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on June 25, 2014, 07:33:57 am
A Training Hall !  :o
And Quarters for Officers !!   8)
And a Hospital too !!!  ::)
And a Power Generator to make all this work...

Mensch !

We will fight, til the end, the war is not yet lost, a new task force is growing, a little more each day !


i know i've posted pics of these elsewhere, but i may as well include the maps/routes/mcds for archival purposes
::)

Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: cort on June 25, 2014, 07:51:53 pm
How about making layout variations for the facilities built more often (living quarters, laboratory, workshop) and randomly choose the layout of the room in the base defense mission, is that possible?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: AlienMuncher on June 28, 2014, 01:26:47 am
Meanwhile... I've managed to come up with final versions of my idea of advanced radar system and reactor. Made sprites (still need some touches) for both facilities and added some new research leading to radar facility.

Hopefully later this weekend I'll be able to put it all together and test it, although I fear it might take a little longer...

I wish there was easy way of adding those facilities to game -> Base Defence.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 28, 2014, 02:22:48 am
Beautiful!
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on June 28, 2014, 05:16:17 am
Meanwhile... I've managed to come up with final versions of my idea of advanced radar system and reactor. Made sprites (still need some touches) for both facilities and added some new research leading to radar facility.

Hopefully later this weekend I'll be able to put it all together and test it, although I fear it might take a little longer...

I wish there was easy way of adding those facilities to game -> Base Defence.

I display vanilla radars for comparison

It appears clearly it's an advanced feature, congratulations  :)

Do not change anything on reactor, it's perfect
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Falko on June 28, 2014, 10:34:00 am
I wish there was easy way of adding those facilities to game -> Base Defence.
can you elaborate?
FYI: to test a base-map you can
- change starting base
- go to new battle
- click on randomize [to assure that the starting base is used]
- select base defence
- test
its easier than waiting until a now retaliation ufo attacks :)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: tnarg on June 28, 2014, 06:51:57 pm
can you elaborate?
FYI: to test a base-map you can
- change starting base
- go to new battle
- click on randomize [to assure that the starting base is used]
- select base defence
- test
its easier than waiting until a now retaliation ufo attacks :)

Yep that's how i do it.  Check out the rule set in this test mod to if you need help.
https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2435.0
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: AlienMuncher on June 28, 2014, 08:34:28 pm
Thanks! It is nice you like it. I'll keep working.

can you elaborate?

By all means. :) It is not about testing (job easy and done ;) ) but adding as in mod per se. What I meant - maybe I misspoke - is I don't know easy way of making rules file containing all necessary rules for only new facilities. My problem is only with battlescape part - basescape is easy and works fine. I was hoping for just couple of rules without the need of going through all of xcom facilities (as in tnarg's rules). I've tried several ways but all don't work - new blocks are filled with dirt from XBASE_20.MAP. It looks to me engine looks for XCOM facilities only under name XCOM as defined under terrain. If for example I add something like:

terrains:
  - name: NBASE
      mapDataSets:
        - BLANKS
        - XBASE1
        - XBASE2
        - XBASE3
     mapBlocks:
        - name: ADV_RADAR
          width: 10
          length: 10

it doesn't work.

If the only way is going through all of the XCOM facilities it would mean that any two mods meddling with them will always be incompatible.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Falko on June 28, 2014, 08:50:23 pm
it would mean that any two mods meddling with them will always be incompatible.
thats the current status :( maps(+missions) have some potential for better ruleset support
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: tnarg on June 28, 2014, 10:07:59 pm
AlienMuncher I agree with you it should be easer to do it.  But if there is a way I have not found it.  It took me some time to come up with something that works and then trimming down to just what is needed.  The biggest problem with. The rule set is not its size but the fact it will not work with other base changing mods.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on June 28, 2014, 10:48:52 pm
Well, it's the same for terror missions for example. While it's a pain, one can merge rulesets as long as they exist. So I don't think potential incompatibility should be a discouragement.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 13, 2014, 02:04:49 pm
Wanted to build a security station, needed windows and half walls so i cloned them from my other mods ( just need to replace graphics and tweak MCD rules), still this should give you some idea of what this building will look like :)

Requires XBASE3 to work ( still in construction).
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 13, 2014, 02:27:35 pm
Wanted to build a security station, needed windows and half walls so i cloned them from my other mods ( just need to replace graphics and tweak MCD rules), still this should give you some idea of what this building will look like :)

Requires XBASE3 to work ( still in construction).
Necessary, essential, vital, indispensable !!!
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Human Ktulu on July 13, 2014, 10:58:44 pm
Nice work !  8)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: niculinux on July 17, 2014, 09:58:55 pm
Fine but just a little dubious: these extra facilities may be better to be a mod instead merged into openxcom? It isn't in the spirit of vanilla thingh and such :/
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 17, 2014, 11:18:05 pm
Fine but just a little dubious: these extra facilities may be better to be a mod instead merged into openxcom? It isn't in the spirit of vanilla thingh and such :/

Yeah, definitely as a mod. Maybe an option, unless you think we have too many already.

BTW this is a broader question anyway... I guess at some point the project will have to be split into sub-projects, probably with slightly different code, to accommodate the various things introduced. Hopefully not any time soon, though; this should only happen after the basic game is done, if ever.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 19, 2014, 04:35:39 pm
So i reworked my XBASE3 ruleset to go onto the end of Warboys early work, still have some graphics to fix but things are coming along nicely.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 19, 2014, 05:38:25 pm
Looks really nice, Luke. Very in line with the original game.

So... What's what? :)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 20, 2014, 12:35:53 am
Xbase_56 is my Small security station
Xbase_55 is my advanced Medial Unit, complete with recoverable alien cloning tanks that xcom has installed in the facility full application is not entirely thought out yet ( do i want clones, special organs/implants or both )?
Xbase_57 is my Large security station

Updated version of Expanded Alien base will include some rooms with these cloning tanks included ( might build them next weekend).
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 20, 2014, 03:30:32 am
If we get the security stations into the game, don't forget to create spawning points for X-Com personnel inside. :)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 20, 2014, 11:13:03 am
I hope you will provide at least two stairways in the Large Security Station
Result is impressive

Question : is there a way to choose wich orientation we wish when building a new facility ? As there is only one door, orientation could become very important
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 20, 2014, 12:47:37 pm
I hope you will provide at least two stairways in the Large Security Station
Result is impressive

Question : is there a way to choose wich orientation we wish when building a new facility ? As there is only one door, orientation could become very important
Could always provide 4 different versions of the map, with 4 different building types for it, that would do the trick, it just wouldn't be very professional
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 20, 2014, 02:52:07 pm
Could always provide 4 different versions of the map, with 4 different building types for it, that would do the trick, it just wouldn't be very professional
Wait, I did not have in mind you have to design four different maps...

I was just thinking about ufos, I guess there are sometimes oriented differently, without having 4 different designs (in fact I don't really know)
Also idea was just to think about possibility to select orientation (that would need certainly some development), so do not take care as it was just an idea
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Solarius Scorch on July 20, 2014, 03:43:00 pm
I was just thinking about ufos, I guess there are sometimes oriented differently, without having 4 different designs (in fact I don't really know)

Sadly, there is no method of automatic rotation of blocks. For example, an eastern wall works completely differently than a northern wall, so there would be no easy conversion. If there are multiple orientations, each one must be made from scratch. If there are ways around this, I don't know them.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Vulgar Monkey on July 20, 2014, 05:05:29 pm
Re cloning tanks -
If you're worried about the lore implications of adopting alien cloning tech, you could always just say they've been adapted for conventional healing techniques, more like a Star Wars bacta tank?

Otherwise I suppose you could just outright steal a couple of alien surgery tables?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 20, 2014, 07:46:55 pm
Sadly, there is no method of automatic rotation of blocks. For example, an eastern wall works completely differently than a northern wall, so there would be no easy conversion. If there are multiple orientations, each one must be made from scratch. If there are ways around this, I don't know them.
Huuhh !
Al right...
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 21, 2014, 03:27:55 pm
So had a go at making a ruleset, it partially works :P Maybe someone can fix this up. Also, i need graphics for the Basescape screen...Any takers?

Would like to include Warboys maps in this set ( since i built on top of his excellent medical centre but i really should ask first so attached is just my 3 files). ::)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 21, 2014, 07:34:39 pm
If it can help

1) Beware, to the unwanted tab and two waste spaces
Cf. line 23 after "- XBASE3" (see 1st screen hot)

2) The keyword "terrains:" is missing (see 2nd screen shot)

3) I added a size of 2 for Fortress, but I think it lacks some blocks : doesn't it need NW, NE, SW and SE ?  (see screen shot 3 and 4)

4) Regarding Security Room, it seems not possible to go upstairs (the small door opens, but path seem to be blocked just behind this small door)

5) Regarding Security Fortress, even if only one corner is visible, it seems some sprites are missing (walls with a window)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 22, 2014, 12:12:33 am
I have not been able to test these without it crashing, can you upload your ruleset?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 22, 2014, 02:15:40 am
I have not been able to test these without it crashing, can you upload your ruleset?
I remade a test from a clean environment
Try perhaps with "facilities" section from attached battle.cfg
Ruleset is attached too

Beware that I changed some values like cost and so on (it has nothing to do with a crash, it is just a warning so you do not overwrite your own values by mistake :P)

EDIT : I use night build 2014 07 09
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 22, 2014, 02:22:30 am
I remade a test from a clean environment
Try perhaps with "facilities" section from attached battle.cfg
Ruleset is attached too

Beware that I changed some values like cost and so on (it has nothing to do with a crash, it is just a warning so you do not overwrite your own values by mistake :P)

LOL i hadnt set any values, i just copied and pasted trying to get these working in game.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 22, 2014, 03:13:08 am
These have been upgraded for a more tactical advantage.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 22, 2014, 03:21:08 am
I just see GIF files... :P

Did you check the small door of the first one, the one that leads to stairs ?

EDIT : is it a dungeon ?  :o  ::)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 22, 2014, 03:23:52 am
I just see GIF files... :P

Did you check the small door of the first one, the one that leads to stairs ?

Yes is fixed, will try these today and upload...Still need graphics for Basescape...
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 22, 2014, 03:24:50 am
The fortress will be very important for base defense  :)

I finally think having just one design with a south door for example (as it is now) is far enough. Base will have to be organized taking this into account (as putting hangars and access lift just north of it ; with a north gate, base would have been inverted, hangars and access lift pushed to the south so it's ok)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 22, 2014, 03:28:37 am
bugger, need to go out, you want to trial new map blocks?

I still need some code for the Advanced medial bay also.... later today maybe.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 22, 2014, 03:29:27 am
bugger, need to go out, you want to trial new map blocks?

I still need some code for the Advanced medial bay also.... later today maybe.
Sofort !

The small security room works

But the windowed walls are still missing (cf. screen shots), is there any map block to activate/install (some terrains you provided in other mods) ?

For the moment, the large security fortress make it crash...
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 22, 2014, 04:04:34 am
Fortress still make game crash, either with size 1 or 2
Previous version was not complete (only NW corner) but did not cause any crash

I provide new Test_Facilities.rul including StartingBase :
- so it is easy to copy it into Battle.cfg
- with some comments on which facility is positioned where, to avoid issues due to wrong placement

startingBase:
# 0/0 1/0 2/0 3/0 4/0 5/0
# 0/1 1/1 2/1 3/1 4/1 5/1
# 0/2 1/2 2/2 3/2 4/2 5/2
# 0/3 1/3 2/3 3/3 4/3 5/3
# 0/4 1/4 2/4 3/4 4/4 5/4
# 0/5 1/5 2/5 3/5 4/5 5/5
#
# HG1 HG1 HG2 HG2 HG3 HG3
# HG1 HG1 HG2 HG2 HG3 HG3
# ACC --- --- --- --- ---
# LQ1 SRO LAB WOR --- ---
# LQ2 SRS FOR FOR --- ---
# STO STO FOR FOR --- ---
#
# 0/0 HG1 2/0 HG2 4/0 HG3
# HG1 HG1 HG2 HG2 HG3 HG3
# 0/2 --- --- --- --- ---
# 0/3 1/3 2/3 --- --- ---
# 0/4 1/4 2/4 FOR --- ---
# 0/5 1/5 FOR FOR --- ---
#
  facilities:
    - type: STR_HANGAR #HG1
      x: 0
...


See third screen shot, it complains of something wrong in map definition
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 22, 2014, 04:11:51 am
Looks like Xbase3 isnt being loaded into OXC... Warboy, little help?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 22, 2014, 04:14:55 am
Looks like Xbase3 isnt being loaded into OXC... Warboy, little help?
I will have a look at terrains
Sometimes there is a "type" indicated

Code: [Select]
      - name: CBASE_00
        width: 20
        length: 20
        type: 7

EDIT : I think it is not involved into the crash, but for Linux people, could you perhaps rename extensions uppercase (inside Terrain folder only)
XBASE3.mcd => XBASE3.MCD
XBASE3.pck => XBASE3.PCK
XBASE3.tab => XBASE3.TAB

I did it but it does not solve issue

I tried to add height: 2 and some other options without success

I wonder if your XBASE_57 should not be provided in four parts, as for the Hangar
If you have a look at other XBASE mapblocks, there are no of 20X20
So it seems the hangar is (10X10)X4 -> I guess XBASE_09 to XBASE_12 if it's linked with BASEBITS.PCK definition (https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=BASEBITS.PCK)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 22, 2014, 07:12:07 am
ok, i have seperated the fortress, i just need to do the routes for the mapblock again...tonight i wil lhave it uploaded

Changed fortress into 4 blocks, have not done ruleset yet...
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: tnarg on July 22, 2014, 10:40:07 am
It would be nice if we didnt have to split them in to 4.  I its sometime hard making the path file when the map is spilt right down a middle of a coridor.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 22, 2014, 01:28:15 pm
ok, i have seperated the fortress, i just need to do the routes for the mapblock again...tonight i wil lhave it uploaded

Changed fortress into 4 blocks, have not done ruleset yet...
You jumped from 0.2 to 2.5  :o

Anyway, I will test it 8)

EDIT : I think it is not involved into the crash, but for Linux people, could you perhaps rename extensions uppercase (inside Terrain folder only)  >:(  ;)
XBASE3.mcd => XBASE3.MCD
XBASE3.pck => XBASE3.PCK
XBASE3.tab => XBASE3.TAB
(This should have to be done once at all and could avoid further issues)

EDIT2 : the Force is with you, this works !
I used 50 to 53, thanks for the hint  :P
Is the XBASE_57 now obsolete ?

Still have to deal with these damn windowed walls

Anyway, this is excellent !

And with some storage capacity, this fortress becomes an arsenal !


I provided adapted ruleset
=> see further post
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 22, 2014, 01:56:35 pm
I forgot to test Medial Unit (is it some medical room ?), now included

How do you plan to make it valuable ? I mean we have "only" following possibilities :
- hyper
- mind
- grav
- storage
- personnel
- aliens
- crafts
- labs
- workshops
- psilabs
- radarRange (& radarChance)
- defense (& hitRatio/fireSound/hitSound)

Also no way to heal injured units ?


Please use this last version of Ruleset for further enhancements, as I added startingBase section to make test easier
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 22, 2014, 02:57:02 pm
ok here it is all in one, still cant work out why XBASE3 is not being loaded into the game, i have changed some strings in the Ruleset and added into these files Warboys Mapblocks that i built on top of (havent heard from him on this topic yet, we will see what happens).

Also, maybe it just me, i havnt been able to play these yet in instant battle, every time i try, it just loads up the original base layout, maybe i am missing something...

XBase21 is Warboys Medical room
Xbase22 is Warboys training room
Xbase50,51,52,53 is the Security Fortress
Xbase55 is the Advanced Medical room
Xbase56 is the security room
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 22, 2014, 03:01:22 pm
I forgot to test Medial Unit (is it some medical room ?), now included

How do you plan to make it valuable ? I mean we have "only" following possibilities :
- hyper
- mind
- grav
- storage
- personnel
- aliens
- crafts
- labs
- workshops
- psilabs
- radarRange (& radarChance)
- defense (& hitRatio/fireSound/hitSound)

Also no way to heal injured units ?

Medical room was Warboys creation, i Assume he had some plans to add increased healing options to units were this base was located. I took this idea ( and some of his graphics) and Expanded on it, i want Gene therapy, implants or maybe even clones long term... It will ( eventually) require alien cloning tanks and some research to become available, right now i would be happy seeing my clone tanks on a map but some BUG appears to be preventing that.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 22, 2014, 04:08:56 pm
I allowed me to update to V0.27

Changes :
- converted the file extension to uppercase under Terrain subfolder
     XBASE3.mcd renamed to XBASE3.MCD
     XBASE3.pck renamed to XBASE3.PCK
     XBASE3.tab renamed to XBASE3.TAB
- updated ruleset and battle.cfg according to both new Warboy's facilities

To do list :
- Deal with these damn windowed walls
- Sprites for displaying all these facilities in base screen (and also in ufopaedia)
- Set right properties (cost,capabilities, ...) to any of these new facilities
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 30, 2014, 06:35:56 am
4 hours to understand how it works... I was not sure to be adequate for this job, now I am*  :P

At least it is not unpleasant task

I also updated to V0.28

Now I will have to make it nice... Strange is that blue colour that is the same but is displayed differently in the three other blocks...

EDIT : And I will have to make the towers aligned :o

Now Security Fortress is quite ready, just this issue about windowed wall sprites to fix

Do not hesitate to give me your opinion as I don't have a lot of imagination (perhaps add some colours to simulate fortress is not empty ??)

* now I am sure !
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Arthanor on July 30, 2014, 07:46:08 am
Nifty! That thing should be called: "Alien shooting gallery"! ;)

I am very much looking forward to new base buildings! Hospitals and Cloning facilities (for crazies like me who try to keep every soldier alive) would be especially nice.
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 30, 2014, 12:07:48 pm
Great job mate, work is killing me at the moment ( yesterday 15hour day and i just sleep in car at work instead of driving hour home) so i was hoping you would work some more on this :)
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 30, 2014, 06:21:34 pm
Great job mate, work is killing me at the moment ( yesterday 15hour day and i just sleep in car at work instead of driving hour home) so i was hoping you would work some more on this :)
Keep cool

V0.28 seemed to work but I was totally wrong between shape and facility ; I discovered it when I tried to build a new one...


Attached V0.29 with Security Fortress fully operational (except for windowed walls)

I added dummy sprites for 4 others facilities, so we (I, or others more talented pretty modders  :-*) will have just to design the inside, and it should will work

I will finish designing Fortress to make it nice later, as I am a little tired right now ; the most important was to make it work and, as you already know, describe a method (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=2708.0) for other facilities

EDIT : attached V0.30 with Fortress design finished ; I will make the Security Room, as it should be easier. And for the other, we have time as there is no possibility to train or heal soldiers yet

EDIT : attached V0.31 with Security Fortress and Security Room design. I am definitely not enough talented to make it nice, so other modders will have to deal with it, but at least it is different from other facilities
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 31, 2014, 02:43:26 pm
Excellent, just need a clone room now and to get these things working in game, great job :D

Warboy has some Sprites here: Haven't had a good look yet but there are some rooms.https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=731.45


ALso Warboy did some code some time ago...https://github.com/Warboy1982/OpenXcom/commit/b6ce134d9403768e8b68cea40b6ef956b6cb417c


Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on July 31, 2014, 07:15:42 pm
What for is the clone room ?

Luke, could you check the Security Fortress, as I think there is a bridge that should be grey and not brawn (NW)

Or I will have to have to adapt facility sprite  :P
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on July 31, 2014, 09:21:55 pm
What for is the clone room ?

Clone room is for this: https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Alien_Reproduction

Luke, could you check the Security Fortress, as I think there is a bridge that should be grey and not brawn (NW)
Bridge is wrong colour, i will fix this weekend
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Aldorn on August 03, 2014, 11:01:36 am
So, with help of dear Hobbes, Security Fortress and Security Room are ready to use (still the bridge  :P)
If anyone does want make BaseScape sprites nicer, be welcome
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: luke83 on August 03, 2014, 11:37:36 am
i have fixed the bridge, it will be uploaded later today.

***uploaded***
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: Biggieboy on March 26, 2018, 09:20:44 am
Hi!

Can you create 2x4 Hangar with 3 craft capacities?

Its good thing for my upgradedfacilities mod!

Thank you!
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: 7Saturn on March 26, 2018, 05:21:18 pm
Is there some sort of complete mod for this? Or is this a collection of base parts only?
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: The Reaver of Darkness on March 26, 2018, 09:20:32 pm
Is there some sort of complete mod for this? Or is this a collection of base parts only?
It looks like a functional mod. You can download it and try it yourself, it's attached to reply #144 (https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,2033.msg28674.html#msg28674).
Title: Re: [Request] Extra facilities for human base
Post by: 7Saturn on March 26, 2018, 09:24:42 pm
Nice, thanks for the pointer. I'll try that one. =)